How do ERE men attract women?

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7Wannabe5
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Re: How do ERE men attract women?

Post by 7Wannabe5 »

iceet said: 7Wannabe5 thank you again for the advice. I feel like that post itself is worth a few years in the dating game in terms of the knowledge it contains.
You are welcome. I should admit that part of me is thinking "Yes, do as I said above, not as I sometimes still do myself."-lol. Whatever wisdom I am conveying is the result of a several years long dialogue/debate I participated in on an internet forum that was just as intellectual as this one but concerned primarily with relationship issues rather than economic issues. I was stuck in a long-term miserable because sex-dead?incompatible marriage at the time and my primary debate opponent was a man about 10 years younger than me who became a very successful player after his brief early marriage failed meteorically because his wife committed adultery and left him for an older more successful man. I would say my dysfunctional irrational subconscious philosophy/practice at the time was something along the lines of "My husband should want to have sex with me because I am a good wife who prepares delicious dinners every night for less than $1 a serving." The rational fact is that although there are many men, my current SO and my father being prime examples, who would very much appreciate the kind of functioning that provides thrifty, delicious meals as part of the whole relationship package, there are pretty much zero men who are directly sexually turned on by this behavior. The fact is that although sex, hopefully, does becomes more layered, deep, fulfilling within the context of a long-term loving relationship, what will turn somebody on sexually in-the-moment never changes. What turns most women on in-the-moment is some kind of confident/dominant signaling (inclusive of but definitely not limited to appearance/display of physical fitness/strength.) What makes most women willing to give in to the urge is some kind of behavior that engages trust or sympathy(backhanded way of engaging trust-do not recommend-will likely result in eventual severe angry reaction when she realizes you were playing her that way.) However, it is also the case, that some women, sometimes, will respond to confident-obnoxious-submissive behavior. For instance, the Spike Lee character who begs "Please, baby, baby, baby...please." over and over again. Actually. that isn't even true because that character was exhibiting dominant physical signaling while exhibiting submissive verbal signaling. Highly unlikely that many women are going to respond if, for instance, you roll over and expose your belly while saying "Please, baby, baby, baby...please." but a fairly high proportion of the male population pretty much can't not respond if a reasonably physically attractive female exhibits that kind of behavior (kind of like that scene in classic sci-fi movies where the computer is fed programming that causes it to explode or something like that.)

Anyways, the point I would make here being that money is just sort of like an accessory or costume when it comes to sexual and/or romantic signalling. Gold credit cards have not been in existence long enough to have informed the human genetic code. It's the manner in which a man uses OR chooses not to use a gold credit card that will inform a response of "respect" (desire/want)or "trust" (heart-felt willingness) in a woman beyond the level on which she maybe is prostituting herself in order to buy bread for her children or baubles of status etc. and what will seem "respect-able" or "trust-worthy" to one woman vs. another will somewhat vary due to her own temperament/culture/experience. For instance, one woman might respect a man who is willing to risk it all on a bold entrepreneurial venture and be excited while another woman might find that kind of behavior absolutely not trust-worthy and be filled with anxiety and vice-versa when it comes to err-on-the-side-of-conservative financial functioning. Since ERE behavior is sort of an unconventional mix of risky and conservative financial functioning, I think it will come down to personal confidence in course of action and doing 500 push-ups a day won't hurt. The funny thing in my current relationship is that my SO thinks I should be admiring of the fact that he has such a huge pile of $$$ in reserve but I am actually more admiring of the fact that he can actually fix things made out of plastic while talking about the science behind the process and he can pick me (5'9" shapely but not skinny) up off the ground so it's almost like I feel compelled to fake financial-consumer orgasm on occasion to make him happy...or something like that-lol.

Dragline
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Re: How do ERE men attract women?

Post by Dragline »

7Wannabe5 wrote: I would say my dysfunctional irrational subconscious philosophy/practice at the time was something along the lines of "My husband should want to have sex with me because I am a good wife who prepares delicious dinners every night for less than $1 a serving." The rational fact is that although there are many men, my current SO and my father being prime examples, who would very much appreciate the kind of functioning that provides thrifty, delicious meals as part of the whole relationship package, there are pretty much zero men who are directly sexually turned on by this behavior. The fact is that although sex, hopefully, does becomes more layered, deep, fulfilling within the context of a long-term loving relationship, what will turn somebody on sexually in-the-moment never changes. What turns most women on in-the-moment is some kind of confident/dominant signaling (inclusive of but definitely not limited to appearance/display of physical fitness/strength.) [snip]
This is absolutely correct. What someone finds sexually attractive in another or "turns them on" almost never has any rational basis, and is often based on relatively primitive urges. I would go so far as to say that all of it is based on fetish-type preferences, although we usually only use that word for "unusual" sexual attractions as opposed to the fetishes that are more common.
7Wannabe5 wrote:Anyways, the point I would make here being that money is just sort of like an accessory or costume when it comes to sexual and/or romantic signalling. Gold credit cards have not been in existence long enough to have informed the human genetic code. [snip]
This made me laugh -- I recently got a new credit card that lets you put a picture on it, and I used my avatar just for fun. It has not been a chick magnet . . . ;-)


I now annoint 7W5 as the forum's "relationship guru." :)

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Sclass
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Re: How do ERE men attract women?

Post by Sclass »

Yes, another great post from 7W5. I wish I had access to her posts twenty five years ago. I had difficulties with dating when I was young. A lot of what 7W5's posts connects some of my dots that I never really understood till reading this.

I dated two college classmates who were abused by their fathers. It took me a long time to figure out why things worked out the way they did between us. Another two had strong supportive dads. When I met them I felt like I was looking at myself in the mirror. We started arguing immediately. I didn't get it at the time.

I can remember a singles mixer that a married couple set up for my single male coworkers where I drank too much and gave social commentary with my voice turned up a couple of notches too high. A woman started hanging on my words and not blinking. I still remember thinking, "geez, she's into this? I'm being an ass."

Being naturally shy and introverted didn't exactly help. Money was never an issue because I didn't have it. I was bipolar. And I had a mild substance problem. So I'd turn into Dr. Jekyll (Mr. Hyde) periodically and strangely, that's when I'd attract somebody. The problem was I'd come back to normal and I'd be totally incompatible with this person.

Too bad the Internet was only the realm of DARPA geeks back then. I could have really used this info. Also casting a wide net using Internet dating and using an aggressive gold digger repellent filter would have been interesting.

I'm just glad I found my SO and escaped the prior experiences. They're out there guys.

Thank you 7wannabe5. This thread has given me a lot.

iceet
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Re: How do ERE men attract women?

Post by iceet »

First of all I wanted to thank you again for taking the time to make another response. We are all busy with many ventures so I really appreciate the fact that you formulated your thoughts in a way that us men could understand.
7Wannabe5 wrote:I would say my dysfunctional irrational subconscious philosophy/practice at the time was something along the lines of "My husband should want to have sex with me because I am a good wife who prepares delicious dinners every night for less than $1 a serving." The rational fact is that although there are many men, my current SO and my father being prime examples, who would very much appreciate the kind of functioning that provides thrifty, delicious meals as part of the whole relationship package, there are pretty much zero men who are directly sexually turned on by this behavior.
Just wanted to let you know that I don't mean to pry and you don't have to answer anything you're uncomfortable with, but from the sound of what you wrote it seems that the dead bedroom so to speak was caused by your husbands unwillingness to want sex. If so that is unacceptable. There are reasons for a low sex drive and ways to fight it, at the very least maybe that could have been explored. Don't blame you for being unhappy in that relationship, sex isn't everything but it is important in marriage for sure.
7Wannabe5 wrote:What makes most women willing to give in to the urge is some kind of behavior that engages trust or sympathy(backhanded way of engaging trust-do not recommend-will likely result in eventual severe angry reaction when she realizes you were playing her that way.)
You kind of opened Pandora's box with that one, I hope ERE members that read this don't abuse this knowledge. That would be a very dirty, underhanded way of getting women to bed, they will hate you for it and it's not worth it. If you're doing things right sex will be in the natural progression of things anyway so it's unnecessary to resort to dirty handed tactics reserved for unsavory characters.
7Wannabe5 wrote:However, it is also the case, that some women, sometimes, will respond to confident-obnoxious-submissive behavior. For instance, the Spike Lee character who begs "Please, baby, baby, baby...please." over and over again. Actually. that isn't even true because that character was exhibiting dominant physical signaling while exhibiting submissive verbal signaling.
So you're saying women prefer a wolf in sheep's clothing rather than the other way around? A jerk masquerading as a nice guy, not a nice guy masquerading as a jerk? All masks fall off eventually however and reveal what's underneath.
7Wannabe5 wrote:Anyways, the point I would make here being that money is just sort of like an accessory or costume when it comes to sexual and/or romantic signalling. Gold credit cards have not been in existence long enough to have informed the human genetic code. It's the manner in which a man uses OR chooses not to use a gold credit card that will inform a response of "respect" (desire/want)or "trust" (heart-felt willingness) in a woman...
Sounds more like an art than a science. You have to kind of feel it out in the relationship to know how much is the right amount to spend without losing respect. Or do I have it wrong?
7Wannabe5 wrote:The funny thing in my current relationship is that my SO thinks I should be admiring of the fact that he has such a huge pile of $$$ in reserve but I am actually more admiring of the fact that he can actually fix things made out of plastic while talking about the science behind the process and he can pick me (5'9" shapely but not skinny) up off the ground so it's almost like I feel compelled to fake financial-consumer orgasm on occasion to make him happy...or something like that-lol.
Doesn't matter if you faked it, I think he would still like it

iceet
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Re: How do ERE men attract women?

Post by iceet »

Just one final thing to add guys before I head back to the grind:

Having a woman that you are in love with or have a crush on can be a way to supercharge your life. They will force you to do things that take you out of your comfort zone. Sometimes you have to admire from afar while you build your empire. If it's meant to be it will happen. Much better than a lifetime of shallow casual relationships that end up draining your soul and spirit over time because they don't last. The best relationships are the ones built up over time with both partners contributing and bringing out the best in each other. Once you have sex with love you can't really go back to sex alone.

If you don't have a woman that you like then go out there and find one! They will not come to your doorstep (until after you get them, then they might be waiting there patiently for "reasons"). Most men are wasting times on tons of BS, if some of that time was put towards finding (and attracting) a woman that you like you'd be amazed. There are attractive women out there many of them lonely because men don't have the balls to go after them. In fact I read somewhere that average woman get hit on more than the attractive ones because men are more comfortable approaching them. Bollocks I say.

If there are men out there that aren't getting the attention they want from women it's their own damn fault. I'll help you, but I have no sympathy for you. It's like lifting weights. You can't have me bench that barbell for you and expect to gain results. You have to get out there and do the work. Get hurt, learn, lather, rinse, repeat. Each time it will hurt less and you will grow stronger. Applies to so many things in life.

7Wannabe5
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Re: How do ERE men attract women?

Post by 7Wannabe5 »

Dragline said: I now annoint 7W5 as the forum's "relationship guru." :)
Egad, I don't know if you want to do that. Please recall that I am an ENTP = Enthusiast Inventor NOT Good Scientist. Sometimes, I might come up with a good idea along the lines of "A pear is like an apple so you could substitute in pie recipe." but other times it might be "A potato is also like an apple so maybe..." and then you might be grouchy and say "I followed your advice and my pie tasted terrible." and I would reply "That was not advice. That was just a new idea I was sharing."

Anyways,..
This is absolutely correct. What someone finds sexually attractive in another or "turns them on" almost never has any rational basis, and is often based on relatively primitive urges. I would go so far as to say that all of it is based on fetish-type preferences, although we usually only use that word for "unusual" sexual attractions as opposed to the fetishes that are more common.
Right. Of course, there can also be a million variations on the theme of common fetishes. For instance, most men are strongly visually-wired and attracted to something like a .7 waist-to-hip ratio but Twiggy and Jayne Mansfield both have close to this ratio and preferences will vary and most women are more strongly verbally-wired and turned on by dominant posturing but some like ravished-by-the-stranger-in-the-elevator erotica and others prefer lassoed-by-the-cowboy-themed romance novels. Also, individuals vary a lot in how narrow or ambient they are in terms of their turn-ons. Kind of like how some people are very picky eaters and others are total gourmands. Then that is further complicated by the fact that some people have much higher drives across their range of preferences than other people. So compatibility in the moment does not necessarily speak to long-term compatibility.

There are some fairly hard-wired tendencies that people find hard to accept either about themselves or the opposite sex. For instance, it is very easy in rational brain-in-jar mode to see why natural selection would favor some tendency towards seeking variety in mates in men (polygamy)and some tendency towards being willing to trade up the dominance chain in women (the serial in serial monogamy) but these tendencies can be profoundly threatening to us when they are exhibited in our own intimate relationships when we are in vulnerable-mammal-mode so there is a dysfunctional tendency towards wanting to deny or repress rather than transcend or synthesize. It literally took me years after believing the science to personally accept the fact that men are very visually hard-wired both sexually and in the realm of limerence (romantic infatuation) but once I really did, I found that it made my life much easier in that realm because I was no longer trying to swim upstream against reality. Simple example of this being that once I accepted this reality, it became very easy to follow the old-fashioned common-sense piece of advice which is "Don't chase boys." IOW, I made it my practice to only date men who clearly were initially choosing to date me based on their visual preferences and gave up my previous sort of Gen-X-Riot-Grrl-style-feminist practice of doing whatever I damn well pleased in that regard-lol.

The Joe Jackson song "Is She Really Going Out With Him?" which contains the line "Pretty women are walking with gorillas down my street." is obviously a very self-aware, humorous take on the difficulty men often have with accepting the female tendency towards being attracted to dominant posturing. The immature reaction from members of either gender (myself oh so often included-sigh) is to label the other as "bad" and think that the solution is to find another who is "good." The mature rational response is to consider how to better bring out your own personal flavor of inner "gorilla" or .7 waist-to-hip ratio etc. etc. Much easier to give advice to others in this realm than to take it yourself. For instance, if some not-famous version of Joe Jackson was my male friend, I would advise him to do something like watch some old clips of Dean Martin and mimic some of his behaviors and do 500 push-ups a day. Fake it until you make it really does work quite well in this realm because human beings are very impressionable monkeys.

Spartan_Warrior
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Re: How do ERE men attract women?

Post by Spartan_Warrior »

iceet wrote:
7Wannabe5 wrote:However, it is also the case, that some women, sometimes, will respond to confident-obnoxious-submissive behavior. For instance, the Spike Lee character who begs "Please, baby, baby, baby...please." over and over again. Actually. that isn't even true because that character was exhibiting dominant physical signaling while exhibiting submissive verbal signaling.
So you're saying women prefer a wolf in sheep's clothing rather than the other way around? A jerk masquerading as a nice guy, not a nice guy masquerading as a jerk? All masks fall off eventually however and reveal what's underneath.
I think it's a common misconception (particularly in PUA circles) that "dominant" = "jerk", and I think it gets people into trouble. Nice guy versus jerk is a totally separate dichotomy from dominant ("alpha") versus submissive ("beta"). IMO, a dominant nice guy will beat any other combination in most situations. Also IMO, a lot of the guys who say they're "too nice to get girls" are actually not that nice, and more typically, they are "submissive jerks". (Where "jerk" connotes narcissism/self-absorption and treating other people poorly and "submissive" implies lack of confidence, leadership, and spontaneity.)

In this context, dominance is not about jerkiness; it's really about self-confidence and posture. So much confidence and self-esteem that you can't be touched or changed or swayed by the world around you. Knowing who you are and what you want. Not faking anything or changing for anyone. Perhaps more succinctly, it's about a lack of fear. Fear is the mind-killer. It's also sex repellent.

Just my two cents (and of course I'm speaking generally, not trying to imply anything of anyone here, in case that needed to be said).

Dragline
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Re: How do ERE men attract women?

Post by Dragline »

7Wannabe5 wrote: The Joe Jackson song "Is She Really Going Out With Him?" which contains the line "Pretty women are walking with gorillas down my street." is obviously a very self-aware, humorous take on the difficulty men often have with accepting the female tendency towards being attracted to dominant posturing. The immature reaction from members of either gender (myself oh so often included-sigh) is to label the other as "bad" and think that the solution is to find another who is "good." The mature rational response is to consider how to better bring out your own personal flavor of inner "gorilla" or .7 waist-to-hip ratio etc. etc. Much easier to give advice to others in this realm than to take it yourself. For instance, if some not-famous version of Joe Jackson was my male friend, I would advise him to do something like watch some old clips of Dean Martin and mimic some of his behaviors and do 500 push-ups a day. Fake it until you make it really does work quite well in this realm because human beings are very impressionable monkeys.
"But if my eyes don't deceive me there's somethin' goin' wrong around here!" :D

Yup, better to be the alleged "gorilla" for this purpose than the guy with the problem singing about alleged gorillas.

In my view, our societal problems with trying to "reason" sexuality, and attempts to make our sexual personalities (foolishly) consistent with our work or other personas just tends to lead to a lot of bad relationships (and bad sex). Good sex is half fantasy and half therapy. The fantasy part is recognizing one's fetish/preferences and being able to act on them with a willing participant. The therapy part is having one's irrational preferences, and one's performance, being accepted by your partner.

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Re: How do ERE men attract women?

Post by jacob »

http://www.16personalities.com/intj-rel ... ips-dating

Since the moniker applies to a lot of people here, do consider that the "dating-scene" is really suboptimal terrain for doing battle for most of you [INTJs] as it exposes all your weaknesses (small talk, socializing, ambient noise filtering, having "fun"). You'd be much better off selecting venues where you can show your strengths (competence and depth) but selecting venues where there are potential candidates and some interaction.

Good places:
Trivial Pursuit clubs.
Political groups.
Cooking classes.
Online dating.

Bad places:
Swimming pools.
Physics club (unless you're female).
Welding 101 class.
Bars.

iceet
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Re: How do ERE men attract women?

Post by iceet »

Spartan_Warrior wrote:
iceet wrote:
7Wannabe5 wrote:However, it is also the case, that some women, sometimes, will respond to confident-obnoxious-submissive behavior. For instance, the Spike Lee character who begs "Please, baby, baby, baby...please." over and over again. Actually. that isn't even true because that character was exhibiting dominant physical signaling while exhibiting submissive verbal signaling.
So you're saying women prefer a wolf in sheep's clothing rather than the other way around? A jerk masquerading as a nice guy, not a nice guy masquerading as a jerk? All masks fall off eventually however and reveal what's underneath.
I think it's a common misconception (particularly in PUA circles) that "dominant" = "jerk", and I think it gets people into trouble. Nice guy versus jerk is a totally separate dichotomy from dominant ("alpha") versus submissive ("beta"). IMO, a dominant nice guy will beat any other combination in most situations. Also IMO, a lot of the guys who say they're "too nice to get girls" are actually not that nice, and more typically, they are "submissive jerks". (Where "jerk" connotes narcissism/self-absorption and treating other people poorly and "submissive" implies lack of confidence, leadership, and spontaneity.)

In this context, dominance is not about jerkiness; it's really about self-confidence and posture. So much confidence and self-esteem that you can't be touched or changed or swayed by the world around you. Knowing who you are and what you want. Not faking anything or changing for anyone. Perhaps more succinctly, it's about a lack of fear. Fear is the mind-killer. It's also sex repellent.
Thanks Spartan, my fellow Murderland brother. That second paragraph is great it doesn't just apply to women and dating. I needed to read it as I'm going through some stressful times at the moment but need to remind myself that no matter what happens I am blessed and should be happy.

steveo73
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Re: How do ERE men attract women?

Post by steveo73 »

I've been thinking about this. I think its the same answer for ERE men as for all men. Lie about how good you are in the sack. It works every time.

iceet
Posts: 18
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Re: How do ERE men attract women?

Post by iceet »

jacob wrote:http://www.16personalities.com/intj-rel ... ips-dating

Since the moniker applies to a lot of people here, do consider that the "dating-scene" is really suboptimal terrain for doing battle for most of you [INTJs] as it exposes all your weaknesses (small talk, socializing, ambient noise filtering, having "fun"). You'd be much better off selecting venues where you can show your strengths (competence and depth) but selecting venues where there are potential candidates and some interaction.

Good places:
Trivial Pursuit clubs.
Political groups.
Cooking classes.
Online dating.

Bad places:
Swimming pools.
Physics club (unless you're female).
Welding 101 class.
Bars.
That was a great article. Made me realize sometimes I may be a little too idealistic in relationships sometimes.

Those are all great places. Add gym classes and outdoor group activities to that list if you're someone that likes nature and physical fitness.

I recommend http://www.meetup.org/ It's a great way to meet people with similar interests.

I like to think that finding and keeping a SO (that you truly desire) is the final frontier of ERE. It goes hand in hand with stabilized finances.

For the single men out there remember that you will have to go through many to find the one. Don't give up! Perhaps seek out bubbly, Extraversion (E) women as they have a tendency to make us feel alive. At least that has been my experience. It takes some effort to fully please them though you have to kind of know what they want.

Just remember, never settle! :D

And Jacob how's the weather up there in Chicago. I used to live there for school and miss it a lot. It's like a more accessible version of NY.

iceet
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Re: How do ERE men attract women?

Post by iceet »

steveo73 wrote:I've been thinking about this. I think its the same answer for ERE men as for all men. Lie about how good you are in the sack. It works every time.
Why lie, it's better to just BE good in the sack. That'll keep em coming back.

7Wannabe5
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Re: How do ERE men attract women?

Post by 7Wannabe5 »

Spartan Warrior said: In this context, dominance is not about jerkiness; it's really about self-confidence and posture. So much confidence and self-esteem that you can't be touched or changed or swayed by the world around you. Knowing who you are and what you want. Not faking anything or changing for anyone. Perhaps more succinctly, it's about a lack of fear. Fear is the mind-killer. It's also sex repellent.
Very true. The other true thing I would note is that being strong in the submissive pose or role also requires overcoming fear or anxiety. The dysfunctional range runs from weak/clingy/desperate/passive to arrogant/jerky/villainous. The functional range runs from submissive/open/receptive/accepting to dominant/purposeful/active/self-directed. So, anybody who is currently strong in their dominant will be actively pursuing their purpose in the direction of their truth with full consideration for the welfare of others but no fear of the reaction of others. The strong submissive pose can superficially seem like a passive pose because it commences with an analogy of overcoming fear in order to stay still and open but then you must be active-responsive in the follow. It's like what was once said about Ginger Rogers which was along the lines of "She had to do the same thing as Fred Astaire but backwards and in heels." The first time I was ever asked out on a date I was in the 5th grade and my immediate strong anxiety reaction was to knock over my young pursuer's bike with such force that something broke off of it. That is an example of weak-in-the-submissive behavior - lol. An example of weak-because-arrogant behavior in the dominant is offered in the book "Man of Steel and Velvet" (which I recommend with some major caveats along the lines that reading this book to learn modern sexual-dichotomy-based-relationship practice would be the equivalent of reading an engineering textbook from the 1960s in order to learn modern Physics) and it is quite relevant to this forum because it has to do with being too frugal. (I am paraphrasing from memory here) A couple is shopping for new linoleum for their kitchen and the wife is the partner who spends more time in the room. The husband (who has ultimate authority over finances in the relationship )highly values thrift so he arbitrarily declares that they will buy the red linoleum which is $1 square ft. vs. the yellow linoleum which is $1.10 square ft. even though his wife has clearly stated her strong preference for the color yellow because it seems more cheery to her and they can readily afford the extra .10 at the margin. An example of weak-in-the-dominant/lead behavior in a similar situation would be if the husband gave in to his wife's preferences for $5 square ft tile she wanted for status-reasons and they really couldn't afford because he was afraid of her emotional reactivity.

Another issue that frequently comes up in discussions in the realm of sexual-dichotomy is the damsel-in-distress/white-knight-rescuer model. Once again there are dysfunctional and functional versions of this type of interaction. The classic romantic novel "Persuasion" by Austen offers two examples in direct contrast. In one scene the excitement-seeking young Louisa encourages our hero Captain Wentworth to catch her as she jumps off a set of stairs. He agrees but she ends up seriously injuring herself. In another scene our heroine Anne is attempting to attend to one sick child as another child is jumping on her back and our hero Captain Wentworth, although he is very hurt/angry because previously rejected by Anne, approaches and removes the child from her back so she can continue with her nursing. Jane Austen herself noted that the character of Anne was almost "too good" to be believable and there are definitely reasons why excitement-seeking behavior in a submissive is not to be completely avoided (lol) but these examples are in alignment with the rule-of-thumb that you should generally avoid riding white knight to the results of insanity but should strive to ride white knight to strong behavior in the maternal. IOW, help female get cat out of tree (good.) Help female pay off gambling debts (bad.)

itsagreatday
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Re: How do ERE men attract women?

Post by itsagreatday »

iceet wrote:
steveo73 wrote:I've been thinking about this. I think its the same answer for ERE men as for all men. Lie about how good you are in the sack. It works every time.
Why lie, it's better to just BE good in the sack. That'll keep em coming back.
Unless you are just looking for hook-ups stop focusing on sex so much! Really, a man who is teachable and eager to please is more than sufficient when sex becomes a factor in a relationship. One of the problems I find (as a woman dating and meeting men online) is that many men think we need to sleep together before embarking on a relationship. I think we need to be in a relationship before having sex. If you are looking for a quality woman for a long term relationship sex really shouldn't be top of mind initially...

George the original one
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Re: How do ERE men attract women?

Post by George the original one »

> I think we need to be in a relationship before having sex.

I take it you've never had the "click" experience? Where both of you just KNOW what's going to happen?

steveo73
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Re: How do ERE men attract women?

Post by steveo73 »

iceet wrote:
steveo73 wrote:I've been thinking about this. I think its the same answer for ERE men as for all men. Lie about how good you are in the sack. It works every time.
Why lie, it's better to just BE good in the sack. That'll keep em coming back.
I typically lose interest after the first event.

itsagreatday
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Re: How do ERE men attract women?

Post by itsagreatday »

George the original one wrote:> I think we need to be in a relationship before having sex.

I take it you've never had the "click" experience? Where both of you just KNOW what's going to happen?
Nope. Not once. No one night stands nor love at first sight. I generally have to know a man's mind, personality, character, etc. before I am really attracted. I have a ton of self-control, responsibility and ability to defer gratification (aka ERE traits) that even when I am really attracted I can't imagine acting on it immediately. We'd have to talk about birth control and STDs, I'd have to feel safe with him, he would have to make sense as a potential partner, etc. Besides, sex without love isn't really satisfying. Sure, it could be fun (like spending sprees can be fun for those strange, non-ERE types) but it would not make me happy long term (like financial freedom.) My world-view in terms of money, sex and life in general are quite well aligned. But back to sex, a slower build up of anticipation is ... very arousing ;)

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GandK
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Re: How do ERE men attract women?

Post by GandK »

steveo73 wrote:Lie about how good you are in the sack. It works every time.
No, because "good in the sack" is subjective. What one woman likes, another doesn't. Give me a listener who's more focused on me than on sex. An attitude of exploration is more fun than "suaveness" anyway.

Also, in my experience, while (regrettably) there's no reliable early relationship indicator of whether a man will be good in bed, there's a very reliable indicator of whether he will be bad in bed, and that's self-centeredness. While few women want an obsequious man, if a guy won't pay much attention to my needs and preferences out of bed, that's a flashing neon sign that he'll be all about himself in bed, too.
itsagreatday wrote:Really, a man who is teachable and eager to please is more than sufficient when sex becomes a factor in a relationship.
+1. This is absolutely right.

George the original one
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Re: How do ERE men attract women?

Post by George the original one »

itsagreatday wrote:We'd have to talk about birth control and STDs, I'd have to feel safe with him, he would have to make sense as a potential partner, etc.
5 minutes of honest Q&A, no problem. Not being direct just costs time.

itsagreatday wrote:Besides, sex without love isn't really satisfying.
100% agreement here!

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