A Journey of Mindfulness--the Remaking of Life in Midstream.
Re: A Journey of Mindfulness--the Remaking of Life in Midstream.
There is the basic single leg stance (SLS) test to start with. The real test there is eyes open vs. closed. I would just make a basic cognitive shift - begin viewing putting socks and shoes on as an exercise routine. It begins with doing it standing up as opposed to sitting down. Like the old fart version of the Karate Kid waxing on and waxing off. The inversion of the child/parent relationship reaches full circle the first time we have to tie the shoes of an elderly parent. Best to militate against that as long as possible.
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IlliniDave
- Posts: 4177
- Joined: Wed Apr 02, 2014 7:46 pm
Re: A Journey of Mindfulness--the Remaking of Life in Midstream.
YearEnd2024 -> 2025
Looking forward to 2025 I'm starting to sense an amount of restlessness emerging. I know the term usually has a negative association, akin to dissatisfaction, and that's not what I mean by it. Maybe saying I feel a stirring would capture it better, but that's sort of nebulous. I've now had 3 full calendar years in Phase III, 2022-2024. Life writ large has served up a number of challenges, but if I focus the lens on the part of life that deals with maintaining resources (in the most general sense) to provide for the basic needs of staying alive along with supporting a dash of enjoyment/enrichment, it's been easy. Easy enough it's embarrassing, tbh. I'm not saying that's a bad thing but it leaves a void. Even though I was probably the archetype of an over-saver/over-planner, I still had a (mostly subconscious) expectation that I'd have to draw on all my wits and inner resources to keep failure at bay. By failure I mean collapse of my lifestyle, and within that financial collapse would be the principal item of concern because I went what's known here as the fatFIRE route, and money was my quick strike capability. I had fantasies fighting a desperate and noble (and brilliant, of course) rear guard action for survival.
But that's just not happening, and it's hard to see it happening in the future save the arrival of a this-changes-everything black swan. I've never been one to live on edge, flinching at every shadow while dedicating my energy to maintaining a vigil for catastrophe. The struggle I'd imagined was much more of a day-to-day one, tactical rather than strategic. I can't say if any of that was wise or unwise, and assessing that isn't really of much interest. The reality of the situation is that I'm here where I am, with somewhat more internal energy/resource reserve than I thought I'd have.
That said, I am going to make an effort to be more mindful of my spending in 2025, and by that I mean simply trying to curb some spending in the health/fitness area, and with some of my hobbies (mostly fishing). I don't feel like I spend extravagantly in either but I tend to be a little impulsive and occasionally throw down some money that in hindsight I could have held onto without any real loss in quality of life.
Another thing I think I'm going to do is to withdraw some money from the stash. Not much, and I'm unsure what I'm going to do with it. I just want to break the ice on that. Pulling some money out back in 2014 to cover part of the cost of buying the hideout was very therapeutic for me. If I'm honest I'm once again feeling a little like a hoarder when it comes to the stash, and as silly as it seems, I think pulling a little out of my taxable account will help give me a healthier perspective on it.
I think of the period between Christmas and the new year as an interlude and the theme this year is exploring ideas for how to deploy my internal surplus without cluttering things up. I've arrived at a balance I'm comfortable and happy with.
I'm prone to beating drums for as long as the pulse has utility, and in line with that I'm going to be looking to extend and expand my quest for wellness and healthy aging. There are a few people who have known me personally over the last several years and think of me as the role model for grabbing the bull by the horns and taking responsibility for my health. Sadly, just like when my quest was to take responsibility for my financial well being, the response was usually "Gee, you're really lucky. I wish I could do that." Anyway, when I look in the mirror after getting some sort of acknowledgement of what success I've had, I feel like a fraud. Not that I haven't had true measurable success, but I'm still leaving a lot on the table. Even though being unusually sound physically for my demographic cohort is something I take pride in, some of the effort to get there sort of sucks. Actually, very little of it is stuff I'd do without a big fat carrot dangling in front of my nose. That's why I'm so keen on biohacking. If I can get 80% of the potential benefit with 20% of the effort, sign me up! And the claims that go with some of the biohackers is that you can get even more benefit than is even possible following conventional wisdom for that same small fraction of required "effort".
I've also evolved to be unafraid to go against the established grain (you could say Medicine 3.0 versus Medicine 2.0). Coming into 2025 I'm actually encouraged that we might see the beginnings of enlightenment when it comes to a new understanding of lifestyle-nutrition-healthcare over the next few years. The powers and interests arrayed and motivated to preserve the status quo are formidable, so true reform and overhaul are probably a ways out still, but maybe some of the deception that's peddled by sources regarded as trustworthy (but who in practice are awash in conflicts of interest) can be disinfected via exposure to a dose of sunlight and thereby some seeds sown.
So what does that mean to me in 2025? I'm too old to wait around for a system that would truly take care of me to emerge, so I'll remain in my N=1 experimental realm. I've learned a lot about what works for me over the last year, but I've yet to completely leverage that knowledge. Since a healthy mind and body underpin nearly everything I want to do with my time, I'm going to attempt to push myself beyond good enough.
Specific to nutrition, I'm going to put a big emphasis on getting as close to eliminating seed oils from my diet as I can. The list I'm working from is
Corn oil
Soybean oil
Sunflower oil
Cottonseed oil
Safflower oil
Grapeseed oil
Rice bran oil
Rapeseed (canola) oil
Palm oil
Peanut oil
In practice I'm going to shun any plant-based oil with the exceptions of EVOO and avocado oil, with the notable exception of C8 and C10 MCT oil, which in my reckoning is a supplement. The names caprylic and capric acid point to the fact both are components of goat milk/dairy, although they can be extracted from the flesh of coconuts with minimal processing. EVOO and avocado oil are also pressed from the flesh of the fruit, rather than the seeds. That's not to say I won't eat nuts or sunflower seeds on occasion, or whatever. But seed oils as food ingredients or for cooking are out. I began being more rigorous about checking labels, and it's surprising how nearly ubiquitous they've become.
My basic nutrition regimen will essentially be Mediterranean in composition but heavier on animal protein and lighter on grains than is standard. I've gone through a lot of inconvenience trying to follow Dr Gundry's advice regarding avoidance of plant foods that contain lectins some fraction of the population is susceptible to. I'm going to loosen up on that while trying to be mindful of any potential negative effect. Mostly I just want bell peppers and zucchini back in my life, lol. Many of the other plant based foods I jettisoned I don't miss at all, which maybe indicates they were problematic for me.
I'm looking to both optimize and streamline the nutritional supplements I take. I've done a lot of experimentation in this area. My goal is to combine a group of general healthy aging supplements with a few selected to potentially help weaker areas in my test results. I think I've pretty much got those covered, and the task is largely discontinuing when there's not a biomarker-driven reason and/or I have too much redundancy.
Exercise is likely to be he area I attempt the most aggressive update. I mentioned an aunt and an uncle, both of whom are within 20 years of my age, and both had "simple" falls that have set them back considerably. As in having to use a walker to get around (hopefully temporary for both of them). So balance, flexibility, and a good amount of healthy muscle, both to back the balance, and provide shock absorption are priorities. And to keep my hormones sharp and preserve V02max, I want to incorporate HIIT in a more consistent and useful manner.
In my function test results I have a number of markers I would like to do better with, and they are all things that can be negatively impacted by stress. Closely linked to that is sleep. So I'm going to try some things in the area of meditation and relaxation techniques that iDave of days past would have thought a little wooish and new agey. I've never really lived up to the title of this journal thread, although for several years I made informal attempts to truly install mindfulness into my day-to-day existence. I'm going to try some more structured things, and I'm going to start with a number of exercises that are programmed into the Oura Ring app.
My thoughts and planning are still a little fluid so there may be updates or changes in the coming days.
Looking forward to 2025 I'm starting to sense an amount of restlessness emerging. I know the term usually has a negative association, akin to dissatisfaction, and that's not what I mean by it. Maybe saying I feel a stirring would capture it better, but that's sort of nebulous. I've now had 3 full calendar years in Phase III, 2022-2024. Life writ large has served up a number of challenges, but if I focus the lens on the part of life that deals with maintaining resources (in the most general sense) to provide for the basic needs of staying alive along with supporting a dash of enjoyment/enrichment, it's been easy. Easy enough it's embarrassing, tbh. I'm not saying that's a bad thing but it leaves a void. Even though I was probably the archetype of an over-saver/over-planner, I still had a (mostly subconscious) expectation that I'd have to draw on all my wits and inner resources to keep failure at bay. By failure I mean collapse of my lifestyle, and within that financial collapse would be the principal item of concern because I went what's known here as the fatFIRE route, and money was my quick strike capability. I had fantasies fighting a desperate and noble (and brilliant, of course) rear guard action for survival.
But that's just not happening, and it's hard to see it happening in the future save the arrival of a this-changes-everything black swan. I've never been one to live on edge, flinching at every shadow while dedicating my energy to maintaining a vigil for catastrophe. The struggle I'd imagined was much more of a day-to-day one, tactical rather than strategic. I can't say if any of that was wise or unwise, and assessing that isn't really of much interest. The reality of the situation is that I'm here where I am, with somewhat more internal energy/resource reserve than I thought I'd have.
That said, I am going to make an effort to be more mindful of my spending in 2025, and by that I mean simply trying to curb some spending in the health/fitness area, and with some of my hobbies (mostly fishing). I don't feel like I spend extravagantly in either but I tend to be a little impulsive and occasionally throw down some money that in hindsight I could have held onto without any real loss in quality of life.
Another thing I think I'm going to do is to withdraw some money from the stash. Not much, and I'm unsure what I'm going to do with it. I just want to break the ice on that. Pulling some money out back in 2014 to cover part of the cost of buying the hideout was very therapeutic for me. If I'm honest I'm once again feeling a little like a hoarder when it comes to the stash, and as silly as it seems, I think pulling a little out of my taxable account will help give me a healthier perspective on it.
I think of the period between Christmas and the new year as an interlude and the theme this year is exploring ideas for how to deploy my internal surplus without cluttering things up. I've arrived at a balance I'm comfortable and happy with.
I'm prone to beating drums for as long as the pulse has utility, and in line with that I'm going to be looking to extend and expand my quest for wellness and healthy aging. There are a few people who have known me personally over the last several years and think of me as the role model for grabbing the bull by the horns and taking responsibility for my health. Sadly, just like when my quest was to take responsibility for my financial well being, the response was usually "Gee, you're really lucky. I wish I could do that." Anyway, when I look in the mirror after getting some sort of acknowledgement of what success I've had, I feel like a fraud. Not that I haven't had true measurable success, but I'm still leaving a lot on the table. Even though being unusually sound physically for my demographic cohort is something I take pride in, some of the effort to get there sort of sucks. Actually, very little of it is stuff I'd do without a big fat carrot dangling in front of my nose. That's why I'm so keen on biohacking. If I can get 80% of the potential benefit with 20% of the effort, sign me up! And the claims that go with some of the biohackers is that you can get even more benefit than is even possible following conventional wisdom for that same small fraction of required "effort".
I've also evolved to be unafraid to go against the established grain (you could say Medicine 3.0 versus Medicine 2.0). Coming into 2025 I'm actually encouraged that we might see the beginnings of enlightenment when it comes to a new understanding of lifestyle-nutrition-healthcare over the next few years. The powers and interests arrayed and motivated to preserve the status quo are formidable, so true reform and overhaul are probably a ways out still, but maybe some of the deception that's peddled by sources regarded as trustworthy (but who in practice are awash in conflicts of interest) can be disinfected via exposure to a dose of sunlight and thereby some seeds sown.
So what does that mean to me in 2025? I'm too old to wait around for a system that would truly take care of me to emerge, so I'll remain in my N=1 experimental realm. I've learned a lot about what works for me over the last year, but I've yet to completely leverage that knowledge. Since a healthy mind and body underpin nearly everything I want to do with my time, I'm going to attempt to push myself beyond good enough.
Specific to nutrition, I'm going to put a big emphasis on getting as close to eliminating seed oils from my diet as I can. The list I'm working from is
Corn oil
Soybean oil
Sunflower oil
Cottonseed oil
Safflower oil
Grapeseed oil
Rice bran oil
Rapeseed (canola) oil
Palm oil
Peanut oil
In practice I'm going to shun any plant-based oil with the exceptions of EVOO and avocado oil, with the notable exception of C8 and C10 MCT oil, which in my reckoning is a supplement. The names caprylic and capric acid point to the fact both are components of goat milk/dairy, although they can be extracted from the flesh of coconuts with minimal processing. EVOO and avocado oil are also pressed from the flesh of the fruit, rather than the seeds. That's not to say I won't eat nuts or sunflower seeds on occasion, or whatever. But seed oils as food ingredients or for cooking are out. I began being more rigorous about checking labels, and it's surprising how nearly ubiquitous they've become.
My basic nutrition regimen will essentially be Mediterranean in composition but heavier on animal protein and lighter on grains than is standard. I've gone through a lot of inconvenience trying to follow Dr Gundry's advice regarding avoidance of plant foods that contain lectins some fraction of the population is susceptible to. I'm going to loosen up on that while trying to be mindful of any potential negative effect. Mostly I just want bell peppers and zucchini back in my life, lol. Many of the other plant based foods I jettisoned I don't miss at all, which maybe indicates they were problematic for me.
I'm looking to both optimize and streamline the nutritional supplements I take. I've done a lot of experimentation in this area. My goal is to combine a group of general healthy aging supplements with a few selected to potentially help weaker areas in my test results. I think I've pretty much got those covered, and the task is largely discontinuing when there's not a biomarker-driven reason and/or I have too much redundancy.
Exercise is likely to be he area I attempt the most aggressive update. I mentioned an aunt and an uncle, both of whom are within 20 years of my age, and both had "simple" falls that have set them back considerably. As in having to use a walker to get around (hopefully temporary for both of them). So balance, flexibility, and a good amount of healthy muscle, both to back the balance, and provide shock absorption are priorities. And to keep my hormones sharp and preserve V02max, I want to incorporate HIIT in a more consistent and useful manner.
In my function test results I have a number of markers I would like to do better with, and they are all things that can be negatively impacted by stress. Closely linked to that is sleep. So I'm going to try some things in the area of meditation and relaxation techniques that iDave of days past would have thought a little wooish and new agey. I've never really lived up to the title of this journal thread, although for several years I made informal attempts to truly install mindfulness into my day-to-day existence. I'm going to try some more structured things, and I'm going to start with a number of exercises that are programmed into the Oura Ring app.
My thoughts and planning are still a little fluid so there may be updates or changes in the coming days.
Re: A Journey of Mindfulness--the Remaking of Life in Midstream.
I'm confused - what are you doing with the money you pull from the stash? Won't these changes demand less spending?
The realization you can do nothing until you die, is a little sobering eh? I'm putting significant energy there in 2025 as well. My planning has centered upon value aligned play. Living in ways that affirm both my personal limits and the person I want to be.
There's an interesting tension between essentially unbounded resources for consumption, and the rewards of production. Especially as it relates to community. Axel's book dropped at an ideal time for me.
The realization you can do nothing until you die, is a little sobering eh? I'm putting significant energy there in 2025 as well. My planning has centered upon value aligned play. Living in ways that affirm both my personal limits and the person I want to be.
There's an interesting tension between essentially unbounded resources for consumption, and the rewards of production. Especially as it relates to community. Axel's book dropped at an ideal time for me.
You're smart to address this ASAP. When life happens, our behaviors built upon will power regress. It's a big part of why I skip "optimal" when it isn't enjoyable. If I can't sustain it for a decade, there's not much point in forcing myself today. Remove the stimulus, lose the adaptation. The body returns to homeostasis surprisingly fast.IlliniDave wrote: ↑Tue Dec 31, 2024 9:39 amActually, very little of it is stuff I'd do without a big fat carrot dangling in front of my nose. That's why I'm so keen on biohacking. If I can get 80% of the potential benefit with 20% of the effort, sign me up!
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IlliniDave
- Posts: 4177
- Joined: Wed Apr 02, 2014 7:46 pm
Re: A Journey of Mindfulness--the Remaking of Life in Midstream.
Hey Scott, happy new year!
I don't know what exactly I'd do with the money. Maybe use it for my 2025 HSA contribution, or maybe for some cabin improvements, or just pad my emergency fund. It's not about the utility, more about trying to ensure a psychological barrier doesn't get too rigid and cause me problems later on down the road.
Yes, one of the days I dread is the day I realize that I'm essentially confined to a house, or a room, or a bed, without much to do but to wait to die. I'd like to squeeze those two junctures together as much as possible. And you're right, at a certain point in life if you let physical capacity slip away due to inactivity, it's nearly impossible to regain.
Re: A Journey of Mindfulness--the Remaking of Life in Midstream.
You can donate it towards repairs at Trash Place 
( /jk obviously)
( /jk obviously)
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IlliniDave
- Posts: 4177
- Joined: Wed Apr 02, 2014 7:46 pm
Re: A Journey of Mindfulness--the Remaking of Life in Midstream.
YearEnd2024 Addendum
I've just recently got my 2024 bookkeeping closed and am fairly current with 2025 so far. I'm going to mention a few numbers as an addendum to my 2024 Year End write up.
Inflation is finally started to catch up with me, my 2024 spending was the highest for a full retired year I've had. It was still comfortably below (by over $700/month) my retirement annuity income. In the last set of forward-looking projections before retiring I was anticipating that this year I would start having to draw down from the stash to meet conservative estimates of living expenses, but I think it's safe to say I can leave the stash untouched. Lifestyle inflation was the main culprit--adding a lot of nutritional supplements and choosing higher quality food account for nearly all the uptick. I should also note that I don't include capital improvements on the hideout as part of living expenses, but rather consider them as moving money from one investment vehicle to another. That's a debatable view, I know, as it's uncertain and probably unlikely that the renovations will pay for themselves if assessed down the road with a sharp pencil. Nevertheless, it's the way I decided to handle it because of my fixation on what my day-to-day lifestyle consumption needs are.
I used to report an "instantaneous equivalent withdrawal rate". 'Instantaneous' in that it's computed based on the present month's expenses compared to the stash balance on the last day of the prior month. 'Equivalent' because I'm not actually withdrawing the money. Since I've retired that average is 2.24%. The average for 2024 was 2.10%. The reason it is lower despite my 2024 expenses being the highest during retirement is because the stash grew underneath it.
At the end of last year the stash was up 11.4% since retirement and 10.1% for the year. So I'm Back in Black as AC/DC would say.
I also have an automatic calculation of what a monthly portion of a 3% withdrawal rate of the stash would be. That number after I take a swag at tax liability is now about equal to my retirement annuity income net of taxes, meaning I could double my monthly outlays with what I feel would be a fairly "safe" withdrawal rate. There's no practical advantage to that since I am looking to rein spending in this year relative to 2024. But it does provide some peace of mind during cold January nights when worst-case possibilities come to mind.
I'm sure I've mentioned this before. Obviously I was an over-saver, fatFIRE, financially uber conservative, dude while preparing to retire. But during 2022-2023 when the stash was sharply down and inflation seemed to be surging I weathered it without any distress since I was prepared for much worse financial stress. I still could have pulled the plug a few years sooner and survived the period living what to me is a fairly comfortable life. But I'm certain my stress levels would have been much higher.
I've just recently got my 2024 bookkeeping closed and am fairly current with 2025 so far. I'm going to mention a few numbers as an addendum to my 2024 Year End write up.
Inflation is finally started to catch up with me, my 2024 spending was the highest for a full retired year I've had. It was still comfortably below (by over $700/month) my retirement annuity income. In the last set of forward-looking projections before retiring I was anticipating that this year I would start having to draw down from the stash to meet conservative estimates of living expenses, but I think it's safe to say I can leave the stash untouched. Lifestyle inflation was the main culprit--adding a lot of nutritional supplements and choosing higher quality food account for nearly all the uptick. I should also note that I don't include capital improvements on the hideout as part of living expenses, but rather consider them as moving money from one investment vehicle to another. That's a debatable view, I know, as it's uncertain and probably unlikely that the renovations will pay for themselves if assessed down the road with a sharp pencil. Nevertheless, it's the way I decided to handle it because of my fixation on what my day-to-day lifestyle consumption needs are.
I used to report an "instantaneous equivalent withdrawal rate". 'Instantaneous' in that it's computed based on the present month's expenses compared to the stash balance on the last day of the prior month. 'Equivalent' because I'm not actually withdrawing the money. Since I've retired that average is 2.24%. The average for 2024 was 2.10%. The reason it is lower despite my 2024 expenses being the highest during retirement is because the stash grew underneath it.
At the end of last year the stash was up 11.4% since retirement and 10.1% for the year. So I'm Back in Black as AC/DC would say.
I also have an automatic calculation of what a monthly portion of a 3% withdrawal rate of the stash would be. That number after I take a swag at tax liability is now about equal to my retirement annuity income net of taxes, meaning I could double my monthly outlays with what I feel would be a fairly "safe" withdrawal rate. There's no practical advantage to that since I am looking to rein spending in this year relative to 2024. But it does provide some peace of mind during cold January nights when worst-case possibilities come to mind.
I'm sure I've mentioned this before. Obviously I was an over-saver, fatFIRE, financially uber conservative, dude while preparing to retire. But during 2022-2023 when the stash was sharply down and inflation seemed to be surging I weathered it without any distress since I was prepared for much worse financial stress. I still could have pulled the plug a few years sooner and survived the period living what to me is a fairly comfortable life. But I'm certain my stress levels would have been much higher.
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IlliniDave
- Posts: 4177
- Joined: Wed Apr 02, 2014 7:46 pm
Re: A Journey of Mindfulness--the Remaking of Life in Midstream.
Some data mined from Oura
I've now been wearing an Oura ring for a little over a year. I decided to do a comparison of the first calendar month (Jan 24) with the this month's month-to-date numbers. In both cases it's a comparison of about 3 weeks worth of data.
The numbers in general are daily averages for the respective time period
Sleep Related
(parameter/Jan 2024 value/Jan 2025 value)
Total Sleep/6h1m/6h40m
Sleep Score/70/78
REM/48m/47m
Deep Sleep/0h58m/1h8m
Sleep Efficiency/81%/81%
Activity Related
Activity Burn/189 cal/592 cal
Activity Goal Completion/47%/141%
Step Equivalent/4,080/10,558
Inactive Time/9h52m/8h15m
Activity Score/62/95
Readiness and Stress
Readiness Score/82/81
Resting Heart Rate/48bpm/51bpm
Stress/28m/13m
I've put a fair amount of effort into improving my sleep over the last year. A quick glance at the numbers might suggest I've seen some improvement, but one thing I've observed is that my sleep seems cyclical with a periodicity of a few months. As an example, here are my sleep scores by month
01/24 70
02/24 74
03/24 79
04/24 81
05/24 80
06/24 69
07/24 65
08/24 62
09/24 63
10/24 66
11/24 71
12/24 74
01/25 78
(above 70 = good, above 85 = optimal)
The big surprise was how the falloff in sleep score correlated with my time at the hideout (last week of May though end of September). Not surprisingly my activity goal completion was above the 2024 full-year average for those months (124% for the year, 134%-161% for those months). So for me being active during the day doesn't necessarily lead to sleeping well at night. One thing I'm going to try is getting a decent quality mattress topper for my hideout bed.
My resting heart rate is one I like to keep an eye on. In Oura-speak resting heart rate is the lowest rate during sleep for a given night. Mine's gone up which I think in general isn't a good thing. The only benign explanation I can come up with is that it's related to my emphasis on strength training/muscle increase over the last half of the year.
Overall I'm encouraged by the sleep trends but not ready to declare victory. There's also a question of apples-to-apples because Oura has updated both the ring's firmware and app several times during 2024 to improve algorithms and accuracy.
The activity-related things are mostly indicative of my behavior rather than evidence of improving health. And it's one of the areas Oura has made several improvements/expansions to functionality. It's now better at detecting when I've been active for a period of time and will notify me so that I can confirm the activity. A simple example is shoveling snow. A year ago I could shovel snow and the ring wouldn't detect I'd done anything (though it wouldn't count the time as 'inactive' either). Now it detects periods of activity, gathers finer resolution data during the period, and prompts me to confirm it afterward. So now I can call shoveling snow a "moderate intensity yard work" activity (for a medium shoveling job) and I get 'credit for a few more calories expended in activity. A surprise is that I've taken to spending more time playing my guitar while standing, versus sitting, and that makes a difference in my scores. Sitting is the new smoking I guess.
A caveat is that I can't speak to the accuracy of the calorie numbers (and many other parameters). For example when on the rowing machine, Oura gives me credit for fewer calories expended than the Concept2 itself does. No idea which is more correct but I lean towards the rower because it can actually measure the energy I put into the flywheel. So even though as I mentioned, Oura has evolved algorithmically, I'm looking at trends rather than fixating on hitting certain numbers.
I think the improved activity detection in the ring might play a role in the stress time number. It's physiological stress the ring purports to measure, and it's possible that the improved activity detection resulted in some stress time moved to the activity bucket. The ring does not report physiological stress during periods of detected activity.
I plan to revisit this again, maybe in 6 months, or maybe quarterly, to get some year-over-year data for periods longer than a month. That means I'll have to do some of the calculating myself as Oura app skips from monthly averages to yearly averages with nothing in between.
I paid somewhere between $300-$400 for the ring plus app subscription. So far I haven't been able to convincingly leverage the information I get from it to make major improvements in health and well being. As a general nerd I like having the data, even when I don't see the trends I'm aiming for, so in that sense it's worth it. One of the more interesting things about it is that it alerted me one day that I was possibly coming down with something, and the next day I woke up sick with my first ever bout of covid.
I've now been wearing an Oura ring for a little over a year. I decided to do a comparison of the first calendar month (Jan 24) with the this month's month-to-date numbers. In both cases it's a comparison of about 3 weeks worth of data.
The numbers in general are daily averages for the respective time period
Sleep Related
(parameter/Jan 2024 value/Jan 2025 value)
Total Sleep/6h1m/6h40m
Sleep Score/70/78
REM/48m/47m
Deep Sleep/0h58m/1h8m
Sleep Efficiency/81%/81%
Activity Related
Activity Burn/189 cal/592 cal
Activity Goal Completion/47%/141%
Step Equivalent/4,080/10,558
Inactive Time/9h52m/8h15m
Activity Score/62/95
Readiness and Stress
Readiness Score/82/81
Resting Heart Rate/48bpm/51bpm
Stress/28m/13m
I've put a fair amount of effort into improving my sleep over the last year. A quick glance at the numbers might suggest I've seen some improvement, but one thing I've observed is that my sleep seems cyclical with a periodicity of a few months. As an example, here are my sleep scores by month
01/24 70
02/24 74
03/24 79
04/24 81
05/24 80
06/24 69
07/24 65
08/24 62
09/24 63
10/24 66
11/24 71
12/24 74
01/25 78
(above 70 = good, above 85 = optimal)
The big surprise was how the falloff in sleep score correlated with my time at the hideout (last week of May though end of September). Not surprisingly my activity goal completion was above the 2024 full-year average for those months (124% for the year, 134%-161% for those months). So for me being active during the day doesn't necessarily lead to sleeping well at night. One thing I'm going to try is getting a decent quality mattress topper for my hideout bed.
My resting heart rate is one I like to keep an eye on. In Oura-speak resting heart rate is the lowest rate during sleep for a given night. Mine's gone up which I think in general isn't a good thing. The only benign explanation I can come up with is that it's related to my emphasis on strength training/muscle increase over the last half of the year.
Overall I'm encouraged by the sleep trends but not ready to declare victory. There's also a question of apples-to-apples because Oura has updated both the ring's firmware and app several times during 2024 to improve algorithms and accuracy.
The activity-related things are mostly indicative of my behavior rather than evidence of improving health. And it's one of the areas Oura has made several improvements/expansions to functionality. It's now better at detecting when I've been active for a period of time and will notify me so that I can confirm the activity. A simple example is shoveling snow. A year ago I could shovel snow and the ring wouldn't detect I'd done anything (though it wouldn't count the time as 'inactive' either). Now it detects periods of activity, gathers finer resolution data during the period, and prompts me to confirm it afterward. So now I can call shoveling snow a "moderate intensity yard work" activity (for a medium shoveling job) and I get 'credit for a few more calories expended in activity. A surprise is that I've taken to spending more time playing my guitar while standing, versus sitting, and that makes a difference in my scores. Sitting is the new smoking I guess.
A caveat is that I can't speak to the accuracy of the calorie numbers (and many other parameters). For example when on the rowing machine, Oura gives me credit for fewer calories expended than the Concept2 itself does. No idea which is more correct but I lean towards the rower because it can actually measure the energy I put into the flywheel. So even though as I mentioned, Oura has evolved algorithmically, I'm looking at trends rather than fixating on hitting certain numbers.
I think the improved activity detection in the ring might play a role in the stress time number. It's physiological stress the ring purports to measure, and it's possible that the improved activity detection resulted in some stress time moved to the activity bucket. The ring does not report physiological stress during periods of detected activity.
I plan to revisit this again, maybe in 6 months, or maybe quarterly, to get some year-over-year data for periods longer than a month. That means I'll have to do some of the calculating myself as Oura app skips from monthly averages to yearly averages with nothing in between.
I paid somewhere between $300-$400 for the ring plus app subscription. So far I haven't been able to convincingly leverage the information I get from it to make major improvements in health and well being. As a general nerd I like having the data, even when I don't see the trends I'm aiming for, so in that sense it's worth it. One of the more interesting things about it is that it alerted me one day that I was possibly coming down with something, and the next day I woke up sick with my first ever bout of covid.
Re: A Journey of Mindfulness--the Remaking of Life in Midstream.
I don't think it's being at the hideout or activity, those are the longest days/shortest nights and the sun comes up earliest. One has a bit more slack to sleep in naturally when the sun comes up later
Re: A Journey of Mindfulness--the Remaking of Life in Midstream.
For what it's with, I don't think absolute measures of calories work in physiological systems. There are too many assumptions.
Concept 2 assumes a flat base amount for the energy moving a 175lb body on the slide, then adds watts converted to calories. It's ignoring your weight, base metabolic rate, stroke rate, efficiency, etc
The relative measure is all I've found useful. IE did I do ten percent more? Because if this, I prefer a tracker as the basis. The assumptions are consistently wrong, meaning I can ignore them in the relative measure.
It's interesting to see the oura data in practice. Thanks for sharing that. I can't say it motivates me to take on a recurring fee, opposed to my Garmin.
Concept 2 assumes a flat base amount for the energy moving a 175lb body on the slide, then adds watts converted to calories. It's ignoring your weight, base metabolic rate, stroke rate, efficiency, etc
The relative measure is all I've found useful. IE did I do ten percent more? Because if this, I prefer a tracker as the basis. The assumptions are consistently wrong, meaning I can ignore them in the relative measure.
It's interesting to see the oura data in practice. Thanks for sharing that. I can't say it motivates me to take on a recurring fee, opposed to my Garmin.
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IlliniDave
- Posts: 4177
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Re: A Journey of Mindfulness--the Remaking of Life in Midstream.
Hey ertyu. That's something I definitely considered, and the hideout's at a pretty high latitude for the continental US which exaggerates length-of-day changes. The evidence counter to that is that in May my overall sleep numbers where among the highest, and May is closer to the solstice than, say, August and September. However, I'm confident the longer days play some role, just not sure how much.
Another variable I considered is temperature. I don't have data on it for last year, but usually the warmest time of the year is latter July/early August up there and that lines up a little better with the center of the relatively poor sleep window. I'll see again in another 5-6 months, but it could be that my sleep will be more typical this coming summer.
I don't remember in years past feeling like I wasn't sleeping well there, would have guessed the opposite, and even though the numbers were low last summer I never really felt like I was sleep deprived.
And per Oura I'm a "morning chronotype", and for me "sleeping in" means staying in bed past 500AM. So most of the year I'm up before sunrise while it's dark, and up there near the solstice I'm up during dawn twilight, which begins around 300AM at midsummer. I also go to bed up there before full night for the weeks surrounding the solstice.
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IlliniDave
- Posts: 4177
- Joined: Wed Apr 02, 2014 7:46 pm
Re: A Journey of Mindfulness--the Remaking of Life in Midstream.
Hey Scott,Scott 2 wrote: ↑Sat Jan 25, 2025 11:59 amFor what it's with, I don't think absolute measures of calories work in physiological systems. There are too many assumptions.
Concept 2 assumes a flat base amount for the energy moving a 175lb body on the slide, then adds watts converted to calories. It's ignoring your weight, base metabolic rate, stroke rate, efficiency, etc
The relative measure is all I've found useful. IE did I do ten percent more? Because if this, I prefer a tracker as the basis. The assumptions are consistently wrong, meaning I can ignore them in the relative measure.
It's interesting to see the oura data in practice. Thanks for sharing that. I can't say it motivates me to take on a recurring fee, opposed to my Garmin.
I'm with you on the relative aspect of it. Like you said, x% more (or less) has more meaning than the calorie count estimates.
If I knew someone who liked to nerd out on data and was looking for a convenient wearable device to track some biometric data without wanting a full-up fitness tracker, I'd recommend it. Otherwise, it might not have the utility to make it worth the money. The subscription is $6/month which is a little annoying. The thing still works without it, just, iirc, can't back up the data to the cloud and don't get some of the summary reports/analysis that app can do. I don't know if that's worth $6/month, but for now I'm subscribed.
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IlliniDave
- Posts: 4177
- Joined: Wed Apr 02, 2014 7:46 pm
Re: A Journey of Mindfulness--the Remaking of Life in Midstream.
2025 February Check-in
On the mundane side of things, financially everything is going fine. Spending was down from January and respectable given the lifestyle I've settled into. I'm getting ready to start my income taxes. Even though I could start sooner my habit from the old days was to start at the beginning of March when certain tax forms could be mailed out as late as the last day of February. As usual, I don't expect too much interesting with those. I think I have my withholding dialed in pretty good and expect in the ballpark of $1,000 back from both state and federal.
Lots happening on the health and fitness front. I'd been having some trouble with my left shoulder. I started with 6 weeks of rest from the heavy upper body movements with the X3 bands. That did no good so I tried some myofascial therapy provided by my youngest sister. That was great as far as loosening me up and reliving some chronic muscle tension in my upper back, but it did not have much effect the actual issue. I then started seeing a chiropractor she recommended. He is somewhat of an athlete (for a guy in his 50s) so kind of "gets it" where I'm coming from. He concurred with my sister in noting my left shoulder blade was a little out of place, due to a combination of generic old man inflexibility and some muscular imbalance and tension (chronic) in my upper torso. He's been working on alignment/loosening of my upper spine, and alignment of the shoulder blade. Along with the treatments he proscribed some what I call therapeutic band exercises that I use my original relatively light bands to perform, as well as some stretches. Over the last 2-3 weeks (about a month after I started working with him), I've increasingly had some very noticeable improvements. Nearly all the soreness is gone and I'm starting back into a subset of my X3 upper body routine (to go along with the lower body routine I've stuck with all along) and it's going well. So I'm feeling pretty good about that.
My annual early year weight purge has not been going like it has in the past several years. Over the first two months I'm down about 6 lbs, where in prior years I would be down about 12-15 lbs by this date, and I'm about 6 lbs heavier than I was on 3/1/24. The mirror and belt notch tests tell me that by those measures I'm ahead of where I was last year, so I'm pretty comfortable asserting that the additional 6 lbs is predominantly lean mass, and likely my lean mass increase is somewhat higher than that, maybe as much as 10lb. That doesn't seem like much for 9 months of effort with X3, but considering my age and that I've always been one of those "hard gainer" dudes, I'm okay with it.
February was a pretty good sleep month (big caveat to that below). I had my highest total sleep average since I started tracking with Oura, and for the first time I averaged over 7 hours (7h 3m) across a calendar month. All of my deep sleep, REM sleep, and Sleep Score averages for the month were among the top 2-3 since Jan 2024 when the data record begins. I've been reviewing data and lifestyle practices but don't really have a smoking gun explaining the recent surge in sleep-related metrics.
I'm an enthusiastic consumer of podcasts when it comes to health/fitness, nutrition, and healthy aging topics. But I think I finally watched one podcast too many. I was watching one last Wednesday on the general topic of healthy aging with Bryan Johnson as the guest, who I've heretofore mostly ignored because I don't have $1M/yr or whatever he spends to immerse himself in all the state-of-the-art technology. In passing he referred to a relatively new study that identified a certain REM sleep pattern as symptomatic of early stage cognitive decline/Alzheimer's. I went back and reviewed some of my Oura sleep stage data and I exhibit the pattern he described. Not every night, but most nights. Johnson was telling the interviewer that he believes the #1 thing that drives his health accomplishments is how well he sleeps, and that the large majority of what he does is intended to drive excellent sleep. And the REM pattern was just a passing topic in that relatively short facet of the discussion. So there's a lot I don't know. But for now I'm alarmed.
My first thought is to double or triple down on my efforts to improve sleep, even though I'd concluded a while back that I was at the point of diminishing returns. The thought behind that is to try to determine if there is something else that is causing the REM pattern. Since this was only a few days ago my plan hasn't developed much yet, but I'm looking at some things like temperature-controlled mattresses and special lighting for the morning (since I typically wake up when it is still dark outside)--things that I'd heard about but didn't take seriously because it seemed like just throwing money around to fix things I thought could be addressed through metabolic health improvements with nutrition and lifestyle.
In parallel with that I cant help starting to do the what-ifs assuming I'm on a one-way ticked down Alzheimer's avenue. I see dementia essentially seven days a week with my dad, and I want to be more prepared for it than he was. That means figuring out what to do about the stash (and general personal finance) should the day come I'm not up to the task. That's been a back burner item for a long time as even "normal" cognitive decline that falls short of a medical diagnosis of some form of dementia might make it prudent to offload certain tasks where an error can be costly. And there are other related things like identifying a care facility or in-home care arrangements and the like. Similar to financial management, those kinds of things need to be worked out eventually irrespective of dementia, but my original plan to cross such bridges when I get close to them falls apart if the path to the bridge is marked by my mind turning to mush along the way. Not exactly fun stuff to be wrestling with.
Prior to the REM pattern thing throwing a wrench into the works, I had started to have my interest aroused by the topic of quantum biology, and the potential offshoot of quantum medicine. It seems very new-agey and wooish, but it seems that at least quantum biology has some basis in reality. So to stretch my brain and push it some I've been doing some occasional casual reading on things like quantum entanglement and quantum tunneling. Ironically, one of the reasons I decided to pursue such topics from a layman's perspective was to see if it boosted REM sleep. That stems from an overly simplistic understanding that deep sleep primarily recharges the body and REM sleep primarily recharges the brain. The thought was that if I spent some time on things that require my brain to work near the end of its capacity, I might be able to bump up the amount of REM sleep I was getting. I've lost some interest in that over the last 3-4 days, but imagine once I convince myself that stewing about whether I am indeed already beginning to succumb to dementia is not an actionable endeavor beyond what I mentioned above, I'll likely drift back to some of the wooish stuff.
On the mundane side of things, financially everything is going fine. Spending was down from January and respectable given the lifestyle I've settled into. I'm getting ready to start my income taxes. Even though I could start sooner my habit from the old days was to start at the beginning of March when certain tax forms could be mailed out as late as the last day of February. As usual, I don't expect too much interesting with those. I think I have my withholding dialed in pretty good and expect in the ballpark of $1,000 back from both state and federal.
Lots happening on the health and fitness front. I'd been having some trouble with my left shoulder. I started with 6 weeks of rest from the heavy upper body movements with the X3 bands. That did no good so I tried some myofascial therapy provided by my youngest sister. That was great as far as loosening me up and reliving some chronic muscle tension in my upper back, but it did not have much effect the actual issue. I then started seeing a chiropractor she recommended. He is somewhat of an athlete (for a guy in his 50s) so kind of "gets it" where I'm coming from. He concurred with my sister in noting my left shoulder blade was a little out of place, due to a combination of generic old man inflexibility and some muscular imbalance and tension (chronic) in my upper torso. He's been working on alignment/loosening of my upper spine, and alignment of the shoulder blade. Along with the treatments he proscribed some what I call therapeutic band exercises that I use my original relatively light bands to perform, as well as some stretches. Over the last 2-3 weeks (about a month after I started working with him), I've increasingly had some very noticeable improvements. Nearly all the soreness is gone and I'm starting back into a subset of my X3 upper body routine (to go along with the lower body routine I've stuck with all along) and it's going well. So I'm feeling pretty good about that.
My annual early year weight purge has not been going like it has in the past several years. Over the first two months I'm down about 6 lbs, where in prior years I would be down about 12-15 lbs by this date, and I'm about 6 lbs heavier than I was on 3/1/24. The mirror and belt notch tests tell me that by those measures I'm ahead of where I was last year, so I'm pretty comfortable asserting that the additional 6 lbs is predominantly lean mass, and likely my lean mass increase is somewhat higher than that, maybe as much as 10lb. That doesn't seem like much for 9 months of effort with X3, but considering my age and that I've always been one of those "hard gainer" dudes, I'm okay with it.
February was a pretty good sleep month (big caveat to that below). I had my highest total sleep average since I started tracking with Oura, and for the first time I averaged over 7 hours (7h 3m) across a calendar month. All of my deep sleep, REM sleep, and Sleep Score averages for the month were among the top 2-3 since Jan 2024 when the data record begins. I've been reviewing data and lifestyle practices but don't really have a smoking gun explaining the recent surge in sleep-related metrics.
I'm an enthusiastic consumer of podcasts when it comes to health/fitness, nutrition, and healthy aging topics. But I think I finally watched one podcast too many. I was watching one last Wednesday on the general topic of healthy aging with Bryan Johnson as the guest, who I've heretofore mostly ignored because I don't have $1M/yr or whatever he spends to immerse himself in all the state-of-the-art technology. In passing he referred to a relatively new study that identified a certain REM sleep pattern as symptomatic of early stage cognitive decline/Alzheimer's. I went back and reviewed some of my Oura sleep stage data and I exhibit the pattern he described. Not every night, but most nights. Johnson was telling the interviewer that he believes the #1 thing that drives his health accomplishments is how well he sleeps, and that the large majority of what he does is intended to drive excellent sleep. And the REM pattern was just a passing topic in that relatively short facet of the discussion. So there's a lot I don't know. But for now I'm alarmed.
My first thought is to double or triple down on my efforts to improve sleep, even though I'd concluded a while back that I was at the point of diminishing returns. The thought behind that is to try to determine if there is something else that is causing the REM pattern. Since this was only a few days ago my plan hasn't developed much yet, but I'm looking at some things like temperature-controlled mattresses and special lighting for the morning (since I typically wake up when it is still dark outside)--things that I'd heard about but didn't take seriously because it seemed like just throwing money around to fix things I thought could be addressed through metabolic health improvements with nutrition and lifestyle.
In parallel with that I cant help starting to do the what-ifs assuming I'm on a one-way ticked down Alzheimer's avenue. I see dementia essentially seven days a week with my dad, and I want to be more prepared for it than he was. That means figuring out what to do about the stash (and general personal finance) should the day come I'm not up to the task. That's been a back burner item for a long time as even "normal" cognitive decline that falls short of a medical diagnosis of some form of dementia might make it prudent to offload certain tasks where an error can be costly. And there are other related things like identifying a care facility or in-home care arrangements and the like. Similar to financial management, those kinds of things need to be worked out eventually irrespective of dementia, but my original plan to cross such bridges when I get close to them falls apart if the path to the bridge is marked by my mind turning to mush along the way. Not exactly fun stuff to be wrestling with.
Prior to the REM pattern thing throwing a wrench into the works, I had started to have my interest aroused by the topic of quantum biology, and the potential offshoot of quantum medicine. It seems very new-agey and wooish, but it seems that at least quantum biology has some basis in reality. So to stretch my brain and push it some I've been doing some occasional casual reading on things like quantum entanglement and quantum tunneling. Ironically, one of the reasons I decided to pursue such topics from a layman's perspective was to see if it boosted REM sleep. That stems from an overly simplistic understanding that deep sleep primarily recharges the body and REM sleep primarily recharges the brain. The thought was that if I spent some time on things that require my brain to work near the end of its capacity, I might be able to bump up the amount of REM sleep I was getting. I've lost some interest in that over the last 3-4 days, but imagine once I convince myself that stewing about whether I am indeed already beginning to succumb to dementia is not an actionable endeavor beyond what I mentioned above, I'll likely drift back to some of the wooish stuff.
Re: A Journey of Mindfulness--the Remaking of Life in Midstream.
Sexual activity improves sleep and has been shown to be preventative of dementia in those over 62. After age 85, social isolation is also huge factor for dementia. Latest study indicates that 42% of us who make it to age 95 will suffer dementia, and over 20% by age 85. Ergo, instead of sweating the details of the metrics, it seems like it might be time to cash in some chips towards younger SO acquisition. I've decided I might be willing to go as young as 45, and may shop internationally if necessary. YMMV.
Re: A Journey of Mindfulness--the Remaking of Life in Midstream.
So telling a group who can't remember the last time they got laid despite not having dementia, to get laid in order than they will now remember the last time they got laid? Maybe there's something to it, but I picture a bunch of confused looking people sitting on folding chairs surrounded by people they don't want to have sex with.
Re: A Journey of Mindfulness--the Remaking of Life in Midstream.
@chenda:
I would estimate that around half of all men will have experienced at least some minor difficulty by around age 52. I have not personally interacted with a man over 60 who has not experienced some difficulty, but this would only be N=4, range 60-75. I think the oldest man I have interacted with who claimed to never have any difficulty was a quite fit 58 or 59. The focus on sexual problems of aging men has mostly been on erectile difficulties, but achieving orgasm/ejaculation also tends to become increasingly difficult and is sometimes made worse by Viagra and similar. It is also possible to achieve orgasm/ejaculation without achieving an erection.
I was watching a videocast recently on which a middle aged male Evolutionary Psychologist was talking about the male sexual strategy being based on still being able to impregnate somebody at age 80, and I had to chuckle a bit, although I know based on my reading of the sexual memoirs of older women that there definitely are some men whose sexual potency persists into their 80s. For better or worse, there is also some tendency for older men to attempt to overcome their difficulties by seeking out much younger or more varied partners and this tactic may be temporarily successful.
I would estimate that around half of all men will have experienced at least some minor difficulty by around age 52. I have not personally interacted with a man over 60 who has not experienced some difficulty, but this would only be N=4, range 60-75. I think the oldest man I have interacted with who claimed to never have any difficulty was a quite fit 58 or 59. The focus on sexual problems of aging men has mostly been on erectile difficulties, but achieving orgasm/ejaculation also tends to become increasingly difficult and is sometimes made worse by Viagra and similar. It is also possible to achieve orgasm/ejaculation without achieving an erection.
I was watching a videocast recently on which a middle aged male Evolutionary Psychologist was talking about the male sexual strategy being based on still being able to impregnate somebody at age 80, and I had to chuckle a bit, although I know based on my reading of the sexual memoirs of older women that there definitely are some men whose sexual potency persists into their 80s. For better or worse, there is also some tendency for older men to attempt to overcome their difficulties by seeking out much younger or more varied partners and this tactic may be temporarily successful.
Re: A Journey of Mindfulness--the Remaking of Life in Midstream.
@7w5 - Interesting. I see Robert de Niro has become a father again at 80
Re: A Journey of Mindfulness--the Remaking of Life in Midstream.
@chenda:
Well, with modern technology affluent women can also become mothers (or again) at age 80 by freezing eggs and buying the services of a surrogate. However, I would not recommend. I also wouldn't recommend having a child with an 80 year old man. For purposes of family formation, I would recommend hooking a guy just prior to his peak and parenting with him just post his peak, which leaves a pretty slim margin for natural female fertility if you are both running Level Orange/Green/Yellow, even if you allow for a 7 year age gap to account for slower emotional development in the male. Basically, women mature faster than men, but then they age much slower after their peak. Thirty to sixty can be sort of a long mid-life plateau for women, but men can still be immature at 35, but then tend to go downhill quite fast after around 45 unless they take extreme measures. I would estimate 42 as the age a man is most likely to exhibit best mix of vigor, emotional development, and experience/skill as a lover.
Well, with modern technology affluent women can also become mothers (or again) at age 80 by freezing eggs and buying the services of a surrogate. However, I would not recommend. I also wouldn't recommend having a child with an 80 year old man. For purposes of family formation, I would recommend hooking a guy just prior to his peak and parenting with him just post his peak, which leaves a pretty slim margin for natural female fertility if you are both running Level Orange/Green/Yellow, even if you allow for a 7 year age gap to account for slower emotional development in the male. Basically, women mature faster than men, but then they age much slower after their peak. Thirty to sixty can be sort of a long mid-life plateau for women, but men can still be immature at 35, but then tend to go downhill quite fast after around 45 unless they take extreme measures. I would estimate 42 as the age a man is most likely to exhibit best mix of vigor, emotional development, and experience/skill as a lover.
Re: A Journey of Mindfulness--the Remaking of Life in Midstream.
Yes I think a lot of the downfall of middle age men is lifestyle rather than genetic, they tend to let themselves go health wise.