Open My Eyes: where can I get a house + garage in a safe area for <250K?

[AxelHeyst]

Starlink has solved the "live in van, need fast internet for job" problem.

+1 sky's idea of a sienna with a mattress in it to start. It'd be a bummer to drop money and time into a sprinter conversion and then realized you hate it. That said, you can't stand up in a sienna, which is *really* nice if it's your home and you work. You might think you hate the life, but you'd have liked it if it were bigger.

You can get a van and convert it for between $1k and $10k, or obviously you can spend $100k. Just depends on how creative, DIY, and Dirtbag you wanna go.

[TopHatFox]

I'd say being able to stand and having a tiny shower/toilet is a requirement if you're working and doing it full-time -- probably Sprinter/Transit/small RV or go home. The Sienna is probably really good for road trips tho, and 1/2 to 1/3 the price. The big cost seems to be the actual van. Converting doesn't have to be a billion dollars, most of it are some wood slats, cabinets, a twin mattress, a shower stall, a little toilet, and the Starlink set.

[chenda]

You could buy a piece of land to stick it on.

[TopHatFox]

@chenda, the Sprinter/Transit? Yeah, that's actually not a bad idea. I could switch to house-building mode eventually, too, while still living in the van on the land.

[mountainFrugal]

Being able to stand up in the van is nearly a necessity if you want to live and work in it long term. +1 on all of @AHs comments. After using starlink at his place I am convinced that has just opened it wide open. Tethering works most of the time, but for data intensive things (mostly uploading) you need to be closer to a city with better reception.

[Sclass]

Why is it so important for you to buy a home?

open your eyes? You sure about that?

[C40]

As someone who did live in a van for a couple years straight, I'd say that you should NOT decide to do that with money being the main motivator. It's only worth doing if you are highly driven by the 'living in a van' part itself.

[TopHatFox]

@C40, the main draw would be being able to travel slow — staying at the Grand Canyon for a week or a month instead of a few hours, then driving to Joshua Tree — all while making money. That and already having a place to live ready when ready to build a house

[Hristo Botev]

I've lived throughout the southeast so I know that area best, . . . . Off the top of my head I know a handful of locations that fit your criteria in Georgia, Alabama, South Carolina, North Carolina, etc. There are metro areas with >200k population. If you want more rural or small college town feel, then there are those places as well. You just need to get out of the Austin/LA/NYC tech bro social media bubble. It should be pretty easy to find these things if you first sort by metro area size in each state and then dig in from there (assuming you want some urban amenities). People act like there is no world outside of a half dozen "hip" metro areas.
. . .
ETA: Aren't you in Florida? Off the top of my head there is Jacksonville, Tallahassee, and Gainesville among many others. They are all still relatively affordable compared to more popular metro areas like Miami, Tampa, and Orlando.

The southeast is full. It's hot and humid. Lots of bugs. Lots of rednecks. Even your county councilman will have a bumper sticker on his half-ton truck (must be a half-ton truck) that says something like: "Save a Deer, Hunt a Pedophile." Everyone is armed. Most people have spent time in jail if not prison, many of the women have worked in strip clubs at some point. Lots of face tattoos, incredibly. You WILL get into an argument with your neighbor at some point about non-functioning vehicles rusting away in his yard (or in your yard). Bicyclists riding on the road are targeted for fun. That "garage" you want is a requirement, because it will become the place where you watch TV with the garage door open so that you can see all the goings-on on the street. And the poor man's garage to tv viewing room conversion will necessitate that you stick a "P.O.D.S."-type storage container permanently in your driveway for storage of the stuff that would have otherwise been in your garage. Cars get parked in the yard. Outsiders get run out of town if they stay past their allotted weeklong vacation time, though longer term seasonal snowbirds and military assignments are tolerated provided they mostly stick to their own, don't participate much or speak up to much at community gatherings, and mostly stick to their condo complexes and military bases. Corruption everywhere. Good ol boy network has and will continue to call the shots. Moving to the southeast is an absolutely horrible idea.

Also, you're too late; the Austin/LA/NYC tech bro soral media bubble has already arrived and jacked up home prices, which is fine, because the homes we buy never make it to zillow in the first place; they are offered for sale via that good ol boy network.

Also also, both internet and electrical services are iffy.

ETA: While I'm not aware of anyone being "ransomed" in the southeast, it certainly wouldn't surprise me to hear that it happens.

[macg]

Moving to the southeast is an absolutely horrible idea.

I personally think these observations are not applicable everywhere, and most can't be limited to the southeast. I have lived in various parts of the southeast and have not had these issues, and I have seen similar types of these issues in the northeast, where I lived most of my life. I think it all falls under the "where you specifically choose" and "what you like" theory.

[TopHatFox]

Having driven through most of the Lower-48, everything east of Rapid City, SD is fairly homogenous. Some distinguishing factors being farms (midwest), hills/forests (appalachia), metropolitan megascapes (NE megalopolis), swamps (Louisiana, FL), and arid oil planes (Oklahoma, Texas). The culture of each sub-region is indeed differen, but overall the landscape is not anywhere near as dramatic as the states west of Rapid City.

In the eastern US, Knoxville was cool, Charleston seemed quaint, Dallas seemed affordable if boring, Oklahoma City was clean and also boring, and Little Rock was good too. The midwestern cities were pretty run down with lots of rust (probably from all the snow/cold), and the NE cities were just too stressful and competitive having visited them and worked in them throughout college. The little towns in the NE are cool, but they're extremely left-leaning, especially cause the college kids that reside in them often don't know any better, so you gotta be into that.

[Frita]

We had a van for a couple years (+/-) with the plan being to travel part-time while our son was still in high school and then longer stints afterwards. It turns out than while it was okay for a week or so, it was not something we wanted to do for extended time periods. Fortunately, we sold it quickly at a slight gain during COVID.

BTW In my locale, it is very popular to own them now (We were ahead of the local curve. ). It seems that most of these vans spend most of there time parked. Status symbol versus lifestyle or something else? Anyhoo, I am glad ours is full-time home to a frugal musician.

But my SIL really liked our van and wanted an adventure-mobile in addition to her townhouse. She rented many different setups before deciding on a pod to tow behind a Forester. She and her SO are happy with the setup. I appreciate her willingness to get some firsthand information prior to committing. That is something I can apply to my own life.

[TopHatFox]

I haven't driven around Europe yet, but I've been thinking that:

1. the UK, Ireland, France, Netherlands, Belgium, Luxembourg, Germany, Denmark, Sweden, Finland, Poland, Czech Republic, Sweden, Finland, Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania, Ukraine, Moldova, Belarus, Hungary, and Russia all are pretty flat, and therefore pretty boring nature-wise.

2. By contrast, Spain, Portugal, Italy, Switzerland, Norway, Austria, Andorra, Monaco, San Marino, Vatican City, Malta, Slovenia, Croatia, Bosnia, Montenegro, Albania, Macedonia, Greece, Romania, Bulgaria, Turkey, Cyprus, Slovakia, and Iceland look geographically very interesting.

3. Europe is similar to the US in that it's dense cities connected by highways with not-much in between. I think the main difference is that the cities are more dense with narrower roads, there are more smaller cities, the architecture and history is much older and includes castles, and the cultures are very different to the point you won't understand the language or moors one country over.

4. From the pretty list (#2), Spain, Portugal, and Italy look good, as I already speak those languages. Maybe Switzerland or Austria as I get better at German. Norway and Iceland are kinda like Alaska - very pretty, but also very far from everything and very cold. The former Yugoslavia countries look pretty, but their languages are Slavic-basaed and therefore much harder for me to pick-up (aside from Romania). Also threat of Russia taking them all over/influencing them again.

[chenda]

1. the UK, Ireland, France, Netherlands, Belgium, Luxembourg, Germany, Denmark, Sweden, Finland, Poland, Czech Republic, Sweden, Finland, Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania, Ukraine, Moldova, Belarus, Hungary, and Russia all are pretty flat, and therefore pretty boring nature-wise.

There are lots of mountainous regions in many of those countries if thats what you're into (e.g. Massif central, Baveria, Carpathians etc)

[TopHatFox]

@Chenda, are we talking mountains-mountains like the Rockies or Sierras, or rolling-foresty hills kinda like the NE of the US?

I see, so southern France, very southern Germany, very southern Poland, SW Ukraine, and west-most Sweden have mountains.

[sky]

[chenda]

@thf yes, Massif central:



Baveria:

[TopHatFox]

@sky, very useful. Yeah, that's what it looked like in my head when I used Zillow. The cheap houses are in the low population parts of the Midwest, South, and NE. It seems you either have to make a shit-ton of $/be creative, build your own small house and hope its reasonably affordable, or just be OK w/ living in one of those lower-demand areas.

@Chenda, pretty! The mountains all look to revolve around the plate-boundary of Italy crashing into the rest of Europe haha. Must be a geologically recent collision as the Alps are huge & pointy.

[loutfard]

@ertyu, you guys are still sovereign nations? I am learning Russian after German :p

I invite you to reconsider this comment.

My family and friends live in one of these "still sovereign nations". They read this forum too. Being forced to learn Russian was the least of their troubles. I'll not bother you with the details, but here's some keywords in somewhat chronological order: first Soviet occupation, Siberia, nazi occupation, second occupation, GULAG, concentration camp, raped, forced conscription, killed, lost fortune, requisitioned, tortured, home taken away, KGB, hyperinflation, crazy '90s crime.

The Baltic countries have wonderful things going for them by the way, like low cost of living, EU, euro currency, NATO membership, low tax, stunning nature, and more.

[chenda]

You can get some bargains in Georgia (the country not the US state) and it's becoming in vogue with the digital nomad crowd. But the Caucasus are the only region of Europe I'd avoid investing in due to geopolitics (Armenia, Azerbaijan, Georgia) as it's a rough neighbourhood. Otherwise I wouldn't have an issue buying in eastern Europe, I agree the Baltics have a lot going for them.

But the fact you speak to Portuguese, Spanish and Italian gives you loads of options. Any of those countries can give you a great quality of life especially with a foreign income.