Suomalaisen Päiväkirja

[suomalainen]

@jace if that's where the ATM is, where's the money come out? That dirty, dirty money.

@clarice just for the record, in case DCFS is monitoring, I don't let my tween kids watch porn. We're talking SNL and John Oliver and comedians who make "adult jokes". There's also apparently a concern if I watch something like Westworld or GOT in a semi-public place where the kids might catch a glimpse of some boobies.

@jp yeah, usually, but she was LIVID. It came out of nowhere. She's not what you would call "self-aware". I'm just sitting there watching a dumb TV show and BOOM, all hell breaks loose. After a few hours of "conversation", I can finally tease out that she doesn't really give a shit about John Oliver, she's worried about our value differences and (my words) doesn't trust me to teach our kids "good values" because she thinks my values suck, being a heathen and all. I laugh off all kinds of dumb stuff, but religion and ERE (especially how they impact the kids) are the two most sensitive topics in our house and usually 17 years of emotions get triggered by some small thing but it's not immediately obvious to me and she can't work through her own emotions to be able to draw the line for me from A to B. It's just 'YOU MOTHERFUCKER, YOU'RE GOING TO FUCKING RUIN OUR CHILDREN WITH YOUR GODDAMN HEATHEN WAYS"* right out the gate. I'm so confused, I go the rational route - "Listen, I have no idea WTF is going on, can you help me understand", so that I can't "go all emo" with her because I literally have no fucking clue what is happening. She's got this whole goddamn drama playing in her head from the time I didn't hold the door open for her on our first date to how I stopped believing in god to how I watch all kinds of "inappropriate" shows to letting the 14 year old watch with me to him becoming a sex addict and his soul rotting in hell for all eternity. Split screen to homer simpson just watching a fucking tv show. Now merge the screens into one scene. By the time I understand (and actually her too), we're both so emotionally exhausted that all I can manage is "I can understand how our value differences can be challenging when we're trying to find common ground in how to parent our children. I'm sorry that it's hard for you. It's hard for me too."

AGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH! Stay single, my young friends. Stay single.

Anyway.

To loop in the prior conversation about my failings as a man, I think it's time we go back on a budget. I'll use the not-moving (which, actually, also was turned into a religious fight**) / furniture discussion as a jumping off point, to be delayed until she's "back on her rocker"***. But my goal is for us to settle on a number (72k/yr we did for 5 years before the last 2, so that should be easy to agree on, but maybe I can get it down to 60k/yr?) and I'll be satisfied with that and if she can save money from the food or whatever budget to buy her chairs, whatever.

* I may be paraphrasing.

** No, I'm not kidding. Maybe you religious folk here could empathize with her (nothing "felt right" spiritually), but to me she's just INFPeeing all over the place.

*** I love Augustus' verbiage on these matters. It's so condescending (to women) yet comfortingly empathetic, so it's somehow not offensive. Maybe the ladies would disagree.

[George the original one]

*Too* *much* *drama*.

Glad I married the gal I did, even if she does snore too loudly.

[jennypenny]

I'm sorry, I don't know what to say, or how to deal with that. We're kind of free-range parents even though we're Catholic and the kids go to Catholic school, so we simply acknowledge (to each other and the kids) when we have a difference of opinion wrt to a parenting issue and negotiate between the three of us (having a kid in the discussion forces us to be civil). But I've never been naive or a bible thumper with my kids, so we don't have those kinds of disagreements.

As far as the budget, I suggest using the word 'allotment' instead of 'allowance' where possible. You could always tell her to get her own checking account, put money in it every month, and let her spend it how she wants. I rarely like that setup, but I agree that she's got you by the balls and you need to separate the money stuff from everything else. You shouldn't have to pay her to be happy, but at this point maybe it's worth it if you're not interested in leaving. (I'd never be able to tolerate that indefinitely ... my hat's off to you.)

[suomalainen]

@gtoo She's great in many ways, but the inability to get out of her own emotional way has been a challenge from time to time.

@jp Mixed faith marriage. Not much I can (or want to) do at this point other than work through these entanglements when they occasionally happen.

It is, however, fascinating to read people's reactions to my attempts at describing slices of my life. Like a funhouse mirror, you start to see things about yourself in ways that you never could have seen by yourself. Even if some of the reflections are exaggerations of reality, they can be instructive. Or at least humorous.

[ThisDinosaur]

if she can save money from the food or whatever budget to buy her chairs, whatever.

I predict she will not like this idea. Like, *very dramatically* not like it. Then you may be tempted to say something like, "If you're not going to negotiate, then I won't either." Then the ATM won't see any action for a couple days. Call it a hunch.

[Hristo Botev]

Man, I got to my desk at about 8 this morning and told myself I'd spend 10 minutes or so reading the first few pages of Suo's journal, before getting down to actual work, given that Suo and I appear to have some significant things in common (age, job, kids; generally struggling to keep expenses in check with a full household and a high income that makes expense-cutting less of a priority than it should be). ~4 hours later with half of the workday gone (and I bill by the hour) and I all I can say is damn, I was not expecting the journal to take the turn it did in those last 6 pages. All I'm going to say Suo is, I get it; and I very much appreciate you putting it all out there.

[Bankai]

Thought experiment:

What conditions would need to be met for you to be happy long term (in your relationship)?

What's the probability of each of these conditions being met?

What's the probability of all of them being met?

[EdithKeeler]

honestly though, your wife is going nuts. i think she needs to get out of the house and get a job. but uh, don't phrase it like that haha. it sounds like she's suffering self esteem issues and is trying to self medicate with shopping therapy.

I think this is spot on. I think she’s thinking you get to go out and do cool stuff all day with new people, and perhaps you’re changing a bit, plus you make and control all money. Plus you’re a heathen pervert who’s corrupting the children... (your 14 YO knows or thinks he knows more about sex than you do...). But seriously: I do think she probably has some self esteem issues, plus the kids are getting older and don’t need her as much, and penny pinching bastard that you are, you won’t even let her make a nice home for your family! And she probably feels insecure about getting a good job because she’s been out of the game and is worried about her skills and value there, too.

I mean, that’s what would probably be going on in my head.

[7Wannabe5]

I think it is pretty clear that the semi-conscious root of Mrs. Suo's anxiety and antipathy is a niggling suspicion that Suo is actually attempting to save up money so that he can afford a second and/or third wife. Therefore, when she once again encounters evidence of his tendencies towards sex fiendishness, she reacts by demanding that more funds be sequestered in her nest.

[suomalainen]

Sooooooo, what you're saying is that my joking for the last decade or so that when she gets old and wrinkly I'll "trade her in for the younger, hotter model" wasn't helpful?! Que horror!

Anyway, she apologized for "overreacting". I'll say!

The furniture/budget issue hasn't come up again. Sleeping dogs, etc

PS Me good (EDIT), no EXPERT, at marriage.

PPS I'm having a steak (tenderloin) for the first time in a while. Thanks for the idea, @brute.

[Jason]

He has to ask his wife.

[suomalainen]

No funny stories about / arguments with wifey this week, sorry to disappoint.

*Start complaint*

Been feeling down. I was feeling down last August too, when I re-started this journal. Maybe there's something about August. I am burned (burnt?) out at work. It didn't help that these last two weeks have just been nothing but utter bullshit. With apologies to anyone reading this who works in compliance, but compliance people suck ass and I hate working with them. A less flexible, more brainless, more checklist engorged professional class I've never encountered. So, it's been hard not to focus on the powerful "I don't want to do this any more" feelings. Diverging my thoughts elsewhere has been a challenge, but I've tried. It's also hard when I go to work all day and my wife and kids are off playing all day. I understand it sucks ass to be with the kids all day every day, but at the same time, they went to the river yesterday and played in it all day, while I was getting dry humped by a compliance person's rigidity. Which would YOU rather be doing?

One of the things I've been trying to focus on is a goal to run a trail ultramarathon next year. Or maybe only 20 miles to start. But a long trail race nonetheless. To do that I've got to lose some weight, and I haven't really been able to make any progress on that over the last 3 weeks even though I've been trying (ketoish diet). So that's been a bummer too. I keep hoping it's because I'm gaining muscle while losing fat, but that's probably unlikely given that I run short 3x a week (slow build given the history of lower leg injuries) and only do strength training 1-2x a week.

Anyway, I've had enough, but I don't have enough, so the character building continues.

*End complaint*

[Jason]

It's also hard when I go to work all day and my wife and kids are off playing all day. I understand it sucks ass to be with the kids all day every day, but at the same time, they went to the river yesterday and played in it all day, while I was getting dry humped by a compliance person's rigidity. Which would YOU rather be doing?

I'd have to know more about the compliance officer before making that decision.

I am reading "Kissinger The Negotiator". Three Harvard professors put together a study on Kissinger's negotiating tactics in his major foreign policy efforts. Putting aside what you may feel about Kissinger (recent Clinton vs. Sanders debate), it is an interesting read and one I would suggest for you although I have a feeling Kissinger might have taken a look at your life and decided its too fucked up to work with.

I have only started but these are some things of note:

(1) Zooming In/Zooming Out

ZI = Micro perspective. Knowing the players. Their interests, their influences, their roles, their concerns, their backgrounds.
ZO = Macro perspective. Strategy, long term policy initiatives.

Successful negotiations employ a zooming in/zooming out dynamic.

(2) Empathy and assertiveness do not necessarily have to be mutually exclusive. One can be both simultaneously.

[suomalainen]

Don't really know much about Kissinger. But I did find the documentary "Fog of War" with Robert McNamara absolutely fascinating. I was really into Donald Rumsfeld's press briefings for a while in the early aughts. I just find the whole international diplomacy / strategy thing totally fascinating. If I had had an alternative career, it could have been in the state department.

Anyway, at the risk of raising something inflammatory (but it's my journal, so bugger off if you don't like it!), I came across this today as I was nursing my whinging attitude: ‘It's the breaking of a taboo’: the parents who regret having children. I think I've said this before: I love my kids, but I hate parenting. This morning as I was walking out the door, the kids had had a "living room campout" last night and the 9yr old peeks his head out of his fort and waves (which will be a wonderful memory), but...I never should have been a father.

you are allowed to think such a thing as regretting motherhood and loving your child

[Jason]

So you find a documentary focusing on an isolated patriarchal figure reflecting on his regrets and mistakes in supporting individuals for which he had no real understanding or genuine concern with fascinating? Shocking.

[suomalainen]

Is that a sentence? Can we get a grammar check in aisle 3 please? I dunno what that's supposed to mean, except you evidently don't like the man. But yes, it was fascinating.

[Hristo Botev]

It's been a few years since I saw the McNamara documentary, but I remember it blew me away. It was jarring to hear him talk about carpet bombing Japan and Vietnam with no emotion at all, and then he'd get emotional about something that seemed to me to be so small (like, if I remember correctly, his Jewish elementary school classmates going to Hebrew school on Saturdays). Also it was just fascinating to get inside the mind of someone so intelligent and analytical as he was describing the decision making that went into decades of war and other international events that shaped our country and many others. My father, a Vietnam combat vet, won't watch it and I suspect would be very much angered by the cold and calculating way McNamara talks about decision making that resulted in my father's friends dying.

[7Wannabe5]

My housemate, a successful, attractive man in his late 40s, does not even have visitation access to his 3 children. He gave up, dropped his end of rope, after very vicious, extended legal battle several years ago. The last time he saw his youngest child, at a school event, she told him "It's okay if you don't want to be our Daddy anymore."

He lives in what was their marital house, and I am currently camped out in what used to be his sons' room. I had to spend a day packing up all sorts of dusty piles of little boy clothes and toys to take to the Goodwill, and I almost broke out in tears. Tragic loss.

Jason offered you a piece of excellent advice above. I know it is hard to see what you can't yet see. But, you very much need to start being more assertive, so that you can be more engaged in your family life.

[suomalainen]

Also it was just fascinating to get inside the mind of someone so intelligent and analytical as he was describing the decision making that went into decades of war and other international events that shaped our country and many others.

Yes, exactly. I felt the same way talking to Gen. Patreaus (sp?).

My father, a Vietnam combat vet, won't watch it and I suspect would be very much angered by the cold and calculating way McNamara talks about decision making that resulted in my father's friends dying.

This all happened before I was born, so he is "just a historical figure" to me. I would be just as fascinated reading / watching about the decision-making processes of Hitler or Stalin as Churchill or Roosevelt or Truman, as he decided to drop the bomb. It's just fascinating to wander through the psyche of a normal person as they make decisions that impact nations and millions of people. Such terrible power individuals can wield.

Jason offered you a piece of excellent advice above. I know it is hard to see what you can't yet see. But, you very much need to start being more assertive, so that you can be more engaged in your family life.

Man, I really do not get what you guys think you see from these snippets of my life that I reveal here. It's like you can't process a person having two conflicting ideas in their head at the same time. I have no problem with assertiveness, but there are certain topics that aren't clear cut for me to the point of having to struggle through the messy process of finding "my truth" and then finding "our compromise" and I don't have any problem showing how the sausage gets made here in my journal. My family's budget is one of those things and this being a sorta financial-focused journal, this is where I talk out and work out my conflicting ideas on that topic. Part of what is probably perceived as "lack of assertiveness" is that I don't know what I want - I want something where the math doesn't support it, no matter how much I squint and angle my head. "If I just adjust this one assumption" it would all work. That one assumption is "wife and three kids". So there's a struggle to come to grips with wanting the impossible and learning to let that go. In the vacuum of the known dream is the unknown alternative. Look at that "Enough" thread or other journals where retired people are trying to figure out what they want to do next. Some know exactly what they want to try and some don't. Or some think they want to try X, but then they do it and eventually it seems to run out of meaning for them, so they start drifting until they find the next thing. I don't think I'm unique in this struggle/process of making the sausage.

When it comes to my kids, I don't really have much else to say. It's okay to struggle with / hate being a parent while simultaneously loving (in action as well as in emotion) your kids. Some people find that a difficult position to accept (wife included), and I'm okay with that.

[Mister Imperceptible]

If you want a distraction from sinking US futures this morning, you might find this entertaining:

https://nypost.com/2018/08/06/inside-th ... aire-exes/