How are you different?

[Bankai]

When discussing with my wife what we do differently than our peers, we decided to try to list some of those things. The list grown longer than we expected. Some of those are very compatible with ERE, some are neutral, however every one of those raises eyebrows when shared with people who are not close to us, while 3 or more at the time could easily earn us a "crazy" label.

Here's the list - how many points apply to you? What else would you add?

1) No kids (or plans to have any)
2) No car (or plans to have one)
3) Happy renting, even though can afford a deposit for a house
4) No meat
5) No dairy*
6) No TV
7) No eating out
8) No alcohol
9) Not collecting CDs/DVDs
10) No religion
11) No patriotism
12) Not voting
13) Not wearing wedding rings
14) Cutting our hair ourselves
15) Buying (some of) our clothes used
16) No debt
17) Saving and investing money
18) Not wearing makeup
19) Not wearing high heels
20) No shampoo
21) No takeaway food
22) No processed food
23) Reading books
24) No social media (my wife's on FB, I don't use any)
25) Not willing to work until standard retirement age
26) No smartphones
27) Not watching / reading news (Brexit confirmed that if something huge happens, you'll know anyway)
28) No extra bedroom in our flat
29) Not smoking
30) Not exchanging gifts
31) Not buying stuff
32) Not supporting / having a favorite sports team
33) Taking responsibility (no excuses)
34) Not planning to go to Vegas (something like 4 in 5 people in our workplaces dream of going to Vegas one day. The other 20% already went are are few £xxxx lighter)
35) Not giving advice

Looking at the list, it's quite negative, i.e. we don't do things which majority considers normal. Are we living in times, where we mostly define ourselves by things/activities we say "no" to? Is habit of saying "no" a way to get ahead in life nowadays?

*EDIT: fixed

[Eureka]

Applies to me: 4,5,6,7,8,9,10,11, 13,15,17,18,19,20,21,22,23,24,25,27,28,29,31,32,33,34
Additions:
36) Not wearing shoes whenever possible and wearing minimalist shoes whenever else
37) practising yoga by myself every morning
38) don't care what other people think about me
39) can improvise delicious meals out of 'whatever is in my fridge/on my shelves'
40) don't wear glasses/contact lenses and keep my eyes fit by exercising them
41) do lots of self studies using MOOCs
42) walk long distances on a daily basis because I enjoy it
43) letting my hair grow long and not having had any haircuts since 1967
44) enjoy quietness and whatever sounds surround me and never listen to music
45) admit that I enjoy sleeping

[slsdly]

Applies to me: 2, 3, 9, 10, 14, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 22, 23, 25, 28, 29, 32, 33, 34, 39, 42, 45 (???)

Sort of applies to me: 5 (I avoid dairy due to recently discovered allergies, but not religiously), 6 (I do own a TV, an antenna but no cable service; my roommate is the primary user for live sports), 21 (very rare, happens once or twice a year at most), 26 (no plan but I have a phone which functions as an alarm clock and travel communication device when in WiFi coverage; it remains home most of the time when I am out), 38 (most of the time, yes, but sometimes I cave to pressure like for #30)

Would love to apply to me: 24 (I don't know what my hesitation is here...some people use it exclusively to talk to me maybe...I like reviewing photos of weddings/shared vacations/etc), 30 (a point of contention with my family...)

Remainder: 1 (no kids, no plans but I could swing either way; I have slowly realized I am pretty big on family in general, and while I don't need a kid of my own to be happy, I think I would enjoy parenthood), 7 (social aspect keeps me going), 8 (its a vice, what can I say), 11/12 (I like Canada and see voting as a duty for intelligent people?), 13 (I'm single but would be fine either way, as long as my ring is not gaudy), 15 (never really occurred to me; I so rarely buy and struggle to find things that fit waist/length wise in general), 31 (yeah I still buy stuff on occasion, I am looking at new weights now *shrug*), 35 (sharing experiences seems human? but I have a small social circle, maybe that is different), 36 (never thought about it), 37 (I attend classes 3-4 times a week, just learning), 40 (distance glasses, can you really control this?), 43 (I like my hair short), 44 (I enjoy quietness, but I also love music, it is a mix)

Additions:
46) intend to die fitting in my first suit (unless my shoulders get broader )
47) eat mostly vegetables and a wide variety of them
48) limit habitual sugar intake to lower bound of WHO guidelines (5-10% of caloric intake)
49) not caring for travel

[BRUTE]

26/35

ps: is that supposed to be no diary or no dairy?

[Dragline]

43) letting my hair grow long and not having had any haircuts since 1967

Somehow I get the feeling you look more like my avatar and I look more like yours. Minus the facial hair.

[Dragline]

You know, I don't know that I am that much different from most people, other that consuming well below my/our means. Other than lots of resources, no debt and a high savings rate:

1. I keep a journal and read my old entries to see how I'm doing.
2. I take a lot more pictures and videos than most. I do this deliberately to export my memory function, since mine doesn't work very well anyway.
3. I don't watch much TV, and especially avoid TV news. I read a lot of books instead.
4. I try to spend as little time as possible with low empathy people -- psychopaths, borderlines, narcissists, etc., and make it a point to evaluate each individual I encounter on that scale and adjust my exposure accordingly. I have spent time in this area learning how to identify such people as soon as possible and believe this should be a basic skill most people should acquire for their own well being.
5. I don't blame or credit large external institutions for my happiness or fulfillment or lack thereof or failures -- that includes governments, large corporations, political parties, financial institutions, international conspiracies, etc.
6. I don't worry much about very low probability events, like terrorism, mass shootings and getting struck by lightning. I consult probability of death tables to decide what I should focus on, which generally means trying to avoid heart disease, cancer and diabetes and avoiding exposure to statistically dangerous activities, items and substances. I'm not counting on the lottery in the positive sense either.
7. I have 19th Century or earlier values about some things. I support more people than I'm legally required to support, and am happy about the choices I have made in that regard. I believe "consumption" means you should continue to use the same object for its designed purpose until it no longer functions for that purpose. I believe I should try to live up to the best examples of my ancestors in some way.
8. I don't think we live in unique or apocalyptic times, except in the sense that any apocalypse has been going on for quite some time now.
9. I think waste and vanity are the two major ethical problems of our era (not that that's unique either). Mostly the latter.
10. I don't believe that one's individual consumptive behaviors have much, if any, ethical or moral meaning. Which means I don't care what you eat, where it was produced, what day you are consuming it on, what you wear, or where you shop for the most part. You could still be a saint or an asshole. Also see item #4 above.
11. I don't believe there is any theory of everything that works in a predictive sense. The best we can do is to treat our lives like a garden that needs to be tended to and weeded regularly, and to maintain some sense of optimism. "Never let the weeds grow higher than the garden. Always keep a sapphire in your mind."
12. I am right handed, but my left eye is my dominant eye. I have A- blood, too. I might be a vampire or a zombie or something.

[black_son_of_gray]

19th Century or earlier ... "consumption" means...

Immediately thought you were going to talk about tuberculosis, which would be very different

[Dragline]

Actually, they are related -- the reason tuberculosis was called consumption is because it "consumed a person" -- i.e., used them up. So its essentially the same concept..

[BRUTE]

is Dragline left-footed or right-footed?

[IlliniDave]

I guess it is a matter of how one defines peers. If the definition is narrow enough there are very few differences. If it's wide enough (let's say my age cohort among US residents) there are more differences.

A few that come to mind relative to the small subset of my demographic peers I regularly interact with:

-I'm not a huge fan of warm climates and beaches (both are nice in small doses)
-Most of my views when it comes to social and political issues are moderate
-I have specific plans/goals I'm working towards
-I'm generally optimistic about the future

[wood]

20/35 and we can relate to many of the add-ons too.

Acquaintances label us "modern day hippies", friends don't label us.

[Dragline]

is Dragline left-footed or right-footed?

Right. When I am not tripping over them.

[GandK]

About a quarter of your list applies to both G and me, and about a third to me specifically (I'm a minimalist and he's more of a frugalist). That said, most of them don't feel like differences because no one notices. Example: makeup. I only wear blush. Anecdotal evidence suggests this is less makeup than 99% of other women my age in my area wear. But I also don't go around telling people this, so few people ever become aware. The only measurable difference of wearing very little makeup IMO is that I'm spending and consuming less. Ditto using coconut oil in place of most skin and hair products, having one car for the family, all of my clothes being either monochrome or pink so they all match each other, etc.

I do not particularly like that list because writing it out that way makes your/my choices feel like rules... "no doing this" and "no doing that." And I'm making such choices to create freedom, not to tie my own hands or to push myself. This may be an emotional quirk of mine getting in the way of the thread/conversation, though.

[Dragline]

I do not particularly like that list because writing it out that way makes your/my choices feel like rules... "no doing this" and "no doing that." And I'm making such choices to create freedom, not to tie my own hands or to push myself. This may be an emotional quirk of mine getting in the way of the thread/conversation, though.

Nah, I had kind of the same reaction/vibe -- I like to try to think about things I'm going to affirmatively do (that others may or may not), and not so much what I don't do. It may just be a rhetorical preference.

[Lucky C]

Only 10 of the 35 for me. I'm similar to a bunch of others but not as strict, e.g. I do drink alcohol but less than once per week.

50. Planning to pay cash for our first house, despite tempting mortgage rates.
51. So far have "beat the market" with active trading. I attribute much of this to luck (see user name) and will be cashing out taxable investments ASAP (see #50).
52. Never set an alarm even though I have to be up early for work.
53. Take a caffeine pill in the morning instead of drinking coffee.
54. My only "bucket list" travel destinations are within the U.S.

[7Wannabe5]

I am different, not because of the things that I don't do, but because of the unlikelihood of any one person doing the things that I do do. For instance, in the last week, I have consumed goat curry, pop-tarts, solar-dried mulberries, fresh chard juice, corner diner cheeseburger, calamari, basil seed drink, black currants, and half loaf of sourdough bread that other half was moldy. I regularly associate with old white men who read the WSJ and watch Fox News in the suburbs, young Muslim children who run barefoot on the urban streets, middle-aged black women who listen to Prince while doing water aerobics, and 20-something hipsters who are into tiny houses. I wear my hair long and bleached blonde, chopped-off-short garden grubby fingernails, tennis shoes I bought used that are splitting at the seams, 1960s angora sweater I bought for $1, tank tops I pretend like nobody can see the coffee stains on, pajama bottoms one of my lovers gave me, cheapest pink lipstick I scrape out of the bottom of the tube, overalls I only wash twice a year, earrings another lover gave me, usually no underwear, but sometimes my one expensive pair of Spanx. I listen to Chopin, dirty Southern hip-hop, British X Factor audition clips and Iranian folk music. I have had lovers who somewhat resemble Mitt Romney, Omar Sharif, Vincent Van Gogh, Samuel Jackson and Charlene Tilton. I have read Christian romance novels, engineering texts, the Qu'ran, all the Travis McGee novels, Hume, Anne Tyler, Abe, Richie Rich comic books, and 19th century travelogues.

I believe that human beings are very clever, omnivorous scavengers and tool-makers, and the best frugal practice is to just keep yourself open to all the possibilities other humans are stupidly rejecting in the market or field because they are lacking in knowledge or skill or they are full of prejudice and fear or dull routine.

[Scott 2]

The raised eyebrows may be from people taking offense to a perceived attack on the things they enjoy. If those thing are a key part of their identity, it's very likely

About half the list applies to me. I would frame it differently though. I had to spend a lot of effort learning to present my identity by what I say yes to. Things like:

I sleep until I wake naturally
I cook dry beans every week
I shred my own cheese
I really like traveling by train
I enjoy working from home
Walking places makes me happy
I like to meditate before bed

Ten years ago, that list would have read:

No alarm clocks
No canned beans
No pre shredded cheese
No flying
No commuting
No driving
No electronic devices before bed

Both lists are driven by the same preferences / reasons, but the first gets other people to ask about them and creates a positive conversation. It also leaves me room to enjoy things I typically say no to. Since my identity isn't tied to it, I can pick up a can of beans when I don't feel like cooking.

[steveo73]

Interesting thread. The first thing I'll state is that there is probably a bell curve in relation to most of the points made above and no on is really that different.

I will state though some aspects of my life that make me a little different.

1. I read a lot. I always have and I assume I always will.
2. We have no debt and own our house. I live in Australia and this would be very unusual as house prices are crazy.
3. We only have one car. That is for a family of 5.
4. My bike and public transport are the main tools I use to get around.
5. I do jiu-jitsu regularly. I'm 42 turning 43. I think that is rare.
6. I intend to retire prior to turning 50.
7. I don't really care about travelling and I have no travel goals/dreams.
8. I go out rarely - this includes pubs/restaurants etc. I do go out but typically only for special events.
9. I cut my own hair. My wife also cuts her own hair. My wife cuts my 2 boys hair. My daughter gets her hair cut at a hairdresser but my mum pays for it once every couple of months.
10. I don't give a shit about my job. I have no career ambitions. I still try and do a good job though. I just do that because I have some passion when I turn up.

[BRUTE]

I would frame it differently though. I had to spend a lot of effort learning to present my identity by what I say yes to.

interesting. brute has always been very skeptical about the "frame things positively" talk. but in terms of driving humans away, it actually makes sense. does Scott 2 think it makes a big difference? brute is very much exclusion-minded in many ways, and often phrases things that way. and brute would say it's not necessarily negative, but it certainly can be. brute somewhat thrives in the antagonist/devil's advocate role (surprise!), so being able to create antagonism out of thin air can often be helpful.

[cmonkey]

34) Not planning to go to Vegas (something like 4 in 5 people in our workplaces dream of going to Vegas one day. The other 20% already went are are few £xxxx lighter)

I don't understand this at all but can relate. Why would anyone want to go there? I have a coworker that went there for his yearly vacation last week. He talked about how it was hot but that they had public misting areas and A/C everywhere. Very wasteful given their water issues.

What worries me is that all those people will be coming this way....within my lifetime most likely.