Bitcoin on the rise

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prudentelo
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Re: Bitcoin on the rise

Post by prudentelo »

@Ego

Many countries have stores that will exchange on the street. Moving across a border with wealth that is actually yours and where the target country is friendly or at least not hostile to you is the most original and important use case for bitcoin.

If the wealth is stolen bitcoin does not necessarily protect you (not untraceable, could just be seized RICO-style if you cant prove provenance, etc.) and if the target country is hostile things get very difficult indeed (but generally you can choose the target country).

Whether this use case justifies current valuation, unclear. But it is something new. You will have a lot more problems transiting an airport with a suitcase full of cash, even with full documentation that the cash is yours. Good chance it will be confiscated with no reason given and you never see it again.

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Ego
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Re: Bitcoin on the rise

Post by Ego »

Chris wrote:
Sat Feb 26, 2022 10:24 am
Transfer to an exchange wallet, then sell to Euro.
If you want to go the P2P route, there is LocalBitcoins.com.
Okay, let's say I want to drive from Ukraine to Germany or Portugal. I will need fuel for the trip. I could start out with a stash of Euros. It would be challenging to spend the bitcoin along the way, right? When I arrive I need to rent an apartment. Bisq has a few people who will transfer in-person for cash. I can't seem to find that option on localbitcoins.com but I can have them transfer it to my Paypal account or to a Wise account. I guess I could then purchase a cashier's check from Wise and make it payable to the landlord. Does that sound reasonable? Can anyone think of a better step-by-step method to pay for petrol, groceries and rent once I arrive in Germany or Portugal?

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Ego
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Re: Bitcoin on the rise

Post by Ego »

chenda wrote:
Sat Feb 26, 2022 2:21 pm
People around the world are using bitcoin to fund and support the Ukrainian military (just an observation not a criticism)
They are also using z-cash. After Canada, probably wise to do so for any donation.

@prudentelo, I am thinking about legitimate bitcoin either earned as wages or bought on an exchange.

jacob
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Re: Bitcoin on the rise

Post by jacob »


WFJ
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Re: Bitcoin on the rise

Post by WFJ »

Buy popcorn, enjoy the show. 99% selloffs will be common among many household names in Crypto, NFTs, Meme stocks, ARKK garbage tech and such. What is always amazing is how difficult it is for most investors to not anchor their value beliefs at the high and not the current price. I still think the market in magic beans and the Emperor's New Clothes will limp along until the student loan moratorium is lifted, but many episodes like this will occur before the end of the student loan bailout.

Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity and I'm not sure about the former. Einstein

zbigi
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Re: Bitcoin on the rise

Post by zbigi »

This is the best part:
Though Estavi owns the digital asset representing Dorsey’s tweet, it is unclear if he owns the copyright of it. Dorsey or Twitter could choose to remove the tweet.
Does that mean that this particular token is just a bunch of bits which don't relate to the tweet in any legal way? If so, what prevents people from making more NTFs of the "Jack Dorsey's first tweet"? If the answer is "nothing", then this whole space (and the fact that the guy supposedly paid $2.9m for this token of no value) is really amazing.

prudentelo
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Re: Bitcoin on the rise

Post by prudentelo »

The NFT craze was driven not just by crypto-optimism but widespread misunderstanding what the asset is.

People believed they were buying titles, like car title. Unique proof of ownership of another object.

In fact they were only buying 'title' to the paper that the "title" was written on.

What this man bought is unique only in the way every physical object can be unique.

bostonimproper
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Re: Bitcoin on the rise

Post by bostonimproper »

Note that there are NFT projects where you do get ownership over the IP linked to the NFT. My favorite in this space is royal, which allows musicians to directly sell a portion of royalty rights for up-front payment from a community. And I’m sure, over time, they’ll be used for wider variety of use cases other than art and collectibles.

The key is, obviously, that the NFT issuer has to be the person or entity which can claim dominion of the product attached to the NFT. E.g. city government has its smart contract for home titles in a locale, LVMH for provenance NFT of digital/physical goods, etc.

jacob
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Re: Bitcoin on the rise

Post by jacob »

prudentelo wrote:
Thu Apr 21, 2022 7:50 am
People believed they were buying titles, like car title. Unique proof of ownership of another object.

In fact they were only buying 'title' to the paper that the "title" was written on.

What this man bought is unique only in the way every physical object can be unique.
They way I understood is that the NFT provides unique ownership of the URL (the link, e.g. https://earlyretirementextreme.com) but does not provide ownership of what's found on that actual URL. An NFT of Mona Lisa corresponds to the location at the Louvre where Mona Lisa hangs but it doesn't really control the actual painting itself. IOW, if they take the painting down or I delete my website, a possible NFT owner would own a 404 link rather than the content website, alternatively the directions to a spot on an empty wall. Is that correctly understood?

disk_poet
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Re: Bitcoin on the rise

Post by disk_poet »

From what I understand that is how NFTs are implemented at the major platforms but I don't see a technical reason for it to be that way. The way I understand it someone could at least add a cryptographic hash to the NFT to verify the content hasn't changed or use something content-addressable like IPFS (https://docs.ipfs.io/concepts/content-addressing/) to point to an NFT instead of a URL.The way I think about it is that an NFT proves ownership of a thing and the major implementations (for example opensea) use URLs as the thing.. but that could be changed.

prudentelo
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Re: Bitcoin on the rise

Post by prudentelo »

jacob wrote:
Thu Apr 21, 2022 8:22 am
They way I understood is that the NFT provides unique ownership of the URL (the link, e.g. https://earlyretirementextreme.com) but does not provide ownership of what's found on that actual URL. An NFT of Mona Lisa corresponds to the location at the Louvre where Mona Lisa hangs but it doesn't really control the actual painting itself. IOW, if they take the painting down or I delete my website, a possible NFT owner would own a 404 link rather than the content website, alternatively the directions to a spot on an empty wall. Is that correctly understood?
Fundamentally NFT is just a numbered piece of paper.

1,000,000 sheets blank paper = fungible
1,000,000 sheets paper with unique numbers on them = non-fungible

What is written on the paper is second step. Could be nothing. Could be [url=https://27bslash6.com/overdue.html]picture of spider[/quote]. Could be actual legal conveyance of $100 million real estate.

NFT can only grant ownership by providing good evidence of ownership that will be accepted ordinary legal processes. Not overturn or replace them.

Many seem to have believed, fuzzily as their brains may have worked, that anything an NFT is "associated" with becomes kind of "internet super duper turbo property" that civil courts cannot touch.

Sorry that's not direct answer to your question. An NFT can contain a URL, and many do (some contain actual very simple graphics). URL can be encrypted, and in principle kept secret. But not sure it's possible to give 'ownership' of a URL, like right to exclude others using it? You're right most URL NFTs come with no or limited guarantee to maintain the target page.

prudentelo
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Re: Bitcoin on the rise

Post by prudentelo »

basically what happened is people realized that you can write titles for valuable property on a piece of paper, and reasoned that because you can draw a picture of a spider on a piece of paper, a paper with a drawing of a spider must be valued by the same tools and with similar quantities as paper containing legal titles. because they're both paper.

leading to investment error

Humanofearth
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Re: Bitcoin on the rise

Post by Humanofearth »

Could we move NFTs to a new thread? Quite unrelated from btc. Talking lots about unique digital media in a digital gold thread.

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giskard
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Re: Bitcoin on the rise

Post by giskard »

Humanofearth wrote:
Fri Apr 22, 2022 1:53 am
Could we move NFTs to a new thread? Quite unrelated from btc. Talking lots about unique digital media in a digital gold thread.
Yeah so, back to bitcoin....

The DXY just hit an astonishing 102.x today, its going up about half a percent a day, which is wild. The dollar is rising relentlessly! The last time it was this high the fed had to do all kinds of emergency actions and open up swap lines with a bunch of foreign countries so their central banks didn't run out of dollar reserves.

Needless to say, this is not great for bitcoin. Additionally, nasdaq has been very much under pressure and annoyingly bitcoin and the tech sector are very correlated. I think we have a chance of breaking correlation here depending on what happens over the next month, but basically we have a confluence of factors just crushing bitcoin.

And yet, it's not down that bad. Though, gold is holding up better here even with the dollar headwinds. The last time the DXY was this high (march 2020) gold was about $1500 / oz.

guitarplayer
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Re: Bitcoin on the rise

Post by guitarplayer »

I don't know much about bitcoin but I read today that Central African Republic adopted bitcoin as its official currency, being second to El Salvador.

Humanofearth
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Re: Bitcoin on the rise

Post by Humanofearth »

A warning about Bitcoin, it really distorted my idea of enough. Keep adjusting my number upwards. Even once I have enough. Too much greed. What’s the point after the first M? Already covers expenses. Could literally spend $100/day on private lessons for any sport, travel, dinners. Gluttony brings no satisfaction. Fasting, daily workouts, well fit clothing and fresh meats/produce from the supermarket, holding your breath for 5 minutes with corals or sprinting up a mountain for an hour with the sunset. How expensive is this? Well under 3% with just 1M.

Even with gluttony, get massages every day and they become boring, ice baths are way more fun. Date someone new every day and you’ve tried every dinner spot, seen every island, tried every adventure. What’s left? The peace and silence when the searching stops and the listening returns us back to where we started.

prudentelo
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Re: Bitcoin on the rise

Post by prudentelo »

You wouldnt want to make TOO MUCH money, not like me. So be careful out there. DONT subscribe my newsletter

WFJ
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Re: Bitcoin on the rise

Post by WFJ »

"I am not so much concerned with the return on capital as I am with the return of capital" This is attributed to Will Rogers, but apparently never said it.

The crypto market is going through the stage of a bubble where the difference between the "public" price and "real" price difference is massive. This happens in every non-financial markets bubble (baseball cards, Beenie Babies, tulips) where price guides will report one price, but if you want to sell, the price is 75% lower or your volume is restricted. Only preferred players are allowed to get out of the market, leaving the others holding their collection of Sammie Sosa rookie cards or Pattie the Platypus Beenie Babies with extremely high book values, but unable to sell for less than 25% of guide price. One can trade Sammie Sosa for Mark McGwire cards at near full value, but cash price is a MASSIVE discount.

OutOfTheBlue
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Re: Bitcoin on the rise

Post by OutOfTheBlue »

For now, hold on to your socks. The situation is still developing. The UST unpegging (which seems to have been orchestrated) and susbequent Luna value loss is a major event, in addition to other factors.

The adult thing would be to wait for the dust to settle first and then analyze. Sling mud afterwards.

jacob
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Re: Bitcoin on the rise

Post by jacob »

OutOfTheBlue wrote:
Wed May 11, 2022 5:10 pm
The adult thing would be to wait for the dust to settle first and then analyze. Sling mud afterwards.
+1 to that.

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