JollyScot's Journey Starts

[JollyScot]

Wasn’t sure whether to bother with an update with it being so long. However our situation has changed a little with a child.

He is doing well, now around 10 months. Fatherhood has not been quite what I was expecting. There are a few general things that can get frustrating rather than difficult. It is more we do different things now. Less people who will do things with us having a child in tow. That has been ok though with plenty are happy to see and spend time with our kid. There is a lot less free time. I guess this is what people find difficult.

I am back to being finished work now that my contract has finally come to an end. The initial 6 month plan ran for a full 3.5 years. A lot longer than I was expecting and we are now a lot older than we realised. Time during the pandemic and subsequent years just sort of slipped away. Good to be finished.

With regards to our property we ended up selling. The high rise of student flats was eventually turned down by the city. However within 6 months they started the process of trying to get in another high rise of student flats. As such we decided to just sell and leave. Glasgow is making choices we can’t be bothered dealing with. If it was proper homes and 20 stories we could have lived with it. But the student properties just expands the party area out to us.

Combined with our building factor planning to increase fees, car zone restrictions and general parking issues (I want no car but wife wants one for kid trips) plans to increase council tax by an outsized amount on larger properties. Just came to the point where the city wasn’t worth it for what we were getting.

The property sold fairly quickly and for a 50k profit. Part of that was eaten up by an early repayment charge on the mortgage but still 30k ahead. We then proceeded to buy a 200k house in one of the areas outside the city. That 20k overpayment fee was made up for with market returns of having money invested so was less of a sting.

The overall impact was an additional 230k of investments and as a result of lower expenses in the new property, council tax, no factor fee, lower energy, comes out as an equivalent of having an additional 150k in saving. So a fairly large swing. We are now mortgage free again, gave up the 2% mortgage rate.

Our running expenses have been £1200pm for all of us. Probably work out at £20000 ish for a year once we factor in car costs and some planned trips. A reasonable chunk of the costs have been getting initial things for our son. A lot of those are now bought and there is not too much more. Our essential costs are £550pm (council tax, energy, food, internet, phone)

Now that I am not working we are looking forward to have more time to spend with son. The result of the accommodation change means we are miles over the ‘safe’ asset number. The property has 3 bedrooms and a small garden, the 3rd bedroom is a dubious description to be fair. There was a couple with larger gardens. They were an extra 100k. There is enough room in the garden for what we want to do,

I did still want a proper piece of land but too much restrictions and general pain here that I gave up looking.

We are planning to send our son to a nursery a couple of afternoons a week. Just to interact with a lot more children. There are a couple of free things to attend at libraries. Maybe we can accumulate some more random events such that we don’t need to send him. However based on the cost of 200pm we can cover it for an initial amount of time.

Beyond that the next few years we will split out time between summer in UK winter doing some travelling. My wife is almost at the point where she can get permanent residency and we can stop being “as” concerned about her getting to stay. Technically we can get her a passport too, however we are not sure whether to or not. As we found out that her father can get Spanish passport through decendency and as a result she can also get it. (Would have been good to know about a few years ago, but oh well)

So it may be in our interest to have an EU passport in the family too. Spain doesn’t allow dual passports with UK so it is an either or I think. We will see, it good to have back ups after everything.

For my general life goals I have made a few bits of progress

My weight is at 68kg, was at one point 85kg
Have a reasonable consistent gyms trips in place now
Finally learned enough Spanish to get by
Automated our cooking a little to reduce take out we were getting into a bad habit of. Each item to avoid takeaways we used to have.
Butter chicken
Pizza
Singapore noodles
Ramen
Lasagna, carbonara (home made pasta)
Home made mice for burgers (includes liver and heart)
Various pies

Kitchen has staples in 10kg buckets of the following, rice, beans, chick peas, quinoa, lentils, cous cous. That we cycle through for non specific meals too.

Beyond that, life is good and we have gotten over the few years of mini disasters that sent me back to work and generally got me annoyed. Will be picking up my Japanese again after it fell apart with heading back to work in terms of a ‘me’ task rather than family task.

[fingeek]

Great to hear the update. ¡Felicitaciones por su bebé!

[guitarplayer]

Hi @JollyScot, always good to hear from you and see you still bother with updates

Sounds like quite a change of lifestyle, wonder how you see years ahead, committed to fatherhood?

[JollyScot]

Gracias,

There is a bit of a change in my lifestyle, not as much as the update would suggest. We are outwith the city now, however day to day is a bit more like what we had when staying in France. Coffees, going for walks, learning bits and pieces we find interesting. Playing with son. Made a starting on planning changes to property. Insulating and an outside shed/area.

The area we are in has a decent school. That is a few years away for having to worry about that. We are working our way through the feeding pantomime just now.

The city flat was great for walking into town. The result was a general increase in the bleed of cash as we went to do things. It got to the point where going for food and using the city amenities were not worth it.

We had a couple of food poisoning at restaurants, the speed of the price increases to go along with drop in quality.

I also got angry at the new service charge that was being added everywhere too. Tipping never really used to be a thing in the UK, only very rarely or when it was genuinely exceptional service. I hate tipping culture and the slow poisoning of our system with it. We having minimum wage laws, it is not like US system. If companies want to automatically increase my bill by 10% it should be in the price. Instead I am put in the position with the server of having to ask them to remove it.

Opinion in the country is unfortunately shifting to more tipping as US culture bleeds its way in.

Now we eat mostly at home and only go out if friends specifically want to go somewhere. Otherwise we don’t bother. It’s more of a hassle to go somewhere in a smaller place. That inertia has stopped us.

[chenda]

I've not noticed any changes tipping wise.

[JollyScot]

Really?

I have, at least in Glasgow. When I initially stayed here prior to moving to Switzerland there was no tipping at all. Post coming back I saw a lot more people leaving tips such that it seems to be an automatic 10%. Then more recently the automatic application of a 10-15% service charge. Along with more places now asking for tips that previously didn’t (because of payment machines).

Maybe you are based somewhere that jumped on the tipping train sooner than Glasgow. Or I am just more sensitive the topic. Regardless, I don’t like the shift whether self imagined or not. Which might be the case since I’ve always hated the system.

[chenda]

Yes in the south ~10% on a restaurant bill was always the norm. I suspect you're right that the decline in cash has led it to being added on to the bill automatically.

[JollyScot]

Last month was the lowest monthly expense number we have ever had. Including when I was running the numbers on my own and just getting ready to retire the first time round.

£142 - Council Tax
£85 - Energy (was hardly on) showered at the gym, just food really and a couple of colder days.
£25 - Internet
£10 - Phone
£254 - Food (home cooked throughout)

£516

Technically we should add the gym cost of £550 for the year for both of us. So an additional £45. This was paid in advance for the year. I wanted a swimming pool.

£561

This annualised would be well under a 1% withdrawl rate. This is going to be a one off though.

No travel expenses. No additional costs related to our son. Just some extra on the food he has been eating. Everything we did was free or already paid for, walks, gym, visit some friends. I did some woodwork type stuff from left over bits from old place. Wife started drawing again.

Son is going to be starting at nursery next month so this is going to add an extra £200 to the total from then on. Not because we need the time back, it is more so he can interact with a large number of other kids. We were thinking of sending him to 2 different places at a day each. however they all stipulated a 2 day minimum. At least the ones we checked.

Still it is interesting to see that just a switch of accomodation has resulted in such a large swing. Especially considering the inflation numbers.

[urgud]

Extremely impressive. Are the £142 Council Taxes the only monthly housing costs? No property taxes, homeowner's association fees or the like?

[JollyScot]

Yeah that is the only fee. Repairs as and when they arrive, none have yet though.

I think council tax would be the equivalent of your property tax. However the way ours works is only loosly based on the price of the property. There are Bands for each level of price. Meaning that really expensive (think multi million mansions) only pay around £4,000 per year. The lowest is around £1,000 per year.

Then there are further reductions if you are poor, or single or a student. Various other exemptions like that.

Supposed to cover some of the local expenditures. In Scotland it also covers our water charges. Technically you can get a individual meter if you think the water portion is too high. I don't think it is really worth the hassle. Our water service is generally good. Useful having 300 days of rain a year.

Then some properies have factor fees. That is what my old one was like and this is maybe closer to the homeowners association fee. However as my place is an older house there isn't any of that. Newer places all have it now, with varying cost level. My last property was £150pm. It had a swimming pool, gym and lifts though.

I think in England these types of fees can cause people a lot of trouble.

[guitarplayer]

Always good to read an update from you @JollyScot. Well done on the expense front, I cannot wait until we pay off our flat next year which is when the household outgoings between DW and I will be more or less like yours in that month.

[delay]

Thanks for your journal update! Food for £254 is inspiring... I gotta work on that. From what I hear, the cost of house maintenance averages 1,5% of the property's value per year.

[JollyScot]

Yeah it is nice have expenses at such a low base that even a splurge doesn't move a needle. It has shifted us to just setting up a good start for our son and going back to doing things we like. It is a very different routine when work doesn’t get in the way. My wife still feels the need to "contribute" by working a little. The system got to her a lot more than it ever got to me. The un-training is still an ongoing struggle.

The maintenance costs seem to come in waves. I have owned 4 places now. First one did not really have any fixes in the 5 years I had it. One boiler repair for a couple hundred. The second ones had updates when I first moved in but nothing after it. The third one has heaps because of the size and got annoying enough that we sold it. This one does not seem to have much, would just be improvements but it operates fine as is so far, early days though.

As for our food costs we have a few bulk purchases Then for our meats we get chicken thighs, pressure cook them for a decent broth as well. Also grind higher fat mince with liver and kidney that goes into a lot of stuff.

Then we pick up whatever is reduced or on offer. So we had a couple months on lamb legs getting picked up. This month a reduced full salmon that we picked up for £11 that lasted us a good while.

After my lockdown sourdough making phase I now make some sort of bready type thing every couple days too. We got fed up with the rubbish processed stuff in UK. I have been reading ingredients too much and getting angry at it.

Recent one was buying clotted cream fudge, had 3% cream in it. So fudge is now on the list. (we got a second hand ice-cream maker, banana fudge was the plan).

[ertyu]

My wife still feels the need to "contribute" by working a little. The system got to her a lot more than it ever got to me.

If one is pursuing FI as part of a couple, it makes sense to keep in loose touch with the formal economy. Consider what happened to LivingaFI: he + wife were FIREd but she left. The money didn't work anymore and he had to go back to work. Now, no one -plans- to divorce or separate, but it happens. When there's children in the picture, it might be even more important that both parents are able to find their way back to paid employment. Your wife may well be working due to being too institutionalized, but imo it's not irrational to do so.

[JollyScot]

Yeah I can understand that, back before the pandemic I probably would have kept the back up kicking along. The 3 year contract has moved our finances over to where we could support a dual house/life system if something like that were to happen.

I am trying to nudge her towards training in something she actually wants to do if she is planning to work. I think once the permanent residency is organised however and we are a bit more inclined to travel again then I can see the sudden need begin to ease back.

Now that her maternity leave is over and she is back at work some days I can see the need to figure out when to take holidays and get time off starting to annoy her.

Much like me, I have a break from working, get convinced to go back, then quickly remember how rubbish it is.

[dara]

Beyond that the next few years we will split out time between summer in UK winter doing some travelling. My wife is almost at the point where she can get permanent residency and we can stop being “as” concerned about her getting to stay. Technically we can get her a passport too, however we are not sure whether to or not. As we found out that her father can get Spanish passport through decendency and as a result she can also get it. (Would have been good to know about a few years ago, but oh well)

So it may be in our interest to have an EU passport in the family too. Spain doesn’t allow dual passports with UK so it is an either or I think. We will see, it good to have back ups after everything.

I know I'm replying months later but I've just seen this comment. The reality I think it's a bit more complicated, there are a lot of Spanish people living in the UK and especially after Brexit, a lot of them set out to get the British passport.

I found some news articles in Spanish about Spaniards living in the UK and doing the naturalisation process and it doesn't even mention the fact that Spain is quite restrictive when it comes to dual citizenship. I wouldn't trust such an article but still, it's not without precedent to have both passports and according to this website and some others I found (the website is in Spanish, I have absolutely no affiliation with the chap) it's possible to get the British nationality once one already has the Spanish and keep both by doing some paperwork at the local Spanish consulate. It's worth at least looking into it, as both passports would come with their own benefits.

From the website:

Pero es que además el mencionado artículo 24 nos ofrece una vía, una pequeña trampa, para no perder nuestro pasaporte, aunque nuestro nuevo país no haya firmado un convenio con España: “No obstante, los interesados podrán evitar la pérdida si dentro del plazo indicado declaran su voluntad de conservar la nacionalidad española al encargado del Registro Civil.”

Google translate's English translation:

But the aforementioned article 24 also offers us a way, a small trap, to avoid losing our passport, even if our new country has not signed an agreement with Spain: "However, interested parties will be able to avoid the loss if within the indicated period “declare their willingness to retain Spanish nationality to the person in charge of the Civil Registry.”

[guitarplayer]

At present our strategy is that the UK passport DW will get around May will be in use outside of Spain, and South American passport when to do with Spain. So now DW is applying for a working visa in Spain for her job in autumn with South American passport for example. Then if it comes to it, she will apply for it off of the South American passport. Then we would be a 5 passport 4 nationality household!

If it ever comes to having a kid, I’ll need to have a think how it is possible to add another nationality.

[dara]

At present our strategy is that the UK passport DW will get around May will be in use outside of Spain, and South American passport when to do with Spain. So now DW is applying for a working visa in Spain for her job in autumn with South American passport for example. Then if it comes to it, she will apply for it off of the South American passport. Then we would be a 5 passport 4 nationality household!

If it ever comes to having a kid, I’ll need to have a think how it is possible to add another nationality.

I'd be careful when it comes to Spain. From what I've gathered a citizen of a Latin American country can apply for a Spanish passport after two years of residence (when they get the passport afterwards is a whole different question, it can take months or years even- to be fair, this is still much better than in most countries, especially in the EU).

One of my main issues with the country that came up in my research is the absolute nonsense level of taxation (if I remember correctly higher income tax bracket starts way lower than in the UK and more importantly, there are no tax wrappers such as ISAs in Spain that are sheltered from Capital Gains Tax). Overall, I think it's much harder to reach FI living there and you need a bigger nest egg if you plan to live there.

[chenda]

@dara - Remember wages are much lower in Spain than the UK, as is the COL. There is something called a European ISA. According to this source, the tax comparison does not look particularly onorous.

https://feifa.eu/tax-and-saving-in-spain

[dara]

@chenda: Wages are lower, true but cost of living in the big cities is somewhat comparable to those of the UK (except for London but that's a different world within the UK, too):

Cost of living, Manchester vs Barcelona
Indices Difference
Consumer Prices in Barcelona are 18.8% lower than in Manchester (without rent)
Consumer Prices Including Rent in Barcelona are 14.1% lower than in Manchester
Rent Prices in Barcelona are 3.9% lower than in Manchester
Restaurant Prices in Barcelona are 19.7% lower than in Manchester
Groceries Prices in Barcelona are 20.1% lower than in Manchester
Local Purchasing Power in Barcelona is 8.6% lower than in Manchester

There is something called a European ISA.

I have no clue what a "European ISA" is. They don't mention the Spanish name and google doesn't return any results. But from what I've read there is no similar equivalent, I even researched people doing FIRE in Spain years ago (but of course I might be mistaken). Each to their own but I wouldn't want to invest (and thus live) in a country that actively discourages saving and investing money.

One more problem but that's not specific to Spain is the money one has saved in ISAs that are tax sheltered in the UK would be taxed in other countries I believe. So if you have a bigger sum invested the calculations become a tad bit more complicated than salaries+cost of living.

This is getting off topic. If this bothers JollyScot (it's his journal after all), we can continue in a relevant thread if there is any.