refilleries

[jennypenny]

We have a new refillery nearby. Does anyone use them regularly? Any tips for getting the most out of it?

[DutchGirl]

What is a refillery? What do they offer?

[jacob]

It's a gas station.

[jennypenny]

Sorry, it's a zero waste store like this one ... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=10v0BOHg7h8

[Slevin]

I have a love / hate relationship with zero waste stores. They are either phenomenal (see Nude foods market in Boulder Colorado, or Simply Bulk in Longmont Colorado), or overpriced greenwashing (see homebody refill in Sebastopol CA).

The problem is that at some point some brand of influencers decided a very specific set of goods were "sustainable", and these goods usually come with an enormous markup and the same aesthetic across the US. See all these places selling bamboo cutlery for $10 when you can get bamboo chopsticks for $.50 per set (these do the same thing and take up less space) literally anywhere. Also, somehow the refills at these places end up more expensive than just buying the bottles of them at the grocery store? Baffling.

I end up in this weird place where I think the thing they are trying to do is fantastic, but it often ends up with me just feeling like I'm getting ripped off for a similar product that I can just get at any grocery store for 1/3rd the price.

It could be that these places are going through completely ethical sourcing and shipping to get these goods, but if that's the case I would expect some of them would actually be advertising that.

[DutchGirl]

I would indeed be careful to avoid products that might get shipped in in plastic bags per pound - then put into the container in the early morning with the plastic put into the dumpster in the back of the store - and then you come and take out your pound in your carefully washed glass container, so happy that you avoided the plastic. That could happen with some of the items. I'm sure it doesn't happen with all items, and for example if you can buy a pound of rice from a container that was filled with 20-pound-bags of rice, then hurrah, you're helping to reduce the number of plastic or paper pound bags that otherwise would have been used to sell this rice to individual buyers.

In the movie you linked to I also saw a lot of soaps, skin "care" products etc, and basically for me what I would say is to just not use most of them (because they won't do you much good), and that probably using LESS of the rest of them is more environment-friendly (and skin-friendly) than specifically buying them at this type of shop.

I would also think about hygiene. Make sure that the only way you can get to the item is a hygienic way, or think about only buying items that will still be thoroughly heated or cooked after obtaining them. (NB this doesn't work with some food pathogens if they produce toxins that are heat-resistant. The heat would kill the bacteria but the toxin that was already produced will still wreak havoc on your body). And flies and insects of course shouldn't have access to items to poop or lay eggs in them, ugh. I'm sure that you are handling items with care, and I really hope the shop employees/owners handle the items with care, but I wouldn't trust all the other shoppers. If someone can cough on your cereal, or if insects could reach the grains before you do, perhaps just don't buy it.

And finally I would think about how fresh the items can stay. Packaging definitely can help keep items fresh (for example by keeping the air out), and thus in the refillery items that need to be fresh should probably have a fast turnover, or else the last bit won't be fresh anymore. And you should also only buy what you can use within a reasonable amount of time, otherwise you're throwing things away that have gone off.

I guess for me I could see using them for specific items that I use quite a lot of, where the risk of food poisoning is small, and where indeed the price is preferably lower than in the regular grocery store.

Please report back

[7Wannabe5]

The book "Unprocessed: My City-Dwelling Year of Reclaiming Real Food" by Megan Kimble is a fun read that explores some of the trade-offs that DutchGirl mentioned.

[jennypenny]

Well, it was encouraging and disappointing at the same time. I like what they're trying to do, and they are definitely raising awareness in terms of reducing waste, but it's definitely geared towards selling items that assuage people's guilt, a la stainless steel straws (which they sell). They actually sell fabric 'paper towels', which are cute (lots of free patterns on the internet) but are the $49 Stepford version of rags.

I'm getting too cynical. Maybe I should find something to buy there regularly to support them.

[Scott 2]

The "wasteful" high volume supply chain is brutally efficient. I'd bet end to end, accounting for all inputs and outputs, the refillery produces more waste. The end consumer experience may feel better, but it's just not feasible to compete with the volume of a large grocer.

[chenda]

I'm old enough to remember electric milk floats and glass milk bottles which were refilled and delivered every morning. Damn you UHT.

[DutchGirl]

I'm getting too cynical. Maybe I should find something to buy there regularly to support them.

It's also okay to find other ways to try and do good for the world. I feel like sometimes companies or entrepreneurs try to do something good for the environment, and they just... fail. Some of those environment-friendly companies are just using more energy and/or producing more waste.

I have a reusable plastic water bottle. And I have a reusable metal/plastic hot drink container (or cup?) with lid to take with me on train rides. And I have some tupperware for meal leftovers or to keep my sandwiches fresh for lunch. And those I use (not all the time, but a lot of times). But I've also bought or received a lot of reusable products that just ended up not being practical and thus not being used by me. So I've become more careful about what products I will buy and/or use and what products may seem nice but will ultimately probably not be used by me and thus will only be more wasteful if I do buy or get them.

Maybe think about in what other ways you might be able to reduce your negative impact on the world, and maybe the reduction will even be bigger, or you will be more sure that it is a reduction because more of it is in your hands.