The FI business

[liberty]

I will here outline a vision for how it's possible for us who are RE/FI to build businesses that are completely different from the regular business with 9 to 5, commute, micro-managing bosses, outside investors that need capital returned and all that shit. As FI we don't need any of that, but can go together and make FI businesses, where:

- You have a good time, hopefully even a fun time.
- Do work that is helping people and that makes the world better.
- There is no outside investors, the employees own the company and as everyone is FI, it won't run out of money as long as there's not much expenses (other than labor). In the initial phase, we work for stocks, no cash.
- You can work as much (or little) as they please, within a range, for example 20 to 50 hours per week.
- You can take extended time away from the business, a mini-retirement, without anyone stopping them.
- You can try new disciplines (but maybe for lower pay until you gain skills).
- We don't need managers? Or maybe one?
- It's completely fine to take an extended lunch break and go for a BJJ class or whatever you please.
- You can work from wherever, but we get together trice a year.
- If we get bored of working on the same product, we make a new one and alternate between them.

I would love to hear your thoughts.

[rube]

I am interested about ideas too. I would only say that maybe a minimum of 20 hours would still be too much for some/sometimes.

[jacob]

How to solve the "e-Myth"-problem of every business needing to fill the roles of:
maintenance
vision
technical
(and sales)

For example, I'm really only interested in the vision and the technical parts. I continually do stuff where the mundanes go "hey, you should get a job doing this" or "why don't you sell it?". But I'm so not interested in those aspects of the business and FI allows me to avoid those parts entirely. This in turn means that my activities never get turned into businesses. I imagine other FIs may be struggling to bother with other parts of the quad.

[rube]

I rented a special tool this week. The place I picked it up was a standard small business place, nothing fancy. He just had specific tools that people normally won't buy as they are expensive and/difficult to store. But they are not so common that every DIY have these tools for rent. Say a specific tool-rent-niche.
Everything was arranged online, only picking up and bring back will be on site (though it could also be send by parcel service).

Something like this appeals to me, but it doesn't fit many of the points you mentioned: investment, need always someone on site during opening hours, extended time away needs to be covered etc. Some could be solved, some not. Nevertheless, somehow this type of business appeals to me.

[2Birds1Stone]

Some of us are naturals at the sales part.....*wave*

[ertyu]

Coaching would appeal to me (I'm aware it's trite and everyone and their mom wants to "be a coach"). But I'd enjoy traveling with 2-3 people as they kick butt while charging them a nominal fee - something like 50 bucks a month comes to mind. At current prices, it would be enough to supplement stash drawdown and make my withdrawal rate 1.5-2% at buttfuck nowhere eastern europe COL.

[liberty]

@rube could be possible to automate this, with boxes where people can pay, pick their tool, and put it back when it's used. Then you could avoid much of the day-to-day work?

[shaz]

@rube could be possible to automate this, with boxes where people can pay, pick their tool, and put it back when it's used. Then you could avoid much of the day-to-day work?

Or an even lower-tech option is to have them pay electronically and then you give them the code to open a box (all you need is a box and a combination lock). Or have them arrange a specific time for pick-up and drop-off if you don't want to trust a box. At any rate it could probably be managed such that you don't have to hang around when no transactions are taking place.

I do most of my selling transactions by telling the buyer I will leave the item on my porch for them to pick up at their convenience and they should put the money under the doormat. So far this has worked for hundreds of transactions and no one has ever failed to leave the full agreed upon amount of money. You have now given me ideas about renting things out.

[DutchGirl]

If there's going to be a FI business, I'll be the one to do the boring administrative work or repetitive work because I rather love seeing my efforts turn into visible results (papers gone from left to right, widgets produced, people helped).

I also want to point out that even when you don't have bosses or shareholders who demand work to be produced right now... you will probably have clients who expect a product, or service. So maybe you can't just take a sabbatical without making sure that someone else can take over your tasks. Or maybe you need to find a niche where products or services can be produced as the workers see fit, and clients will buy something only when it's available...

[liberty]

@shaz True! That's probably even easier, as long as you find a solution for electronic payment connected to the rental object - may require coding if there is no solution for this already? When starting out, you could do some more manual checks, then automate it.

@jacob Then if FIs get together, we will fill the quads together, and the world will see how much great stuff that comes out of ERE/FI.

@DutchGirl I think product businesses are more chill, since you can build something, and then it runs (until it doesn't...). Clients are more complicated. I think we should get as much away from selling services per hour, then it's just like having bosses, then the business is just a proxy business.

[shaz]

@liberty or just have them send the payment via PayPal or a similar service. Once the payment is received you can reply with the code.

[Western Red Cedar]

I would love to hear your thoughts.

Paul Millerd talks extensively about building businesses, fostering creativity, challenging scripts passed down through childhood, and taking an iconoclastic approach to work in his writing and podcasts. He hits on all of the points you mention in terms of self-employment and/or building businesses, but suggests that someone (with the right disposition) is better off pursuing those options well before they reach FI.

Here is a link to his writing. He presents a compelling take on the "freedom to" discussion and provides an interesting variation on FIRE or even ERE:

https://think-boundless.com/writing/

[zbigi]

@DutchGirl I think product businesses are more chill, since you can build something, and then it runs (until it doesn't...).

I think it's very optimistic. Manufacturing is a brittle process that requires semi-constant massageing. And, even if you don't manufacture anything (i.e. your product is some IP, like software), then there's still a lot of maintenance to make sure the operation is running smoothly.

[basuragomi]

I'm trying to build and sell things that should exist but don't. My strategy is driven by being FI. Unlike a typical startup I'm trying to be as open as possible. This is meant to trick someone into making these things for me at lower cost and higher quality. I've got no shortage of ideas or money, only time...

[liberty]

@basuragomi That's amazing! Have you sold any of the things? Or got them stolen?

[grundomatic]

How to solve the "e-Myth"-problem of every business needing to fill the roles of:
maintenance
vision
technical
(and sales)

Can’t wait to hear about your experience at the bike institute, it’s definitely something DH and I are thinking about for him in the near future. And if he does get a job at a bike shop, I’m hoping we can also do a similar combination of selling our coffee/candles like you are doing with your artwork.

If there's going to be a FI business, I'll be the one to do the boring administrative work or repetitive work because I rather love seeing my efforts turn into visible results (papers gone from left to right, widgets produced, people helped).

I'll do the sales/customer service for the ERE bicycle and cottage industry co-op.

[basuragomi]

The only thing worth copying so far was a penguin-shaped wicker basket:
.
The mass-produced version is just as cute (though painted instead of dyed) and a fraction of the cost I charged.

[7Wannabe5]

I think your penguin is cuter. Is it meant to be a sustainable resource substitute for plastic toy bin or laundry hamper? Unfortunately, $83.99 for mass produced version would still be a bit steep for this cheapskate.