GTD Getting Things Done for ERE People

Anything to do with the traditional world of get a degree, get a job as well as its alternatives
macg
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Re: GTD Getting Things Done for ERE People

Post by macg »

Okay, let me try to map out how I use GTD.

ETA - This is a long post, I apologize ahead of time. Also, DA is David Allen, the author :-)

As I have mentioned before, I have used GTD pretty much since the release of the first run of the book - it was within a month that I first read it. So 20+ years now, I guess. Wow I'm old LOL.

As is typical, throughout the years there have been times I have been excellent, times I have been awful, and times that I have been just okay. A key is, though, that after using it that first time for a while, certain aspects were ingrained in my process, and never left - regardless of how deep into the whole process I have been at any given time. So overall it has been a great thing for me.

Let me start with the overall implementation - I never implemented it in a "straight out of the book" way. The original book was very paper-centric, and even then it seemed to me that DA dealt with people that had different types of jobs than me. I was always a "computer guy", so I have always implemented it as close to fully digital as I can. The updated release of the book (I think it was 2015?) was more digital, and remodeled some of the original things to conform more with the times.

To me and the way I use it, there have always been 5 key pieces:
  • Capture/Collect
  • Clarify/Process
  • Defining & Using Contexts (part of the "Organizing" phase)
  • Calendar Usage (part of the "Organizing" phase)
  • Weekly Review (this is on & off again for me, I will detail more below)
Capture/Collect
I touched upon this in a previous comment on this thread, so I will just post the first two sentences again - The key for me has always been capturing everything. If you don't, when I don't, then I can't trust the system.

Clarify/Process
You have to process the things you capture. It doesn't have to be immediate, but it has to be done. i usually do it every morning, but some things get left to the Weekly Review.

Two of the key things around Clarifying are the next two topics - Defining & Using Contexts & Calendar Usage (both part of the "Organizing" phase)


Defining & Using Contexts (part of the "Organizing" phase):
In my mind, you have to use Contexts. Contexts are simply filters, simply identifying where a Next Action would fall. You don't have to use them all the time, but it's the vast majority of the time, at least for me.

To give you insight into my world, here are the contexts I currently use:
  • @computer - for anything that needs to be done in front of a computer
    @shopping - for anything I need to buy. Every few years I alternate between calling this @errands or @shopping LOL
    @read - I use this to link articles/emails/etc. Used sparingly, but for me, the logic behind it is that it's things I can sit there and read on my phone
    @boss - (name removed) - things I need to specifically talk to my boss about one-on-one
    @team-meeting - I have this specifically for my current job, for items that the whole team may need to discuss
    @waiting-for - anything I am waiting on someone else
    @calls - anyone I need to specifically call
    @someday/maybe - more of just a list, but things that I am not doing now, but might want to in the future
I also sometimes use an @home context, if there is anything I specifically need to do on my home computer, not my work. But this is rare, so it's actually not even on my current list

The key to contexts is this - Make them your own. Play around with them, figure out what works best for you. Mine have alternated continuously, depending on the type of job I have had, or frankly changes in how I think and deal with things. Don't be afraid to use whatever you need. You can always add more / remove them as they lose their usefulness.


Calendar Usage (part of the "Organizing" phase)
This might be the biggest thing for me. I was always a calendar guy - I come from a family that every year around now, my parents would pull out the new wall calendar for the coming new year, and sit and copy everything from the current year into the new calendar. So I always was a big user of calendars.

Once digital calendars (my first palm pilot that synced with Lotus Notes, ahhhh) came into play, I got rid of the paper calendars.

Once GTD came into play, I started heavily using it. Anything that has a date associated with goes into my calendar. Anything. Possible due date? In calendar. Scheduled appointment, no matter how small? Calendar. Renewal of a product I buy? Calendar.

This is not a brag, but I do not ever forget dates. How can I? Everything possible is in my calendar, synced to my phone, which alerts me.


Weekly Review:
I agree with AH, this is extremely important. It's also the biggest thing I lapse on, and always have. That's bad, I know. But at this point, it's not the most devastating, because I am good at the rest of it.

But get in the habit as soon as you can - I think the reason I still struggle with this is because in the very beginning, I lapsed with it.

Schedule it - block off time in your calendar specifically for this. I did that a couple of years back, and I have been 90% consistent with it since then, so I am doing better.


Tools
As mentioned before, I currently use a paid web application called FacileThings. I found it a couple of years back, and my work reimburses me the $84 a year to use it. It is great, I love it, and it's simple. It has a mobile app for when I need to capture or look up Next Actions to do while on-the-go.

For calendar, I use Outlook for my work, and Google Calendar for personal. I have my Work synced to my Google so I only ever have to look in one place.

I have used dozens of tools/setups in the past. This one probably works the best out of all of them. The next best was an app made for a very old version of Outlook that was affiliated/sold through DA's site. Unfortunately that folded. I have tried using Google Mail/Tasks/calendar, EverNote/OneNote, ToDoList, various other things. All worked fine for a period of time, then jobs/technology/I changed and I had to find a new one.

Ultimately you will experiment with different setups until you find one that works best for you.

Here's a key - if you are frustrated using the system you have, change - if you can't use the tools, you won't use the underlying system.


This has turned into something far longer than expected, so I am going to end at this point. Feel free to ask any clarification questions if I missed talking about anything, of if anything (all? lol) I wrote doesn't make sense.

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Slevin
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Re: GTD Getting Things Done for ERE People

Post by Slevin »

Started a trial of doing ZTD with google tasks because I’m a minimalist and it has a cool widget so I can throw my daily tasks up on the front of my phone. Thanks for the post about it @Outoftheblue. Will maybe post an update here in a month or two if I keep up the implementation, but it honestly seems simple enough, meets all my use cases, and is free. Random notes just go in a google doc. I didn’t read the GTD book, only the ZTD book, so no idea If I’m making an implementation mistake I’m making here, but it seems to fit my basic needs for now.

shelob
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Re: GTD Getting Things Done for ERE People

Post by shelob »

@OutOfTheBlue
Thank you for your helpful post, and the reading recommendation. I just went down a bit of a rabbit hole in that thread, and added the book to my reading list. I think I already intuitively do a few of the practices recommended in How To Take Smart Notes - just in a haphazard manner, spread out over a bunch of different physical notebooks, a notetaking app, and various odt and docx files. The improvement is kinda obvious now, and it seems like Logseq might be just the tool for it.

That's not my current organization problem, though. My problem is:
-my calendar is mixed with my to do list, and thereby cluttered
-my to do list contains 'projects' more than Next Actions, making dealing with it frustrating (there's not enough 'ticking off')
-my to do list is spread over two apps (calendar and notetaking) and various physical formats -> lack of overview -> lack of trust that when I write something on a list, I will actually get back to it -> it stays on my mind as stress factor.

In retrospect, it's really obvious how these are problems, I just somehow never noticed that they're problems until I started reading GTD.
I've looked at like five different programs and tried both Everdo and Logseq this afternoon to see which of the two would be the better tool for fixing that, and Everdo came out the clear winner. I think I might migrate to something else as my life evolves, but right now the better fit is obvious.

I'm getting the impression that you're better at the "frictionless life" thing than I. Could that be? It would explain the difference.

I've already run against the limitation of number of projects in the Everdo free version. I'd really appreciate the license key for the full version, if the offer is still open. I can pass it on if/when I move on to something else.



On a more general note
AxelHeyst wrote:
Sat Dec 10, 2022 8:22 pm
I value my GTD system more now that I don't have a real job, because it helps me organize my post-w*rk and arguably much more complex life. I have a lot more different things going on in my life now that I don't have a j*b hoovering up all my time. GTD helps me keep my freedom-to trajectory straight.
+1000 for the need to upgrade organisation techniques as the complexity of life increases!

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Re: GTD Getting Things Done for ERE People

Post by AxelHeyst »

@macg, thanks for sharing your history/approach, awesome post!

I appreciated your section on Contexts. I realized that I have essentially the same functions but they're built into my Project structure. But... I'm not sure it's a very efficient method. The way you've described yours feels much cleaner and more accessible. You've inspired me to reexamine my use of context tags/principles. Thank you!

macg
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Re: GTD Getting Things Done for ERE People

Post by macg »

AxelHeyst wrote:
Thu Dec 15, 2022 4:49 pm
@macg, thanks for sharing your history/approach, awesome post!

I appreciated your section on Contexts. I realized that I have essentially the same functions but they're built into my Project structure. But... I'm not sure it's a very efficient method. The way you've described yours feels much cleaner and more accessible. You've inspired me to reexamine my use of context tags/principles. Thank you!
I am glad it was helpful!

I didn't talk about Projects, but I do use them. Pretty much exactly as the book describes - anything that requires more than 1 Next Action = Project.

In the beginning I had troubles with this, my Projects were scatter-brained. But eventually (through usage and Weekly Reviews), I wrapped my head around it. There are many times now where I will just blitz 10 Next Actions into a project, when I get an epiphany of future steps. I think much of my early trouble was that my tools weren't set up in a way where I could easily view Projects stand-alone, meaning open a project and see all the Next Actions I had defined. Or the reverse - I was looking at Next Actions, and not able to easily see what project it linked back to. Once I started using tools that cleaned that up, I was good to go.

And to be clear, every Next Action in my Projects have a context defined as well. Again, for me it just makes it easier to decide what I will do next, dependent on where I am/what I am doing.

Love this thread! :-)

OutOfTheBlue
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Re: GTD Getting Things Done for ERE People

Post by OutOfTheBlue »

shelob wrote:
Thu Dec 15, 2022 4:02 pm
Glad Everdo clicked for you, PM sent for the license key. Swapping trash and treasure gone digital!

Logseq represents a big shift and is not specifically made for GTD, so there is a lot left to figure out. Not surprised it didn't hold up to the initial comparison. Maybe something for later!

I feel you about the issues you mention, especially Projects vs Next actions and the fiction with calendars.
Slevin wrote:
Thu Dec 15, 2022 2:59 pm
Started a trial of doing ZTD […]
Curious to see how this goes for you. The minimalist take is what appealed to me too

vexed87
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Re: GTD Getting Things Done for ERE People

Post by vexed87 »

I have added read GTD to my to do list, I hope I read it sometime soon to remind myself to read it (kidding, thanks for the recommendation).

I think Asana would work great for this. I think there is a free version useful for individuals, I use it a lot for my proffesional work, great for herding a team of cats and myself.

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Re: GTD Getting Things Done for ERE People

Post by luxagraf »

Ah I love me some GTD nerdery. I too took this up way back when Merlin Mann was a blogger and have at various points been really good with it, totally dropped it, gone back to it, customized it, added some elements of Kanban to it and so on. Today I still use the core elements (capture and organize esp) and thanks AxelHeyst for inspiring me to reread the book, it made me realize that for me the big thing is avoid is prioritizing tasks. The opposite of ZTD in other words. I just want to see my lists and then make a decision on what to do. I do have deadlines, but those go on my calendar so I'm not consulting a list of what to do when I already know what I have to do (if that makes sense). And if there's nothing I *have* to do right now, then I want to see the full list of what I need to do before I decide what to do. Anyway.

I'm not a big fan of GTD apps, I just use plain text files and some bash scripts I wrote to make it quick and easy to create and sort them by context.

And I credit GTD for saving me countless hours a month, whole days a year. Well worth exploring if you haven't already.

Gilberto de Piento
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Re: GTD Getting Things Done for ERE People

Post by Gilberto de Piento »

vexed87 wrote:
Thu Dec 15, 2022 8:09 pm
I think Asana would work great for this. I think there is a free version useful for individuals, I use it a lot for my proffesional work, great for herding a team of cats and myself.
I switched my personal list of projects/tasks over to Asana from Google Keep recently. I use Asana at work but only the free version because work doesn't pay for unauthorized software. It seems like Asana should work well but in the free version there is no way to set the priority of tasks or projects so I have a long list of intermingled items with radically different levels of importance. I don't think $10 per month for the paid version would be worth it for my use as a personal task list. Am I missing some workaround for prioritization filtering or ordering? Or am I doing gtd wrong and I shouldn't be prioritizing?

Google Keep is a lot more basic but I can prioritize by either "pinning" tasks to the top or tagging them with a priority level and then filtering for the high priority items.

Asana notifications also don't seem to work. A deadline comes and goes with no email or push notification from the app. It seems like I have it set up for notifications but nothing has happened so far.

Gilberto de Piento
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Re: GTD Getting Things Done for ERE People

Post by Gilberto de Piento »

shelob wrote:
Thu Dec 15, 2022 1:33 am
@Gilberto de Piento: How consequent are you with collecting?
Sorry about the delayed response. I think I've been doing a good job of collecting projects / tasks (which word?) I need to do (both personal and professional). I've been good at doing this part for years.

Unfortunately they aren't all going to the same system. Some become recurring calendar events if they are tied to a date and I will need a reminder (ex: buy Christmas gifts) and others go into a to do list app if they are to be done when I can (ex: repair dripping kitchen sink). I'm getting the impression that having to do items in multiple places is not best practice.

I'm also not using the contexts mentioned in a post above. Maybe I should try that.

vexed87
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Re: GTD Getting Things Done for ERE People

Post by vexed87 »

Regarding prioritisation in Asana, I can think of multiple ways,I'm not sure what is restricted by the licence model, but you could add a custom data field and label appropriately, and use tags, sort by due date, or numbering of some sort. If you don't sort tasks in any way you can also reorder them by simply dragging them around a project list or board.

Scott 2
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Re: GTD Getting Things Done for ERE People

Post by Scott 2 »

I pay $28/yr for this digital planner:

https://www.ticktick.com/about/features

IMO the combination of flexibility and pricing is best in class. The product is designed for someone managing themselves. I found most digital planners were burdened with team or organization scale aspirations. I do also use a Google calendar, which TickTick integrates with.


While I don't use the GTD system, I believe the required features are present.

https://medium.com/@sourabh8044/ticktic ... 1914548231

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Re: GTD Getting Things Done for ERE People

Post by AxelHeyst »

luxagraf wrote:
Thu Dec 15, 2022 10:13 pm
Today I still use the core elements (capture and organize esp) and thanks AxelHeyst for inspiring me to reread the book, it made me realize that for me the big thing is avoid is prioritizing tasks. The opposite of ZTD in other words. I just want to see my lists and then make a decision on what to do. I do have deadlines, but those go on my calendar so I'm not consulting a list of what to do when I already know what I have to do (if that makes sense). And if there's nothing I *have* to do right now, then I want to see the full list of what I need to do before I decide what to do. Anyway.
I wanted to highlight this, because I don't think it's come up until you mentioned it. Canonical GTD does not have a system for task prioritization on purpose. The notion is that knowing what is the most important thing to do in this moment, moment by moment, is such a fluid, dynamic, necessarily intuitive process that externalizing it to some system is bound to fail. You can prioritize your stuff accurately today, but quite possibly tomorrow your situation will have changed due to new circumstances that totally reverses your priority system. But you're jamming, so you don't go in and tweak it every single time. So prioritization becomes this rigid thing in your system that was true at one time but no longer is, and you kinda look at it but kinda don't, but bottom line is that you don't really ever trust it for more than a day or two.

This goes back to the 'get things out of your head and into a trusted system, so you can have a mind like water.' If your mind is trying to hold all your 'stuff', it's not going to be able to see/think clearly and accurately prioritize. You won't be able to be in touch, because you're overwhelmed/your cognitive RAM is overfull. When you do have an external system that you trust, your mind has the bandwidth to do the magical grey-matter work of discerning what is most important to you to take action on today, now.

Making prioritization decisions are one of the few things that GTD insists should stay inside your head.

(ETA: for ERE folk, there might be some relevance of this to the ability to pounce on serendipitous opportunities, or to intuitively manage a complex web of goals with low friction...)

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Re: GTD Getting Things Done for ERE People

Post by guitarplayer »

AxelHeyst wrote:
Sat Dec 10, 2022 8:22 pm

Q: I think I'll just do less stuff instead.
A: That's fine.
I think this is me now.

Otherwise, appreciate the OODA loops cue, that one I enjoyed as a really nice interdisciplinary work.

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Slevin
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Re: GTD Getting Things Done for ERE People

Post by Slevin »

3 week later check-in:

Finding ZTD extremely effective as an anxiety management tool (which I didn’t really expect). My anxiety levels have dropped by half or maybe more, just due to storing everything in a scheduled set of lists maybe?

I’m sure I’m not 100% implementing everything correctly, because I’m mostly just using the task list and setting daily tasks then once a week looking at all my completed tasks, etc, but it seems to be helpful even in implementing it this way.

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Re: GTD Getting Things Done for ERE People

Post by AxelHeyst »

GTD and Timeblock Planning

A really common question early on in GTD adoption is "How do I know when to do what?"

GTD is annoying coy about giving a straight answer to this question. Canon is that the whole point of GTD is to get your ideas out of your head so you are free to think, and frees up bandwidth to be able to make intuitive decisions about what to do. That's nice and all, but there are several issues it doesn't address. For example, everyone has tasks they don't really want to do, that would improve their lives in some way, but it's also fine if they just ignore it forever. GTD doesn't really have a straightforward answer to this.

A common method is to put these tasks on your calendar. GTD (and I) discourages this. Your calendar is for 'real' deadlines, appointments, meetings, and the like. If you start putting tasks that don't REALLY need to be done on your calendar, eventually if not immediately you'll procrastinate on them, and now you won't trust your calendar. This is bad!

The whole premise of GTD is to have a system that you trust, because your mind will only let go of stuff if it TRUSTS your external system. As soon as you start doing things that only work kinda sorta sometimes, your brain is going to distrust it and start holding on to those things. Not good.

What to do?

What I do is Cal Newport style daily timeblocking paired with weekly planning. For me, it complements ERE really well. Let me walk through it.

The last step of my Weekly Review, which I typically do on Sundays, is to write my weekly plan down in a notebook I have dedicated for timeblocking. At minimum, all this is is a list of desired outcomes for the week. It looks like this:
.Begin CA Residency application
.Do r/bwf RR on M, W, F this week
.Do yoga on T and R this week.
.Write every morning
.Begin bifacial panel ground mount rack design research and model
.Update model for X's project based on his comments
.Measure threshold spacers
.Draft and send email to Y requesting Z.
.Begin editing ep10.

I make this list while looking at my GTD system, which for me is in Standard Notes. I'm referencing active projects and next actions list, and I've just looked through my whole system, so this is the point of the week when I've got the best, most up-to-date mental model of all of my projects and areas of focus.

Every morning, I make coffee and write for an hour. Then, I open my timeblock notebook and draft the daily timeblock plan, referencing my weekly plan. First, I'll typically write down a list of tasks and things i could focus on. This isn't a 'have to do' list, it's a list of stuff that it might make sense to focus on that day. This is so that if, at any point of the day, I'm unsure of what to work on if I've got a gap in my plan, I can just reference that list and pick something.

My timeblocks are typically 90minutes long. It's typically around 0800 when I draft my timeblock plan. So I'll block out chunks of time that get me through the morning, include time for working out and lunch, and whatever I want to do in the afternoon. These days my plans rarely go longer than 1500. Sometimes the last thing on my timeblock plan is "workout and lunch", which concludes at 1300.

I don't like to think of my chunks as tasks, but rather as 'what to focus on'. Many things, I don't know how long they're going to take me, but I know that I need to spend consistent time focused on it. So instead of writing, say, "Complete the panel rack design", I'll put down 90 minutes for "designing the panel rack". The chunk tells me what to put my mind to, not exactly what should be done. I might finish the design in 90 minutes, or I might only get halfway, I've no idea. It's fine. My aim is to spend 90 minutes focused on the rack design, and that's my 'win' condition. It's a deep work focus, rather than a widget-cranking focus.

For me, this is what makes timeblock planning different than putting tasks on a calendar. Timeblock planning is less about "what am I going to complete today?" and more about "what am I going to focus my life-energy on today?". It's an outcome-independent approach to doing meaningful activity.

What I *don't* put on my timeblock plan is almost as important as what I DO put on it. If I choose to have the last thing on my timeblock plan be lunch, then that means that I'm making an intentional decision that my afternoon is for exactly whatever I feel like. If I feel like going for a walk, I'll do that. If I feel like reading some scifi all afternoon, I'll do that. I'm "done" for the day, I've already completed whatever it was I decided was important and meaningful for me to do, and now the most important and meaningful thing for me to do is to have wandery, freetime, where I'm not trying to 'accomplish' anything. I like my days to have an average of 50% non-scheduled free-play time, but some days are more and some days are less.

The effect of putting that 'hole' in my plan of the day is that I'm not second guessing myself. At 1500 I'm not going to go "oh, man, I've just been faffing off reading a book for two hours, should I be being productive instead?" because I already made the decision that, for the rest of the day, no, I'm good, I'm done. This is a really important point: for me, the most important and positive effect of timeblock planning is not knowing when and how to be productive, but knowing when to NOT be productive. It helps me put things down. This is the point of Cal's 'shutdown complete' routine.

Cam
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Re: GTD Getting Things Done for ERE People

Post by Cam »

Thank you for this Axelheyst!
Axeheyst wrote:Timeblock planning is less about "what am I going to complete today?" and more about "what am I going to focus my life-energy on today?". It's an outcome-independent approach to doing meaningful activity.
I like this way of thinking more. It involves less guilt if whatever it is doesn't get done, as long as focused time is spent.

Axelheyst wrote: The effect of putting that 'hole' in my plan of the day is that I'm not second guessing myself. At 1500 I'm not going to go "oh, man, I've just been faffing off reading a book for two hours, should I be being productive instead?" because I already made the decision that, for the rest of the day, no, I'm good, I'm done.
I do this second guessing ALL the time and I would love to stop it. I think I may give this time blocking a try. Being able to really say, "Okay Cam you can do whatever you want now, you're done for the day" will be very freeing.

Thank you for your introductions to GTD. I may have already failed my first attempt with it, but I'm going to keep trying (still gotta settle on a weekly review time) as the effort put in seems to pay for itself many times over both in productivity and peace of mind.

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Re: GTD Getting Things Done for ERE People

Post by AxelHeyst »

Cam wrote:
Sun Jan 15, 2023 9:37 am
I like this way of thinking more. It involves less guilt if whatever it is doesn't get done, as long as focused time is spent.
Yes, nailed it! It also, or another way to think of it is, it shifts the emphasis from extrinsic rewards/motivation to intrinsic rewards/motivation. It supports the idea that what I value is not accomplishment X or achievement Y, but rather the experience of spending my time well (in focus, with people I like, in creative endeavor, on meaningful engagement...).
Cam wrote:
Sun Jan 15, 2023 9:37 am
Thank you for your introductions to GTD. I may have already failed my first attempt with it, but I'm going to keep trying (still gotta settle on a weekly review time) as the effort put in seems to pay for itself many times over both in productivity and peace of mind.
I saw a quote in someone's forum sig that went something like "They say you have to make 500 crap drawings to make your first good one. 137 down..."

With GTD, it's more like "You have to fail to get off the ground 2-5 times before your GTD system gains self-sustaining momentum. One down..."

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Re: GTD Getting Things Done for ERE People

Post by AxelHeyst »

An example of last week's timeblock plan, for reference.

Image

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Re: GTD Getting Things Done for ERE People

Post by jacob »

How is GTD compatible with the maker schedule?
http://www.paulgraham.com/makersschedule.html

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