Any Data Analysts?

[alex123711]

@ertyu

I'd go with the first one. When starting in this profession...look for generalized skills that can be applicable just about everywhere like SQL or Python. It looks to me like the "Google Data Analytics Professional Certificate" provides that generalized basis. And also gives your resume a brand name to boot. Employers still grok over things like "AWS" or "Google" or "Python" on a CV.

For instance, when I started my data analysis career, I only worked in Excel and SQL for years (occasional R as well). In my current job, I primarily program in SAS but we're starting Python now as well. I was able to pick up SAS rather quickly due to my prior experience in SQL.

SQL is used just about everywhere in economics/finance because one is pulling transactional or accounting data. Especially transactional data depending on a business process, you'll need to know how to merge/join with other tables quite often. SQL is good for getting a programming base but also helping to mentally visualize how data is transformed.

Would just excel and SQL still be sufficient these days? Seems like a lot of jobs require a lot more now. Is the google cert worth having on a resume?

[ertyu]

When it comes to data analysis and data science, chatgpt should also be discussed. I'm not informed and I haven't played with it, but I've stumbled on the writings of data analysts who have and who are using it at work. It changes how they do their jobs. It makes me question whether a traditional degree in data analytics still makes sense to pursue.

[guitarplayer]

It makes me question whether a traditional degree in data analytics still makes sense to pursue.

A traditional degree works as a flag or a signal. One forumite once mentioned to me that it works as a general IQ test substitute, since IQ tests are not allowed. While being a practitioner in a(ny) discipline, I think it makes sense to be pragmatic and apply things that work. Academia usually takes a while to take on board things that work (or never does it due to some taboos, conflicts of interests etc). Academia is a social system, too.

Put differently, people thriving in academia (i.e. those who deliver traditional degrees to their clients) are pragmatic about their job and apply things that work.

Nota Bene, I am going to try to use ChatGPT as an idiot savant study buddy and see if it can help me prove some mathematics. So I will listen attentively, but always work from the assumption that what I receive might be an utter pile of crap.

[7Wannabe5]

It makes me question whether a traditional degree in data analytics still makes sense to pursue.

Yes, this is a question I've been asking myself since I am likely going to end up forking out about 20K for an MS in Data Analytics at the age of 58. My thought is that my B.S. in Mathematics, even though I haven't made that much direct use of it, has always been like an LBD (little black dress) in my closet that I could pull out when needed. So, an M.S. in Data Analytics is maybe like a classic over-sized gray blazer. Something I could wear with the LBD in a formal setting, or just with a pair of jeans in more casual venue.

I am actually quite geeked about the addition of chatGPT to the mix, because this brings the two branches of Information Science, Research Librarian vs. Data Analyst, closer together, and that is also closer to how my brain works. There's a level on which trying to communicate the concept of negative numbers to a 5th grader isn't that different than trying to formulate an interesting question for chatGPT.

[Sclass]

@7W I think you just need to get started. Stop looking at your LBD and just put it on and go out. Forget about the $20K for the handbag and heels…the LBD and some confidence will go a long way.

The fact that ChatGpt is about to upset this field opens up an opportunity for people willing to learn how to wield it effectively. As intelligent as it is I think the real challenge is commanding it and constraining it to get a desired output. From what I’ve seen the human interface requires a new human computer interaction model. Incrementally modifying an algorithm looks wildly tricky in the online videos. Starting out from scratch right now with a ChatGpt style of data science may be a good opportunity to break in.

Be careful what you ask for. Like all powerful analytical software ChatGpt has a need to be conditioned and constrained to produce meaningful output especially as the task becomes more complex. Incremental improvement of an algorithm using a chat bot looks challenging compared to doing it with old school coding. This may be the skill test for an effective data scientist going forward.

I was looking at investing in Alteryx a few years ago. It looked like a good concept. Data science tools for people who couldn’t program yet understood math. I’m glad I didn’t put any money into that. Perhaps they’ll invest in AI and stay relevant but before that they’ll be vulnerable to ChatGpt.

Data science has been a big exit plan for many of the physicists I’ve worked with. Up to the data science thing starting (~2011) physicists in tech felt kind of trapped at my company. With their math skills all it took was some Python and database coding skills which they picked up in a few months…then Boom, LinkedIn post about their new job in big tech. I think adding the ability to efficiently converse with a chat bot is a smart skill to add to that mix.

It’s just a matter of learning how to solve an analysis problem with the ChatGpt in your problem solving loop. I’m seeing kind of a hybrid approach where you make the machine do some of the heavy lifting.

[7Wannabe5]

@7W I think you just need to get started. Stop looking at your LBD and just put it on and go out. Forget about the $20K for the handbag and heels…the LBD and some confidence will go a long way.

I know, I know...I'm halfway done with the degree already, and at this point I'm actually going to be break-even on the cost due to some finagling I managed, so I might bail. I even have a bit of a literal old boy network willing to help me. But, I also kind of just want to spend the summer swimming and camping in the wooda, focused on regaining my physical health and vitality now that my disease is 80% under control. 100% brain-in-a-box lifestyle makes me feel cold and look uggo; working on a program for 12 hours/day takes me back to the flickering flourescent lights of the sub-sub-basement computer lab of the arctic zone engineering school of my youth and makes me remember why I transferred out of that program, but I think what I need to do is come up with an independent project that will engage me.

[ether]

made all my money from being a data analyst.
it's a super chill job and so easy I was able to do two jobs at once which caused my to reach FI so much quicker.

For me I just learned SQL online, started a fake consulting company for experience and then got a tableau certification.

There are a 10k analyst jobs on dice.com and linkedin that need to be filled right now and it's super easy to get into the field.

I've trained about 6 people that had no formal education into getting $30-60/hr analyst jobs so I have confidence to say this method works

[ertyu]

For me I just learned SQL online, started a fake consulting company for experience and then got a tableau certification.

Ha, explain the fake consulting company hustle

[guitarplayer]

and then got a tableau certification.

I sometimes think about getting a SAS or Power BI certification to pivot my way to another country down the line so that I retain diversity of experience and lower the chances of brain degenerative diseases in old age.

[alex123711]

made all my money from being a data analyst.
it's a super chill job and so easy I was able to do two jobs at once which caused my to reach FI so much quicker.

For me I just learned SQL online, started a fake consulting company for experience and then got a tableau certification.

There are a 10k analyst jobs on dice.com and linkedin that need to be filled right now and it's super easy to get into the field.

I've trained about 6 people that had no formal education into getting $30-60/hr analyst jobs so I have confidence to say this method works

How did you train them? Would you still recommend the tableau certification?

[Stahlmann]

viewtopic.php?p=190680#p190680

[zbigi]

but I think what I need to do is come up with an independent project that will engage me.

Hah, I've been pretty much looking for an "independent project that will engage me" for the past 10+ years. It's possible that my treshold for engagement is higher, because I'm looking for an idea with a shot at commercial viability (At this point it seems impossible to for me to become engaged by doing something which doesn't lead to money (or, at least, saving of money)). However, software world seems to be just terrible for that, it's a power-law-dominated winner take most universe.

[jacob]

Hah, I've been pretty much looking for an "independent project that will engage me" for the past 10+ years. It's possible that my treshold for engagement is higher, because I'm looking for an idea with a shot at commercial viability (At this point it seems impossible to for me to become engaged by doing something which doesn't lead to money (or, at least, saving of money)).

I see (saw?) engagement at three different levels:

1) Costs money/effort/etc. IOW most people's hobbies are money and time sinks.
2) Cost neutral. That's typically something that's self-sufficient or saves as much money as one spends.
3) Commercial. Something that can be turned into a business.

I think one's pursuit ought to be determined by one's reserves. I cut (1) out of my life when I started thinking about ERE1. I basically surrendered all hobbies that did not somehow "add value" somewhere on the vector of capital. I never pursued (3) directly.

FWIW, I think the pursuit of money or the pursuit of not spending (the negative space) can lead to "putting a price on everything". In my case, this lead to seeking external rewards (or external neutrality) and never asking if something was good for me. This can become a deep hole to dig out of. In the past year I've focused more on having fun with computers and projects, essentially rediscovering my teenage years and early twenties. I find myself a lot happier when not connecting with people, "building community", and dealing with social maintenance, etc.

Ultimately, it can be seen along the lines of career advice.
First, make a list of what's worthwhile. (or doesn't waste money ... whatever the cut-off is)
Second, delete all entries you lack the talent for. (In my case, interacting with humans on a regular basis)
Third, pick whatever you're interested it.

It's helpful to start with a long list than trying to check boxes in triplets.

Add: I think a pure pursuit of (3) is unwise. It follows the standard "just find your passion" and "it's not work if you like what you're doing". The problem is that externalizing rewards tend to destroy/replace passion with is internally motivated. A good way to kill someones interest is to a) offer them money and b) ask them to go beyond what they inherently want, because money.

[zbigi]

In the past year I've focused more on having fun with computers and projects, essentially rediscovering my teenage years and early twenties. I find myself a lot happier when not connecting with people, "building community", and dealing with social maintenance, etc.

Hah, this is in some way similar to my path, although my "rediscovering youth" phase has been going for a couple years now, and I'm becoming dissatisfied with it. Anyway, the story is that, as a teenager and even university student, I've lived very carelessly, not pondering the issue of money or career at all (except for the fact that I was very interested in computers, so it was natural that I will be doing something with them). The idea of working in a corporate world, building up career etc. were extremely alien to me - I pretty much hardly knew that such things existed. [1] Instead, I either partied, read books or played a lot of games.
After that, I was introduced to my first job and, with it, quickly came the cold realization that OMG THIS SUCKS I NEED TO GET OUT ASAP. This made me quite focused on the career path and I pretty much didn't touch the games I loved for 10+ years, as I saw them as slowing me down in my quest to financial independence. And finally now, when I'm FI, I am regressing to my youthful state of not giving AF and playing a lot of Magic and Civilization again. However, this makes my high-achiever persona of the past 10+ years quite disappointed - so the joy is not as pure and innocent as it was in my youth. Also, I know much more about game design now, so the games aren't as engaging as they were in the past. All this results in a kind of midlife crisis/crisis of meaning, that I'm currently struggling with.

[1] Contrast that with young Poles of today, who seem to have quite precise career development scenarios in mind, along with job titles and expected salaries after X years of work. I was brought up in poorer and simpler times, where the rat rate wasn't as intense, because the rewards sucked anyway.

Add: I think a pure pursuit of (3) is unwise. It follows the standard "just find your passion" and "it's not work if you like what you're doing". The problem is that externalizing rewards tend to destroy/replace passion with is internally motivated. A good way to kill someones interest is to a) offer them money and b) ask them to go beyond what they inherently want, because money.

How do you see (3) being on the same page as following one's passion? Most people's passions have low chances of meaningful commercialization (at least, without killing the passion along the way), so one would have to seriously delude themselves to think the passion will lead to non-trivial money.

[white belt]

FWIW, I think the pursuit of money or the pursuit of not spending (the negative space) can lead to "putting a price on everything". In my case, this lead to seeking external rewards (or external neutrality) and never asking if something was good for me. This can become a deep hole to dig out of. In the past year I've focused more on having fun with computers and projects, essentially rediscovering my teenage years and early twenties. I find myself a lot happier when not connecting with people, "building community", and dealing with social maintenance, etc.

I'm also on this path, although in my case it's playing Magic: the Gathering. Although I don't consider myself past WL5/6, my catalyst was working an unfulfilling job in combination with realizing that I am 1-2 years out from leaving salaryman work. My savings rate meant that FIRE would be almost a certainty, which means I felt like I had to figure out how to live a fulfilling life on my own when money is a solved problem. That's quite different from doing an activity solely because it saves/makes money, although I do think my hobby could at least grow to be financially neutral at some point.

[ether]

Ha, explain the fake consulting company hustle

1. just go to IRS website and do free file to get company ID called employer identification number (EIN)
https://www.irs.gov/businesses/small-bu ... ein-online
2. make company bank account
3. have friend or yourself request for a paid project
4. deposit money into biz bank account
5. report taxes
6. when recruiter and backround check person from real company asks for proof of employement you can provide your tax return. the back round checker won't care how much you got paid just that it's a real biz

[ether]

I sometimes think about getting a SAS or Power BI certification to pivot my way to another country down the line so that I retain diversity of experience and lower the chances of brain degenerative diseases in old age.

powerbi has way more market share than SAS
https://trustradiusnew.wpengine.com/wp- ... x675-2.png

[ether]

How did you train them? Would you still recommend the tableau certification?

I used to teach for a for profit bootcamp so I just gave them all the home work sets.
If you want a free-ish version of what they paid for just take these classes on linkedin learning

https://www.linkedin.com/learning/table ... lculations
https://www.linkedin.com/learning/table ... g-14959992
https://www.linkedin.com/learning/paths ... sis-skills
https://www.linkedin.com/learning/search?keywords=sql
https://www.linkedin.com/learning/learn ... ng-8382385
https://www.linkedin.com/learning/paths ... e-16361344

take your time and you can plow through this in like 4 months tops and be an average quality data analyst. Plenty of pros that lack the skills even in these basic courses. it's not a competitive industry there is a total lack of supply so there are a ton of posers.

I think certs are cool if you are just getting started and lack a lot of practical experience. once you got experience i wouldn't stress about the retest or expired licences, it's just a money grab by the vendors

[jacob]

[1] Contrast that with young Poles of today, who seem to have quite precise career development scenarios in mind, along with job titles and expected salaries after X years of work. I was brought up in poorer and simpler times, where the rat rate wasn't as intense, because the rewards sucked anyway.

...

How do you see (3) being on the same page as following one's passion? Most people's passions have low chances of meaningful commercialization (at least, without killing the passion along the way), so one would have to seriously delude themselves to think the passion will lead to non-trivial money.

"Follow your passion" is standard career advice in Denmark (and I presume the rest of Scandinavia). Self-delusion becomes much easier if everybody else is deluded too. I always suspected that the advice was because it's possible to graduate more students if they study something they're actually interested in. In practice "following your passion" does lead into non-monetizable traps but the welfare-state catches people from falling and let people retrain. Those who didn't find their passion the first time get a second degree, and maybe a third ... and so on. Always in pursuit of their passion.

Passion may also have some "rockstar"-payoffs in that when/while it's good, it's really good; thus creating a small group of actually passionate people that continuously hype the idea.

[7Wannabe5]

Hah, I've been pretty much looking for an "independent project that will engage me" for the past 10+ years. It's possible that my treshold for engagement is higher, because I'm looking for an idea with a shot at commercial viability (At this point it seems impossible to for me to become engaged by doing something which doesn't lead to money (or, at least, saving of money)). However, software world seems to be just terrible for that, it's a power-law-dominated winner take most universe.

It was an interesting experience recently taking a programming (app dev in 21st century parlance)course after last taking one over 30 years ago. I've done little snippets of programming on my own over the years as needed for doing something interesting with Excel, or creating a website , teaching kids about simple robots etc., but always on my own timer. I find (or now remember) that I really do not enjoy programming on a timer. It made me remember something BRUTE said about it being like plumbing, because I really do not like performing tasks like installing a hot water heater on a timer either. OTOH, I can whip up a BS research paper or summary-for-the-executive-suite type report just like chatGPT; one part something obviously relevant, one part something also obviously relevant but a bit more advanced, one part something brought in from left field, and I pass for somebody with critical thinking skills

I don't have anything against young tech bros as humans, they might even be more lovable on average than, for instance, old engineering bros, but the tech world is kind of weirdly insular due to a pretty high level of similarity between its inhabitants. For instance, I was watching an interview with Sam Altman about chatGPT, and Jordan Peterson was brought up in the conversation, and my thought was how useless, predictable, and boring. The reason why a society might want to have one human who is passionate about not-immediately-monetizable interests such as Peruvian Basket Weaving for every human who is passionate about Fibre Optic Installation is that something resembling a liberal education might result around the midpoint. Everybody reading the same 3 or even 30 books is a recipe for disaster over the long run.