Early Retirement Extreme Forums

I live in Singapore. Countries are limiting necessities and commodities for exports now. We are a small country and it affects us tremendously as we pretty much require almost all our necessities from other countries. Energy, food, water, you name it.

I feel that when it comes to retirement, we should also consider countries that are self-sufficient, so that we are less affected by such factors. What are factors to consider when choosing a place to retire for you?

What are your thoughts?

I'm pretty much tied to my area of Poland by family and friendships, but if that wasn't the case, I'd think really hard about the US. Jacob wrote here a couple of times that, in times of gradual decline, the center of civilization (US at the moment) will experience it lastly. The US economy and currency are very strong, the demographic projections look very good, political class seems very solid (compared to alternatives in many other countries), it is mostly self-sufficient in terms of resources, the society is interesting, varied and has sensible values. The big problem of course is health care, so that would have to be investigated before pulling the trigger - but AFAIK there's free some government health care program for old people (medicare?).

Climately Northern Europe would be my long term choice, the Baltic will become like the Mediterranean. Canada and New Zealand are also good choices. Politically stable, resource rich, somewhat self sufficient.

On the other hand, you might have a better life living in an area which is declining. Cape Town for example can give you a great quality of life but I'd have an exit plan and wouldnt invest there.

chenda wrote: ↑

Fri May 27, 2022 2:41 am

Climately Northern Europe would be my long term choice, the Baltic will become like the Mediterranean. Canada and New Zealand are also good choices. Politically stable, resource rich, somewhat self sufficient.

On the other hand, you might have a better life living in an area which is declining. Cape Town for example can give you a great quality of life but I'd have an exit plan and wouldnt invest there.

I live in an area that went through massive decline. Yeah it's cheap, but otherwise not pretty. Luckily, there's no crime (drugs never caught on in Poland, so we don't have addiction-driven crimes), but still - the place's overall energy is sapped. Both people's spirits and state of infrastructure, buildings etc. are shitty, and living in such conditions is an emotional downer.

zbigi wrote: ↑

Fri May 27, 2022 4:26 am

I live in an area that went through massive decline. Yeah it's cheap, but otherwise not pretty. Luckily, there's no crime (drugs never caught on in Poland, so we don't have addiction-driven crimes), but still - the place's overall energy is sapped. Both people's spirits and state of infrastructure, buildings etc. are shitty, and living in such conditions is an emotional downer.

Yeah I should have clarified I meant a country or region in overall decline. Much of South Africa is extremely violent and impoverished, but there are certain very affluent areas where you can live a first works lifestyle at a fraction of the cost. The long term future isn't great. I do agree living in an economically depressed area is, well, depressing, even if you are personally prospering.

Cool climate, good water source, low cost of living, walkable area, peaceful people, low pollution, areas of protected nature (forests), access to health care.

The US can be low cost - high quality of life if you choose the right areas and avoid the traps that can increase costs.

Looking around, I think Equador or Colombia might be good retirement destinations, but that just might be me wanting to go on an adventure.

Go to many places

not flippant answer

I lived in many places and no place is what I thought it was before arrival

Also "feel" of place is bigger than "factors". "Factors" rule out, but not in.

Big social factors dont matter much to retirees. Money stashed abroad, no kids (probably). Things go bad just leave.

in the US, i'de go for the UP. This is by far the best compromise i visited in the US. it is good enough to compensate the lack of mountain.

otherwise, i like switzerland, and all the area around the baltic.
i especially like how switzerland never gets dry.
one thing that binds me to switzerland is how free i feel there. knowing the culture allows you to do a lot more, and thus makes life more enjoyable and saves money.

Jean wrote: ↑

Fri May 27, 2022 9:06 am

in the US, i'de go for the UP.

What is UP? Agree Switzerland is pretty awesome. I might try living there soon.

There may be a trade of between the feel of a place (very important) vs long term prospects. Some people like Australia, but its burning down. Invest your money in a safer place and live the lifestyle you want wherever you want.

Other places are like marmite, you either love it or hate it. Some like South East Asia, but its definitely not my cup of tea. South America on the other hand I like. Patagonia is a long term climate change option.

The Gambia and Ghana is a popular choice, especially for some black British and African-Americans.

uper peninsula, the northern part of michigan.
West Africa has many great aspect, but i'de avoid capital cities(in ghana, i felt much better in kumasi, than in accra, same in ivory coast) And even if you are like 75% black, you could be percieved as white there, which can be a problem.
Looking like you're aboriginal or a very successful colonist is a must in my opinion to safely settle somewhere long term.

Ah right, @7wannabe5s patch.

Interesting to hear you've been to West Africa Jean. The white population is shrinking in South Africa, many fleeing the violence. This is bad news for everyone.

once was for work, and the second time with a friend's friend.
addit:
@chenda, you often mention how much you'de like switzerland. have you visited it? or what is preventing you to visit?

I agree. Singapore is unique since it's only a city-state (if using the term is correct here) and there's nowhere else to go besides the one city.

I agree with @prudentalo - go to other places and see. Just within Southeast Asia, the different countries have HUGE differences - even just in different parts of one country.

For us it’s probably going to be Italy.
Our respective families live within 1h of our hometown in northern Italy, which is relatively low cost, has great affordable healthcare, lots of water.
I give an outsider chance to the USA.
In case we ever manage to get a green card I can see is settling somewhere around SLC

Jean wrote: ↑

Fri May 27, 2022 10:44 am

@chenda, you often mention how much you'de like switzerland. have you visited it? or what is preventing you to visit?

I have been several times in the past on short trips. Geneva, Zurich, Lucerne, Lausanne. I'd like to try living there for several months, maybe in the mountains.

Seppia wrote: ↑

Sat May 28, 2022 12:54 am

In case we ever manage to get a green card I can see is settling somewhere around SLC

Have you considered religion? Nothing against Mormons, but they are a tightly knit group and unless you are in, you are totally out. I hear SLC is an exception, but I suspect most of Utah would be tough unless you are a member of the Mormon church. The state is absolutely gorgeous though!

chenda wrote: ↑

Fri May 27, 2022 10:35 am

Ah right, @7wannabe5s patch.

Not really. The UP is a cultural unto itself and aligns much more closely with places on Lake Superior than the rest of the state. 7w5 is almost 500 miles away with a different climate, economy, and people.

Majority of SLC is now non-mormon. One of my brothers lives there and loves it. Mormonism there is a non-issue. There are a lot of young people from outside the state who have moved there to have closer/better access to trails, parks and natural areas. I think a concern would be the smog in the winter. The area suffers from inversion that traps all pollutants from escaping to upper levels of the atmosphere when it's cold enough out. Perhaps you can find an area outside of the smog though. We have the same thing in the town near which I live, but we live one valley over and avoid all of the winter smog.

On the wave of my recent enthusiasm for free education in this country, I am going to take a stab at it and suggest Scotland. For residents here:

+s:
- great outdoors
- sparsely populated generally but densely populated and there is lots going on in the central belt
- when earning below a certain threshold (ERE retirees will qualify), possible to study multiple fields in structured programs as zero or near zero cost
- NHS will take care of health accidents and even minor ailments (though you'll possibly need to wait for it to take care of these)
- climate change will likely play in its favour, good for growing most things (though watch out for areas prone to flooding)
- possible to grow important foods already now: dark leafy greens, grains, berries (very good climate for berries), root vegetables, broadbeans
- land and property not very expensive
- English speaking
- Part of an island, but well connected with flights and ferries to elsewhere
- people are nice, even people from rough areas
- extensive folklore if someone is into this, 'place with a history'

-s:
- wet, variable weather (can rain 4 times in a day interspersed with sun)
- tricky for those who love to bask in the sun
- midges from May to October, give or take
- drug problems in urban areas (never experienced personally, know from reading stats about it)

I think at the moment this country is a good place for ERE retirees. Who knows what the future's gonna bring. Echoing others, probably best to go and find out for oneself.

For Scotland you forgot:
+s: whisky


I’m with theanimal on SLC. Last time I was there was 6 years ago, but it did not feel overwhelmingly mormon.
It kinda felt like any other US city, only with a fantastic access to nature that I think is almost unparalleled.