Subject: China Travel Advisory: Level 2: Exercise increased caution, January 3, 2019

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Mister Imperceptible
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Subject: China Travel Advisory: Level 2: Exercise increased caution, January 3, 2019

Post by Mister Imperceptible » Thu Jan 03, 2019 1:02 pm

From: STEP Notifications <STEP-Notifications@state.gov>
Date: Thu, Jan 3, 2019 at 11:24 AM
Subject: China Travel Advisory: Level 2: Exercise increased caution, January 3, 2019
To: <ACS_CHINA@calist.state.gov>

Exercise increased caution in China due to arbitrary enforcement of local laws as well as special restrictions on dual U.S.-Chinese nationals.

Chinese authorities have asserted broad authority to prohibit U.S. citizens from leaving China by using `exit bans,' sometimes keeping U.S. citizens in China for years. China uses exit bans coercively:

-to compel U.S. citizens to participate in Chinese government investigations,
-to lure individuals back to China from abroad, and
-to aid Chinese authorities in resolving civil disputes in favor of Chinese parties.

In most cases, U.S. citizens only become aware of the exit ban when they attempt to depart China, and there is no method to find out how long the ban may continue. U.S. citizens under exit bans have been harassed and threatened.

U.S. citizens may be detained without access to U.S. consular services or information about their alleged crime. U.S. citizens may be subjected to prolonged interrogations and extended detention for reasons related to "state security." Security personnel may detain and/or deport U.S. citizens for sending private electronic messages critical of the Chinese government.

Extra security measures, such as security checks and increased levels of police presence, are common in the Xinjiang Uighur and Tibet Autonomous Regions. Authorities may impose curfews and travel restrictions on short notice.

China does not recognize dual nationality. U.S.-Chinese citizens and U.S. citizens of Chinese heritage may be subject to additional scrutiny and harassment, and China may prevent the U.S. Embassy from providing consular services.

Read the Safety and Security section on the country information page.

If you decide to travel to China:

-Enter China on your U.S. passport with a valid Chinese visa and keep it with you.
-If you are arrested or detained, ask police or prison officials to notify the U.S. Embassy or the nearest consulate immediately.
-If you plan to enter North Korea, read the North Korea Travel Advisory.
-Enroll in the Smart Traveler Enrollment Program (STEP) to receive Alerts and make it easier to locate you in an emergency.
-Follow the Department of State on Facebook and Twitter. -Follow the U.S. Embassy on Twitter, WeChat, and Weibo.
Review the Crime and Safety Reports for China.
-U.S. citizens who travel abroad should always have a contingency plan for emergency situations. Review the Traveler's Checklist.

prognastat
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Re: Subject: China Travel Advisory: Level 2: Exercise increased caution, January 3, 2019

Post by prognastat » Thu Jan 03, 2019 1:25 pm

From my understanding tensions are rising in China and there has been some course change where up until recently they were relaxing on the communism and more open to trade, but that that this has been shifting back recently and has foreigners visiting/staying in China uncomfortable.

Not sure if they can, but I'm sure if they can some of our members that are/have been located either in or closer to China might be able to provide more information regarding this.

jacob
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Re: Subject: China Travel Advisory: Level 2: Exercise increased caution, January 3, 2019

Post by jacob » Thu Jan 03, 2019 2:10 pm

Mister Imperceptible wrote:
Thu Jan 03, 2019 1:02 pm
Security personnel may detain and/or deport U.S. citizens for sending private electronic messages critical of the Chinese government.
prognastat wrote:
Thu Jan 03, 2019 1:25 pm
Not sure if they can, but I'm sure if they can some of our members that are/have been located either in or closer to China might be able to provide more information regarding this.
That would probably be ill-advised.

prognastat
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Re: Subject: China Travel Advisory: Level 2: Exercise increased caution, January 3, 2019

Post by prognastat » Thu Jan 03, 2019 2:16 pm

Yeah, that's why I mentioned the if they can such as people who may no longer be located in China or happen to live near, but not in China. Definitely don't put yourself in any potential risk if you currently live in, plan to live in China or have ties business or family wise there.

niemand
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Re: Subject: China Travel Advisory: Level 2: Exercise increased caution, January 3, 2019

Post by niemand » Thu Jan 03, 2019 11:32 pm

It is not too uncommon for countries to take citizens of opposing nations as political hostages if it serves their agenda. Bannning people from leaving is essentially taking them as prisoners within the country’s borders.

I travel to China a couple of times a year for work and have been going since 2012. Imho central control is increasing. Maybe this is accelerating since Xi Jinping* became forever-president, not sure. These days I’m doing in-and-out trips, spending as little time as possible.

* Sadly, since Xi resembles Winnie the Pooh in appearance, the Pooh-bear is now a persona-non-grata on social media. Chinese Big Brother reads all social mdia and any mention of the Pooh may get you into trouble for defamation.

Some things I find remarkable:

At the airport you now have to provide fingerprints of every single of your fingers before you can go through passport control. The machine that takes your prints greets you in your passport’s mother tongue and tells you welcome back if you’ve been scanned before. All prints go into a database that will be used for who knows what...

I’m finding my colleagues from the independent nation of Taiwan more worried about geo-politics than usual...
China’s attitude is what has once been Chinese needs to become Chinese again. In the past this only implied territory (e.g. Taiwan). Maybe it now includes people, too (e.g. dual citizens)?

China is expanding its know-how by buying up strategic companies across the world, for example in robotics, solar or automotive. Sometimes foreign governments intervene, but most of the time China gets away with it...

Other topics:
IP theft...
Trade War...
New Silk Road...
“Aid” to developing countries...

I’ve got more but I’ll spare you - they are all in the vein of the above. The central government is consolidating and asserting its power internally and externally. Most likely this will be the Chinese Century.

tonyedgecombe
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Re: Subject: China Travel Advisory: Level 2: Exercise increased caution, January 3, 2019

Post by tonyedgecombe » Fri Jan 04, 2019 5:18 am

niemand wrote:
Thu Jan 03, 2019 11:32 pm
The central government is consolidating and asserting its power internally and externally. Most likely this will be the Chinese Century.
I've always thought the real test for the CPC would be a deep recession. It's easy to keep things moving along when you have plenty of economic growth, much harder when things start contracting.

niemand
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Re: Subject: China Travel Advisory: Level 2: Exercise increased caution, January 3, 2019

Post by niemand » Fri Jan 04, 2019 6:34 am

I may be wrong, but Imho there will not be a recession, not officially. People on the streets due to an unofficial recession will be squashed.

thegreatvoid

Re: Subject: China Travel Advisory: Level 2: Exercise increased caution, January 3, 2019

Post by thegreatvoid » Fri Jan 04, 2019 7:28 am

niemand wrote:
Fri Jan 04, 2019 6:34 am
I may be wrong, but Imho there will not be a recession, not officially. People on the streets due to an unofficial recession will be squashed.
As much as I dislike the people´s republic of China( which in my eyes is equivilant to Mordor :twisted: )
It´s not like the West doesn´t artifically make the economy go up or down.
Look at the great recession. hey lets just pump in a 152 billion dollars to save the stock market from going to zero.
or Trump cutting taxes to inflate the Stock market, to get reelected.

Remember occupy wallstreet....

fiby41
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Re: Subject: China Travel Advisory: Level 2: Exercise increased caution, January 3, 2019

Post by fiby41 » Fri Jan 04, 2019 8:21 am

Where can I find similar advisory for Russia?

Sorry for derailing/ off tangent.

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jennypenny
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Re: Subject: China Travel Advisory: Level 2: Exercise increased caution, January 3, 2019

Post by jennypenny » Fri Jan 04, 2019 9:09 am

The State Dept has notified specific groups and individuals in China of the enhanced warning beyond normal STEP notifications.

@fiby41 -- US advisory for Russia

thegreatvoid

Re: Subject: China Travel Advisory: Level 2: Exercise increased caution, January 3, 2019

Post by thegreatvoid » Fri Jan 04, 2019 9:39 am

Can someone please explain to me , how the republican party and every right wing person in the world developed a crush for Russia and Putin.A country ruled by an authoritarian regime with a wekass economy. Russia´s GDP is lower than Italy´s or Canada´s, with 4 times its population.

Campitor
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Re: Subject: China Travel Advisory: Level 2: Exercise increased caution, January 3, 2019

Post by Campitor » Fri Jan 04, 2019 11:12 am

The friendliness you're talking about really isn't friendliness but rather a different level of focused interest. China currently is our #1 trading partner and Russia is #30 so it's not surprising that so much focus is being put on China by the current administration. What is stupid is the current administration's policy of imposing tariffs on Chinese goods to protect US businesses which artificially imposes price hikes on US consumers; so the grand bloviator creates a smattering of jobs while raising the price of goods and services for everyone else.

Augustus
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Re: Subject: China Travel Advisory: Level 2: Exercise increased caution, January 3, 2019

Post by Augustus » Fri Jan 04, 2019 1:08 pm

Campitor wrote:
Fri Jan 04, 2019 11:12 am
What is stupid is the current administration's policy of imposing tariffs on Chinese goods to protect US businesses which artificially imposes price hikes on US consumers; so the grand bloviator creates a smattering of jobs while raising the price of goods and services for everyone else.
I sometimes feel that Trump has subtle agendas that he achieves by doing WWF wrestler impressions. My suspicion is that he knows how unstable China's economy is so he's trying to tip it over. But given China's state control over everything that may not be possible. The market control there is fascinating. You need government approval to sell things, so when things start crashing the government bans everyone from selling, reducing supply, and causing prices to stabilize. It'll be interesting to see how long that can last. The problem they had last year is that they inflated the prices so much that it was cheaper to buy things in the west, so they had huge capital flight and Chinese started buying up Western property like houses and businesses. Their solution was to ban capital flight.

Xi Jinping is scary, so far he's made concentration camps, used anti corruption laws to kill or imprison his political enemies, made himself president for life by removing term limits, massively expanded the military (Rand now says they're at parity with the US in Asia), and annexed territory.

Apparently he was persecuted in his youth and some people believe he's overcompensating for that by being extremely aggressive.

Campitor
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Re: Subject: China Travel Advisory: Level 2: Exercise increased caution, January 3, 2019

Post by Campitor » Fri Jan 04, 2019 2:44 pm

@ Augustus

This oligarchical control of the economy will only weaken them in the long run imho. China's economy grows when they loosen the reigns but they are subsequently frightened by the autonomy and freedom it provides.

oldbeyond
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Re: Subject: China Travel Advisory: Level 2: Exercise increased caution, January 3, 2019

Post by oldbeyond » Fri Jan 04, 2019 2:56 pm

The PRoC has warned its citizens about traveling in America(street crime etc). This is likely partly a response to that/part of the trade war as well as a genuine concern.

I think there’s been a gradual tightening of security for years, even going back to when I left in -12 but it certainly has escalated lately. Even then some friend of a friend was disappeared by the security services, likely after having come in conflict with someone with CCP connections. I think that worked itself out in the end but still, western citizen and all.

My take is that the Chinese(and Xi in particular), are determined not to lose the command over their fate ever again and feel that the times has come to make the world understand that they’re Great Again. Just look at One Belt One Road.

niemand
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Re: Subject: China Travel Advisory: Level 2: Exercise increased caution, January 3, 2019

Post by niemand » Fri Jan 04, 2019 4:43 pm

The US recently got a high profile Chinese citizen arrested – the CFO of Huawei*.
Holding dual US/China citizenship is against Chinese law, and provides a cheap entry point for retaliation against the US – via the travel bans.
Mutual upping of travel warnings could be a side effect of the above.

* Huawei is a massive competitor of Apple, as good in spying as Google, and linked to the Chinese government/military.

The Old Man
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Re: Subject: China Travel Advisory: Level 2: Exercise increased caution, January 3, 2019

Post by The Old Man » Fri Jan 04, 2019 9:56 pm

thegreatvoid wrote:
Fri Jan 04, 2019 9:39 am
Can someone please explain to me , how the republican party and every right wing person in the world developed a crush for Russia and Putin.A country ruled by an authoritarian regime with a wekass economy. Russia´s GDP is lower than Italy´s or Canada´s, with 4 times its population.
There is no crush. It is merely a recognition that the Cold War has ended and it is time to move on. Russia is not the USSR.

fiby41
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Re: Subject: China Travel Advisory: Level 2: Exercise increased caution, January 3, 2019

Post by fiby41 » Tue Jan 08, 2019 11:04 am

thegreatvoid wrote:
Fri Jan 04, 2019 9:39 am
A country ruled by an authoritarian regime
Democracy is not a panacea. A country's geography determines the type of government. The current landmass under the Russian Federation is impossible to govern by a single state under parliamentary democracy.

tonyedgecombe
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Re: Subject: China Travel Advisory: Level 2: Exercise increased caution, January 3, 2019

Post by tonyedgecombe » Tue Jan 08, 2019 11:51 am

Canada manages and it has a challenging geography. It is smaller than Russia but it's not an order of magnitude difference.

BlueNote
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Re: Subject: China Travel Advisory: Level 2: Exercise increased caution, January 3, 2019

Post by BlueNote » Sun Jan 13, 2019 10:16 pm

China is an interesting place. I've watched most of the videos from these two guys ( https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCl7mAG ... s8rhhh8XZg, https://www.youtube.com/user/churchillcustoms) and their experience there is fascinating. Basically two westerners who attempt to integrate into the country by learning the language, starting businesses, getting married etc.

Interestingly the place does seem to be swinging back to a more communist/big brother mentality. However most of the people there seem to give two sh**ts about politics and are attempting to just go about their lives. Chinese culture is much stronger than the authoritarian regime and is probably what is helping drive their huge economic growth rather than the government. A democracy would be better IMHO but that's a really difficult thing to establish and keep and I don't see it happening in my lifetime there without some sort of war or similarly massive event.

I'm not sure I would want to travel there right now, being a Canadian and all I wouldn't want to become pawn in the American/Chinese dispute that Canada was basically dragged into. However when it all blows over I'd like to visit for awhile.

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