Early Retirement Extreme Forums

Biscuits and Gravy wrote: ↑

Sat Mar 01, 2025 11:41 am

2) I now appreciate the importance of rest and recovery.

Woo! Clapping!

Biscuits and Gravy wrote: ↑

Sat Mar 01, 2025 11:41 am

The evenings, I've come to conclude[4], are not for working toward my goals, but are for not working against my goals. I do wonder if I can hack this aspect of myself by taking a midday nap. While the required research is daunting and will surely be exhausting, I think I am up for subjecting myself to some rigorous testing.

I found the same thing and really like how you expressed the evening goal of not working against your goals. Definitely familiar. Personally, in my exteeeeensive ( ) nap experience, I find that while a nap restores some energy and unfogs my mind somewhat, it doesn't generate any additional willpower for the day so the evenings are still kind of a low-energy/low-motivation deal still where I need to stir myself carefully. I'll be very curious to hear about how the (strenuous!) experiment goes for you.

Biscuits and Gravy wrote: ↑

Sat Mar 01, 2025 11:41 am

Conclusion thus far into the quit-job experiment: I have no regrets, and am very glad I took this chance. It has been much more challenging (and not at all in a financial way) than I envisioned. My identity has been shaken up, I've relinquished crutches, and I've spent a lot of uncomfortable time sitting with myself. I've gone from "independent educated working mom earning six figures[5]" to... well, I'm not sure how to describe what I am now. Or if a description even matters. Something that does matter, I think, is giving back to the community that got me here, so I hope y'all find these albeit self-absorbed reflections helpful.

I find them really interesting and really helpful, so thanks for sharing them! It all sounds amazing, including having no regrets still. Best of luck with everything.

Well, as usual, I was half-joking about sleeping through the sex. However, it is true that because I often fall asleep so early, I have sometimes given partners permission to wake me up if they want to have sex*. So, I was more reflecting on the fact that I oddly enjoy waking up or half waking up to discover that I am already or about to have sex. I also fall back asleep quite easily, so has happened that I have asked a partner, "Did we have sex last night?" Although, obviously, not likely that this would be an encounter of most vigorous "bear mauling" or as Doechii has expressed it," Bedroom bully in the bando, He gon' make it flip, do it with no handles, Never switchin' sides, only switchin' angles, Ooh, we go crazy like Rambo." variety.

*Do not try this at home without permission.

Well, I reached out to my old boss to proffer my services on an annual springtime project that I alone always handled for him, and he offered me my old job back. I said “no thank you, but maybe I’ll consider it after this summer.” No thank you to gobs of money and prestige. No thank you to commuting, extra stress, blazers, hair coifing, scheduled time off, coworkers, and less time with my husband and kids. No thank you to those extra years on my resume. No thank you to the padding of my accounts. No thank you to the high connections and inside knowledge. Man, that was a hard decision. So glad I could discuss it with my husband on a midday walk, and now I can return to my leisurely life of chores and reading.

For better or worse, pretty much the whole decision for me would have been made on the basis of "hair coifing."

God, I know. I have a ridiculous mane of hair that defies all coifing, too. My sisters called me “Medusa” growing up. A stranger once told me my hair reminded her of the princess from Disney’s Brave. It’s a real consideration.

I went into my old office (with my hair as big as a house, thanks, humidity), saw my old boss, reconnected with old coworkers, and committed to doing a ~15 hour project for my old boss. I left the building certain of my decision to leave, and I feel recommitted to my time off. It was good to touch base and key in on the resultant instructive feelings. If I'm careful my cash should last until 2028. If I suddenly become Mooretrees-level awesome, then I guess it might last forever. We'll see. I've never been one to have vague notions about my finances and limp future calculations, but suddenly I just don't give a fuck about the money.

Writing
I've only written 20,000 words of a novel, but it's been really fun to have something for my mind to drift to during the course of The Tedium. Les Mis inspired me to rewrite the characters in a romantic way that focuses on their psychology, and this has been a really fun and challenging project. I want to leave the main character as a shell for the reader to step into, but the people she encounters will be caricatures. One of them is a modern day antinomian, and I feel like I could spend a solid month just on researching and developing this one character. It might all come to nothing, and I'm totally fine with that; I'm just having a good time stretching my creative muscles and learning along the way.

Kids
What to say, other than they are becoming their own people, and my fretting about the world and their interactions with it is ceaseless. My stepkids will in all likelihood never visit Texas due to its political facets, and that bums me out, but I get it. I'm kinda stuck here and I wish I could offer them an appealing place to stay or visit as they start itching to leave the nest and see the world. My biokids stress me out even though they're only in kinder and first. They both garner negative remarks from their teachers* (DD is "defiant, difficult" and DS apparently screams and runs around during classtime) and I don't get it. They both tested into Gifted and Talented which indicates their IQs are likely over 130 (I'm not bragging), and speaking from a lifetime of experience as someone in that IQ range (still not bragging--it's a curse) I can say it just makes things harder: the average person's choices and behavior are baffling; most schoolwork is boring and restrictive; an existential crisis looms around every corner; and there is a pervasive and pernicious sense of being "other." I dunno. Sometimes I wonder if I should go back to work and create trust funds for all of these kids so they can just go off and be their weird selves. Who knows what they could accomplish and what woes they would be spared if they weren't subjected to a lifetime of the world whipping them with its displeasure for their nonconformity. Although I guess money as a solved problem wouldn't save them from all of the lashes. I dunno. Maybe they just need sports.

*In fairness to my children, they also get positive remarks, such as DD is "bright, a 'rockin' reader,' creative, and artistic," and DS is "emotionally intelligent, kind, bright, friendly, and fun." And, babies, if you ever find this journal: 1) I love you!; 2) please forgive your mother for her humanity; and 3) I am so, so glad you're in my life and, while I know there will be ebbs and flows, I hope we always have a relationship and that you find it to be net-positive.

Fitness
If y'all see a fit woman over the age of 35, it's safe to assume that woman's whole life revolves around fitness. She runs her life on a caloric deficit, spends at least an hour each day working out, and refuses to be in the same room as a cookie. Just... goddamn this is getting hard. I can't cheat at all! Even a bowl of cereal is out of the question now. And I guess that's not to fitness, more to vanity, but c'mon. 5 years ago all I had to do was commute by bike and I'd lose five pounds, now I probably have to do a century every effing day to lose a single pound. Anyway. I'm feeling frustrated because I plateaued on my weight loss. The broken foot certainly didn't help. The scale continues to mock me with 142, despite any and all efforts. Fuck you, scale. I'm getting back to the 130s and I'm never leaving them again.

Regarding smart children. I found this interesting Youtube video. The video explains that being a very smart person might be better understood as having a special need, especially for a child in school. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vwi-fGf0rm4

The person being interviewed has a very smart child. He decided to create a special school for his child and other similar children.

Biscuits and Gravy wrote: ↑

Fri Mar 28, 2025 9:28 am

I've only written 20,000 words of a novel, [...]

I for one miss the days when authors could make their fictional points in ~100 pages. If Siddhartha was written today it would be 800 pages long and involve different stories with multiple concurring characters stitched together randomly along with barely relevant historic research notes about rivers and river crossings as if the author didn't really know where they were going with it and ultimately decided to glue it all together with some light edits just to get it out of the door.

blink2ce wrote: ↑

Fri Mar 28, 2025 9:50 am

Regarding smart children. I found this interesting Youtube video. The video explains that being a very smart person might be better understood as having a special need, especially for a child in school. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vwi-fGf0rm4

@blink2ce Thank you very much for that link. Right off the bat they say how it's socially unacceptable to mention or brag about your high IQ kids, haha. I completely agree with his point that high intelligence is just an attribute and what really matters is what you do with it. I unfortunately wasn't told that until well into my 30s, so let me broadcast that point here. He also says that an unsophisticated teacher may see that a child is doing well, so they give them more work and that is kind of punitive, and my daughter was just complaining about that two weeks ago. She loves drawing comics, but whenever she finishes her work the teacher just gives her more work, so now she's stopped doing her work so she can draw comics instead.

I recently watched a lecture designed for schoolteachers about the difference between gifted and ADHD, and the lecturer also used the term "asynchronous" wrt giftedness. In her usage, a child with a high IQ may speak in compound sentences and express complex ideas and so we expect them to be more adult in their behavior, even though their emotional and social intelligence is asynchronous with their IQ and potentially even below average for their age. In your link they used "asynchronous" to describe the gifts of the child, however, like maybe they're gifted in languages and history, but below average in math (as I was/am), and this leads to all sorts of anguish about not being good enough, or "if I'm so smart then why can't I just---".

That bit about "twice exceptional" hits home for me. My son already has that label (ADHD+gifted), and recently the pediatrician suggested we evaluate my daughter for ADHD because of her defiance/inattention, but I do think ADHD would just be a misdiagnosis of her giftedness. Although all the labels really do is get them some more services in public school, so I guess what harm is there. There is a private school for gifted kids here, and I have been eyeballing it. If the kids really start floundering in public school, I might have no choice. I'd hate for them to go through the self-doubt, isolation, and teasing I went through.

@jacob Haha, I used the word "only" because the average novel is between 70,000 - 100,000 words. A novella is 30,000, and Siddhartha had 35,000 words. But I prefer a real meaty novel. I want to acutely feel the absence of the characters when I finish a work of fiction.

Biscuits and Gravy wrote: ↑

Fri Mar 28, 2025 10:55 am

I recently watched a lecture designed for schoolteachers about the difference between gifted and ADHD, and the lecturer also used the term "asynchronous" wrt giftedness. In her usage, a child with a high IQ may speak in compound sentences and express complex ideas and so we expect them to be more adult in their behavior, even though their emotional and social intelligence is asynchronous with their IQ and potentially even below average for their age. In your link they used "asynchronous" to describe the gifts of the child, however, like maybe they're gifted in languages and history, but below average in math (as I was/am), and this leads to all sorts of anguish about not being good enough, or "if I'm so smart then why can't I just---".

That bit about "twice exceptional" hits home for me. My son already has that label (ADHD+gifted), and recently the pediatrician suggested we evaluate my daughter for ADHD because of her defiance/inattention, but I do think ADHD would just be a misdiagnosis of her giftedness. Although all the labels really do is get them some more services in public school, so I guess what harm is there. There is a private school for gifted kids here, and I have been eyeballing it. If the kids really start floundering in public school, I might have no choice. I'd hate for them to go through the self-doubt, isolation, and teasing I went through.

Also see, viewtopic.php?p=287571#p287571 (beware the Forer effect in terms of self-diagnosis. Only put a check mark if the behavior or requirement is dysfunctional. E.g. some would claim they "have a wide range of interest", yet it mainly comes down to frivolously adding in everything that has captured their focus in recent history. Better turn it around: "has a problem staying with the same interest".)

In addition it's useful to break the presumption that g-factor IQ is not necessarily the same as gifted even if the terms have been (ab)used by the school system historically. Being gifted is a way of thinking albeit one that requires above average intelligence. As such, a high level of intelligence is likely a required but not a sufficient condition for being gifted.

IME, from similar perspective of having been "gifted child" who raised her own "gifted children", the intersection with personality type can make a huge difference. Dealing with my INTP son and his interactions with school environment was like a rollercoaster ride of praise, concern, and outright criticism from his teachers and others involved with his care. I think his first grade teacher called me at least once per week to let me know that he was still getting up from his desk and wandering around the classroom while she was attempting to teach a lesson, and even the teacher who was trained in dealing with gifted kids couldn't deal with the level of arrogant smart-azz he was capable of exuding by 5th grade. I had to threaten to homeschool him at one juncture to ensure that they didn't place him in Remedial English as punishment for refusing to write papers for a teacher he believed to be too stupid to be instructing him. I can feel my stress levels jumping just running through my memory vault on these interactions.

OTOH, my XNXX "The Diplomat" daughter just breezed through school and all associated extra-curriculars and also her social life. Her only obvious dysfunction, in alignment with sloth being the vice of The Diplomat type, was that her bedroom was continuously a disgusting mess which I would periodically have to help her dig her way out of. Almost like it served a Picture of Dorian Gray function in her otherwise highly functional functioning. At one conference her teacher actually referred to her as "a perfect angel child" which I felt was somewhat mawkishly inappropriate. And one time I recall calling up the mother of one of her friends to inquire when she might be coming home from extended sleep-over weekend, and the mother asked me, "Can she please stay another night? All the other children behave so much better when she is around." I literally only remember one or two occasions on which I had to discipline her through the entire course of her childhood. At an elementary school concert, she was assigned a solo entitled "You're the Greatest Mom in the World" and I had to stand up and be identified while she performed. This was pretty much the peak example of the biggest problem I have with being her mother which is that I feel guilty because the job is too easy and she deserves somebody much better than me, like maybe Elizabeth Warren or Barbara Kingsolver.

7Wannabe5 wrote: ↑

Fri Mar 28, 2025 11:34 am

IME, from similar perspective of having been "gifted child" who raised her own "gifted children", the intersection with personality type can make a huge difference.

https://www.reddit.com/r/mbti/comments/ ... fted_list/ (the graph uses conditioned probabilities from the Gifts Differing book) comes to mind. It wouldn't surprise me if it has been discussed in some thread or two here already.

jacob wrote: ↑

Fri Mar 28, 2025 11:09 am

In addition it's useful to break the presumption that g-factor IQ is not necessarily the same as gifted even if the terms have been (ab)used by the school system historically. Being gifted is a way of thinking albeit one that requires above average intelligence. As such, a high level of intelligence is likely a required but not a sufficient condition for being gifted.

That is useful, thanks, and maybe I was wrong in assuming that the kids have high IQs simply because the school system has labeled them as “gifted.” Just got off the phone with my daughter’s first grade teacher and apparently my daughter is not a brilliant, bored genius, but just a stubborn jerk who refuses to do her work or participate in class. This heartburn. Why. It’s only first grade. My sobriety will never hold.

@jacob:

I think that chart needs to be balanced with the one indicating the probability of being found alone in a garret, drinking gin from a soup can, and muttering to oneself over a chessboard and/or the one indicating the probability of being found wandering disoriented in a garish costume outside a hotel in Singapore after a threesome with one of Elon's hired surrogates and somebody found on short list for Booker prize 7 years ago.

Biscuits and Gravy wrote: ↑

Fri Mar 28, 2025 1:46 pm

Just got off the phone with my daughter’s first grade teacher and apparently my daughter is not a brilliant, bored genius, but just a stubborn jerk who refuses to do her work or participate in class. This heartburn. Why. It’s only first grade. My sobriety will never hold.

When I was in kindergarten, the teacher told my mom I would never function normally in school, I was too defiant and wouldn't listen to anything (so also a stubborn jerk?). She came home in tears.
I went on to get a PhD. (Not that getting a PhD really means anything, but you know, I did ok in school).

Thanks for sharing your thoughts and congratulations on the 15 hour side project.

Biscuits and Gravy wrote: ↑

Fri Mar 28, 2025 9:28 am

They both tested into Gifted and Talented

I wonder where today's obsession with testing comes from. I took my first test at age 12. We didn't prepare for it, nobody was stressed for it, the results were unsurprising. And we were sorted into age 12-18 school based on that test, so it was very consequential.

Biscuits and Gravy wrote: ↑

Fri Mar 28, 2025 9:28 am

If y'all see a fit woman over the age of 35, it's safe to assume that woman's whole life revolves around fitness

We are drowned in advertising for unhealthy food and lifestyles. Essentially this is a mental headwind against fitness. So one can also become fit by learning to ignore advertising.

The later requires one to accept that advertising has influence over one's decisions. That is a big step. For example, a credit card is a powerful influence for self indulgence and overspending, but people deny even such a plain fact with unbelievable fierceness.

@NewBlood How could you do that to your mother?! No, I’m kidding, that’s awesome and thank you for that perspective. I tend to catastrophize when it comes to the children. I had a sit down convo with baby girl yesterday and we worked it out. Well, hopefully. We’ll see if her behavior improves. Notably, she’s exceptionally defiant and stubborn at home, too. At least I’ll never have to worry about her caving into peer pressure.

@delay Well, the kids’ dad is in the school system and it was important to him that they test into GT. I’m of the opinion that as long as they read widely, work hard, and are curious, they’ll be okay. Thus the heartburn at baby girl refusing to work.

Not sure if advertising is my barrier wrt weight loss, but it’s true I could always make better choices about what I put in my mouth. It’s more likely that, in my ripe old age, my metabolism has finally slowed down, and so I have to make some changes to account for that. I’ve switched to only eating between 10:00 and 18:00 and my diet focuses on protein and fresh fruit and veg. Of course I sometimes stress eat the kids’ ice cream or cookies because I no longer drink, and I am grieving that I will have to drop these crutches too if I want to meet my goals.

Biscuits and Gravy wrote: ↑

Sat Mar 29, 2025 7:31 am

Not sure if advertising is my barrier wrt weight loss, but it’s true I could always make better choices about what I put in my mouth. It’s more likely that, in my ripe old age, my metabolism has finally slowed down, and so I have to make some changes to account for that. I’ve switched to only eating between 10:00 and 18:00 and my diet focuses on protein and fresh fruit and veg. Of course I sometimes stress eat the kids’ ice cream or cookies because I no longer drink, and I am grieving that I will have to drop these crutches too if I want to meet my goals.

Thanks for your reply. At age 50+ I eat between 14:00 and 20:00. It doesn't matter if I eat cookies or ice cream or drink beer as long as I also eat healthy food. When the unhealthy food pushes out the healthy food I do start to gain weight.

I suppose aging means this will get harder every year...

According to Sara Szal, author of "The Hormone Reset Diet", intermittent fasting, ketosis, and similar practice/processes do not work the same in men and women. Basically, women are going to feel hungry longer when not fed, likely because it is more important for the future of the species that we are well fed. She frequently sees affluent women in her practice who have old lady bone density at mid-life due to dieting themselves too thin when young. You can't see bone density when you look in the mirror at age 40, but it is absolutely what will shrink you, hunch you over, and take you down in your 70s and 80s, especially if you are an old white lady. I don't know how tall you are, but unless you are quite short, carrying a weight in the 140s is not likely to be a health issue, especially if you can engage in strength training appropriate to convert much of it into muscle. OTOH, I comprehend that everybody has their own aesthetic and basic build. It was only at mid-life that I truly became somebody who would truly rather be built like Destiny's Child era Beyonce than Kylie Minogue. Thick thighs rule! (thick belly, not so much still...)

Also, on the issue of gifted child refusing to do the work, I now know the solution which I didn't when my kids were the appropriate age. Unfortunately, it involves simply sitting with them for long blocks of time while they do their work, but interfering in the process as little as possible, but in a relaxed rather than punitive manner. IOW, not "helping", not "supervising", not "overseeing", just sitting at the table with them until the work is done. Beyond the fact that you are firmly enforcing the boundaries of the practice, the conversation during the process should be towards a peer professional level, because you believe that they are absolutely competent to do the work that has been assigned. So, not "How many problems have you done now?", but more "Have you learned any other strategies for multiplication?" or "Oh cool. You are learning about photosynthesis." IOW, the sort of light conversation you might engage in to exhibit interest in another adult's work, or journalistic inquiry. Setting up the table so it seems like a professional workspace with appropriate tools and provisions will also be helpful, and you should also bring some of your own work to the table, even if it's just something like crossword puzzle initially. This method best addresses the developmental schism between their ability to do work independently and their ability to do work alone. It will also provide you with better insight into whether they are being appropriately challenged. If their school isn't providing supplemental material, you may have to do it yourself. For example, more complex math puzzles to supplement simple math problems.

I appreciate y’all even responding to this tired trope of “vain woman whines about aging.” A few years ago I would have (and did) deny my vanity, but the reactions I had to that 15 pounds I rapidly put on during my last year of work showed me my true colors. A reckoning is nigh.

@delay That’s great you found a system that works for you. I had a working system too, and I guess I’m whining because it’s no longer working and I need to put effort (sigh) into reworking it. I wish I had more bandwidth.

@7 I’m 5’5”. Thanks for reaffirming that strength training > dieting. I really need to focus on that. Just one more way I admire Mooretrees. It’s been instructive to observe my mother, even though we have different body types (she’s in her early 60s and extremely vain and fitness-focused). When I was growing up she was vocally hypercritical of her own body and others’ bodies (“wow, that woman should not be wearing those shorts” was a common refrain) and so I developed an intense insecurity wrt appearance and weight. All I can really do there is do my best not to pass it onto my daughter (and I have had to tell my mother not to say things like “it’s no wonder I’m getting fat when I just stuff my face all of the time!” around baby girl). Note here that my mother is not and has never been an unhealthy weight. Anyway, even my mom now preaches the gospel of strength training > dieting, and she’s dieted her whole adult life.

I like your idea of sitting with the kids while they work. They don’t get homework, but they probably should be doing some sort of lessons at home so we can create that habit. Maybe Spanish? Complex math problems would not be my first choice, haha. We have a great work area already set up—this classic dining table I inherited from my aunt and uncle—and we use it now for impromptu art and puzzles.