spoonman's Journal
Re: spoonman's Journal
Thanks for the suggestion, that looks like a very interesting read. I'll be adding it to my list of books to read in the near term.
Re: spoonman's Journal
I saw this article reading cnn this morning and thought of your move: http://money.cnn.com/2015/01/08/real_es ... index.html
Apparently, the PNW is the place to be. Hopefully too many people don't move there in the coming years and make it unpleasant. I suppose you'll be living it up overseas and won't have to worry
Apparently, the PNW is the place to be. Hopefully too many people don't move there in the coming years and make it unpleasant. I suppose you'll be living it up overseas and won't have to worry
Re: spoonman's Journal
Indeed, the PNW has got a lot of good stuff going for it. If you can endure the rain, then you can really come out ahead. The PNW is great and will always have a special place in my heart no matter where we go in the future. With all the awesome things happening here, it's innevitable that a lot of people will come this way, whether the locals like it or not.
Since we have quite a bit of wanderlust to quench, we will leave the PNW sometime this year. But we'll return some day, and when we do, the experience will be even better because we'll already be acquainted with the area and all the good spots.
Since we have quite a bit of wanderlust to quench, we will leave the PNW sometime this year. But we'll return some day, and when we do, the experience will be even better because we'll already be acquainted with the area and all the good spots.
Re: spoonman's Journal
I'll be getting the book in a couple of weeks, but I couldn't help reading the free snippet offered by Amazon. The following part was interesting:
"Equally, in the future, one of the milestones by which you measure your financial success will be not just how many zeroes you can add to your net worth, but whether you can structure your affairs in a way that enables you to realize full individiual autonomy and independence. The more clever you are, the less propulsion you will require to achieve financial escape velocity...unprecedented financial independence will be a reachable goal in your lifetime or that of your children."
That's what this community is all about!
I have a feeling that, since the book was written in the 90's, parts of it will be painful to read, but I very much look forward to reading it anyway.
Re: spoonman's Journal
#100 01/12/2014 -- Our Experience in Setting up SEPPs
Spoongirl and will be tapping the funds in our IRAs this year by using a version of the 72(t) exemption where we take distributions via Substantially Equal Periodic Payments (SEPP). This allows us to take modest distributions well before traditional retirement age without incurring the 10% early withdrawal penalty. For reasons outlined in previous posts, we've deemed this to be the best course of action for us among other methods for using the IRA money, such as Roth conversions.
Here are some lessons that we've learned during the process of setting up SEPPs:
* We used the following calculator for estimating the proper annual payments: http://www.dinkytown.net/java/Retire72T.html . I say estimating because the government uses words like "reasonable" when describing the interest rate, that means there is a degree of ambiguity here. Because of that, we chose to pay ourselves something like 15% less than the maximum allowed amount in case we get audited by the IRS and they question the amount we selected.
* Most banks will require you to fill out a form to set up a SEPP and automatic payments. When filling out the form, be sure to have a customer service representative on the phone that can help you fill it out. I submitted a form to one of our banks and made some incorrect assumptions that ended up forcing me to spend a couple of grueling hours on the phone with customer service. The forms themselves are not that complicated to fill out, but in some cases there are some ambiguities that are very much open to interpretation (e.g. the rate of distributions as annual or monthly) and some forms have a ton of superfluous fields that don't need to be filled out. The second SEPP we setup was much easier because we got help from a representative. However, they misinterpreted two of the fields in the form so we had to call them to fix the issue.
* If you call the customer service line with a question, make sure you tell them that you are interested in a 72(t) SEPP...not a SEP IRA. When we called one of the banks it took me like 2 minutes to explain to the so-called expert what I was talking about. He kept thinking I was a small business owner trying to setup SEP IRAs.
* If you feel the person on the phone is not knowledgeable, don't be afraid to ask to speak to their supervisor. This is very basic wisdom, but I had to learn the hard way (and Spoongirl makes sure I remember that =)). The people that pick up the phone are only trained to follow a tight script and can hardly think for themselves. That's pretty much true of any institution you call.
So these are the most salient lessons that I can think of right now. The main lesson that we learned is that you have to hold the bank people's hand, otherwise they can very easily fuck things up. Next year, when we get ready to do taxes, we'll report on our experience claiming the 72(t) exemption. It will involve filling out form 5329, which we'll let our tax accountant handle for us.
Spoongirl and will be tapping the funds in our IRAs this year by using a version of the 72(t) exemption where we take distributions via Substantially Equal Periodic Payments (SEPP). This allows us to take modest distributions well before traditional retirement age without incurring the 10% early withdrawal penalty. For reasons outlined in previous posts, we've deemed this to be the best course of action for us among other methods for using the IRA money, such as Roth conversions.
Here are some lessons that we've learned during the process of setting up SEPPs:
* We used the following calculator for estimating the proper annual payments: http://www.dinkytown.net/java/Retire72T.html . I say estimating because the government uses words like "reasonable" when describing the interest rate, that means there is a degree of ambiguity here. Because of that, we chose to pay ourselves something like 15% less than the maximum allowed amount in case we get audited by the IRS and they question the amount we selected.
* Most banks will require you to fill out a form to set up a SEPP and automatic payments. When filling out the form, be sure to have a customer service representative on the phone that can help you fill it out. I submitted a form to one of our banks and made some incorrect assumptions that ended up forcing me to spend a couple of grueling hours on the phone with customer service. The forms themselves are not that complicated to fill out, but in some cases there are some ambiguities that are very much open to interpretation (e.g. the rate of distributions as annual or monthly) and some forms have a ton of superfluous fields that don't need to be filled out. The second SEPP we setup was much easier because we got help from a representative. However, they misinterpreted two of the fields in the form so we had to call them to fix the issue.
* If you call the customer service line with a question, make sure you tell them that you are interested in a 72(t) SEPP...not a SEP IRA. When we called one of the banks it took me like 2 minutes to explain to the so-called expert what I was talking about. He kept thinking I was a small business owner trying to setup SEP IRAs.
* If you feel the person on the phone is not knowledgeable, don't be afraid to ask to speak to their supervisor. This is very basic wisdom, but I had to learn the hard way (and Spoongirl makes sure I remember that =)). The people that pick up the phone are only trained to follow a tight script and can hardly think for themselves. That's pretty much true of any institution you call.
So these are the most salient lessons that I can think of right now. The main lesson that we learned is that you have to hold the bank people's hand, otherwise they can very easily fuck things up. Next year, when we get ready to do taxes, we'll report on our experience claiming the 72(t) exemption. It will involve filling out form 5329, which we'll let our tax accountant handle for us.
Re: spoonman's Journal
#101 02/15/2015 -- General Update
It’s been a while since I’ve dropped by the forums, so I just wanted to swing by real quick and let everyone know we’re alive and well =). Let’s just say that hanging out in the interwebs has not been a priority for me of late, I’ve been spending my time doing lots of reading and relaxing.
But mostly, the thing that we’ve been trying to cultivate is handling life one day at a time. My MO in the past had been to tackle things head on and take care of as many problems as I can in a single day. Since we no longer have to spend the bulk of our waking hours at a soul sucking job, we can afford to take our foot off the pedal and take it easy.
This new philosophy has sort of come about organically. It’s very easy to tell someone “take it one day at a time”, but putting that into practice is actually harder than you think, especially after spending years in the rapid pace of a corporate job. Each week I feel like we’re slowing down more and more, it feels great.
On the financial front, the month of January was another success. Out of an income of $1810, we spent $1521. We were way under budget because we did not spend much money in the discretionary categories. We spent $518 on food, which is above our target average of $400-$450. The reason for this increase is because we spent a week hanging out with family and had to pick up the tab here and there. As long as our total expenses for the month come out to less than our income, I won’t sweat it if one category is above normal. Going forward, our budget will be partitioned differently depending on where we’re living and specific circumstances.
I’ll be discussing other topics and experiences in future posts (before the end of the month, I hope =) ).
It’s been a while since I’ve dropped by the forums, so I just wanted to swing by real quick and let everyone know we’re alive and well =). Let’s just say that hanging out in the interwebs has not been a priority for me of late, I’ve been spending my time doing lots of reading and relaxing.
But mostly, the thing that we’ve been trying to cultivate is handling life one day at a time. My MO in the past had been to tackle things head on and take care of as many problems as I can in a single day. Since we no longer have to spend the bulk of our waking hours at a soul sucking job, we can afford to take our foot off the pedal and take it easy.
This new philosophy has sort of come about organically. It’s very easy to tell someone “take it one day at a time”, but putting that into practice is actually harder than you think, especially after spending years in the rapid pace of a corporate job. Each week I feel like we’re slowing down more and more, it feels great.
On the financial front, the month of January was another success. Out of an income of $1810, we spent $1521. We were way under budget because we did not spend much money in the discretionary categories. We spent $518 on food, which is above our target average of $400-$450. The reason for this increase is because we spent a week hanging out with family and had to pick up the tab here and there. As long as our total expenses for the month come out to less than our income, I won’t sweat it if one category is above normal. Going forward, our budget will be partitioned differently depending on where we’re living and specific circumstances.
I’ll be discussing other topics and experiences in future posts (before the end of the month, I hope =) ).
Re: spoonman's Journal
#102 02/26/2015 -- Monday Afternoon Day Trip
One of the things I vividly remember about my working days was the frustration I felt when I had to go into work on a beautiful day. It was such a sad affair; attending stupid meetings and writing TPS reports knowing that it was an awesome day outside and knowing I will never get that day back. Well, not anymore. =)
As you all know it rains a lot in the PNW, so on a recent warm and sunny day we took a little day trip to Mt. Hood. I did some quick research and decided it would be great to view Mt. Hood from the nearby Trillium Lake. The image below captures the breathtaking scenery. There are no words to describe the awesomeness of the lake and the great stratovolcano (which, btw, has something like a 5% chance of blowing up in the next 30 years).
The Trillium Lake camping ground was actually closed, so we had to park our car at the entrance and walk 2 miles into the site. Since the entire area is packed with evergreen trees, we were rewarded with the scenery at the very end. The walk to the lake was very quiet, it felt like a scene of The Walking Dead, where the roads are empty and leaves cover the area. Thankfully there wasn't any snow on the roads, so the path was straightforward. Below is another view of the lake catching the sunlight.
After hiking back to the car we drove another 15 minutes to the historic Timberline Lodge, located halfway up Mt. Hood. It was built in the 1930’s and was used in aerial shots for the Overlook Hotel in the movie The Shining. The ski lifts were not running by the time we got there, but I’ve heard that it’s a major skiing destination.
We spent about an hour at the lodge and had some local beer, snacks and hot cocoa. The image shows Mt. Hood bathed in the sunset light.
Here’s an image of the nearby stratovolcano Mt. Jefferson:
All in all, it was a very memorable and fun trip. We’re gonna be doing a few more of these in the next couple of months. The PNW has a wealth of delights!
One of the things I vividly remember about my working days was the frustration I felt when I had to go into work on a beautiful day. It was such a sad affair; attending stupid meetings and writing TPS reports knowing that it was an awesome day outside and knowing I will never get that day back. Well, not anymore. =)
As you all know it rains a lot in the PNW, so on a recent warm and sunny day we took a little day trip to Mt. Hood. I did some quick research and decided it would be great to view Mt. Hood from the nearby Trillium Lake. The image below captures the breathtaking scenery. There are no words to describe the awesomeness of the lake and the great stratovolcano (which, btw, has something like a 5% chance of blowing up in the next 30 years).
The Trillium Lake camping ground was actually closed, so we had to park our car at the entrance and walk 2 miles into the site. Since the entire area is packed with evergreen trees, we were rewarded with the scenery at the very end. The walk to the lake was very quiet, it felt like a scene of The Walking Dead, where the roads are empty and leaves cover the area. Thankfully there wasn't any snow on the roads, so the path was straightforward. Below is another view of the lake catching the sunlight.
After hiking back to the car we drove another 15 minutes to the historic Timberline Lodge, located halfway up Mt. Hood. It was built in the 1930’s and was used in aerial shots for the Overlook Hotel in the movie The Shining. The ski lifts were not running by the time we got there, but I’ve heard that it’s a major skiing destination.
We spent about an hour at the lodge and had some local beer, snacks and hot cocoa. The image shows Mt. Hood bathed in the sunset light.
Here’s an image of the nearby stratovolcano Mt. Jefferson:
All in all, it was a very memorable and fun trip. We’re gonna be doing a few more of these in the next couple of months. The PNW has a wealth of delights!
Re: spoonman's Journal
Cool trip! That area is really nice.
I doubt there's any shortage of nice lakes, but if you're ever looking for a cool lake to go spend a day at, Cresap Bay Recreation area at Lake Merwin is a wonderful place. It only cost like $1-2 per person or car or something cheap like that. There's a nice building with restrooms. A little beach, and a great grass area with picnic tables overlooking the lake.
I doubt there's any shortage of nice lakes, but if you're ever looking for a cool lake to go spend a day at, Cresap Bay Recreation area at Lake Merwin is a wonderful place. It only cost like $1-2 per person or car or something cheap like that. There's a nice building with restrooms. A little beach, and a great grass area with picnic tables overlooking the lake.
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jacob
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Re: spoonman's Journal
Also a 0.00...00X% chance of blowing up in the next 30 seconds, which is always an interesting fact to contemplate(*) It's funny how (at least material) parts of WA has some finite chance of semi-instant death associated with it. Looking at the west coast and coastal Pudget Sound, which is tsunami territory, it faces similar odds. There seems to be some poetic connection between beauty and death, eh? 
BTW are you on the east side or the west side of the sound? I forget?!
(*) My favorite example is what's known in German as Nachbarnsternsupernovaeksplosionsgefahr
(also pretty) ... could happen anytime with an incredibly small probability.
It's funny how (at least material) parts of WA has some finite chance of semi-instant death associated with it. Looking at the west coast and coastal Pudget Sound, which is tsunami territory, it faces similar odds. There seems to be some poetic connection between beauty and death, eh? BTW are you on the east side or the west side of the sound? I forget?!
(*) My favorite example is what's known in German as Nachbarnsternsupernovaeksplosionsgefahr
(also pretty) ... could happen anytime with an incredibly small probability.Re: spoonman's Journal
@C40: Thanks for the suggestion, that sounds like our kind of place. There certainly isn’t a shortage of lakes in the PNW, it’s one of the things that makes me realize how water rich the area is.
@jacob: Ahaha! Yeah, it’s always fun to quote those crazy statistics. It spices things up for me =). Btw, that super long german word cracked me up. It reminded me how germans have a penchant for concatenating words. I remember one german guy giving a presentation had one slide where a single concatenated word occupied the entire title.
We’re actually sort of south of the sound, but don’t wanna say too much =).
@jacob: Ahaha! Yeah, it’s always fun to quote those crazy statistics. It spices things up for me =). Btw, that super long german word cracked me up. It reminded me how germans have a penchant for concatenating words. I remember one german guy giving a presentation had one slide where a single concatenated word occupied the entire title.
We’re actually sort of south of the sound, but don’t wanna say too much =).
Re: spoonman's Journal
#103 03/02/2015 -- Six Months Since We Quit Our Jobs
We have reached the six month point since we left our jobs and declared ourselves FI, and it's been four months since we moved to the PNW. It sure feels like a lot more time has gone by, especially during our stay in the PNW. I suppose our new lives are not as monotonous as before so our subjective experience of time is different.
I think that things will continue to slow down for us because we will keep trying to experience life one day at a time. Hopefully we’ll approach the point where a year feels like a veritable eternity. =)
Another factor that has modified our sense of time is the mild winter we’ve had. There was a point in January when I found myself complaining that it was in the mid-30's, but temperatures have been much higher than that the majority of the time. The early arrival of spring has allowed us to spend more time exploring the delights of the PNW.
We have reached the six month point since we left our jobs and declared ourselves FI, and it's been four months since we moved to the PNW. It sure feels like a lot more time has gone by, especially during our stay in the PNW. I suppose our new lives are not as monotonous as before so our subjective experience of time is different.
I think that things will continue to slow down for us because we will keep trying to experience life one day at a time. Hopefully we’ll approach the point where a year feels like a veritable eternity. =)
Another factor that has modified our sense of time is the mild winter we’ve had. There was a point in January when I found myself complaining that it was in the mid-30's, but temperatures have been much higher than that the majority of the time. The early arrival of spring has allowed us to spend more time exploring the delights of the PNW.
Re: spoonman's Journal
Oh, this is wonderful. One huge lament of people as they age is that it feels like time passes faster and faster - or that it feels like it just slips by. You nailed it - it's because of monotony. I'm curious how much of your feeling is because of the newness of your current life vs your more recent lifestyle. Time is one currency we spend where we do not get to control the rate of spend - it goes by whether we're getting good use of it or not. I hope I remember to aim for the kind of feeling you're having - that you're getting a lot of out of your time
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George the original one
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Re: spoonman's Journal
Since you've exited the workforce, has any of the above come into play?spoonman, a long time ago wrote wrote:For a about a year now I’ve begun to realize that the post-retirement challenges are nothing to mess with. I’ve also come to the realization that some of those problems will be impossible to predict. I can read and dissect a post by BNL on the “The Retirement Identity Gap” and tell myself that I will be ready, but deep down I get a feeling that I will inevitably be go through the negative experience and come to terms with it on my own. I can read and re-read Alain de Botton’s “Status Anxiety” and learn about the woes and ways of dealing with status anxiety, but in the end it’s something that I won’t be able to evade simply by reading about it.
Re: spoonman's Journal
@C40: I think the bulk of the feeling is a consequence of the newness of our current lives. I feel like a college student again, a lot of what's been happening to us is new and has been forcing us to live in the moment. I hope that we can sustain the feeling even if we decide to set roots somewhere.
@GTOO: That's a great question! Thank you for digging that. Let me start with Status Anxiety. So far, it hasn't been a big deal because we haven't rubbed elbows with other family members all that much. We did have some cousins come over and have a look at our apartment, and for a moment there I couldn't help but feel a little bit of Statux Anxiety. After all, we had moved from one of the most desirable neighborhoods in Los Angeles. I think they were a bit puzzled by our choice of neighborhood and apartment, but in the end they were excited to have us in the area. I'm sure Statux Anxiety will rear its head in the future, but I hope that by then its effects will be diminished. For instance, we plan to brag about the awesome places we'll visit around the world (i.e. we're hanging out in Paris, what are you up to? =) ). Eventually, our family will get the drift that we're in supreme command of our finances.
Now, about the Retirement Identity Gap, that one hasn't been too difficult to deal with. Since we've been busy downsizing our lives and restructuring our finances, I've been able to punt on the issue. But I will slowly pick up some interesting and stimulating projects. Initially, I will start playing around with projects that won't necessarily lead to money or prestige. After that, I'll re-evaluate the situation and see what my heart tells me.
One little project I've been working on is going back to some topics I didn't get the chance to delve into very deeply in college and in grad school. One of these is digging deeper into Quantum Mechanics and its interpretations. I've been going over John Bell's "Speakable and Unspeakable in Quantum Mechanics", it's been a very enjoyable read.
@GTOO: That's a great question! Thank you for digging that. Let me start with Status Anxiety. So far, it hasn't been a big deal because we haven't rubbed elbows with other family members all that much. We did have some cousins come over and have a look at our apartment, and for a moment there I couldn't help but feel a little bit of Statux Anxiety. After all, we had moved from one of the most desirable neighborhoods in Los Angeles. I think they were a bit puzzled by our choice of neighborhood and apartment, but in the end they were excited to have us in the area. I'm sure Statux Anxiety will rear its head in the future, but I hope that by then its effects will be diminished. For instance, we plan to brag about the awesome places we'll visit around the world (i.e. we're hanging out in Paris, what are you up to? =) ). Eventually, our family will get the drift that we're in supreme command of our finances.
Now, about the Retirement Identity Gap, that one hasn't been too difficult to deal with. Since we've been busy downsizing our lives and restructuring our finances, I've been able to punt on the issue. But I will slowly pick up some interesting and stimulating projects. Initially, I will start playing around with projects that won't necessarily lead to money or prestige. After that, I'll re-evaluate the situation and see what my heart tells me.
One little project I've been working on is going back to some topics I didn't get the chance to delve into very deeply in college and in grad school. One of these is digging deeper into Quantum Mechanics and its interpretations. I've been going over John Bell's "Speakable and Unspeakable in Quantum Mechanics", it's been a very enjoyable read.
Re: spoonman's Journal
ok,spoonman wrote:
One little project I've been working on is going back to some topics I didn't get the chance to delve into very deeply in college and in grad school. One of these is digging deeper into Quantum Mechanics and its interpretations. I've been going over John Bell's "Speakable and Unspeakable in Quantum Mechanics", it's been a very enjoyable read.
you need help, reading quantum mechanics for pleasure ?
seriously though, nice pictures on timberline; I went up there years ago and loved it.
if you're going to other places in Oregon, i'd recommend Eugene which has a great small town feel, Newport has some places to stay right on the coast, the Columbia river gorge and of course crater lake.
Re: spoonman's Journal
Awesome photos. The lake is amazingly clear.
Re: spoonman's Journal
@jacob: Thanks for the suggestion, I'm curious to see what he says about local causality (which is something John Bell was passionate about). Which text did you use in grad school? I got the pleasure to use J.J. Sakurai's book, it made everything easy to digest.
@leeholsen: Newport is definitely on my list. I visited the area when I was 12 years old, the town had a nice charm that I couldn't fully appreciate at the time. I'll put Eugene on the list as well.
@Chad: glad you enjoyed the photos!
@leeholsen: Newport is definitely on my list. I visited the area when I was 12 years old, the town had a nice charm that I couldn't fully appreciate at the time. I'll put Eugene on the list as well.
@Chad: glad you enjoyed the photos!
Re: spoonman's Journal
Have you visited Multnomah falls and that general area? Siskiyou national Forest area is also awesome for hiking, camping, swimming. Enjoy!
Re: spoonman's Journal
@mxlr650: Sometime back in January we went to the waterfalls by the Columbia Gorge while visiting some family in the area. It was really beautiful but also very crowded. Several years ago we went to another place in Oregon that had a bunch of waterfalls, one of which had a walkway behind the waterfall itself...it was incredible. The PNW as a whole is bursting with water, much different than the SoCal environment we're used to.