Early Retirement Extreme Forums

@7w5, erytu: That is interesting about ED. It reminded me of reading about some recovered covid patients losing teeth (literally just bloodlessly pooping out) because they had some prior issue with the blood vessels in the gums and mouth. There were also warnings that those with gum diseases who caught covid had increased risk of respiratory failure. Would covid effect ED or even cause it in some cases, or am I completely misunderstanding?

UK-with-kids wrote: ↑

Sat Dec 19, 2020 9:41 am

Statement from the UK's Chief Medical Officer today about the new CV strain which has been spreading in southeast England:
https://www.gov.uk/government/news/stat ... f-covid-19

The UK has informed the WHO that the new strain is spreading more rapidly than previous strains. Urgent work is underway to assess whether it's any more dangerous and if vaccine efficacy is affected.

Just watched today's press conference with the British Prime Minister, the Chief Medical Officer (Chris Whitty) and Chief Scientific Advisor (Patrick Vallance).

The new strain may be transmitted up to 70% more readily than the previous ones. It's believed that it arose in mid September, and it now makes up 60% of all cases in London.

There are 23 changes with this strain of the virus, which is an unusually large number of variants, and it has changes associated with how it binds to cells.

Q1 - Does it transmit more readily? - yes, see above, it's become the dominant strain

Q2 - Does it make people sicker? - no (as far as we can tell so far)

Q3 - Does it alter how the body responds? (inc if it's had a vaccine) - theoretically yes, but no evidence to suggest that yet. Porton Down is investigating.

With transmission being easier, it's been decided that more measures are needed. From midnight tonight there's now a Christmas lockdown for millions of people in so called "Tier 4" areas (including the whole of London). Travel bans, no overnight stays, no household mixing, etc.

Christmas is cancelled. For the first time since Oliver Cromwell and the Puritans in 1644.

UK-with-kids wrote: ↑

Sat Dec 19, 2020 11:53 am

Christmas is cancelled. For the first time since Oliver Cromwell and the Puritans in 1644.

Well I wouldn't go quite that far! Christmas will continue, but with more restrictions.

Yeah a bit of annoyance spilled over in the last paragraph. They've just made it illegal for the mother-in-law to visit, lol.

The rest of my post is scientifically interesting though!

UK-with-kids wrote: ↑

Sat Dec 19, 2020 12:21 pm

Yeah a bit of annoyance spilled over in the last paragraph. They've just made it illegal for the mother-in-law to visit, lol.

The rest of my post is scientifically interesting though!

Ha yes agreed, your post was very useful in distilling all the stuff on gov.co.uk, which has a bit too much info on it for a quick read.

If the virus substantially mutates so as to eliminate immunity without increasing significantly in morbidity, we should cut our losses and release it. We didn't win this one. Let's try to learn from more effective countries (e.g. China, Vietnam) for next time.

peanut wrote:Would covid effect ED or even cause it in some cases, or am I completely misunderstanding?

I didn't mean to convey that. I was just kind of using ED as an example of hidden things that can go wrong with your body as you age. Aging and death or planned obsolescence of the bodies of human individuals is a feature not a bug. The lifespans of all mammals are proportional to size and frequency of heart beat. Therefore, it's magical thinking to believe that improvements to health and/or fitness equals age reversal. This is more clear if you consider the case of an overweight 12 year old who greatly improves her health habits. Is she now equivalent to being a 6 year old? No, she is simply a much more healthy and/or fit 12 year old, which is a worthwhile goal of its own.

If the virus substantially mutates so as to eliminate immunity without increasing significantly in morbidity, we should cut our losses and release it. We didn't win this one. Let's try to learn from more effective countries (e.g. China, Vietnam) for next time.

If immunity has been eliminated then it is effectively a different virus and we (all humans including those in China, Vietnam) are back to Square 1 in terms of herd immunity. If it continues to circulate in the pool, it will likely continue to mutate. This is very bad news.

nomadscientist wrote: ↑

Sat Dec 19, 2020 1:06 pm

If the virus substantially mutates so as to eliminate immunity without increasing significantly in morbidity, we should cut our losses and release it. We didn't win this one. Let's try to learn from more effective countries (e.g. China, Vietnam) for next time.

China locked down Wuhan very hard, is that what you are proposing?

Interestingly it seems this new variant has already escaped the UK.

I did read today that one way the virus might change to spread more rapidly is by infecting the respiratory tract rather than lungs. I don't know if this was based on any evidence or is just wishful thinking.

7Wannabe5 wrote: ↑

Fri Dec 18, 2020 3:22 pm

Of course, you are free to believe that there is a strata of health to be achieved beyond level of simply not having any of the co-morbidities listed in the calculator and/or any level of being overweight, but this is not a scientific belief unless this difference is in some way measurable.

From the scientists I mentioned above I may bring one book by Dr J. Furman called "super immunity" to your attention. In chapter 1 it mentions the case where a pandemic virus can release so called cytokine storm in humans. An overreaction of your immune system. That book was published in 2012/13 so before Covid 19. This dr Fuhrman gives explanations how your immune system can be brought to an optimum. Read also his more recent "eat for life". It is coherent with what the other scientist/doctors I have mentioned have found.

So it is not a believe, but more a well tested way to get an optimal immune system. And as have corrected my too bold use of words, having such optimal immune-system is effective for about 93% (90-95%) of all kind of vira or bacterial infections.

It gives me peace of mind since I eat/live in such way as recommended, but I am aware that 93% is not a guarantee.

Perhaps you can compare it as follows: Working to an excellent condition, stamina and strenght Jacob states somewhere that although he is in his forties now, he has a condition level of a twenty-some-thing. For me, in my seventies now, I have a working immune-system level of a forty-some-thing.

I am not saying I have a younger body than my real age, but its immune function is a lot better than man of my age who eat/live not as I do.

My contributions about health are not to boast, they are intended to every one who wants to have a body which has the most chance to survive a contamination with Covid 19 (or in one or more of its mutations).

ducknald_don wrote: ↑

Sat Dec 19, 2020 3:21 pm

China locked down Wuhan very hard, is that what you are proposing?

No of course not. I propose ineffective measures that last forever like the rest of smart people.

7Wannabe5 wrote:If immunity has been eliminated then it is effectively a different virus and we (all humans including those in China, Vietnam) are back to Square 1 in terms of herd immunity. If it continues to circulate in the pool, it will likely continue to mutate. This is very bad news.

Those countries control their borders, so they're not back to square one practically.

White people will start trying to emigrate to those countries en masse, like Mexicans into the USA in the beforetime.

7Wannabe5 wrote: ↑

Sat Dec 19, 2020 1:49 pm

I didn't mean to convey that. I was just kind of using ED as an example of hidden things that can go wrong with your body as you age. Aging and death or planned obsolescence of the bodies of human individuals is a feature not a bug. The lifespans of all mammals are proportional to size and frequency of heart beat. Therefore, it's magical thinking to believe that improvements to health and/or fitness equals age reversal. This is more clear if you consider the case of an overweight 12 year old who greatly improves her health habits. Is she now equivalent to being a 6 year old? No, she is simply a much more healthy and/or fit 12 year old, which is a worthwhile goal of its own.

Ah, later I did a Google search and saw there were a bunch of articles mostly from just the past month saying that covid can and does cause or exacerbate ED. So in fact a very timely connection!

I feel like I should unnecessarily add I was asking out of mere curiosity and not personal concern. But the teeth falling out thing definitely terrifies me.

The constitution America wrote for Japan required it to allow coronavirus to spread in Japan, forbidding both effective policies and the "lockdown." Why? Because "lockdown" is indistinguishable from state militarism against the public. Nonetheless, only three thousand Japanese are dead in Japan, though my Japanese friends send me new photographs of themselves at restaurants almost every week, and Japan has the oldest population in the world.

The American, confident of his eternal mastery, the invincibility of his navy, and the infallibility of his "science," requests entry to Japan. The reply, for now: please wait.

Please wait.

Please wait.

UK-with-kids wrote: ↑

Sat Dec 19, 2020 11:53 am

The new strain may be transmitted up to 70% more readily than the previous ones. It's believed that it arose in mid September, and it now makes up 60% of all cases in London.

I read this in the news earlier. What does this mean exactly? Does it mean that the new strain is spread through methods other than airborne/droplets or that it takes less exposure to become infected?

“J” wrote: Perhaps you can compare it as follows: Working to an excellent condition, stamina and strenght Jacob states somewhere that although he is in his forties now, he has a condition level of a twenty-some-thing. For me, in my seventies now, I have a working immune-system level of a forty-some-thing.

Jacob’s conditioning might resemble that of a human in his 20s from the perspective of a Physicist looking at the output from an exercise machine, but I doubt that a Cannibal Chef putting leg parts in a pot would be as easily fooled. My point being that it is not yet known whether the perspective of Covid 19 is more like that of a Physicist or a Cannibal or ???

You do not even have the benefit of direct measurement of the functioning of your immune system. You are relying on the advice of MDs who make more passive money selling books recommending non-pharmaceutical actions than they can make actively writing prescriptions.

“nomadscientist” wrote: White people will start trying to emigrate to those countries en masse, like Mexicans into the USA in the beforetime

But not so much those in Australia or Cement City, MI.

The latest article I read indicated that it is possible the spread of this new strain has been quicker for reasons of happenstance, such as one super-spreader event. Also, the vaccines target more spikes than are altered by this mutation. Therefore, getting everybody vaccinated ASAP is likely still best option. Though the animal reserve is still worrisome.

Strange phenomena with the new strain. Some of the big name scientists who are on the decision making committees are weighing in with speculative warnings of what the new strain might do. Their speculation is out of character and seems on the verge of fear mongering. Other big names who seem to have not gotten the memo are saying they are reading the papers and see no evidence it increases severity, antibody evasion or transmissibility. They say it is a perfectly normal result of the founder effect.

I wonder if this is more about managing public opinion than explaining reality.

It's just a coincidence that the first of dozens of mutations to be pushed hard to general population by the media and political institutions happened to be in the first country vaccinating.

@momadscientist:

No, it is not a coincidence because it would have to be a country with high technological development.

I did wonder if the "coincidence" was that such a big deal was being made of a new strain just before Christmas, a time when millions of households would be mixing. It's certainly a convenient reason to change the rules at the last minute - "when the facts change, I change my mind" etc.

That's some "dihydrogen monoxide inhalation causes suffocation"-level reporting.