Is a men following the ERE Lifestyle More Attractive?
Re: Is a men following the ERE Lifestyle More Attractive?
Urban slang referencing value of erotic capital. Same derivation as OPP. I first encountered it in a self help book for women entitled “Play or Be Played”, by Tariq Nasheed, author of “The Mack Within.”
Re: Is a men following the ERE Lifestyle More Attractive?
I don't understand the pre/trans thing very well, but I think in this case it might be another WL5/6 moat thing.
If you are designing a resilient lifestyle this makes you an autonomous agent with a WoG. It's up to you to put what you want in your WoG and then it's up to you to build the requisite skills and then integrate it with the rest of your life. It's becoming more well documented that there is a learning portion at WL6 which often requires spending a bit more money initially as the system is expanded to areas that may have been minimized to optimize savings rates in WL5.
Sometimes you don't want what you thought you wanted and you have to fuck around and find out (what you actually want).
if you are in WL3-5 world where you see everything primarily in terms of money, things get harder. Fucking, dating and short-medium-long-term partnerships are all activities and activities take resources. If your main resource is money, you can expect to use some. In theory there is no reason you can't optimize this for money. However, activities involving other people are notoriously hard to optimize (see "I can't have friends because ERE" and "OH NO!: Family and ERE"). Adding sex to the mix is only going to make it harder.
What bothers me in these threads are the pervasive myths that: 1) Mate finding for men is impossibly expensive* either in terms of money or signaling or time and 2) that the skills to get whatever you want out of mate selection are someone not learnable or not desirable to learn.
*Also the financial goal of most people here is to have hundreds of thousands saved and be very good at resource acquisition through money or other means. Like "oh no," you realize you need a new wardrobe... just go get it however the fuck you normally get stuff, you should be much BETTER at this than the average person.
(1) is this myth that women only like guys who buy them stuff or who signal that they can buy them stuff/ are successful by having very expensive stuff or that you somehow need to make it into the top 0.1% of men in some appealing category to attract women. I promise you this is untrue.
(2) is a myth that changing things about yourself to appeal to the female gaze is either not possible or includes some sort of irreconcilable forfeiture of your sense of self. This is also untrue.
Most women don't want to date sloppy ass broke dudes they have to take care of. A small percentage of women do care primarily about money. Some men, usually young, think getting laid is the be all end all of romance and figure out how to get laid a lot. Often they end up unhappy and bad at long-term relationships. All three of these things being true does not make the myths listed above true.
EREers should be BETTER consumers than Joe-consumer because we do not fall prey to the myth that more consumption and less knowledge about things outside of our narrow sphere of specialization lead to greater happiness. This makes it possible to outperform consumers even at consumption. Pair this with eschewing the two popular myths of masculinity above and any masculine EREer should have what they need to get what they want....
Good luck figuring out what you want, that's on you.
If you are designing a resilient lifestyle this makes you an autonomous agent with a WoG. It's up to you to put what you want in your WoG and then it's up to you to build the requisite skills and then integrate it with the rest of your life. It's becoming more well documented that there is a learning portion at WL6 which often requires spending a bit more money initially as the system is expanded to areas that may have been minimized to optimize savings rates in WL5.
Sometimes you don't want what you thought you wanted and you have to fuck around and find out (what you actually want).
if you are in WL3-5 world where you see everything primarily in terms of money, things get harder. Fucking, dating and short-medium-long-term partnerships are all activities and activities take resources. If your main resource is money, you can expect to use some. In theory there is no reason you can't optimize this for money. However, activities involving other people are notoriously hard to optimize (see "I can't have friends because ERE" and "OH NO!: Family and ERE"). Adding sex to the mix is only going to make it harder.
What bothers me in these threads are the pervasive myths that: 1) Mate finding for men is impossibly expensive* either in terms of money or signaling or time and 2) that the skills to get whatever you want out of mate selection are someone not learnable or not desirable to learn.
*Also the financial goal of most people here is to have hundreds of thousands saved and be very good at resource acquisition through money or other means. Like "oh no," you realize you need a new wardrobe... just go get it however the fuck you normally get stuff, you should be much BETTER at this than the average person.
(1) is this myth that women only like guys who buy them stuff or who signal that they can buy them stuff/ are successful by having very expensive stuff or that you somehow need to make it into the top 0.1% of men in some appealing category to attract women. I promise you this is untrue.
(2) is a myth that changing things about yourself to appeal to the female gaze is either not possible or includes some sort of irreconcilable forfeiture of your sense of self. This is also untrue.
Most women don't want to date sloppy ass broke dudes they have to take care of. A small percentage of women do care primarily about money. Some men, usually young, think getting laid is the be all end all of romance and figure out how to get laid a lot. Often they end up unhappy and bad at long-term relationships. All three of these things being true does not make the myths listed above true.
EREers should be BETTER consumers than Joe-consumer because we do not fall prey to the myth that more consumption and less knowledge about things outside of our narrow sphere of specialization lead to greater happiness. This makes it possible to outperform consumers even at consumption. Pair this with eschewing the two popular myths of masculinity above and any masculine EREer should have what they need to get what they want....
Good luck figuring out what you want, that's on you.
Re: Is a men following the ERE Lifestyle More Attractive?
@Jin+Guice:
Bravo! My similar message to a "natural woman" cohort would be:
1) Is this myth that men only like women who are quite physically attractive, at the very least a 6 = "cute" (or a 5 and his particular type) on an objective 10 point log scale, and preferably at least 20% younger than them. IOW, the belief that men uniformly rate almost 50% of all females as undatable is not true!
2)Is the myth that changing things about yourself to appeal to the masculine gaze is either not possible, extremely expensive, or includes some sort of irreconcilable forfeiture of your sense of self. This is not true!
OTOH
3) Cross-cultural research does seem to indicate that among the top 5 qualities humans do care about when mating, some such as intelligence and kindness are more sex invariant, but some such as physical attractiveness and resource potential/provision are highly sex variant. Men care much more about physical attractiveness of partners in both short and long term "contracts" and women care much more about resource provision of partners in both short and long term "contracts." In studies across two centuries and all cultures, on average women value resource potential of mate approximately twice as much as men and men value physical attractiveness of mate as being 50%* more important as a quality in mate than women do. Men rate it as an Important (Top 3)quality, and women rate it only as a Somewhat Desirable or Desirable quality.
4) Believing that members of the other sex are "wrong-minded", "overly culturally-influenced", "superficial", or "evil" due to these persistent sex variant preferences will get you nowhere fast. This is true!
*So, it's actually easier for broke-azz men to gain some traction with women based on looks than it is for homely women to gain some traction with men based on resource provision. I think most of us would confirm this in our day to day experience of couplings of which we are aware.
Bravo! My similar message to a "natural woman" cohort would be:
1) Is this myth that men only like women who are quite physically attractive, at the very least a 6 = "cute" (or a 5 and his particular type) on an objective 10 point log scale, and preferably at least 20% younger than them. IOW, the belief that men uniformly rate almost 50% of all females as undatable is not true!
2)Is the myth that changing things about yourself to appeal to the masculine gaze is either not possible, extremely expensive, or includes some sort of irreconcilable forfeiture of your sense of self. This is not true!
OTOH
3) Cross-cultural research does seem to indicate that among the top 5 qualities humans do care about when mating, some such as intelligence and kindness are more sex invariant, but some such as physical attractiveness and resource potential/provision are highly sex variant. Men care much more about physical attractiveness of partners in both short and long term "contracts" and women care much more about resource provision of partners in both short and long term "contracts." In studies across two centuries and all cultures, on average women value resource potential of mate approximately twice as much as men and men value physical attractiveness of mate as being 50%* more important as a quality in mate than women do. Men rate it as an Important (Top 3)quality, and women rate it only as a Somewhat Desirable or Desirable quality.
4) Believing that members of the other sex are "wrong-minded", "overly culturally-influenced", "superficial", or "evil" due to these persistent sex variant preferences will get you nowhere fast. This is true!
*So, it's actually easier for broke-azz men to gain some traction with women based on looks than it is for homely women to gain some traction with men based on resource provision. I think most of us would confirm this in our day to day experience of couplings of which we are aware.
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Humanofearth
- Posts: 195
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Re: Is a men following the ERE Lifestyle More Attractive?
J+G
I was extreme in terms of not spending prior. I saw this have many detrimental effects on my social life.
The focus for me is extreme health, though it’s an effort, I am definitely not yet extremely healthy, it is an ideal to strive for rather than something to stress over. I have yet to see focus on health have a strong negative effect in the way I saw focus on not spending had a strong negative effect on my social life once I eased up.
I don’t know if I’ve been with 10’s, I don’t think it’s necessary or particularly desirable. I am with women I find attractive who treat me with respect and desire. Money is but 1 piece. Looks, but 1 piece. If you’re genuinely clean, shredded, healthy and clear skin, well fitted clothes with color patterns that complement your skin well, that’s 90% of the looks piece.
Most of my time in the heavy dating time was spent dating, not focused on improving my looks. 2 hours to workout and shower in the morning. It’s enough. There’s too many other things to focus on. I have a friend who trains 6 hours a day. I train, but I also focus on skin, masks, etc. I do a genuine effort and that’s it.
I was extreme in terms of not spending prior. I saw this have many detrimental effects on my social life.
The focus for me is extreme health, though it’s an effort, I am definitely not yet extremely healthy, it is an ideal to strive for rather than something to stress over. I have yet to see focus on health have a strong negative effect in the way I saw focus on not spending had a strong negative effect on my social life once I eased up.
I don’t know if I’ve been with 10’s, I don’t think it’s necessary or particularly desirable. I am with women I find attractive who treat me with respect and desire. Money is but 1 piece. Looks, but 1 piece. If you’re genuinely clean, shredded, healthy and clear skin, well fitted clothes with color patterns that complement your skin well, that’s 90% of the looks piece.
Most of my time in the heavy dating time was spent dating, not focused on improving my looks. 2 hours to workout and shower in the morning. It’s enough. There’s too many other things to focus on. I have a friend who trains 6 hours a day. I train, but I also focus on skin, masks, etc. I do a genuine effort and that’s it.
Re: Is a men following the ERE Lifestyle More Attractive?
This will be unattractive. OTOH, "creating a world as your own man outside of consumerism" will be attractive. The "trans" point I am trying to make is that beyond the short-term in which "being your own man" makes you more attractive (like a wild stallion as opposed to a domesticated show pony), "creating a world as your own man outside of consumerism in which you honor the preferences of other" is even higher, more attractive, functioning. And beyond that, "creating a world as your own man outside of consumerism in which you honor the preferences of feminine other and accept her need for space adequate to express her own desire for freedom and creativity towards self-actualization" would represent even higher functioning.Humanofearth wrote:focus on not spending
IOW, I am doing a hack job of it, but here is a summary of the problems with heterosexual relationships at each level currently represented in society/behavior:
Red: sexual violence and conquest
Blue: rigid gender roles and societal rules concerning the expression of sexuality
Orange: sex/gender neutralized towards the masculine energy, soul-less transaction/investment based relationships
Green: sex/gender neutered towards the feminine energy, warm/familial relationships devoid of sexual polarity
Yellow: too early to say what the problem will be, but it will likely be something like inability to see the whole picture from just one's own WOG.
However, one of the solutions offered at Yellow is to re-introduce, re-energize sexual/romantic relationships through enhanced sexual dichotomy. So, for example, maybe I was in my super-competitive masculine energy at a book sale in the afternoon, and I'm still a bit pumped from the score I achieved. As I slip into my dress for my date that evening, since I am self-aware about my core preference to be in feminine energy in sexual relationship, I will choose to relax into my feminine energy and not continue in the highly directed "masculine" behavior that allowed for my success at the book sale within the context of my date, although my success will likely remain as a glow within my relaxation. Therefore, if I arrive at the coffee shop at the same time as my date, and he insists on paying for my coffee, I bow to his plan. If he is value-core-frugal to the extent that he believes buying the occasional coffee at a coffee shop is wasteful, then his practice should be to suggest meeting in a public venue where he can provide a beverage that he prepared at home. Not offering to pay for my coffee if/when he suggested meeting at coffee shop sends a mixed message which will require more energy on my part to interpret. Somebody has to be driving the interaction/relationship forward towards an actual sexual encounter, and if I am relaxed in my feminine energy, it is not going to be me. Could I choose to flip into my masculine energy and take the initiative/driver's seat. Absolutely, BTDT, but these-a-days, it is my practice not to go there (initially), because I am self-aware that it is not my preference over the medium/long run to be the partner primarily initiating/driving sexual encounters. Therefore, because money is primarily the means by which things get done, projects are advanced, etc. in our culture, if/when you suggest meeting in a coffee shop, but you don't offer to pay for her coffee, you are also subtle-signaling either sexual disinterest, sexual passivity, or something somewhat egalitarian wishy-washy like what one of my very towards Level Green partners once said to me which was , "Sometimes I might want to tie you up in bed, but then other times you might want to tie me up in bed." , my immediate unvoiced response being, "You wish."
OTOH, likely because there is a shortage of men of my generation who are capable of comprehending this at Level Yellow "trans", I have not infrequently found myself in relationship with men who are still "pre" exhibiting sexual dichotomy at Level Blue (tinge of Red), and who are thus incapable of accepting/appropriately supporting me in my more independent "masculine" energy mode. For example, I dated a second-generation Greek-heritage man who actually became angry with me, because I bought my own coffee at a rest-stop while I was on a road trip with him, etc. etc.
Okay, here is the visualization I am now imagining (subject to much future revision.) Each human has their own WOG towards self-actualization. These WOGS may be imagined as formed on half-spheres. A "goal" is inherent of masculine energy, so if you are a human who core, most often, prefers to be in your masculine energy in sexual relationship, then you should approach the other human, assumed to prefer feminine energy in sexual context, with your WOG convex side to her WOG concave side which will be where her underlying preferences/emotions infuse her "being." And, obviously, if you can comprehend this visualization, then you also should possess the ability to undertake this with only spending money to the extent that it is in alignment with your own value structure.
IOW, you will think along the lines of "How will it make her feel if I approach her in my broad-shouldered presence, and reach out my arm in that rigid-wristed, fast-action masculine manner, and "Allow me" swipe to pay for her coffee, after inquiring/allowing her first to state/order in alignment with her preferences? Granted, I am the sort of female who has had three of her significant partners independently decide that "Bunny" is most appropriate form of endearment for her, but in my experience, it makes me feel like I have been "picked up" securely and confidently in firm-handed grip and can better relax for the rest of the date.
Re: Is a men following the ERE Lifestyle More Attractive?
Getting back to the Op.
Let's keep this simple. I think Jean has come to the closest and simplest advice so far: be happy. Happy people make others around them feel good which has to be one of the most enticing attractants ever. A sense of humor will win over money any day of the week.
If you can't be happy be content with what you have and your station in life, also a strong attractant.
And if you can't accomplish either of those, then do the work to make that happen*. The internet is inundated with these gender wars that continuously break down the sexes into their worst base instincts which is unfortunate. Preying upon others weaknesses for a short term goal makes no sense other than very fleeting pleasure. You could write a book on what is wrong with the "hawk tuah" girl situation right now.
* be clean, groomed, and moderately fit
be competent in something, preferably many things
be interested in others for the sake of curiosity
do interesting things for the sake of the activity being interesting
learn how to read people through intonation, body language, etc
always improve upon your verbal and social skills
Let's keep this simple. I think Jean has come to the closest and simplest advice so far: be happy. Happy people make others around them feel good which has to be one of the most enticing attractants ever. A sense of humor will win over money any day of the week.
If you can't be happy be content with what you have and your station in life, also a strong attractant.
And if you can't accomplish either of those, then do the work to make that happen*. The internet is inundated with these gender wars that continuously break down the sexes into their worst base instincts which is unfortunate. Preying upon others weaknesses for a short term goal makes no sense other than very fleeting pleasure. You could write a book on what is wrong with the "hawk tuah" girl situation right now.
* be clean, groomed, and moderately fit
be competent in something, preferably many things
be interested in others for the sake of curiosity
do interesting things for the sake of the activity being interesting
learn how to read people through intonation, body language, etc
always improve upon your verbal and social skills
Re: Is a men following the ERE Lifestyle More Attractive?
I don't know about a book, but I can certainly write a paragraph. I was not familiar with the reference, so I searched it and watched the video. The essential problem is that the interview is being conducted at crude Level Orange. The question posed by the interviewer places the women interviewed firmly in their masculine energy, He asks "What move can you make..." Any human "making a move" is in their masculine energy. Therefore, the replies generated are bound to be simultaneously titillating and repulsive. This is also why I rated the website that promoted learning high-level fellatio skillz as fairly low on the Sexuality Wheaton Table on other thread. Sex-positivity is fantastic. I highly promote it. Learning skillz in any realm in which you intend to practice is fantastic. I highly recommend it. However, this is entirely the wrong mind-set to be in if interested in attracting somebody in their core masculine energy. Actually, even the phrase "drive a man crazy" in the interview question reveals this, because "crazy" is not a state a man-in-his-power straightforwardly wants to find himself in. A somewhat better question the interviewer might have asked might be "What do you do in bed to make your man feel like a man?" The answers would likely still have been a bit risque, but the energy would likely be more towards uniformly attractive. Although, also likely more towards erring on the side of Meg Ryan exhibiting a faked orgasmffj wrote:You could write a book on what is wrong with the "hawk tuah" girl situation right now.
I was trying to think of an interview question that a female interviewer on the street (or in very bad pop-up neo-Byronic Level Green poetry workshop) could ask random men to generate a similar/opposite response. Maybe something like "Describe in your own words the feelings you experience when you worship with your torn heart as sacrifice at the feet of a beautiful woman as though she were your Goddess or a vision of angelic purity the very moment you first gaze upon her at coffee shop." IOW, a too early or too blatant expression of "slobbery luv feelings" by a male can have similar effect as a too early, or too blatant demonstration of "hawk tuah sex skillz" by a female.
Re: Is a men following the ERE Lifestyle More Attractive?
I'm just waiting for the announcement that the next International Physics Olympiad is to be held in the town that Hawk Tua girl lives in.
Re: Is a men following the ERE Lifestyle More Attractive?
Right.
She was clearly drunk when she was filmed by some lame content creator that was preying upon people with altered states. So he caught her with her guard down and exploited it, but what is worse is that she volunteered way too much information because I'm sure somewhere in her thoughts she thought it was empowering*. The fact that she is currently selling merchandise and appearing on stage with country music stars tells me she is quite short-sighted. She will forever be known as the girl that spits by the world. She'll never escape this and while now it's a big joke someday she may want to get married, become a community leader or the equivalent which will forever be undermined by that video. The whole situation is wrong on many levels.
But maybe I am over-reacting too as I am a different generation and her peers will think nothing of it. I don't know. Time will tell.
*Don't misunderstand my position. I'm not shaming her for anything she does in her private life. But why would she not know, even drunk, that this was a mistake?
She was clearly drunk when she was filmed by some lame content creator that was preying upon people with altered states. So he caught her with her guard down and exploited it, but what is worse is that she volunteered way too much information because I'm sure somewhere in her thoughts she thought it was empowering*. The fact that she is currently selling merchandise and appearing on stage with country music stars tells me she is quite short-sighted. She will forever be known as the girl that spits by the world. She'll never escape this and while now it's a big joke someday she may want to get married, become a community leader or the equivalent which will forever be undermined by that video. The whole situation is wrong on many levels.
But maybe I am over-reacting too as I am a different generation and her peers will think nothing of it. I don't know. Time will tell.
*Don't misunderstand my position. I'm not shaming her for anything she does in her private life. But why would she not know, even drunk, that this was a mistake?
Re: Is a men following the ERE Lifestyle More Attractive?
Maybe she could move to Scandanavia?ffj wrote:she may want to get married, become a community leader or the equivalent
Okay, seriously, these are Traditional/Level Blue institutions. I agree that this seems like a problem for her, because in the video, there is also an issue with classism which would place her towards a rougher Level Red background. IOW, it's not entirely clear whether she learned the conservative rules of Level Blue and is choosing to break with them towards individuality OR if she never learned them in the first place. Akin to when the kids are acting up when I am teaching in a rough neighborhood, and another adult might say something like "Y'all are acting like you had no home-training." Compare and contrast with a few quotes from frequently in her more masculine energy while enunciating with upper-crusty Mid-Atlantic accent, Katherine Hepburn, who has sometimes been described as the sort of woman that other women find most attractive.
If you obey all the rules, you miss all of the fun.
Good girls go to heaven, bad girls go everywhere.
If you want to sacrifice the admiration of many men for the criticism of one, go ahead, get married.
It’s a force of life; sex. You can’t deny the thrill of riding high, wide, and handsome with someone you love.
I also think about when my DD33 attended an extremely expensive college full of the extremely nerdy daughters of Southern Debutantes, and they made me watch twerking videos when I visited. I highly doubt that the "hawk tuah" girl was sexually empowered by reading Camille Paglia in a Feminist Theory 201 class at my daughter's up-rent university. More likely she is just the 21st version of the classic bawdy tavern wench accustomed to bouncing on the lap of some Level Red gangster types. That said, it is certainly not unpossible that she could someday find herself married to a good guy and a member of church and PTO group. Everybody loves a redemption story.
Re: Is a men following the ERE Lifestyle More Attractive?
@7
I get the impression you think my irritation of this situation is cute and outdated.
Once the momentary fame subsides, she may get tired of every guy she meets visualizing her performing her skills upon them. Or she may love it, I don't know, yelling out "spit on that thang" to every bar she visits for free drinks. Or maybe that could be her wedding theme, who knows anymore.
I get the impression you think my irritation of this situation is cute and outdated.
Once the momentary fame subsides, she may get tired of every guy she meets visualizing her performing her skills upon them. Or she may love it, I don't know, yelling out "spit on that thang" to every bar she visits for free drinks. Or maybe that could be her wedding theme, who knows anymore.
Re: Is a men following the ERE Lifestyle More Attractive?
Hawk Tua woman has hired a patent attorney, a business manager and a marketing company to make sure she 7figures this before some Appalachian ass licker stumbling out of an 18 wheeler out spit shines her and knocks her head first (pun intended) into the viral ditch. That there is the technological difference. What used to get a bar girl a free shot of whiskey and some country song worthy false promises can now mint her into financial independence.
Re: Is a men following the ERE Lifestyle More Attractive?
No, in fact, my recent reading reinforces the theory that heterosexual men are innately disposed at the level of evolutionary biology to prefer signaling of sexual chastity in their long-term female partners. OTOH, in their short term sexual partners, heterosexual men prefer signalling of fairly easy sexual availability. IOW, classic Madonna/Whore dichotomy holds up pretty well in recent research. Heterosexual females are less dichotomous in their preferences for long vs. short-term partners, so it can be a bit difficult for us to fully grok this tendency in men. In particular, it kind of seems irrational to want to enter into a life-long monogamous sexual contract with somebody who is currently signalling that maybe they don't even like sex in general or sex with you in particular.ffj wrote:I get the impression you think my irritation of this situation is cute and outdated.
One thing I have noted in my experience is that men often behave as though they care more about the appearance or signalling of sexual chastity vs. the reality of sexual chastity. IOW, the truism that men want somebody who is a, "Lady in the streets, slut in the sheets." also holds true. For example, I know you have been married for a long time, but if you were back out on the dating market at your current age, would you want or expect to find a compatible partner who had never in actuality performed fellatio upon a previous partner? Like most rational modern humans, you would likely be towards "Don't ask, don't tell." on the graphic details, but you would likely also find it passingly odd if one of your peers posted an online dating profile in which his stated preference was "Woman, age 32 to 49. Must be fellatio virgin."
However, it is also the case that particular sexual behaviors go in and out of style or in and out of approval by general public. For example, behavior such as fellatio which was edgy for members of the Silent Generation (in the Midwest, U.S., at least) is considered pretty hum-drum these-a-days. But other behavior, such as randomly smacking a woman on the ass, which was fairly acceptable when the Silent Generation was coming of age is pretty much against the law nowadays.
Re: Is a men following the ERE Lifestyle More Attractive?
@7
This is not an indictment of that particular act. If I were to become available again and I met an older woman with no sexual past, including blowjobs* that would probably scare me off quicker than one with multiple past partners.
It's the young lady who thinks it is empowering to be known for blowjobs** that I find disturbing and how it has been celebrated. Maybe if she creates an OnlyFans which people are asking for already? This is really my only point here.
Am I that out of touch? There are ramifications down the line for this young person.
* You made me say it
** You made me say it again
This is not an indictment of that particular act. If I were to become available again and I met an older woman with no sexual past, including blowjobs* that would probably scare me off quicker than one with multiple past partners.
It's the young lady who thinks it is empowering to be known for blowjobs** that I find disturbing and how it has been celebrated. Maybe if she creates an OnlyFans which people are asking for already? This is really my only point here.
Am I that out of touch? There are ramifications down the line for this young person.
* You made me say it
** You made me say it again
Re: Is a men following the ERE Lifestyle More Attractive?
I want to hug you. I thought people who see things this way had almost disappeared. Thank you!ffj wrote: ↑Tue Jul 02, 2024 3:40 pmRight.
She was clearly drunk when she was filmed by some lame content creator that was preying upon people with altered states. So he caught her with her guard down and exploited it, but what is worse is that she volunteered way too much information because I'm sure somewhere in her thoughts she thought it was empowering*. The fact that she is currently selling merchandise and appearing on stage with country music stars tells me she is quite short-sighted. She will forever be known as the girl that spits by the world. She'll never escape this and while now it's a big joke someday she may want to get married, become a community leader or the equivalent which will forever be undermined by that video. The whole situation is wrong on many levels.
But maybe I am over-reacting too as I am a different generation and her peers will think nothing of it. I don't know. Time will tell.
*Don't misunderstand my position. I'm not shaming her for anything she does in her private life. But why would she not know, even drunk, that this was a mistake?
Re: Is a men following the ERE Lifestyle More Attractive?
@ffj:
Maybe because she is so young you are thinking about her behavior in terms of that of a daughter you would hope to protect? I must admit that for me, the problem with the "hawk tua" girl's behavior is more the crudity (likely reflective of reactive classism on my part) than the overt sexuality. It appalls me for the same reason that I can't bear to watch television shows like Judge Judy or Maury Povich.
In fact, I also must admit that one of the means by which I sometimes relax into my feminine energy while waiting for a blind coffee date is to pretend like I am somebody who "maybe" appeared in a sensual art film in my youth. As if my date might crinkle his handsome eyes and murmer "You look puzzlingly familar to me..." and I might reply. "Are you perhaps familar with Art Zerinfsky's "Blue Peach, Red Robot"? So, I sometimes find it odd that the response I fairly frequently receive is more along the lines of "Even though I just today met you, I can tell that you are a very good woman. Will you come to my house on Sunday to meet my kids and my old Catholic mother?" Seriously, this has happened to me on multiple occasions. Men...
ETA: Upon further reflection, I think that it likely would be in a young woman's self-interest to signal sexual chastity if she was interested in finding a husband to be the father of her children. However, I do not think it would be in any woman's self-interest to signal sexual chastity just to attract a husband or romantic pair-bond if she does not want children or is past child-bearing phase. Family formation requires the acceptance of patriarchy by the human male in a manner unique to our species. An alternative to signalling sexual chastity might also be finding a human male (likely older) who has already independently entered into patriarchal functioning.
Maybe because she is so young you are thinking about her behavior in terms of that of a daughter you would hope to protect? I must admit that for me, the problem with the "hawk tua" girl's behavior is more the crudity (likely reflective of reactive classism on my part) than the overt sexuality. It appalls me for the same reason that I can't bear to watch television shows like Judge Judy or Maury Povich.
In fact, I also must admit that one of the means by which I sometimes relax into my feminine energy while waiting for a blind coffee date is to pretend like I am somebody who "maybe" appeared in a sensual art film in my youth. As if my date might crinkle his handsome eyes and murmer "You look puzzlingly familar to me..." and I might reply. "Are you perhaps familar with Art Zerinfsky's "Blue Peach, Red Robot"? So, I sometimes find it odd that the response I fairly frequently receive is more along the lines of "Even though I just today met you, I can tell that you are a very good woman. Will you come to my house on Sunday to meet my kids and my old Catholic mother?" Seriously, this has happened to me on multiple occasions. Men...
ETA: Upon further reflection, I think that it likely would be in a young woman's self-interest to signal sexual chastity if she was interested in finding a husband to be the father of her children. However, I do not think it would be in any woman's self-interest to signal sexual chastity just to attract a husband or romantic pair-bond if she does not want children or is past child-bearing phase. Family formation requires the acceptance of patriarchy by the human male in a manner unique to our species. An alternative to signalling sexual chastity might also be finding a human male (likely older) who has already independently entered into patriarchal functioning.
Re: Is a men following the ERE Lifestyle More Attractive?
@Seppia
It's hard to articulate these positions without looking like an out-of-touch person. It's further complicated by religion muddying the waters. So thanks for reaching out!
@7
Indeed, I am influenced by the fact that I have a daughter around this girls age and the fact she is a Southern girl. I've been to Nashville several times and it's almost comical observing the groups of young women walking around in gaggles. They all are wearing mini-skirts or skimpy sun-dresses, a cowboy hat, and without fail cowboy boots. Bar-hopping and drunkenly very loud. No thank-you, haha.*
*I once met a guy around my age whose job it was to pick up a literal van load of RedBull models (think F1 grid girls for comparison) for the Nascar Racing season. Multiple races, multiple women. I made the joke that had to be a good job at which he rolled his eyes and said you have no idea what a personal hell it was dealing with these girls. All they did was complain or have special needs he said. I always thought that story was funny.
It's hard to articulate these positions without looking like an out-of-touch person. It's further complicated by religion muddying the waters. So thanks for reaching out!
@7
Indeed, I am influenced by the fact that I have a daughter around this girls age and the fact she is a Southern girl. I've been to Nashville several times and it's almost comical observing the groups of young women walking around in gaggles. They all are wearing mini-skirts or skimpy sun-dresses, a cowboy hat, and without fail cowboy boots. Bar-hopping and drunkenly very loud. No thank-you, haha.*
*I once met a guy around my age whose job it was to pick up a literal van load of RedBull models (think F1 grid girls for comparison) for the Nascar Racing season. Multiple races, multiple women. I made the joke that had to be a good job at which he rolled his eyes and said you have no idea what a personal hell it was dealing with these girls. All they did was complain or have special needs he said. I always thought that story was funny.
Re: Is a men following the ERE Lifestyle More Attractive?
@ffj:
TMI (Also a bit towards the transgressive, although I do sincerely universally wish upon others a freedom of expression towards greater empathy. As in, who amongst us did not exhibit a bit of sexual idiocy in youth?)
TMI (Also a bit towards the transgressive, although I do sincerely universally wish upon others a freedom of expression towards greater empathy. As in, who amongst us did not exhibit a bit of sexual idiocy in youth?)
Last edited by 7Wannabe5 on Fri Jul 05, 2024 7:09 am, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Is a men following the ERE Lifestyle More Attractive?
Noted, but waaaay too much information.