PS. I DID get a very cool income this month. Well, for me. I'm ok with earning 1500 euros/month. I'm used to earning 2000-2500 euros a month. This month, it was 3650 euros! All due to working hard and many hours in February; but I think it was worth it.
I'll be spending about 1400-1500, so that's a nice savings rate of 59%. On the other hand, this month I took a week off, and I'll also work less hours during the other weeks, so next month I'm expecting a paycheck of about 1500 euros. Eeeh, I still won't have to touch my savings account! (I'm currently building up a 5000-euro-buffer in my savings account, which I find very annoying because the interest rate on saving accounts is so low - high for current American standards, but yeah, interest rates are abysmal everywhere; still it is smart to have some money at hand... ).
DutchGirl's journal
It's finally becoming spring. So welcome, hay fever... (ha).
In March, I made 3729 euros (salary 3627; interest/stock value growth 102 euros) and I spent 1363 euros. So a savings rate of 63%, which is exceptionally good for me, and both due to high income and low expenses.
On April 1st, my net worth was about 36,100 euros. So with a 4% SWR, if I could live on 120 euros per month, I'd be golden
. Still, compared to a few years ago, when my income from interest/stocks was about 0; now getting more than 1000 euros annually "for free" is really cool. And it does feel like it's going somewhere! I could still spend it all on (only) one very luxuruous car, but of course I'm not going to do that.
By the way, last month I did work enough hours so that I can expect a paycheck of 2000 euros, not 1500 euros, in a few weeks. Which means my savings rate will not go in the negative and will probably be something like 25%-30%. And this month, I'm working more hours again, so it should get better.
In March, I made 3729 euros (salary 3627; interest/stock value growth 102 euros) and I spent 1363 euros. So a savings rate of 63%, which is exceptionally good for me, and both due to high income and low expenses.
On April 1st, my net worth was about 36,100 euros. So with a 4% SWR, if I could live on 120 euros per month, I'd be golden
. Still, compared to a few years ago, when my income from interest/stocks was about 0; now getting more than 1000 euros annually "for free" is really cool. And it does feel like it's going somewhere! I could still spend it all on (only) one very luxuruous car, but of course I'm not going to do that.By the way, last month I did work enough hours so that I can expect a paycheck of 2000 euros, not 1500 euros, in a few weeks. Which means my savings rate will not go in the negative and will probably be something like 25%-30%. And this month, I'm working more hours again, so it should get better.
-
CarharttGuy
- Posts: 2
- Joined: Sun Sep 30, 2012 8:40 pm
Hi DutchGirl,
this Dutch calculation site might be of interrest
to you;
http://www.derentenier.nl/calculate.html
Keep doing what you are doing!
this Dutch calculation site might be of interrest
to you;
http://www.derentenier.nl/calculate.html
Keep doing what you are doing!
@CarharttGuy: wow, this was your first message, cool that I was the receiver!
I actually already knew that website, and have been using it to make some calculations! But your post inspired me to look at it again.
I used to use it to calculate my own path towards retirement. But... My boyfriend has been stressing out lately about his chances on the job market. So this time I used it to calculate when one of us can retire. I put all our current assets in there, both of our possible contributions for the next several years, and... One of us could retire in 4 years time. The other then needs a few years more.
Very reassuring, and it shows the power of DINKs
I actually already knew that website, and have been using it to make some calculations! But your post inspired me to look at it again.
I used to use it to calculate my own path towards retirement. But... My boyfriend has been stressing out lately about his chances on the job market. So this time I used it to calculate when one of us can retire. I put all our current assets in there, both of our possible contributions for the next several years, and... One of us could retire in 4 years time. The other then needs a few years more.
Very reassuring, and it shows the power of DINKs
-
borisborisboris
- Posts: 67
- Joined: Sun Aug 08, 2010 4:12 pm
Wow, cool website - wish I had seen something comparable in English before I built my own spreadsheet.
I read through their 'over ons' page, and it made me wonder - what do people think of ERE in NL? I (an American) have family there but would never ask them such a question.
Part of the reason I ask was the recent coverage of DividendGuy et al in the national media here, and the predictably ignorant comments on those articles. But in my experience Dutch people treat money differently than Americans--they are more naturally frugal.
DutchGirl, what has your experience been?
I read through their 'over ons' page, and it made me wonder - what do people think of ERE in NL? I (an American) have family there but would never ask them such a question.
Part of the reason I ask was the recent coverage of DividendGuy et al in the national media here, and the predictably ignorant comments on those articles. But in my experience Dutch people treat money differently than Americans--they are more naturally frugal.
DutchGirl, what has your experience been?
Hi borisborisboris, have you tried firecalc? http://firecalc.com/
We Dutch are famous for our frugality. You have the expressions "going Dutch" and "a Dutch treat". They are charicatures, though! In the last couple of years, the Dutch on average have 1500 euros consumer debt (about $2000). About 2 million people have a credit, from about 17 million in total (includes kids). 700,000 had problems paying their debt.
Most Dutch families have one car, or two. But gas is way more expensive than in the US, luckily distances are much shorter in the Netherlands. Most Dutch people have a bike, too, which is often used for shorter distances. Walking can be an option, too. Fast food is used a little less often, I think, and there are less drive-throughs (I visited Boston and saw three to five fast food chains per highway exit). I think people eat their meals at home more often, and bringing lunch to work (sandwiches, mostly) is seen as normal.
We have a mortgage problem, in that it has been possible for a long time to finance all, or part, of your house with a mortgage that you never had to pay back. All that was required of you, was paying the interest. As long as house prices went up like crazy, that was okay: you would sell your house and the extra money it would sell for was enough to cover your debt. Many people never paid down their mortgage debts, and now that house prices have fallen, many are underwater.
Also, over the last 15 years, insurance companies had offered financial plans based on investing. When they started, the market was going up and up and up. So people were told they could on average make >10% annually. On top of that, premiums often were >5% of whatever people put in. In the recent five years or so, when markets collapsed, these plans also collapsed, and people are often left with less than what they put in. People were greedy. Insurance companies were unethical. I am glad that I never bought one of these products, maybe just because I was too young when they were promoting them.
I don't think many Dutch people are planning on retiring early. About twenty years ago, there were many government-financed plans for people to retire early. After all, many young people didn't have work, so the old people should retire so that the new generation could get work. So many people could retire from age 55 and up with favorable conditions.However, currently there is a pension crisis, and the age at which we'll start receiving benefits will go up from 65 to 67, within a few years. Many, many people are complaining about having to retire later. This also shows, that these people apparently have zero money saved up to retire on their own conditions.
We Dutch are famous for our frugality. You have the expressions "going Dutch" and "a Dutch treat". They are charicatures, though! In the last couple of years, the Dutch on average have 1500 euros consumer debt (about $2000). About 2 million people have a credit, from about 17 million in total (includes kids). 700,000 had problems paying their debt.
Most Dutch families have one car, or two. But gas is way more expensive than in the US, luckily distances are much shorter in the Netherlands. Most Dutch people have a bike, too, which is often used for shorter distances. Walking can be an option, too. Fast food is used a little less often, I think, and there are less drive-throughs (I visited Boston and saw three to five fast food chains per highway exit). I think people eat their meals at home more often, and bringing lunch to work (sandwiches, mostly) is seen as normal.
We have a mortgage problem, in that it has been possible for a long time to finance all, or part, of your house with a mortgage that you never had to pay back. All that was required of you, was paying the interest. As long as house prices went up like crazy, that was okay: you would sell your house and the extra money it would sell for was enough to cover your debt. Many people never paid down their mortgage debts, and now that house prices have fallen, many are underwater.
Also, over the last 15 years, insurance companies had offered financial plans based on investing. When they started, the market was going up and up and up. So people were told they could on average make >10% annually. On top of that, premiums often were >5% of whatever people put in. In the recent five years or so, when markets collapsed, these plans also collapsed, and people are often left with less than what they put in. People were greedy. Insurance companies were unethical. I am glad that I never bought one of these products, maybe just because I was too young when they were promoting them.
I don't think many Dutch people are planning on retiring early. About twenty years ago, there were many government-financed plans for people to retire early. After all, many young people didn't have work, so the old people should retire so that the new generation could get work. So many people could retire from age 55 and up with favorable conditions.However, currently there is a pension crisis, and the age at which we'll start receiving benefits will go up from 65 to 67, within a few years. Many, many people are complaining about having to retire later. This also shows, that these people apparently have zero money saved up to retire on their own conditions.
Income in April: 2135 euros, of which 42 from investments (interest, dividend and increased value of stocks).
Expenses: 1802 euros.
Savings rate around 10-15% of my income, which is quite low.
Expenses included 340 euros on a new Iphone 3GS; which may or may not have been a good idea. My intentions were to be able to stop using my Samsung smartphone which has been a nuisance ever since buying, no, financing it into my payment plan, two years ago, and to be able to pick a sim-only or maybe even pay-as-you-go phone plan starting in July when my current contract ends (and by the way, if I want to end it early, I will still need to pay full contract price for every month I stop early, so no gain there). I'm currently paying 35 euros per month for my plan, and I hope to get to a plan that costs say 10-15 euros per month.
I hope that this iphone will stay functional for at least two years, hopefully even three. Then the costs-per-month will go down to 15-10 euros. While my boyfriend is doubtful because it may soon become impossible to update the software; I hope that the fact that I only use a few apps will save me from needing an update, anyway. (What I use: a public transport app, a keep-track-of-money app; both very useful for a person like me; and I use the internet for amusement). It is a pity that newer and newer phones come out with options I never use, but with prices to match all those options that I'll never use.
I hope my gamble was correct, but we'll see.
I was also accumulating money in my savings account for a bigger emergency fund, but I just can't do it. There's 2000 euros in an emergency account already, and now there were 3500 more euros just sitting there and earning almost no interest. So instead I bought shares from a bonds fund with it; general profit has been between 0 and 6% annually for the last 5 years, average 3.8%, and so if I never need the money, I'll just sell the bonds and probably will have made more profit than in my savings account. Another gamble that I hope works out for me.
(I bought bonds, not stocks, because A it is emergency fund money after all, could be needed sometime soon and B I have made a financial plan of how much bonds and how much stocks I want, and the balance had shifted too much towards stocks, so this was also a rebalancing act).
Next month, my income will be a bit higher again, and my expenses a bit lower (at least that's what I'm aiming and hoping for).
Expenses: 1802 euros.
Savings rate around 10-15% of my income, which is quite low.
Expenses included 340 euros on a new Iphone 3GS; which may or may not have been a good idea. My intentions were to be able to stop using my Samsung smartphone which has been a nuisance ever since buying, no, financing it into my payment plan, two years ago, and to be able to pick a sim-only or maybe even pay-as-you-go phone plan starting in July when my current contract ends (and by the way, if I want to end it early, I will still need to pay full contract price for every month I stop early, so no gain there). I'm currently paying 35 euros per month for my plan, and I hope to get to a plan that costs say 10-15 euros per month.
I hope that this iphone will stay functional for at least two years, hopefully even three. Then the costs-per-month will go down to 15-10 euros. While my boyfriend is doubtful because it may soon become impossible to update the software; I hope that the fact that I only use a few apps will save me from needing an update, anyway. (What I use: a public transport app, a keep-track-of-money app; both very useful for a person like me; and I use the internet for amusement). It is a pity that newer and newer phones come out with options I never use, but with prices to match all those options that I'll never use.
I hope my gamble was correct, but we'll see.
I was also accumulating money in my savings account for a bigger emergency fund, but I just can't do it. There's 2000 euros in an emergency account already, and now there were 3500 more euros just sitting there and earning almost no interest. So instead I bought shares from a bonds fund with it; general profit has been between 0 and 6% annually for the last 5 years, average 3.8%, and so if I never need the money, I'll just sell the bonds and probably will have made more profit than in my savings account. Another gamble that I hope works out for me.
(I bought bonds, not stocks, because A it is emergency fund money after all, could be needed sometime soon and B I have made a financial plan of how much bonds and how much stocks I want, and the balance had shifted too much towards stocks, so this was also a rebalancing act).
Next month, my income will be a bit higher again, and my expenses a bit lower (at least that's what I'm aiming and hoping for).
I also have an iphone 3gs for 3.5 years.
some tips: get yourself a protector ASAP! If it falls, chance is very big that it is gone since the casing is very fragile. I have one with a build in battery which doubles the battery time. I don't use it much, although it is always on, and I have the impression that the battery is not getting bad. So that is good
I have not always been as careful with it.. but the phone is still doing fine. The only thing that went bust is the silver volume button on the side.. it fell off after 2.5 years.
The glass is very good.. I often have it in my pocket with all kinds of junk (e.g. keys) and the damage to the screen is very little.
The software: you can always jailbreak it (I have done that to get rid of mobile operator restrictions). Perhaps the jailbreak will also help you install software otherwise not available.
I'm sure the telephone will survive another 1.5 years.. maybe even longer.
PS: Next time buy a second hand one A lot cheaper.. let someone else deal with the depreciated value first..
some tips: get yourself a protector ASAP! If it falls, chance is very big that it is gone since the casing is very fragile. I have one with a build in battery which doubles the battery time. I don't use it much, although it is always on, and I have the impression that the battery is not getting bad. So that is good
I have not always been as careful with it.. but the phone is still doing fine. The only thing that went bust is the silver volume button on the side.. it fell off after 2.5 years.
The glass is very good.. I often have it in my pocket with all kinds of junk (e.g. keys) and the damage to the screen is very little.
The software: you can always jailbreak it (I have done that to get rid of mobile operator restrictions). Perhaps the jailbreak will also help you install software otherwise not available.
I'm sure the telephone will survive another 1.5 years.. maybe even longer.
PS: Next time buy a second hand one
A lot cheaper.. let someone else deal with the depreciated value first..@bulgaria: I was too afraid to just use ebay. What if I pay 100 euros and the thing immediately falls apart? Well, maybe next time . I did buy a cover for it and am using that.
Fun moment with the boyfriend: I recently told him that I estimate that together we have 175000 euros. Most of it is his. He hates talking about money, so he shrugged it off. Then, four days later or so, he says: "So we have 175k, ey? That's actually pretty cool." I believe it is a comforting idea to him; even when he claims not to care much about money.
. I did buy a cover for it and am using that. Fun moment with the boyfriend: I recently told him that I estimate that together we have 175000 euros. Most of it is his. He hates talking about money, so he shrugged it off. Then, four days later or so, he says: "So we have 175k, ey? That's actually pretty cool." I believe it is a comforting idea to him; even when he claims not to care much about money.
Money's running away from me quickly these days. I sponsored a bike ride against cancer (the money is going to the Dutch Organisation against Cancer, and from my work I know they do a great job paying for good scientific research). From my personal life, there are just too many people I know suffering from cancer, so that was my motivation for this charity over others. I also combined doing volunteer work for them with treating my mum on a weekend away for Mother's Day, costing me some bucks for travel and a place to stay. But to be fair, Mum picked up the tab for our restaurant meal on Saturday evening. And it was great to spend some time together! I see my savings account dwindle though, and I don't like it. Time to stop (discretionary) spending for this month of May.
We are saving on our grocery budget though, because we are dieting. The boyfriend and me both definitely could stand to lose some weight, and after some failed attempts, he found the key to my motivation: money. I'm blushing as I write this, because isn't that a bit low of me? But it is truly working. The deal is, that I pay him 500 euros (being 1/5th of a normal salary for me, equal to an "ouch" amount of money) if he loses xx kilos before July 1st, and that he'll pay me the same amount if I lose yy kilos before July 1st. So if we both reach our goal, no money is lost. If we both fail, ditto (which is a weak point in this system, anyone has a better idea?). The most painful experience for me would be him succeeding and me failing, because then I'll really lose 500 euros. The weight loss-amounts are between doable and hard, certainly not impossible. We started on May 1st, and it's going so well that we're both about 40% of the way (at 1/4th of the time). We're not sabotaging each other, because we know we are both susceptible to it... So far so good!
That's it for now. Salary coming in in about a week, should be about 2500 euros. Next month the salary will be bigger again, because I'm working my butt of this month, in between all national holidays that are happening (Ascencion day etc).
We are saving on our grocery budget though, because we are dieting. The boyfriend and me both definitely could stand to lose some weight, and after some failed attempts, he found the key to my motivation: money. I'm blushing as I write this, because isn't that a bit low of me? But it is truly working. The deal is, that I pay him 500 euros (being 1/5th of a normal salary for me, equal to an "ouch" amount of money) if he loses xx kilos before July 1st, and that he'll pay me the same amount if I lose yy kilos before July 1st. So if we both reach our goal, no money is lost. If we both fail, ditto (which is a weak point in this system, anyone has a better idea?). The most painful experience for me would be him succeeding and me failing, because then I'll really lose 500 euros. The weight loss-amounts are between doable and hard, certainly not impossible. We started on May 1st, and it's going so well that we're both about 40% of the way (at 1/4th of the time). We're not sabotaging each other, because we know we are both susceptible to it... So far so good!
That's it for now. Salary coming in in about a week, should be about 2500 euros. Next month the salary will be bigger again, because I'm working my butt of this month, in between all national holidays that are happening (Ascencion day etc).
Salary was indeed 2500 euros, expenses were 2200 euros, so a very small savings rate this time. But next month should be better, as expenses will be down again (there were some annual bills in May) and income should be way up. When my salary comes in, I'll also hit 40.000 (euros) in savings, for a short while at least, during July it will drop down to 39.x k again, but it will be fun to see the 40k+ for the first time. And onwards to 50k+ of course!
Losing weight is a struggle at the moment. After a very rainy May I have started biking again, which has already saved me some euros in transport costs, but my weight hardly goes down. I'm probably growing muscle (?). Sigh. I'm not a very patient person by nature, but I'll stick with it and hope for a reward in the end.
Losing weight is a struggle at the moment. After a very rainy May I have started biking again, which has already saved me some euros in transport costs, but my weight hardly goes down. I'm probably growing muscle (?). Sigh. I'm not a very patient person by nature, but I'll stick with it and hope for a reward in the end.
@ Dutchgirl. You give a comparably large % of your money to charity. Have you considered putting the money you want to give aside into a trust or separate account, then investing it in a balanced portfolio of stocks, bonds, real estate etc. and letting it compound until you die? Upon your death the charitable donation would be virtually guaranteed to be way more, even with inflation, then it would be by giving it now.
Kiva/microlending is my favourite type of charity because the money is loaned and gives people a hand up rather then a hand out.
I like your journal and in terms of losing weight I am right there with you, its tough but you can do it!
Kiva/microlending is my favourite type of charity because the money is loaned and gives people a hand up rather then a hand out.
I like your journal and in terms of losing weight I am right there with you, its tough but you can do it!
@BlueNote: thanks. . The recent charity expenses are a bit misleading, I think all in all, charities are about 7% of my annual expenses (and thus about 4% of my income). I guess I could wait till age 80+ (I hope to live that long), but I want the world to be a better place, starting now, not when I'm dead.
And oh, by the way, the weight loss finally happened. Didn't lose anything for a whole week, then dropped a whole kilo in one day. Go figure... Since then, it's been an ounce or so every day. This morning I was only 1.3 kilos from my goal for the first of July, I hope that that's manageable in two weeks.
PS. i just got my refund from my taxes. 800 euros, now I'll definitely get past the €40k mark (and the $50k mark) when my salary comes in, a week from now. It will be:
-1000 in checking
-7000 in savings (emergency fund plus saving for expected expenses)
-15000 in CDs (avg interest is 3.8%; unfortunately rates for new CDs have dropped since then)
-17000 in investments
. The recent charity expenses are a bit misleading, I think all in all, charities are about 7% of my annual expenses (and thus about 4% of my income). I guess I could wait till age 80+ (I hope to live that long), but I want the world to be a better place, starting now, not when I'm dead. And oh, by the way, the weight loss finally happened. Didn't lose anything for a whole week, then dropped a whole kilo in one day. Go figure... Since then, it's been an ounce or so every day. This morning I was only 1.3 kilos from my goal for the first of July, I hope that that's manageable in two weeks.
PS. i just got my refund from my taxes. 800 euros, now I'll definitely get past the €40k mark (and the $50k mark) when my salary comes in, a week from now. It will be:
-1000 in checking
-7000 in savings (emergency fund plus saving for expected expenses)
-15000 in CDs (avg interest is 3.8%; unfortunately rates for new CDs have dropped since then)
-17000 in investments
I reached my weight loss goal on Saturday morning. So a week before I had to. Hurray! Now for the next two months, I will try to lose 6 more kilos. (Yeah, I really am overweight, need to lose quite some weight...).
My salary came in today, it was quite high for me (I did work a lot of hours in May), and my total assets are now €40,200, so over €40k. Woot! This amount will go down again, since I need to pay my rent and groceries, but after next month's salary I should stay above €40k and indeed then I'll be on my way to the next big number .
At my work, I'm a bit worried about the hours I'll get from September onwards (July and August are fine). So far, they've booked me for maybe 36 hours in September, which is enough to live on, but not enough to save. Working less hours does give me more time to finish up my PhD, though. After which I might be able to find a better job that pays even more. However, I do like my current job and one option for me was to just continue doing it, also after finishing up the PhD. But of course that doesn't work if they're downsizing too much.
My salary came in today, it was quite high for me (I did work a lot of hours in May), and my total assets are now €40,200, so over €40k. Woot! This amount will go down again, since I need to pay my rent and groceries, but after next month's salary I should stay above €40k and indeed then I'll be on my way to the next big number
.At my work, I'm a bit worried about the hours I'll get from September onwards (July and August are fine). So far, they've booked me for maybe 36 hours in September, which is enough to live on, but not enough to save. Working less hours does give me more time to finish up my PhD, though. After which I might be able to find a better job that pays even more. However, I do like my current job and one option for me was to just continue doing it, also after finishing up the PhD. But of course that doesn't work if they're downsizing too much.
Re: DutchGirl's journal
Damn... I overspent quite a bit these last few months. Making my average, since I started tracking 1.5 years ago, €1772 per month. Most of it is charities (annual gifts) and a new, much-needed, laptop. And the overspending isn't going to end, yet. My mum and dad are going to have their wedding anniversary this month, and we (the three kids) are going to give an expensive gift. Considering I am glad they raised me well, and they paid my full education and I would gladly pay a few hundred bucks every month for them if their retirement money ran short (so far, things are looking okay), I shouldn't be too worried about a one-time €400 gift, but I am, just a bit. I feel a little sick to my stomach about it, since I was hoping this could be one of the cheaper months. The €1200 total is going to buy them a set of table+chairs for the garden, high quality I'm sure but quite expensive. It's an idea from my sister who bought the same set, and I'm not sure whether mum and dad really want it, or just were polite when they said they liked it. I don't know very well what to do. Sometimes fondness is expressed with money in our family, and there was a recent big fight in my boyfriend's family on the same topic; I don't want to cause one in mine . That's not worth it. Still, I had a nice €50-gift in mind, not a €400 one.
How does one change this gift-giving thing from growing bigger and bigger every year (with perhaps gifts that are not quite right) back to a "normal" bunch of flowers or a couple of quality beers?
. That's not worth it. Still, I had a nice €50-gift in mind, not a €400 one.How does one change this gift-giving thing from growing bigger and bigger every year (with perhaps gifts that are not quite right) back to a "normal" bunch of flowers or a couple of quality beers?
Re: DutchGirl's journal
It is very annoying if you are forced to spend money on something because you are supposed to. It feels very uncontrollable.. if you don't give you are considered cheap and there will be a lot of fuss.. if you do give.. you feel steeling from yourself and failing to meet your own expectations.
I'm sometimes in similar circumstances due to my girl her family. Now I'm indirectly paying for the renovation of her moms apartment. Luckily I got all the money back that I lend to another part of her family, so now they lend 1000 euro's and another 1500 of my girl her travel budget is going to her moms apartment. Next year I'm somehow expected to pay to travel with my girl to the middle east (where they are living) and to pay for a 'big' present for her sister who is going to marry. And although I dislike her sister, I would also not give my own family a big gift when they marry. But for me the limit is now completely reached.. she gets the 1500 euro's a year for traveling or whatever she wants to spend it on.. and that is where it ends.
Luckily I managed to explain to her that all money withdrawn from my bank account means less money for our retirement. So instead of paying me back, our pension fund needs to be payed back.
About the gifts... imho the value you provide to your family/friends is not measured based on the prize of the gift. So a part in me says: here you have the finger.. quit forcing me into something. But in the end you will try to not cause a fuss and just go with the flow..
[edit]
Sorry if I sound a bit like a dick, but I needed to release some steam
I'm sometimes in similar circumstances due to my girl her family. Now I'm indirectly paying for the renovation of her moms apartment. Luckily I got all the money back that I lend to another part of her family, so now they lend 1000 euro's and another 1500 of my girl her travel budget is going to her moms apartment. Next year I'm somehow expected to pay to travel with my girl to the middle east (where they are living) and to pay for a 'big' present for her sister who is going to marry. And although I dislike her sister, I would also not give my own family a big gift when they marry. But for me the limit is now completely reached.. she gets the 1500 euro's a year for traveling or whatever she wants to spend it on.. and that is where it ends.
Luckily I managed to explain to her that all money withdrawn from my bank account means less money for our retirement. So instead of paying me back, our pension fund needs to be payed back.
About the gifts... imho the value you provide to your family/friends is not measured based on the prize of the gift. So a part in me says: here you have the finger.. quit forcing me into something. But in the end you will try to not cause a fuss and just go with the flow..
[edit]
Sorry if I sound a bit like a dick, but I needed to release some steam
Re: DutchGirl's journal
It this a special anniversary for your parents, like their 25th? If so, I can see how your sister might want to get them an extra-nice present to celebrate. Like you said, your parents raised you well, paid for your education, etc. That's definitely worth more than the 400 Euro. However, if this is going to be an annual expectation, would you consider discussing the matter with your sister and paring back to flowers or a heartfelt gift?
Fortunately, my side of the family has never been big on gifts. My mother would probably smack me on the side of the head if I spent more than fifty bucks on a present for her. On my husband's side, it started getting a little out of hand because we were giving presents to his mother, two sisters, and three nieces/nephews. This past year, we cut back and sent one family gift (cookie basket) for everyone to enjoy. They probably thought we were stingy, but I really don't see the point of buying tangible goods for people when it's not part of my value system.
Fortunately, my side of the family has never been big on gifts. My mother would probably smack me on the side of the head if I spent more than fifty bucks on a present for her. On my husband's side, it started getting a little out of hand because we were giving presents to his mother, two sisters, and three nieces/nephews. This past year, we cut back and sent one family gift (cookie basket) for everyone to enjoy. They probably thought we were stingy, but I really don't see the point of buying tangible goods for people when it's not part of my value system.
Re: DutchGirl's journal
It's their 39th, but the present is supposed to be for their 40th, only now they can enjoy it earlier. (I'm a bit afraid though that when the 40th comes around next year, we will buy another big present).
I guess my biggest problem is with the sudden rush, there's pressure put on by my sister, she wants to buy now so that my parents can get the exact same set as she has (note: their houses are 140 miles apart, nobody is going to notice if the color of the other set is a bit different). The other thing is that I don't know whether my parents really want this particular set.
I called my brother yesterday but he had visitors over, we'll discuss this today, might be that he has hesitations too. Also from the two of us he is the one with more social skills, which might help.
Meanwhile, I had a few days off last week. Funny how life is so much better when you are working less hours. I seem to be in a bit of a catch-22, where when I work many hours per week I long for less hours and ERE, but if I work less hours progress towards ERE is too slow.
(I worked 16 hours per week at the beginning of the year, spent 1200 and could save 400 per month. I worked 38 hours per week last month, spent 2900 (ouch - also on charity and a laptop, but still) and could save 1600 (still better than only 400).
Also, I'm wondering how much I should tell people about my financial status. It feels like I'm crossing a point where people will start saying "don't be cheap, you have enough money" and later, when I ERE, people might say "don't be cheap with your time, you have enough of it to come help me paint / babysit my kids / take care of our parent etc". Guess I'll have to practice saying no?
I guess my biggest problem is with the sudden rush, there's pressure put on by my sister, she wants to buy now so that my parents can get the exact same set as she has (note: their houses are 140 miles apart, nobody is going to notice if the color of the other set is a bit different). The other thing is that I don't know whether my parents really want this particular set.
I called my brother yesterday but he had visitors over, we'll discuss this today, might be that he has hesitations too. Also from the two of us he is the one with more social skills, which might help.
Meanwhile, I had a few days off last week. Funny how life is so much better when you are working less hours. I seem to be in a bit of a catch-22, where when I work many hours per week I long for less hours and ERE, but if I work less hours progress towards ERE is too slow.
(I worked 16 hours per week at the beginning of the year, spent 1200 and could save 400 per month. I worked 38 hours per week last month, spent 2900 (ouch - also on charity and a laptop, but still) and could save 1600 (still better than only 400).
Also, I'm wondering how much I should tell people about my financial status. It feels like I'm crossing a point where people will start saying "don't be cheap, you have enough money" and later, when I ERE, people might say "don't be cheap with your time, you have enough of it to come help me paint / babysit my kids / take care of our parent etc". Guess I'll have to practice saying no?
Re: DutchGirl's journal
You mean that's what I should say when they want my time?