@chenda Haha yes, I saw it. The next sentence says something about the Finns’ “mystic silence,” which, of course! Their meeting’s entire discussion of every Marxist-Leninist pamphlet was probably just a bunch of barely audible “yoh”s with different inflections.
Deep River has an excellent Finnish communist immigrant character who takes part in America’s labor movement. Really good read.
European History Book Recs
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suomalainen
- Posts: 1273
- Joined: Sat Oct 18, 2014 12:49 pm
Re: European History Book Recs
Hmm. Wonder if there was a mass Finnish migration following the civil war between “reds” and “whites”. Perhaps the “reds”, having lost, emigrated en masse. ~1917. Never really learned Finnish history proper. Just some old stories. Should find a textbook from Finnish high school.
Re: European History Book Recs
The question is if there were any reds or whites in the first place. In Poland, which was partially within Russian Empire back then as well, we had neither of those, as tese were both centred around the idea of Russian imperialism (either old school or disguised as communism), which was obviously the last thing anyone here was interested in (except for the few "loyalist" who built their careers on handling Moscow's business in Polish territory - "compradors" in colonial discourse terms). There was a large socialist movement in Poland, but they absolutely did not identify with the reds.
Re: European History Book Recs
During the Russian civil war/revolution nationalists groups seeking succession from the Russian empire were known as 'the greens'. Finland freeed itself from Russia in 1917, and despite a slightly bizzare history in ww2 of fighting for both sides managed to retain its independence after 1945. Which was unique as all the other ex Russian territories were absorbed back into the USSR in 1945.
@Biscuits - Thanks for the recommendation. Another good book is Themes in modern European History, 1890-1945 edited by Paul Hayes.
@Biscuits - Thanks for the recommendation. Another good book is Themes in modern European History, 1890-1945 edited by Paul Hayes.
Re: European History Book Recs
Except for Poland, which was remained a separate state, however now 100% controlled from Moscow when it came to strategic decisions (type of economy, military alliances etc.).
Re: European History Book Recs
True, nominally independent unlike say the Baltics or Kazakhstan which were actually part of the USSR. I think Hungary and several other eastern European nations had a similar status to Poland.
Re: European History Book Recs
Yes, but they were never parts of Russian Empire or Soviet Russia before (unless I'm missing some country) - the "southern" countries (Czechs, Slovakia, Romania, Hungary) were all part of Austro-Hungarian Empire before 1918. Poland, Finland and the Baltics are the countries in the neighborhood which freed themselves from Russia post-1917, although in Baltics's case it was only until 1939 (after which they became "reintegrated" into USSR), and Poland became a Soviet satellite state post 1945.
Re: European History Book Recs
Yes thats true too. Yugoslavia was a curiosity as it was communist but independent of the Soviet block, and a favoured tourist destination for westerners until the 1990s. Iirc Austria was split between East and West a la Germany until the 1950s when it became a neutral unoccupied state.
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Biscuits and Gravy
- Posts: 405
- Joined: Thu Aug 06, 2020 1:38 pm
Re: European History Book Recs
I’m about 200 pages into Volume I of The Story of Civilization by Will Durant and it is a very entertaining read. The first volume was published in 1935, and the modern reader may be put off by the casual racism and misogyny.
“The differences in strength which now divide the sexes hardly existed in those days [precivilization], and are now environmental rather than innate: woman, apart from her biological disabilities, was almost the equal of man in stature, endurance, resourcefulness and courage; she was not yet an ornament, a thing of beauty, or a sexual toy; she was a robust animal, able to perform arduous work for long hours…”
“Bracelets, necklaces, anklets, finger-rings and ear-rings made the women of Sumeria, as recently in America, show-windows of their husbands’ prosperity.”
Durant is an atheist and pulls no punches when it comes to religion. To wit:
“Hence the state, in order to maintain itself, used and forged many instruments of indoctrination—the family, the church, the school—to build in the soul of the citizen a habit of patriotic loyalty and pride.
…
Morals, then, are soon endowed with religious sanctions, because mystery and supernaturalism lend a weight which can never attach to things empirically known and genetically understood; men are more easily ruled by imagination than science.
…
[R]eligion arises not out of sacerdotal invention or chicanery, but out of the persistent wonder, fear, insecurity, hopefulness and loneliness of man. The priest […] consoled the weak in their inevitable exploitation by the strong.
…
King Ur-engur proclaimed his code of laws in the name of the great god Shamesh, for government had so soon discovered the political utility of heaven…. [M]en will pay any price for mythology.”
…
“In part such [pessimistic and skeptical] literature represents one of those interludes, like our own moral interregnum, in which thought has for a time overcome belief, and men no longer know how or why they should live. Such periods do not endure; hope soon wins the victory over thought; the intellect is put down to its customary menial place, and religion is born again, giving to men the imaginative stimulus apparently indispensable to life and work. We need not suppose that such poems expressed the view of any large number of Egyptians; behind and around the small but vital minority that pondered the problems of life and death in secular and naturalistic terms were millions of simple men and women who remained faithful to the gods, and never doubted that right would triumph, that every earthly pain and grief would be atoned for bountifully in a haven of happiness and peace.”
To ERE: “Everywhere man is born in chains: the chains of heredity, of environment, of custom, and of law.”
To America’s current situation:
“At every step the history of civilization teaches us how slight and superficial a structure civilization is, and how precariously it is poised upon the apex of a never-extinct volcano of poor and oppressed barbarism, superstition and ignorance.”
“The differences in strength which now divide the sexes hardly existed in those days [precivilization], and are now environmental rather than innate: woman, apart from her biological disabilities, was almost the equal of man in stature, endurance, resourcefulness and courage; she was not yet an ornament, a thing of beauty, or a sexual toy; she was a robust animal, able to perform arduous work for long hours…”
“Bracelets, necklaces, anklets, finger-rings and ear-rings made the women of Sumeria, as recently in America, show-windows of their husbands’ prosperity.”
Durant is an atheist and pulls no punches when it comes to religion. To wit:
“Hence the state, in order to maintain itself, used and forged many instruments of indoctrination—the family, the church, the school—to build in the soul of the citizen a habit of patriotic loyalty and pride.
…
Morals, then, are soon endowed with religious sanctions, because mystery and supernaturalism lend a weight which can never attach to things empirically known and genetically understood; men are more easily ruled by imagination than science.
…
[R]eligion arises not out of sacerdotal invention or chicanery, but out of the persistent wonder, fear, insecurity, hopefulness and loneliness of man. The priest […] consoled the weak in their inevitable exploitation by the strong.
…
King Ur-engur proclaimed his code of laws in the name of the great god Shamesh, for government had so soon discovered the political utility of heaven…. [M]en will pay any price for mythology.”
…
“In part such [pessimistic and skeptical] literature represents one of those interludes, like our own moral interregnum, in which thought has for a time overcome belief, and men no longer know how or why they should live. Such periods do not endure; hope soon wins the victory over thought; the intellect is put down to its customary menial place, and religion is born again, giving to men the imaginative stimulus apparently indispensable to life and work. We need not suppose that such poems expressed the view of any large number of Egyptians; behind and around the small but vital minority that pondered the problems of life and death in secular and naturalistic terms were millions of simple men and women who remained faithful to the gods, and never doubted that right would triumph, that every earthly pain and grief would be atoned for bountifully in a haven of happiness and peace.”
To ERE: “Everywhere man is born in chains: the chains of heredity, of environment, of custom, and of law.”
To America’s current situation:
“At every step the history of civilization teaches us how slight and superficial a structure civilization is, and how precariously it is poised upon the apex of a never-extinct volcano of poor and oppressed barbarism, superstition and ignorance.”