Exercise/Fitness Log

[jennypenny]

Progress has slowed. I have until 8/6 to show significant progress or I have to have another surgery. So July will be focused on diet, exercise, and some meditation (because the thought of more surgery turning the recovery clock back to day 1 is making me batshit).

Note to non-yoga people: All of my therapy -- elbow/arm, ankle, and post-concussion cognitive therapy -- includes balance and flexibility exercises. In the beginning it's the main focus so you can perform tasks without risk of another injury. I'm a convert. I still hate yoga, but it's too important to ignore. I can see that yoga and pilates will be at the core of my fitness going forward. Those, plus walking and lifting, are probably all you need for a long health span.

[J_]

Wish you the best jennypenny

I can see that yoga and pilates will be at the core of my fitness going forward. Those, plus walking and lifting, are probably all you need for a long health span.

For me that works too, for many years already.
For fun, endurance and social contacts I have added skiff rowing and cc skiing. Both sports are gentle to my body.

[AxelHeyst]

Murph Progress:

| 2024.05.28 | DNF | Unweighted, 12 rounds. Started failing pushups. |
| 2024.06.06 | 58:10 | Unweighted, |
| 2024.06.12 | 49:26 | Unweighted, felt like meatball, tight calves, etc. |
| 2024.06.20 | 46:06 | Unweighted, pullups limiting factor now |
| 2026.06.26 | 42:34 | unweighted, morning, first thing. |
| 2026.07.03 | 41:39 | unweighted, morning, first thing. |
| 2026.07.09 | DNF | unweighted, 1mi, 10 Cindys, 1/2mi, done. |

Update on the Murph Project: I've been happy with rapidly dropping times but I also know it's noob gains and the goal (<40min weighted murph time) is a long ways off. I've never specifically trained or studied metabolic conditioning or cardio specificially, so this is uncharted territory for me. Additionally, I've been feeling run down for almost two weeks now, and started feeling some throat stuff which is why I bailed on today's Murph halfway through. I really don't want to get bronchitis or something right now, and I think I might be doing too much high intensity training.

I'm reading Training for the Uphill Athlete (TUHA) and *wow* is that a great book. The main takeaway is how much volume of low-intensity work you need to do to build endurance capacity, and how important increasing your aerobic threshold is. Now, TUHA is specifically for long duration endurance athletes, but I'm guessing it's not totally inapplicable to what I'm trying to do. Considering that I've never trained for endurance I'm guessing my aerobic threshold is very low, but I'll be doing the tests to try to quantify that soon.

It seems clear that my current program is not setting me up for long-term success.
M: high intensity strength wo
T: 30min zone 3/4 ruck or hill sprints
W: murph
R: 30min zone 3/4 ruck or hill sprints
F: high intensity strength wo

Literally zero training volume below zone 3, and low overall volume. The murph is my longest training duration day, and it's Z4 finishing with a Z5 push at the end.

I need to read/study more to figure out a better approach for what I'm specifically trying to do, e.g. I'm not training for ultradistance, but I am immediately going to swap my T/R training days with Zone 1/2 sessions of >=1hr and schedule zone 1/2 sessions on weekends. I'm also going to look into my strength workouts. Besides cardio conditioning, pullup strength is my greatest barrier to a decent weighted murph time so I'll be focusing on that.

I really like the idea of continuing a murph a week, but it's possible the smartest training move for my current state of conditioning is to cut that down to 1/2wks or 1/mo and focus on base conditioning, now that I have a better sense of where I'm at. More study required.

[Bicycle7]

@AH: I bet bikepacking builds good cardiovascular base fitness, pedaling at low average intensity all day

The best long distance runners put in crazy amounts of volume year after year. Professional 5k and 10k runners average 100 miles/week or more of running.

That's great progress on the Murphs and I agree that at this point 1 or 2 per month will be more effective. The once per week would maybe be more motivating for me to keep improving, but is a lot of intensity week in and out.

I'm interested to hear more about what you learn on cardiovascular training!

[theanimal]

It seems clear that my current program is not setting me up for long-term success.
M: high intensity strength wo
T: 30min zone 3/4 ruck or hill sprints
W: murph
R: 30min zone 3/4 ruck or hill sprints
F: high intensity strength wo

Are you using a heart rate monitor to figure out what zone you are in or are you guessing? Hill sprints sounds more like zone 5 to me. And I'd be surprised if you were hitting zone 3 rucking unless you're going straight up one of those hills.

If you haven't already read it, "Outlive" by Peter Attia viewtopic.php?t=12778 speaks to a similar regimen ie. as much zone 2 as possible each week with some zone 5 thrown into the mix. Rucking, biking, jogging, and hiking in the mountains (among others) are all great ways to do zone 2 work. The challenge with zone 2 can be that you're best off doing as much as possible, but it's low intensity and can be kind of boring.

[AxelHeyst]

I'm guessing at the zones based on perceived effort, but I will either be getting a hr monitor or start taking spot checks and building hr intuition (thanks @mooretrees for the advice on that). My T/R workouts are over variable, rough terrain, so over the 30min or so I'm moving back and forth between Zone 2 and Zone 5, with most time in 3 and 4. I think. I'll fast ruck on my driveway, then ruck up the well tank hill (sometimes carrying my hi-lift or a rock), or do a 2-3mi run with well-tank-hill sprints every half mile, or do my 1.5-2mile loop which is half flattish terrain and half long steep hill, etc.

I also suspect what *should* be Zone 2 work for someone in better metabolic condition is actually Zone 3 for me because my AeT is low.

As it's been dawning on me that I ought to be doing more volume of lower intensity work for a variety of reasons, my initial reaction was "ugh I don't have time for that." But then I remembered that I tend to have ideas for writing, projects, and life decisions while doing low intensity boring physical activity, and can also listen to more podcasts and books and etc, so I'm actually looking forward to it now.

[mathiverse]

One thing you could look into is adding scheduled deload weeks. IIRC, Training for the Uphill Athlete also talks about deloads. Maybe your frequency is sustainable if you schedule in deload weeks rather than waiting until you feel run down.

[Scott 2]

I'm about as far from naturally athletic as one can get.

When I was focused on v02 max, accumulating zone 2 time emerged as dramatically superior. Plodding along got me a score over 50, with nearly linear gains and the highest work capacity of my life. Anything hard offered a temporary peak at best. High intensity just made me better at trying.

Having previously punished myself with sled work, circuits, hard rows, etc. - it was honestly aggravating how much better taking things easy worked. I'm not an intense person by nature, so that could have been a factor too.

I also looked about the least impressive I ever have. The hours of low intensity drained my strength and aggression. My testosterone was even suppressed below normal. It's a common response to lots of endurance work.

When my focus drifted, the adaptations did not prove durable. Over roughly 6 months, as my activity changed, my fitness did as well. Similar to strength training, if you want to keep your gains, the stimulus has to remain sustainable.

For me, 4-5 hours a week of zone 2, was not. My joints couldn't handle that much of the fun stuff, and constant cross training on exercise machines got old.

[mountainFrugal]

One thing you could look into is adding scheduled deload weeks.

Integration weeks are crucial to not over-training. It is really easy to over train in the beginning. Your deep sleep also may be affected with how hot it is outside at night during this heatwave. Trust the process and the endurance research outlined in TFUA. The training compounds over months and years. Do you want to be faster right away (HIIT et al.) or do you want to be able to run at 80-85% at elevation for hours?

"The key to having a big motor is a lot of Zone 1". -Paraphrasing from TFUA

Endurance training is about how much load you can absorb. The integral under the curve of long Zone 1 sessions is greater when stacked on top of one another day after day, week after week because you can recover from them. You are building a training pyramid.

[AxelHeyst]

I'm definitely feel like I could use an extra hour+ of sleep a night. The nights are cool enough (60's), but a) I've never been a great sleeper and b) for the past week the local pack of coyotes have been serenading me 3-4x/night. I'm going to prioritize strategies for better sleep though, there have got to be low hanging fruit.

I totally buy the premise of compounding over very long time with focus on Z1, aka Capacity Training rather than Utilization Training. I just need to figure out the execution - where I'm currently at, what too much looks like, building intuition for what Zone I'm actually in, etc.

[mountainFrugal]

As it's been dawning on me that I ought to be doing more volume of lower intensity work for a variety of reasons, my initial reaction was "ugh I don't have time for that." But then I remembered that I tend to have ideas for writing, projects, and life decisions while doing low intensity boring physical activity, and can also listen to more podcasts and books and etc, so I'm actually looking forward to it now.

I missed this on my first read. This is where I get so much thinking done even if I am not actively thinking.

[AxelHeyst]

Did my first Murph in two months: back on the DNF train. Did 1 mile, 10 Cindy's, 1 mile. Lacked the strength endurance to crank out a full 20 cindys. While I was in Alaska I did a 3x/wk strength routine, but it was definitely at a 'maintenance/prevention of serious loss' level of intensity so I'm not surprised my murph performance took a big hit. I also just spent 10 days just sitting on a bike. I suspect I'll recover ground quickly with a few weeks of consistency, though.

Based on the reading I mentioned and some other WoG shuffling, I'm working on habituating a routine which looks like:
-yoga first thing 5x/wk
-strength workout 3x/week, one of which is a Murph or equivalent.
-Zone 2 work 5+ days/wk, 30-60min with longer sessions on weekends (day hikes, rides, etc). Aiming for 5-10hrs/week.

[AxelHeyst]

The Murph Diaries
I did another Murph attempt on 9/19, a week after the last, and also DNFd at 11 Cindys. This one didn't surprise me so much because I'd slept very poorly for the previous week+ due to fest. I decided to do a Murph every other week, and on the bye weeks sub in a strength training day specifically designed for increasing Murph performance.

So on 9/25 I did a weighted pullup and core workout, for example.

Today I was well rested and hoped to get a full Murph. I got 3/4 of one. On the bright side, my pullups did feel stronger. The pushups were strangely hard, compared to when I was doing full Murphs before my AK trip.

I'm surprised that it's taking me so long to get back to the shape I was in in August. I wonder if I'm doing something wrong, or what I'm doing wrong is just called "being almost 40". I wasn't sedentary in AK, I continued my workouts, but I was somewhat phoning them in. And then 20days on a bike cumulative was not great for conditioning. It just felt like when I first started the Murphs I progressed rapidly, and now I'm taking way longer to recover to my previous PRs. I don't fully understand it.

[brainstorm]

Murphs sound really tough! Even partial ones. I'd like to do one, but after I get some more running under my belt I'm not the runner I once was

Today I was well rested and hoped to get a full Murph. I got 3/4 of one. On the bright side, my pullups did feel stronger. The pushups were strangely hard, compared to when I was doing full Murphs before my AK trip.

I'm surprised that it's taking me so long to get back to the shape I was in in August. I wonder if I'm doing something wrong, or what I'm doing wrong is just called "being almost 40". I wasn't sedentary in AK, I continued my workouts, but I was somewhat phoning them in. And then 20days on a bike cumulative was not great for conditioning. It just felt like when I first started the Murphs I progressed rapidly, and now I'm taking way longer to recover to my previous PRs. I don't fully understand it.

How's your diet been lately? When I'm feeling really low-energy, beat up, etc, it's usually because I'm not getting enough cals (or maybe not doing my stretches)

[AxelHeyst]

How's your diet been lately? When I'm feeling really low-energy, beat up, etc, it's usually because I'm not getting enough cals (or maybe not doing my stretches)

I think my diet's been all right. I've actually been feeling quit high energy for the past week plus, generally, both mentally and physically. Also for the past two plus weeks now I've been doing yoga 5x/wk (I'm currently building up to a full ashtanga sequence) so my mobility etc ought to be better than it was prior.

I may have just underrated how good of conditioning I was in prior to AK (also having just done 22 days bikepacking trip and then kept up conditioning after that probably had me in a better place from a cardio perspective), and how quick it is to lose it when not staying on top of that kind of training. I'm not actually certain if it's strength or conditioning that I'm struggling to recover which is causing the long buildup of Murph performance. That's the beauty of the Murph, you have to be strong *and* well conditioned to pull it off.

Murphs sound really tough! Even partial ones. I'd like to do one, but after I get some more running under my belt I'm not the runner I once was

Just run what you can and fast-walk the rest. Life is short, Murph more.

[brainstorm]

I'm sure the monster cardio base helped/helps a lot! (The only reason I'd wish for a long bike commute – tons of "free" zone 2 training). Sounds like you have your ducks in a row.

Just run what you can and fast-walk the rest. Life is short, Murph more.

Fair enough haha I will report here after completion o7