No grid challenge

[jacob]

https://arstechnica.com/science/2023/01 ... manhattan/

... by reducing consumption and using a small PV+battery combo ala lowtech magazine's setup.

Seems to have the same [mental] effect as a "buy nothing"-challenge. I like the framework of a cultural change rather than the framework of sacrifice because that is what it will eventually result in.

A no electricity challenge would be more interesting [to me].

PS: The author has a phd in astrophysics, has a podcast and is into sustainability, kettlebells, and personal challenges. Otherwise no relation.
PPS: That's the third astrophysicists that I know of who have made material life changes to live sustainably. The other one is Peter Kalmus.

[unemployable]

"Let me post to the internet about how off-the-grid I am!"

And he still used electricity and stuff, just not at home. For several years I drank coffee only when it was free at work. I didn't need it when I wasn't going into my job and had to be awake on someone else's schedule. So did I "give up coffee"?

I haven't flown since 2016 either, to my dad's funeral; I was previously a 1K on United for 10 years. Where's my medal?

[Ego]

That was a great artcle!

Attitude was more important than technology, though. Attitude made my setup doable.

And the Lincoln quote

Nothing is more damaging to you than to do something that you believe is wrong.

[ducknald_don]

And he still used electricity and stuff, just not at home.

Christ this stuff is like a fundamentalist religion to some people. It doesn't have to be perfect to be valuable.

[unemployable]

Christ this stuff is like a fundamentalist religion to some people.

So much for assuming the level of intellect on this forum meant questioning assumptions didn't automatically lead to ad-hominem attacks. (I can throw one at @Ego if he wants.)

It doesn't have to be perfect to be valuable.

I didn't say it wasn't, so nice strawman argument too. He figured out a way to get his own solar setup in NYC, so that's cool, and I would have far less of an objection if that were the focus. But I see the larger exercise and reportage as mostly self-serving. I presume he was still on the water, sewage and trash "grids", otherwise I'd like to know what he did with his shit (no, wait, I don't). He was certainly still on the police and fire protection grids, the mask-mandate grid and so on. He was buying stuff, earning money and paying taxes on all of it.

The people who are more "off-grid" in NYC are the ones I read about who live in $200 rent-controlled apartments that are like 100 sqft and have furnishing that haven't been touched since the 20s. Here's one example but I've read about better ones, where they live in relative squalor for effectively free.

[sky]

I am impressed that he was able to cook using only electricity from solar panels. I have lived for months in my camper van with a 200W solar system, but I used propane for cooking and refrigeration. 200W covered lighting, data, vent fan and occasional use of the RV furnace. My system also charged from the alternator when the motor was running, so its not a fair comparison.

His needs for electricity were cooking, light and data. I assume his building heat either came from a central heating system or heat passed through the walls from other apartments.

As an experiment, I tried to power my phone with a 15W solar panel and a 10,000 mWh battery. At that time I watched a lot of video on the phone, and used too much power for the solar panel to keep up in cloudy weather. Without the video screentime, I probably could limit my data needs to what a 15W solar system can provide.

[Lemur]

Reminds me of the Hong Kong units but those aren't romanticized.

But I love these challenges for there paradigm shifting possibilities. When I lived in Guam, I tried a no AC challenge and lowered my electric bill to under $70. $50 or so was fixed expenses from the grid and fees so effectively I paid around $20 a month for electricity. That was unheard of in a place like Guam. Or when I tried a no meat eating challenge (Veganism) for a month. Or when I tried the no-buy year - I failed this but I am left with this permanent scar that makes it really hard to justify purchases outside of base needs...

Ultimately I failed to be perfect in all the challenges ... but this is not the enemy of good. All challenges led me to lasting changes. Now I'm much more careful of energy usage and I only really eat meat now when it is served to me (I don't go out buying it or cooking it).

Agree - the framing is important. Best to speak of what one has to gain and not what they've to lose. Digital minimalism is the challenge I've been doing lately though my activity on this forum is up.

[theanimal]

Cool!

I too would be curious to read more details about his cooking setup. He says he uses a pressure cooker and with his qualifiers I am presuming it is an electric model?

I have friends who lived without electricity for 5 years at their cabin outside Fairbanks. They ultimately decided to hook back up to the grid because they wanted to start hunting and needed chest freezers to preserve the meat.

Going without refrigeration with access to a freezer is easy. I have to imagine going without a freezer less so. Of course there are alternative preservation methods like canning, fermenting, drying, salting etc.

[candide]

"Let me post to the internet about how off-the-grid I am!"

The project is only about the electricity grid, and in the process of doing this he seemed to gauge better how much energy different internet activities used, so for example doing less video when he didn't have the power.

I also want to (re)draw attention to this from the article:

The Wright brothers didn’t need to make a 747 or a global network of airports to show that controlled powered flight had potential. Showing success once created the mindset shift that led to a process of continual improvement among innovators, who did the rest. So who knows? Perhaps my story will inspire a few innovators (maybe even you!).

In addition to the obvious benefits that reduced power consumption brings, there’s also the issue of grid resilience. If everyone could stand a few days without grid power, we could build grids that aren't made for 99.9 percent uptime but for 95 percent or lower uptime (with dedicated power for essential services like hospitals, police, and subways). At some level of local resilience, we could power cities exclusively with solar and wind despite their intermittency, with much lower battery needs.

I would imagine that it is much easier to make systems that only have to work 95% of the than the 99.9 with as many extra zeroes as can be done expected.

[white belt]

Just realized this thread exists but it doesn't mention Spodek by name so it didn't show up in search results. I originally posted this in a new thread:

I searched the forums and didn't see any mention of Josh Spodek. He is a former astrophysicist (remind you of anyone?) who is now an executive coach. I just learned about him from this AP article about him living in Manhattan without a fridge and running everything off solar power: https://apnews.com/article/refrigerator ... 08dcfb5731

He has an extensive blog and a TEDX talk as well: https://joshuaspodek.com/

From his bio:

My mission is to help change American (and global) culture on sustainability and stewardship from expecting deprivation, sacrifice, burden, and chore to expecting rewarding emotions and lifestyles, as I see happen with everyone I lead to act for their intrinsic motivations.

It seems to me that he is working to package sustainability in a way that appeals to the high-powered type A business executive type. He focuses a lot on the impact that personal change can have on systemic change.

[white belt]

Everyone loves travel. I love travel. So doesn't not traveling worsen my life?

The opposite of not traveling isn't sitting a room staring at the wall. In my case it's community. It's discovering local food. It's finding joy and reward inside instead of out there.

It's recognizing that billions of people who never flew were perfectly able to create happiness for themselves without flying and I can too.

It's enabling. It reduces your dependency on others. It leads you to learn about yourself and learn that you can find as much about yourself and your community that you can in the Musee D'Orsay or jungles of Costa Rica.

It's about finding diversity in your neighbors. Someone twenty years older or younger than you may have lived as differently from you as anyone from any other culture.

I learned to summarize the mainstream dependence on travel based on self-reinforced denial and irresponsibility in a few words:

Everybody cares about the environment until they want to see the Eiffel Tower.

Source: https://www.inc.com/joshua-spodek/365-d ... lying.html

That was an article written after his first year of no flying. I believe he hasn't flown in 8 years or so.

[7Wannabe5]

It's about finding diversity in your neighbors. Someone twenty years older or younger than you may have lived as differently from you as anyone from any other culture.

This. Especially if you also expand the definition of neighbors to include "creatures that live in your compost pile" and "author of the book you picked at random from the library or free box" and "the people who lived in your region 100 or 500 years ago."

[chenda]

It's an unfortunate truth that more air miles will equate to more Bangladeshi children drowning. On the other hand, Michael O'Leary off of Ryanair probably deserves the Charlemagne award for helping to unify Europe. We can do without cars or off season produce. But the world I think would be a more provincial, isolationist place without the ability go around it in 24hrs. Lets hope we can do it soon with hydrogen fuelled aircraft or something.

[ZAFCorrection]

This is a really interesting idea. Worst case, it would make you more resilient in the face of natural disasters hitting the power. Best case, it seems if enough people did it, grid design and expectations might change.