Everyday noise tolerance

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Scott 2
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Re: Everyday noise tolerance

Post by Scott 2 »

I never bother to confront a noisy person. Their most likely response is to get even louder. At best, they'll give a token agreement, then resume making the noise a short period later. Some people are just noisy. Trying to change them is a waste of time.

7Wannabe5
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Re: Everyday noise tolerance

Post by 7Wannabe5 »

It’s not that I am noisy. My default posture is slumped with my nose in a book. I’m very good at tuning out externalities until the other person in the room directly seeks validation for their own level of annoyance by asking me “Can you hear that?” and then proceeds to bang on the ceiling with a broom.

theanimal
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Re: Everyday noise tolerance

Post by theanimal »

I think this subject also underscores the importance of developing community . Talk to your neighbors! Someone you know and interact with is going to have a much more favorable response to any requests you might make. The relationship can also serve to reduce noise in advance as it can establish more of a sense of care. Nonviolent communication helps as well, One of my neighbors is a builder so he frequently uses a mill, chainsaws and heavy machinery. He hired another neighbor for some help earlier this summer and in June they decided to start working each day with chainsaws at 6:45 AM. Not ideal normally, even less so with a pregnant wife. I only had to send a text asking if they could hold off until at least 8 am going forward and problem solved. I think it could have been a lot different if I had only minimal interaction with them or this was the first occurrence.

Myakka
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Re: Everyday noise tolerance

Post by Myakka »

I'm probably as sensitive to noise as you are, except in those moments when I manage to make myself so focused on the task at hand that the rest of the world completely fades out for me. My understanding is that this is a form of "One pointed meditation" and that it is something that people out there teach -- even though that is not how I've gotten there.

zbigi
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Re: Everyday noise tolerance

Post by zbigi »

Scott 2 wrote:
Sun Aug 14, 2022 9:52 am
I never bother to confront a noisy person. Their most likely response is to get even louder. At best, they'll give a token agreement, then resume making the noise a short period later. Some people are just noisy. Trying to change them is a waste of time.
My experience so far has been suprisingly positive. The lady downstairs seemed to get the message and no longer lets her neurotic dog on the balcony, at least so far (knock on wood). On another occasion, another one of neighbors was playing music incredibly loudly from time to time and, when confronted, said to me that it's her right and the police won't do anything to her because she works at the police. Well, I called the cops anyway and she's been quiet since.

zbigi
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Re: Everyday noise tolerance

Post by zbigi »

Myakka wrote:
Sun Aug 14, 2022 1:24 pm
I'm probably as sensitive to noise as you are, except in those moments when I manage to make myself so focused on the task at hand that the rest of the world completely fades out for me. My understanding is that this is a form of "One pointed meditation" and that it is something that people out there teach -- even though that is not how I've gotten there.
Interesting... My experience is that, when I working on something hard and/or unpleasant (like some of my everyday coding tasks), I need perfect conditions or I get irritated and distracted easily. Whereas, I've meditated a bit in the past, and found meditation way easier and less demanding. I think I could easily meditate with dogs barking around me.

zbigi
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Re: Everyday noise tolerance

Post by zbigi »

theanimal wrote:
Sun Aug 14, 2022 11:14 am
I think this subject also underscores the importance of developing community . Talk to your neighbors!
I do that. Unfortunately, the nice neighbors who I regularly talk to never cause any troubles :) It's the borderline sociopaths or otherwise somewhat troubled people, who are hard to talk to, and who will be problematic.

The better solution would be to live in a bulding with least amount of flats possible and/or one for more affluent people (I think they cause much less problems on average).

zbigi
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Re: Everyday noise tolerance

Post by zbigi »

guitarplayer wrote:
Sun Aug 14, 2022 6:26 am
I tend to avoid noise too (e.g. choosing quiet space on trains etc), but noise comes in different forms.

Being in the nature can be loud; between April and May when I am on the phone with the window open, people I speak with sometimes complain about birds being too loud. They normally start about 4am and can wake you up. Or imagine living in Bialowieza when the stags and deer are mating in the Autumn time. I would probably count barking dog into the 'natural noise' group.
I'm thinking the bird noises can be dealt with via high-grade windows (triple-glazed, great for savings on heat/AC as well) closed when necessary, plus mechanical ventilation to exchange the air.
Dan Price is quite something, but he has a whole different lifestyle, I don't think you'd be able to keep your job going down his alley @zbigi. You could start drawing though like he does :)
Yeah, I don't wish to replicate his lifestyle. My ideal setup would be probably a house at the edge of some village (so that there's paved road to it), surrounded by forests (so that there are no farming equipment noises). I actually know two people who have houses like that, and they're completely peaceful and blissful places. However, in both cases the 4G Internet is spotty at best.

Re: drawing, I've actually been learning to draw (very sporadically) for the past 10 years or so. My main motivation was to get good enough so that I can make artwork for solo gamedev. I've poured maybe 500 hours total into it so far. Unfortunately, I grinding the fundamental exercises rather boring (as most people do I guess), but I think I got enough skill and understanding to illustrate my own game if I will ever set out to make one.

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Ego
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Re: Everyday noise tolerance

Post by Ego »

Scott 2 wrote:
Sun Aug 14, 2022 9:42 am
However, my personal experience has been there's an adaptive limit. It erodes without constant exposure. Even with adaptation, some overhead on one's arousal curve and daily stress tolerance persists.
I agree that there is a limit to the amount we can adapt. I also believe (and there is evidence to support) that our stress-tolerance is very flexible and the degree of flexibility is determined, at least in part, by our mindset about stress.

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/23437923/
Abstract
This article describes 3 studies that explore the role of mindsets in the context of stress. In Study 1, we present data supporting the reliability and validity of an 8-item instrument, the Stress Mindset Measure (SMM), designed to assess the extent to which an individual believes that the effects of stress are either enhancing or debilitating. In Study 2, we demonstrate that stress mindsets can be altered by watching short, multimedia film clips presenting factual information biased toward defining the nature of stress in 1 of 2 ways (stress-is-enhancing vs. stress-is-debilitating). In Study 3, we demonstrate the effect of stress mindset on physiological and behavioral outcomes, showing that a stress-is-enhancing mindset is associated with moderate cortisol reactivity and high desire for feedback under stress. Together, these 3 studies suggest that stress mindset is a distinct and meaningful variable in determining the stress response.

zbigi
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Re: Everyday noise tolerance

Post by zbigi »

Ego wrote:
Sun Aug 14, 2022 4:20 pm
I agree that there is a limit to the amount we can adapt. I also believe (and there is evidence to support) that our stress-tolerance is very flexible and the degree of flexibility is determined, at least in part, by our mindset about stress.

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/23437923/
That's interesting, I hope someone goes deeper into the subject. There are clearly various kind of stresses - stress while striving towards a goal vs stress while trying to merely keeping the status quo, and stress with a time limit vs stress that will never end. I could see that the stress while someone is e.g. trying to push their PhD thesis through the finish line is completely different that the stress of living with a serious, incurable chronic disease.

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jennypenny
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Re: Everyday noise tolerance

Post by jennypenny »

zbigi wrote:
Mon Aug 15, 2022 2:33 am
I could see that the stress while someone is e.g. trying to push their PhD thesis through the finish line is completely different that the stress of living with a serious, incurable chronic disease.
Not really. How we choose to view stressors is key. There's a lot of research on people with chronic health issues that shows that it's all about mindset.

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Ego
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Re: Everyday noise tolerance

Post by Ego »

Agree with @JP. See the work of Jon Kabat-Zinn or the derivatives of Viktor Frankl.

zbigi
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Re: Everyday noise tolerance

Post by zbigi »

jennypenny wrote:
Mon Aug 15, 2022 8:57 am
Not really. How we choose to view stressors is key. There's a lot of research on people with chronic health issues that shows that it's all about mindset.
In general, this can be viewed via one of two opposing perspectives. One is - most people get crushed under too many setbacks, but it's all about mindset, they just didn't try hard enough, I can be in the minority which perserveres. The other is - most people end up crushed, I'm probably not exceptional so most likely I will get crushed too.
I think the second outlook is the one behind ERE - i.e. ERE does not encourage people to become unlikely outliers (e.g. try to be the in the minority of people who love what they do at their jobs and hence don't want to retire), but to accept the statistical realities and make life plans with them in mind.

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jennypenny
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Re: Everyday noise tolerance

Post by jennypenny »

I wouldn't frame it that way. I'm not even sure if there are only two perspectives. If I had to reduce it to two, I'd say they are fragile and anti-fragile. Using your descriptions, fragile would be people who rage at things that don't go their way and things they can't control (which, if you're determined to keep score, is most things), and anti-fragile would be people who can thrive regardless of their situation and find meaning in acceptance. If anything, EREs* are the outliers in that they dislike their jobs (and at an early age) and look for ways to 'free' themselves. In the US at least, a majority of people say they like their jobs and that number goes up with education level.


* Obviously, not all EREs feel this way. Many are drawn to the resilience aspect of ERE.

** Why do I always clench when Ego and I agree about a topic?

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