white belt wrote: ↑Sun Jan 23, 2022 4:24 pmWar, like life, is a marathon not a sprint. Anyone can win when things are going their way, but there will always be times when things aren't going your way. One thing that separates the elite soldiers from conventional is that the elite soldiers can continue to maintain a consistent performance regardless of the situation (sleep deprivation, low morale, death/danger, starvation, etc). There is a balance between going all-out to win and saving something in the tank for the next task because there is always a next task. If you burn yourself out trying to win at one task it might mean failure on the next task.
white belt wrote: ↑Sun Jan 23, 2022 7:40 pmWhen dealing with dynamic real-time situations (life, team sports, war), it's critically important that one is able to be both process oriented and goal oriented. Process orientation is key for preparation and longevity; it will keep you focused on growth and perseverance even when you don't "win". Goal orientation is an important tool for motivation ("I want to win") and for remaining adaptive in real-time situations. I think the motivation connection is pretty straightforward, as it's well documented that creating goals can provide structure and motivation for individuals.
The ability to adapt (semper gumby**) is less discussed outside of circles that spend a lot of time interacting with dynamic, messy situations with incomplete information. In war, it's not sufficient to resign yourself to "Oh well, we aren't winning this battle but at least our process is solid." Fuck no, you need to figure out how to win at any cost because that absolutely matters, especially in life/death situations where TINA. This may require you to entirely throw out your previous framework/process to try something novel. Being too process oriented and getting your ego wrapped up with your process can be a hindrance to such a pivot. Many people would rather fail conventionally than succeed unconventionally (even in life and death situations). You can read a variety of survivor memoirs to see that dynamic in action.
jacob wrote: ↑Mon Jan 24, 2022 11:59 am...My point is that there are different reward systems for different environments. I think transitioning from "salaryman" to "renaissanceman" requires rewiring one's reward system. For the renaissanceman-type, the innate playfulness and inner drive of a child (before creativity was trained out). See https://earlyretirementextreme.com/a-me ... ement.html or the Pearsall quote (see WL8) about not making a distinction between work and play.
In my experience this [innate drive] is pretty hard to recover once it's been damaged or destroyed by [OC] turning play into work.
Hence a pox on external reward-systems!! I can see how they'd get otherwise unmotivated people to do stuff, but insofar internal motivation is inherent, external rewards (operant conditioning) can really *fuck* with that system. One-size-does-not-fit-all.
Key concepts: grit, don’t-quit, resilience, ability to adapt, ability to tap into a sense of intrinsic motivation..
We’ve had several excellent discussions and posts about burnout. It seems that arriving at post-FI life burnt out and unable to muster the desire to win that one once had is a very common problem. What I’m interested in discussing in this thread is what are specific, actionable steps people can take to restore their desire to win, not quit, triumph, lose well, adapt, etc? An ideal outcome for this thread would be a guideline / set of best practices that anyone could read and use to adapt to their specific circumstance to build a program for restoring desire to win as much as is possible, whether they’re pre-FI, post-FI, or semiERE. Everything from understanding what’s going on at a neurological / operant conditioning level, to small-scale exercises to build small wins (James Clear “upward spiral of success/winning”), to what kinds of activities ought to be avoided at all costs, etc.
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Ideas and thoughts on how to rebuild desire, grit, don't-quit, recover from burnout, etc, synthesized from the discussion:
- Avoid people who are burnt out, it's contagious. Hang out with people who are gritty, it's contagious. @ego
- Whiteknuckling through N more years might cause irreversible damage. Beware! @jacob
- With Scott Young's Spiral of Confidence in mind, seek appropriately-sized wins. If you're really burnt, find the smallest win you can imagine, and do it. Then another. Then another. Don't attempt to go from burnt-out husk of a human meatsack to epic Hero by Tuesday - your subconscious will refuse to believe it's possible. Take the next step up the spiral of confidence. Keep going.
- Testosterone. Get some. Years of losing almost definitely reduced T levels. Seek to increase it. It's probably (?) impossible to have too much endogenous T. @Kriegsspiel