The Cost of a Comfortable Retirement Around the World

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C40
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Re: The Cost of a Comfortable Retirement Around the World

Post by C40 »

That's interesting. I've been looking at info similar to this - COL in various places. I'd say the amounts shown are doable and are reasonable for ERE folks, but would be considered too low my most consumerist type folks. But, I guess it's different since in their example the starting age is 64

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unemployable
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Re: The Cost of a Comfortable Retirement Around the World

Post by unemployable »

Monthly living costs were collated for 124 countries, then multiplied by 176.4 = 14 years and 8.4 months between retirement age and life expectancy. To allow for a more comfortable retirement, the figures were further revised up by 20%.
So to adjust their numbers for the standard 4% withdrawal rate, which is the same as having 300 months of living expenses, multiply their dollar amounts by 1.7, which is 300/176.4.

If you want to forego the "20% lifestyle inflation" factor they use and want a strict 4% number, multiply by 1.42, coincidentally close to the square root of 2, instead.

So you "need" about $825k in the US. (Oh shit.)

Besides this, their modeling of retirement expenses doesn't seem to be much better or worse than anyone else's, but they do seem to presume you have a paid-off car with free parking.

Their number for Thailand looks a bit high, which perhaps is a result of assuming Bangkok COL.

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fiby41
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Re: The Cost of a Comfortable Retirement Around the World

Post by fiby41 »

Nice find! I'd consider the ~$2.5k difference between India and Pakistan as a safety/security premium. Life in Nepal and India would be identical but higher cost could be attributed to moving goods higher and higher for smaller and smaller groups of people.
Example, the standardized capacity for a LPG (liquified petroleum gas) cylinder in India is 14.2 kg but 5 kg cylinder category was invented for the mountaineous Himalayan states so that one could carry them upward on a cycle over an inclined slope.
Bummer no info for Afganistan.

Laura Ingalls
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Re: The Cost of a Comfortable Retirement Around the World

Post by Laura Ingalls »

Healthcare is not in the basket of goods making this less valuable to all of us holding US citizenship and grossly underestimating the cost for anyone else trying to retire here (except for Canadians that can easily repatriate themselves.)

Still it was super cool data and described a life I would want (ratio of meals at home to meals out.). Thanks for sharing.

ducknald_don
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Re: The Cost of a Comfortable Retirement Around the World

Post by ducknald_don »

I'm a surprised how little variation there is between the extremes, I would have expected at least an order of magnitude difference.

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Ego
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Re: The Cost of a Comfortable Retirement Around the World

Post by Ego »

They used Numbeo for crowdsourced cost of living data. Super interesting site.
https://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/

Like @ducknald_don I would have expected much higher variation but I ran the numbers for a few cities I know and they are indeed accurate to my experience.

For instance, here is Medellin, Colombia (the COP is about 4000/$1USD) https://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/in/Medellin

They also have data for:
Quality of Life
Affordability of housing
Pollution including air, water, etc.
Crime rates
Health system quality
Traffic (commute times)

ETA, I did a search here and realized that others have referenced this site before. New to me!

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Re: The Cost of a Comfortable Retirement Around the World

Post by FRx »

@Laura Ingalls I am a physician and I am not buying into the US healthcare system in any way. For those with serious chronic conditions of the non-lifestyle sort I think it's tough regardless of what country you live in. I see people getting sucked into it one way or another and then they are swallowed up by the system. Keeping out of the US healthcare system is my goal and should have a savings price tag of somewhere around $300,000.

FRx
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Re: The Cost of a Comfortable Retirement Around the World

Post by FRx »

Spain is probably right for the average but I live in Spain and living in Madrid versus Galicia is a huge price difference. With a paid off house in Galicia, say around $100,000, you probably need another $500 for a great quality of life per month.

Laura Ingalls
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Re: The Cost of a Comfortable Retirement Around the World

Post by Laura Ingalls »

FRx wrote:
Wed Dec 29, 2021 6:42 pm
@Laura Ingalls I am a physician and I am not buying into the US healthcare system in any way. For those with serious chronic conditions of the non-lifestyle sort I think it's tough regardless of what country you live in. I see people getting sucked into it one way or another and then they are swallowed up by the system. Keeping out of the US healthcare system is my goal and should have a savings price tag of somewhere around $300,000.
I am not committed to US based healthcare necessarily but it is both where I live presently and the only place I have citizenship. My point is that to have access to adequate healthcare in the US you need to participate in the system which requires money unless you live in an expansion state and realize very little income. Medicare and medigap are not free.

The data just skip it entirely probably because it is complicated. How much your rent is is much more straightforward.

chenda
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Re: The Cost of a Comfortable Retirement Around the World

Post by chenda »

Interesting. I'm inferring from their methodology they are using an effective ~ 5% SWR and, as stated, you are renting a 1 bedroom property

As FRx notes though COL can vary a lot, even in small countries, especially for rent. Turkey is increasingly popular as a retirement destination, I know quite a few people who have bought property there and its pretty awesome. I'd have long term concers about wild fires and climate related issues their though, and, to a lesser extent, political instability. Georgia might be better on the former point at least.

The best strategy I think is still to keep your assets predominantly in Northern Europe/US or Canada for a basic retirement, and by all means live it up somewhere cheaper for as long as the party lasts.

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Sclass
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Re: The Cost of a Comfortable Retirement Around the World

Post by Sclass »

This sounds like a doable number in the US. I didn’t get much about the details of the calculation in the article.

Guesstimate there’s a social security check and Medicare for the 64 yo. Then the $600,000 can be drawn down to zero over the next twenty years. At 5% you’ll get $4,000 a month. Till you reach 84 where you’ll likely be dead or checking into a medicaire funded euthanasia center for whatever the respiratory virus of the day happens to be. Not bad. Maybe you won’t even get there.

My mom burned $150,000 from 80-81, then $250,000 from 81-82. But her doctor said it was my no holds barred care that was keeping her live. Had I institutionalized her things would have gone a lot quicker.

I guess we don’t need a ton of money if we shoot for 100% drawdown.

WFJ
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Re: The Cost of a Comfortable Retirement Around the World

Post by WFJ »

Interesting data, but I'd be curious about the volatility of the number and what variable cause the most increase in living expense. In the US we are an oil exporter, while some countries fall into chaos when the cost of oil goes up a few percentage points (Japan and Korea) who are 100% importer. I'd also be curious how healthcare costs were calculated, and how the quality of the care standardized. People who have only lived in the US and read "The Atlantic" for all their scientific based knowledge might think the US is the worst healthcare in the world, but one tends to see a lot of foreigners at US hospitals (especially Canadiens), so something doesn't jibe.

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Re: The Cost of a Comfortable Retirement Around the World

Post by Seppia »

Ego wrote:
Wed Dec 29, 2021 3:47 pm
They used Numbeo for crowdsourced cost of living data. Super interesting site.
https://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/
I have been using Numbeo for quite some time.
Having been fairly mobile I can say that when it comes to big cities (=many data inputs) the numbers are surprisingly accurate.

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