Polyamory Support Group

[7Wannabe5]

@7WB5: Ah, this is interesting. What forms of capital are you thinking of? Economic self-sufficiency comes to mind, and you already mentioned housing.

Autonomy, self-respect, joie de vivre, and imagination come to mind. Also, I must admit that going to the salon for the first time in over 3 years and throwing down $75 to get your hair back to a uniform pale yellow absent frayed ends and tangles doesn't hurt. Also purchased a burgundy leather jacket with shiny silver zippers and a pair of kick-ass black suede boots with 3 inch heels (40% off with extra 20% off coupon and additional 15% off for joining mailing list) and a new power pink lipstick*. Then I looked in the mirror and felt up to the task of dumping BF and reconsidering the possibilities of polyamory.


*I know very non-ERE congruent behavior, but I was once a 13 year old suburban girl heavily influenced by the movie "Grease." If it works, it works.

ETA: Okay, Sandra Dee move worked so well, I didn't even have to dump the BF. Some may scoff at notion of "cake and eat it too", but I think it just might work at systems thinking level.

[Jin+Guice]

@C40:

When I got into this relationship the only "strategy" I was employing in any part of my life was flailing. I knew that I didn't want the traditional things (marriage, regular career, etc..), but I hadn't replaced them with anything nor had I thought about how or what in our traditional framework I was rejecting. This wasn't working badly, but I wasn't thinking deeply about what I was doing or where it might lead. Over 7 years later this has changed. I did a good job of not getting into anything I couldn't get out of, but some of the ideas, responsibilities, relationships and attitudes from the flailing period are still part of my life. That's a long way of saying mistakes were made. Honesty I don't know if I'd be able to recognize them without having made them.

Being in a long-term pretty stable relationship (which was not something I planned on doing) has been interesting. There weren't many problems for the first 2 years and the real problems only appeared around year 3/4. I was always lead to believe that substantial problems would present themselves before this time period if there were to be any. This includes the sexual problems. When we first started dating we had sex all the time. This lasted for 2-3 years. I'm still not sure I could see a low sex drive individual coming from that far away.

I don't think that long-term monogamy is for me. I also don't think I like living with a partner. This again took years to develop, living together was great for several years. It's still fine and I wouldn't move out from the current girlfriend (as noted by 7w5, it's hard to go back down the relationship escalator), but I doubt I'll do it again with a future partner.

@MI: What is the right dating regime for zen homeostasis? Poly/ partnered is largely limiting, but it does give you access to places and people you may otherwise not have had access to.

@Everyone_else: The GF's reaction to the situation and non-monogamy has been frustrating and not great, but as C40 noted, it's pretty good in most other dimensions. I certainly use this thread to vent, and I appreciate all the comments, concerns and advice. I'm glad to here everyone else's multi-partnered adventures are going well.

[Mister Imperceptible]

My hypothesis is that you will be a better musician if you keep your semen in your blood and play your instruments, and that you will have a more satisfying sex life when women take notice of your talent.

There is no homeostasis, only volatility. You are either going up or you are going down. No man steps in the same river twice. Everything flows.

I have wasted so much of myself on women unworthy of me. You might be doing the same thing.

[C40]

Semen is not in one's blood.

Semen is a mixture of:
- Sperm. Stored in the epididymis, the weird stuff attached to the outside of testicles that feels sort of like skin and tubes.
- Seminal fluid. Stored in the seminal vesicle, which is up near the bladder.
- Some kind of fluid from the prostate. It has components that stabilize the sperm/DNA. This stuff is what gives sperm it's taste.

plus there is a small gland near the base of the penis that makes what is known as pre-cum. Some of this is in semen.

[Mister Imperceptible]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Literal ... e_language

[llorona]

Autonomy, self-respect, joie de vivre, and imagination come to mind. Also, I must admit that going to the salon for the first time in over 3 years and throwing down $75 to get your hair back to a uniform pale yellow absent frayed ends and tangles doesn't hurt. Also purchased a burgundy leather jacket with shiny silver zippers and a pair of kick-ass black suede boots with 3 inch heels (40% off with extra 20% off coupon and additional 15% off for joining mailing list) and a new power pink lipstick*. Then I looked in the mirror and felt up to the task of dumping BF and reconsidering the possibilities of polyamory.

@7WB5: When did this happen??

[7Wannabe5]

When did this happen??

Tuesday. I should note that the shopping trip was not made in effort to impress BF. My DD28's wedding is tomorrow, and it is going to be a 3 day event starting with a costume party tonight and ending with an out-of-towners breakfast which I am hostessing on Sunday. In addition to my grouchy BF (who has now promised me he will be on best behavior and will even pop a Xanax as needed), I have to deal with my entire extended family, my ex-husband and his extended family, and the groom's family. I have not yet met the groom's parents, but I have been informed by bride and groom that the groom's mother will likely be Robert DeNiro to my Barbara Streisand in "Meet the Fockers" analogy. Also, my terrible mother made a point of calling me from the rehab center, from which she will be taking medical transport to attend ceremony, to tell me that it is important for the Mother-of-the Bride to look good,clearly insinuating that my style had recently (once again) disintegrated from chic to shabby minimalism. So, under this extreme level of pressure, I have momentarily reverted to my 14 year old spend-all-babysitting-money-on-shiny-clothes-to-wear-to-roller-rink financial functioning only mediated to the extent that I was able to triple-discount down and zero in on some very cute Ann Taylor Loft dresses on sale for $7.50!!!(I bought 3 because I may be going on some job interviews soon, and the style seemed a good mix of professional and youthful.)

Anyways, since my hair is now untangled, I can once again wear it down long, and 3 old guys have approached me in the last 2 days to ask me questions about my Smart car, even though I remain in state I might describe as menopause-induced pudgy. I guess most old guys are okay with some pudge as long as you still look kind of juicy.


Back to topic:

I am of the opinion that you can't really be functionally polyamorous if you haven't had the experience of at least one long term domestic relationship (7 years?), because it is too likely that you are simply continuing in a state of youthful promiscuity. In fact, I would even suggest that you have to go through a phase where you do some work to transcend the phase of long term relationship where the sex is likely to ebb, decline or dry up completely, before you can experience functional polyamory. IOW, this hierarchy follows the usual Wheaton level pattern of constuct/destruct/reconstruct etc. One of the primary reasons I believe this to be true is that it is so clear to me that people who are still in or approaching first long-term relationship do not grok that you can't really backtrack to "just" youthful promiscuity. The "long-term domesticity" level of skills or behaviors will carry forward no matter what.

[Jin+Guice]

@MI: Man, we approach this so differently that it's almost difficult to communicate. I haven't "wasted my time" with any women. Every new woman is a chance to learn something about other people, dating, yourself, and so many other things. Dates are one of the easiest social situations to get out of or avoid. No women are "unworthy" of me and I'm not unworthy of any of them. My barrier for entry to going out for a drink with someone is almost non-existent, but my barrier to spending significant time/ other resources on someone I'm romantically involved with is very high.

The proposition that I should pay attention to how sexual energy effects my musicianship/ life in general is a good one. However, I think you're overestimating how much time a musician spends shredding on-stage vs. sitting alone in a room quietly frustrated with their own hands. A ton of unreleased sexual energy is not equally helpful in both situations.

In my experience, having a really fresh haircut is almost always a better strategy for getting laid than being very good at something.

I think what you might be saying is that spending more time on self-improvement and less time worrying/ pursuing potential lovers is likely to result in better romantic opportunities. I agree, with the exception that you will obviously need to spend some time pursuing others and that it is important to improve yourself in the general direction that your pool of desired paramours want you to.

@7w5: I'm of the opinion that looking good is almost always worth the expense if you are cognizant that the expense need not be very high.

My gut response is to disagree with your opinion about being functionally polyamorous, but I don't know why. You are also much more experienced in this realm than I am. Do you feel it's also necessary to go through a state of youthful promiscuity as well?

[C40]

It's the confidence that is important. That can com from a haircut, from having made improvements in some thing (becoming better at music), or just from thinking highly of yourself.

For me, when it comes to meeting the kind of women I want to have relationships with, I do well when I have confidence of the type of having done good/interesting things, being good at doing many things. I tent to have a certain quiet conviction in myself. Maybe 30% of women seem to notice this and particularly like it.

[7Wannabe5]

@7w5: I'm of the opinion that looking good is almost always worth the expense if you are cognizant that the expense need not be very high.

My gut response is to disagree with your opinion about being functionally polyamorous, but I don't know why. You are also much more experienced in this realm than I am. Do you feel it's also necessary to go through a state of youthful promiscuity as well?

It is often probably worth the expense, even if it is rather high, if the money is well spent. Well known correlation between looks and earnings, which is much higher than IQ and earnings. Also, first-world females who rank in top 2-5% appearance actually on average gain greater share of income/assets/lifestyle-consumption through social association than earned income, which means that if one could achieve this "extreme" level of appearance, it would be worth more as an asset than amount necessary to generate 1 Jacob of income at 3%. However, it can become very demoralizing to engage in this level of lifestyle accounting, especially when you are 54 years old

I was using the term "promiscuity" as it would be used by a naturalist describing the behavior of one species of voles. I don't think period of youthful promiscuity would be strictly necessary, but it would be analogous to the "Working Man" quadrant in the Renaissance Man diagram. The "Business Man" quadrant would be analogous to either a marriage valued most for being "successful" or described as being like a "partnership" ( dominant on dominant)OR some aspects of one-sided male dominant polygamy, and the Salaryman quadrant would hold the range of Puppy Love to Old Couple Dwelling in Domestic Affection or dysfunction which is known as Lesbian Bed Death (submissive on submissive.) Something like that...

[Jason]

Apparently gaining acceptance in the Dungeons and Dragons community.

https://nypost.com/2019/12/06/polyamoro ... -pregnant/

[7Wannabe5]

@Jason:

Thanks for sharing. I liked how the female hub just seemed like a very nice nerdy person as opposed to some super edgy hipster. Isn't it better that all of those young men are getting some loving?

In semi-related news, had to watch "The Greatest Showman" 5 times in a row today while teaching a high school marketing class, so now I am thinking Hugh Jackman and Zac Efron might want to come over to "the other side" with me. That could happen, right..?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OJHX5T89t5Y

[Jason]

Adding baby detail to a rotation of four nerdy guys who's sexual appetites are only eclipsed by their lust for board games? To expound upon the spokes of the wheel metaphor, there better be a donut somewhere in that trunk because a blowout is just around the bend.

[Toska2]

Apparently I date swans. I have a greater chance of a husband or bf pull a knife on me than have a passing acknowledgment in the street a few months later.

I live vicariously through this thread.

[7Wannabe5]

@Jason:

I think she will do alright after the baby comes. Five adults to one baby ratio is much better than most of us had. Also you might consider the fact that even if the average hourly wage earned by each of her partners is only $15/hr, that adds up to well over 6 figures annual income for the household, so she can probably afford to take extended maternity leave from whatever else is on her schedule. Humans are so inventive!

@Toska2:

Unfortunately, I am currently living vicariously through this thread too ( sigh.)

I was a bit worried about knife fight level jealousy myself, but it has been my experience that overt, open contract ameliorates 95% of that tendency. I chucked at the point in the video above where one of the 4 male partners said something like “Jealousy happens, but it’s not like I am interested in marriage myself.” Most humans hold to some notion of fair trade. Even in one-sided polygynous contracts compensations are usually provided . IOW, there are very few people who are going to agree to 50/50 on everything egalitarian peer relationship except I get to step out and you don’t.

[enigmaT120]

Uh. With my appetite no way I could stand to be one of 4, unless I had several other partners as well or the other guys were interested. And obviously not everybody was using condoms. So many STDs.

On the other hand I pretty much handle my needs myself now so maybe it wouldn't all be that different.

[7Wannabe5]

@enigmaT120:

Have you talked with your wife about possibility of opening up your relationship contract?

[reepicheep]

This thread needs this:

https://polyweekly.com/517-stis-for-dummies/

P.S. Have HSVII. Have had it since I was 20 -- my entire adult sexual life. Contracted via monogamous partnership with the person I lost my vaginal virginity to and eventually married (and then divorced). He didn't know he was a carrier and had never had an outbreak, which is the case for a lot of people with HSV.

Does not impact my sex or dating life much. Works as an excellent screen for sexually uneducated assholes, though.

I get tested quarterly for other STI's (which is the modern update to "disease" because syphilis ain't the plague, yo). And use condoms. My partners are also regularly tested and engage in safer sex practices as appropriate.

---

Uncertain if I'm promiscuous or solo-poly or just 20-something.

Don't want to live with someone again at present. Prefer to pick up only my own dirty socks. Also, dog likes to roll in shit and dead things at the rate of about once a week, and wrestling her into a bath (and managing my own oral hygiene on a mostly daily basis) is enough care-taking for me.

Someday I want to park my tiny house next to my girlfriend's yurt and have goats and rabbits and a livestock guardian dog named Cerberus. And we will send each other cock shots of fabulous men with six packs that we find on Fetlife, and occasionally invite one of them into a threesome.

Also I would like to find someone to fuck regularly in Eugene. Bonus points if they also want to go hiking.

At least that's what I want this week.

It's almost Christmas. Santa, baby, please?

[reepicheep]

How does group sex work?

[A Case Study Not Intended to Be Advice or Applicable to Anyone Except Reep, (who is currently avoiding sorting four months of mail)]

• Be in non-monogamous non-sexual relationship with older Dom/Sadist. Learn to stop sassing.

• Get picked up off of dance floor by studly man-martial-artist slut. Have one-night stand.

• Observe Dom/Sadist manage his harem with joyous courtesy.

• Meet his many happy partners who are 20+ years older than me, take one out to lunch, pick brains.

• Also spend a year going to sex-ed classes once a week until accidentally becoming education coordinator at local munch due to being on volunteer email listserv at wrong time.

• Meet boy. Date boy for amazing Grease-style summer romance. Break up with boy after full extent of alcoholism becomes clear.

• Be very, very sad.

• FWB boy for a year.

• Break up with boy again. Stay friends.

• Dom/Sadist decides I have grown up enough to fuck me instead of just beat me. Takes more than a year.

• Listen to hundred+ hours of polyamory weekly and other podcasts

• Read lotta books. Write 70k+ words on my adventures.

• Fuck my way through Peru ala Leah Lays London, https://leahlayslondon.wordpress.com/

• Start dancing with women at dance.

• Meet Witch. Practice archery. Make-out with Witch at dance.

• Live threesome fantasies fully clothed at dance with Witch and Witch's (former) studly man-martial-artist slut.

• Dom/Sadist, Witch, Reep go out to lunch.

• Dom/Sadist, Wtich, and Reep go to his house and do not have threesome. Witch watches.

• Lunch, take 2!

• Threesome! QFC Sandwiches!

• Threesome! Cheese, crackers, and smoked sausage from Spain!

• Reep has more group sex than other kinds of sex for three months.

• Reep and Witch take turns making sure they each get solo time with Dom/Sadist.

• Birthday Threesome! Mexican takeout!

• Reep proposes MMF with Dom/Sadist and as-yet-unknown very special guest star with penis (still searching, but Dom/Sadist demonstrates secure masculinity and has experience with various configurations of group sex, so it seems like a matter of when, not if).

[enigmaT120]

She believes in divorce. That's it.

Good question though.