Random Relationship Derailment Thread

[Jason]

I just submitted my blog post "The Bat Shit Length These Big Old Bull Dykes Go To Spending Their Entire Income During Gay Pride Week" to their website so hopefully we'll get an opposing viewpoint on their obviously non-partisan website.

[prognastat]

As for a comparison on her bias look at how she writes about women cheating:
https://melmagazine.com/en-us/story/why ... e-than-men

Suddenly instead of trying to paint the subjects of the topic as negative as possible we are trying to find gray areas and excuses for what is generally considered bad behaviour.

[Lemon]

@Augustus

The point I am trying to make is going beyond recognising the issue is exists is how it is best to move forward to actually help solve the problem. The abrasive defensiveness is going to mean even those who might read the forums etc. are not going to feel particularly inclined to comment or share their insight (Please stay C&T!) in to these issues which being from a different perspective might provide novel (to here) strategies for individuals to try. Clearly lack of success in relationships causes significant distress, hence the need for a derailment thread here or, just silencing the issue in most other similar spheres. Banning discussion of an issue does not mean it does not exist.

Having more women in this space would enhance it. Now, maybe women are just less interested in fruagality. But that doesn't mean almost none. As far as I am aware the only very active female poster is 7wb5 who is one of the most awesome outliers ever. That to me suggests that it likely isn't an inviting space.

@Prognastat

Yes she isn't some impartial commentator but biased sources are not entirely without merit on all fronts.

[prognastat]

JennyPenny, DutchGirl, Sclass, Chenda, EdithKeeler are all very active. Im sure there are many more either just not coming to mind or that don't indicate they are women in their name or posts.

[Stahlmann]

Sclass isnt a dude?!

[prognastat]

I didn't think so, but if Sclass is a dude they have my sincerest apologies.

[Cats_and_tats]

na

[Lemon]

@prognast good point. I am forgetting way too many people. I am not entirely sure how other than thinking only within the realm of activity within this sort of thread, sorry.

[Jason]

As for a comparison on her bias look at how she writes about women cheating:
https://melmagazine.com/en-us/story/why ... e-than-men

Suddenly instead of trying to paint the subjects of the topic as negative as possible we are trying to find gray areas and excuses for what is generally considered bad behaviour.

Amber, an attorney and millennial woman living in Los Angeles, admitted to blowing only first year attorneys in her firm because "The male dominated management culture was so sexist that I felt the need to demonstrate that I wanted to be judged solely on my legal abilities and that I was therefore only going to hand out sexual favors to those who could not help me in my career advancement." When asked if she had a boyfriend she responded "Yes, but he's not satisfying my needs, so I don't consider it an issue."

[Gilberto de Piento]

There was a recent thread of someone saying how they have more success with women when you start relationships by lying to them, and many people were like, oh, great idea, whatever gets you that pussy. But I can guarantee if a lady started the relationship with lies and got found out and it was posted about here, everyone would be saying how all women are liars and garbage and cheats, etc.

I thought this was terrible and I think I (too gently) called him out on it. He has reported some other questionable non-relationship behaviors in the past. Not everyone is going to be well behaved unfortunately.

I'm glad you posted your opinion on the article even if we don't agree on it.

[Cats_and_tats]

na

[prognastat]

@ Cats_and_tats
viewtopic.php?f=16&t=10493&start=80#p185975

I think I made at least some points regarding the issues with the blogpost even if you don't agree with all my disagreements.

[Toska2]

@slsdly

I have had a knife pulled on me more than gfs. The competition is fierce in more than one way.

@7wannabe5

Don't feel sorry for me. I have a more correct view of the social dynamics. Panning out to the whole situation, one gets a different feeling. What I alluded to is, generally women are dropping out of dating faster than men. That is true up to and including death and it cascades from there. I am wise enough to know what matters to me, my INTJ-ness is not noticeable due daily differences.

@white belt

Location, Location, Location. I know. I read an article about the one thing in common for most partners was a sub one hour commute. That allows relaxed weekday activites. My former career made mechanical engineering look like nursing, 99.x% male. Saying I am location independent is a nice way of saying I am underemployed.

[7Wannabe5]

I agree with what C&T said about the existence of other frugality realms that are more inviting to females. For instance, 25-30 years ago (Gawd, I am so old) when my kids were babies, my frugality references overlapped heavily with my breast-feeding hippie Mom references. My ex was the office manager of a very large, very good book store and he would bring me home stacks of cover-removed-magazines with articles like "How I Feed My Family of 6 on $40/Week" and rhapsodies on the joys of cuddling up for a nap with your 3 year old after spending the morning picking apples for pie.

As another counter-example, I can't for the life of me remember the name of the former frequent poster to this forum, but at some point his avatar was a smiling picture of himself, his wife, and their two very cute babies, as they were traveling around the world together. Every time I saw that picture, I thought about how appealing it might be to a fairly large swath of females, including young me.

Frugality can be defined as best practice in the realm of home economics. So, there really isn't any reason why the topic shouldn't appeal to women as much as men. Like the related topic of gardening, it is a realm that requires both masculine and feminine energy. The "problem" is that this forum generally veers WAAAAY over towards the FINANCE 402 side of home economics and away from the notion of warmth inherent in the word "home." In fact, the whole highly individualistic notion of "personal" finance contributes to this "chill" and promotes the ridiculous belief that there are humans who don't even need a home, or any living thing to love, care for, or cherish and vice-versa.

That said, I TRULY do not believe that Jacob himself is promoting of this philosophy. His vulnerable "baby" is the environment of the planet, and I believe his wife, who holds an advanced degree in something like unto Field Biology shares this deep commitment. That's why he encourages people to spend less more than he encourages people to earn/save more. So, it is very unfair to create such a caricature of him and his marriage.

[Cats_and_tats]

na

[Colibri]

JennyPenny, DutchGirl, Sclass, Chenda, EdithKeeler are all very active. Im sure there are many more either just not coming to mind or that don't indicate they are women in their name or posts.

I am a woman and actively pursuing ERE. Althought I don't post regurlarly, I come on the forum many times a week to read new posts. I love to lurk.

Just a side note on difficulties of finding a ERE compatible partner/mate :
I tried dating sites this winter for the first time ever in my life ( I am 31). I have been single since 2012, except for one very short relationship in 2014.
Met and dating that one guy for a couple of weeks now who is supposedly frugal and with whom I have a lot in commons (we like to do the same things). Everything seems to be fine until I mention I get my clothes for free at the local dump. And then it went cold turkey when he learned I have 3 paid for properties. The more he learn about my ERE lifestyle the more he retreats. I think we are not dating anymore actually... too bad, I really liked him.

Good luck finding compatible partners, NO MATTER YOUR GENDER !

[prognastat]

Yeah, I think there's a definite delineation between just being frugal and being FIRE/ERE minded. When people hear frugal they think oh you're poor that's understandable, but if you had money you would be spending it. Then when they find out you are voluntarily frugal and could actually afford to spend that money it doesn't compute for them.

I guess maybe not outright lying about your more frugal behaviour, but rather just letting them come up as they naturally arise and hoping that you've built enough of a connection by the time they figure out your way of living to the point where they like you enough that they are willing to put in the effort to understand might work. Either that or get really lucky and find someone who is already into FIRE/ERE or very close.

Anything that puts you outside of what is considered the norm is going to make it a bit more difficult though.

[prognastat]

viewtopic.php?f=7&t=10500&p=185482&hilit=vice#p185482

Here's a guy criticising FIRE and forum members calling in to question his motives and a few ad hominems and no-one is in a hurry to defend the guy. You could say the general response from the forum was a lot lighter, but he was much less aggressive and offensive in his criticism so it makes sense that the response isn't as aggressive either. I have no doubt if he had attacked the community and major FIRE figures personal lives made accusations as serious as significant as sexism that the response would have been similarly harsh. In my book that isn't an indication of sexism and rather just how people respond when they feel they or someone they respect is being attacked. Not pretty, but also not surprising.

There's another topic today questioning whether Sam Harris is an idiot because he doesn't agree with the members personal beliefs.

I don't think that it came from a woman is really the reason for the hostility, but rather that it attacked people's for lack of a better word belief system, a role model(s)/leader(s), their community and their identity. People tend to lash out when those are threatened.

Suze Orman also go pretty heated backlash from the FIRE community, here not for accusations of sexism, but rather again the community feeling their belief systems, role models, community and identity being attacked.

[Jason]

To criticize JLF based on the fact that mysognist douches like myself post on his board and not on the content of his book is the standard methodology of those either too lazy or too arrogant to really understand a thought system. "I am a feminist." Yeah, well so was Aileen Wournos so I guess you believe in killing truck drivers.

[Cats_and_tats]

na