First, thanks LiquidSapphire and boris*3 for the comments.
Now for the numbers. I had to approximate a few things since I wasn't keeping careful track of everything.
Total expenses were 2,070 and total income was 6,381.67. I had a net savings rate of 67%. I'm leaving my bonus off of this, as well as a few purchases I made out of the 'bonus fund'. At the end of the month, I have almost exactly 100 months saved, if I factor in returns, and 85 months of raw expenses.
The market was very kind in January, and some of the employment numbers, etc, were quite encouraging. So I'm hoping at least we can avoid crashing during early 2012.
My calculated investment income, per month, averages out to $378; actual investment income was $252 in January.
I'm expecting expenses to be similar in February because I have a large medical bill (optometrist) that cancels out savings in apartment. However, I anticipate expenses dipping a bit in March to around $1950.
I decided that my situation at work is ridiculous enough and I have enough leverage that I'm going to be proactive and push to change my situation. Not to get into details, but asides my immediate teammate/partner, the rest of my team, including my manager, basically ignores what I'm doing and focuses on their own little closeted space. Everyone I work with considers the whole situation is ludicrous, and many people who are senior to me (but not really 'senior' at the organization) don't seem too fond of my manager. He's a nice guy but not a good leader.
Anyway at this point I have enough savings and think the reward justifies any type of risk I take by being somewhat outspoken that I'd rather push to change my situation than be unhappy with the way things stand.
m741's ERE Journal
February Results
First, a note: I (occasionally) post updates on SkillsFIRE, which is an ERE-related blog.
February was a pretty good month for me. Not just from a financial perspective. I've been focusing on my job, and right now I don't have any qualms about that. I'll be working at (hopefully) the same place, for at least 3-4 more years before I will really feel comfortable thinking about retirement or partial retirement. And I'm still learning quite a bit and sometimes enjoying the work.
Also the market recovery is great, my net worth is up quite a bit. I'm not entirely comfortable with where the market is (I think it's overvalued) but there are good signs of job recovery, etc.
I've been doing some ERE-oriented things though. I started focusing a bit more on my health. Still not as much as I ought to, but at least I'm eating somewhat healthier these days. A few months ago I bought a pressure cooker, and I've been getting some use out of it, cooking Mexican-style black beans, Indian-style dal (a lentil dish), and I'm looking to try some other things. It's a great combination: the satisfaction of cooking something myself, the lower cost, the healthiness of fresh vegetables & beans. The only downside is it takes some time to cook, but honestly between cooking and cleanup time it's less than an hour of work, and closer to half an hour. That provides enough food for between 3 and 5 meals.
Finally I've been helping a friend by doing some freelance website design work. It's nothing special, but I get some refreshers on HTML/CSS/javascript and a decent tax-free salary, and he gets a much cheaper rate than he would have to pay elsewhere. I also had my highest month of dividends to date. I'm currently looking to put another 10-20k into stocks and bonds.
Anyway. For February, I lost track of the numbers towards the middle of the month, but I think this is basically accurate.
Total Income: 6538
Total Expenses: 2219
Saving Rate: 66%
Months Saved: 99
My largest expenses were $220 for medical reasons/checkups, $80 for drinks/dinner out with friends, and $350 for food (higher than I'm comfortable with there).
For March I expect expenses to be down a bit to around $1900-2000. No looming payments on the horizon that I can foresee.
First, a note: I (occasionally) post updates on SkillsFIRE, which is an ERE-related blog.
February was a pretty good month for me. Not just from a financial perspective. I've been focusing on my job, and right now I don't have any qualms about that. I'll be working at (hopefully) the same place, for at least 3-4 more years before I will really feel comfortable thinking about retirement or partial retirement. And I'm still learning quite a bit and sometimes enjoying the work.
Also the market recovery is great, my net worth is up quite a bit. I'm not entirely comfortable with where the market is (I think it's overvalued) but there are good signs of job recovery, etc.
I've been doing some ERE-oriented things though. I started focusing a bit more on my health. Still not as much as I ought to, but at least I'm eating somewhat healthier these days. A few months ago I bought a pressure cooker, and I've been getting some use out of it, cooking Mexican-style black beans, Indian-style dal (a lentil dish), and I'm looking to try some other things. It's a great combination: the satisfaction of cooking something myself, the lower cost, the healthiness of fresh vegetables & beans. The only downside is it takes some time to cook, but honestly between cooking and cleanup time it's less than an hour of work, and closer to half an hour. That provides enough food for between 3 and 5 meals.
Finally I've been helping a friend by doing some freelance website design work. It's nothing special, but I get some refreshers on HTML/CSS/javascript and a decent tax-free salary, and he gets a much cheaper rate than he would have to pay elsewhere. I also had my highest month of dividends to date. I'm currently looking to put another 10-20k into stocks and bonds.
Anyway. For February, I lost track of the numbers towards the middle of the month, but I think this is basically accurate.
Total Income: 6538
Total Expenses: 2219
Saving Rate: 66%
Months Saved: 99
My largest expenses were $220 for medical reasons/checkups, $80 for drinks/dinner out with friends, and $350 for food (higher than I'm comfortable with there).
For March I expect expenses to be down a bit to around $1900-2000. No looming payments on the horizon that I can foresee.
March Update
Things feel as though they're changing really fast. Partly I think that's attributable to spending a *lot* of time at work. But also a lot has been going on in my life. First, the numbers, and then some of the details.
This month I basically didn't track my expenses at all. I know - I was *really* hoping to, I've just been lazy about it recently. April I'll get back on track, I swear.
Total Income: 6454
Total Expenses: 2113
Percent Saved: 67%
I think this is a roughly accurate estimate of expenses, with one caveat (see below).
As for what's changed recently... where to start? At work, I changed teams. My enthusiasm from earlier in the year changed pretty rapidly, and I found that my old team situation (isolated, on a failure of a team) was untenable. Now I'm well-integrated with a new team, there are lots of opportunities for me to learn new things, and I have a team leader I actually respect. On the down side, I've lost some autonomy, and I have more support to do, and I'll have to do some projects which are less exciting.
On a less serious note, I caved and bought a vitamix blender. I left it off this month's expenses. It's awesome, and between that and some other changes I feel like I'm making some progress on improving my health. I've been running for 20 minutes, no pressure, on alternating mornings. And a lot of my health problems were due to after-work snacks. Now I don't really eat much of anything at work (1-2 apples or some oatmeal), and I have a big meal after work. Right now, that meal is 2 pitas, 5-6 eggs, fat free cheese, 2 bananas, a carton of strawberries, some protein powder, some yogurt/milk, and various supplements. It's a lot of food, but first off it's all basically fresh and unprocessed. Second, it has a lot more vitamins, etc, in their natural form. Third, I suspect I consume fewer calories now, and fourth, the cost is only slightly higher.
After buying the vitamix, which I'd craved for a while, I really feel like I have basically everything I need. I don't feel like I 'need' to buy this or that right now. I don't own a microwave (since moving apartments), but I'm fine with that. I will need to buy A/C at some point, and I need to pick up a few things for my wardrobe. Besides that, I'm basically looking to continue to upgrade things, but get rid of quite a bit as I do so. That means downsizing useless clothes, old gadgets, lots of books, and various other things I just don't need anymore.
Finally, I'm getting to be a bit more socially active. One of the guys on my new team has a lot of similarities with myself. I played some board games with him and his wife today and had a good time, so hopefully that becomes a regular thing. I'm looking to participate in some German-language groups and ultimate frisbee groups in a regular basis.
Oh yeah, I've been on the forums much less recently. I miss you guys, but it's probably for the best. I'll still be checking in!
Things feel as though they're changing really fast. Partly I think that's attributable to spending a *lot* of time at work. But also a lot has been going on in my life. First, the numbers, and then some of the details.
This month I basically didn't track my expenses at all. I know - I was *really* hoping to, I've just been lazy about it recently. April I'll get back on track, I swear.
Total Income: 6454
Total Expenses: 2113
Percent Saved: 67%
I think this is a roughly accurate estimate of expenses, with one caveat (see below).
As for what's changed recently... where to start? At work, I changed teams. My enthusiasm from earlier in the year changed pretty rapidly, and I found that my old team situation (isolated, on a failure of a team) was untenable. Now I'm well-integrated with a new team, there are lots of opportunities for me to learn new things, and I have a team leader I actually respect. On the down side, I've lost some autonomy, and I have more support to do, and I'll have to do some projects which are less exciting.
On a less serious note, I caved and bought a vitamix blender. I left it off this month's expenses. It's awesome, and between that and some other changes I feel like I'm making some progress on improving my health. I've been running for 20 minutes, no pressure, on alternating mornings. And a lot of my health problems were due to after-work snacks. Now I don't really eat much of anything at work (1-2 apples or some oatmeal), and I have a big meal after work. Right now, that meal is 2 pitas, 5-6 eggs, fat free cheese, 2 bananas, a carton of strawberries, some protein powder, some yogurt/milk, and various supplements. It's a lot of food, but first off it's all basically fresh and unprocessed. Second, it has a lot more vitamins, etc, in their natural form. Third, I suspect I consume fewer calories now, and fourth, the cost is only slightly higher.
After buying the vitamix, which I'd craved for a while, I really feel like I have basically everything I need. I don't feel like I 'need' to buy this or that right now. I don't own a microwave (since moving apartments), but I'm fine with that. I will need to buy A/C at some point, and I need to pick up a few things for my wardrobe. Besides that, I'm basically looking to continue to upgrade things, but get rid of quite a bit as I do so. That means downsizing useless clothes, old gadgets, lots of books, and various other things I just don't need anymore.
Finally, I'm getting to be a bit more socially active. One of the guys on my new team has a lot of similarities with myself. I played some board games with him and his wife today and had a good time, so hopefully that becomes a regular thing. I'm looking to participate in some German-language groups and ultimate frisbee groups in a regular basis.
Oh yeah, I've been on the forums much less recently. I miss you guys, but it's probably for the best. I'll still be checking in!
The past few months have been both exciting and demoralizing for me. On the one hand, I'm learning quite a bit and my situation is better now than a few months ago.
On the other hand, I'm getting increasingly worn down by repeated political infighting. Everyone seems to think this will settle down over the next few months, but I'm less optimistic. Also, given my increasingly outspoken personality, I do think I'm offending some people. But I'm not about to pull any punches.
What's become clear to me is that if I don't set some sort of end date to my stay at my current firm, I'll settle in and either (A) follow this path of least resistance forever, or (B) get laid off and feel psychologically crushed (since work is all I do).
I can foresee a future where I'll keep telling myself "just wait 4 more years to retire. In 4 years you'll have all your finances in order." I was saying that a year ago, and I would be saying it a year from now. I always tend to follow the path of least resistance, and working for the same firm, even if that entails long hours, is the path of least resistance.
So I'm setting a timeline. This isn't so I have "an end in sight" - although depending upon my mood, that's one way of looking at things. But also, I don't want to get too comfortable with where I'm at. If I have an end date, I think I'll appreciate the good I have, and savor moments I wouldn't have otherwise.
So, my timeline is this: I will leave my job on April 1, 2015. That sounds like a long ways off. It's 1087 days. It's 778 workdays. But it's countable. It's about 150 weeks. It's less time than I've currently been working.
I'm thinking about this as a graduation date. Knowing that there's an end in sight - that I won't just be cruising along in the same track, until I'm 45 and desperate and lonely, looking at all the fresh-faced college graduates on the subway, wondering where my youth has gone. After that, I could travel, hike, camp, or simply try a new profession.
In the interim, I want to do a few things, many of which I've already acknowledged. I want to get in shape - I've definitely been eating healthier. Right after 'graduation' I want to be able to do physically strenuous things. I know I'll be mentally sharp, and I want my body to be able to keep up.
I also want to experience NYC. I've been more adventurous recently, checking out some jazz bars; wandering through Tribeca, the High Line, & Chinatown. With a limited number of weekends ahead of me in NYC, even 3 years' worth, I don't want to spend all Saturday mouldering in front of the computer reading Reddit.
I want to get better at all the things being an 'adult' entails. That means keeping a clean apartment (I'm terribly embarrassed about my bachelor lifestyle), learning to dress presentably, learning to keep myself tidy, learning to be punctual when replying to letters/phonecalls, etc. It's time for me to grow up and be more mature.
I want to get my finances in order. I'm still working out what my 'number' is, but I believe that in 3 years, I can have $400k in savings; even if I have to work again, that's hardly the end of the world. I'd also like to set aside a dedicated travel fund, for two things: first, to travel (duh), and second, to relocate once I'm done traveling. I'm thinking of about $15k, which ought to be enough to cover quite a bit of travel, and maybe $4k of which would be to move and get settled in somewhere new.
Of course it's ambitious to set timelines 3 years in the future. But without an end in sight, I'll take nothing for granted, and I'll keep being a coward, postponing the time when I step away from my desk.
On the other hand, I'm getting increasingly worn down by repeated political infighting. Everyone seems to think this will settle down over the next few months, but I'm less optimistic. Also, given my increasingly outspoken personality, I do think I'm offending some people. But I'm not about to pull any punches.
What's become clear to me is that if I don't set some sort of end date to my stay at my current firm, I'll settle in and either (A) follow this path of least resistance forever, or (B) get laid off and feel psychologically crushed (since work is all I do).
I can foresee a future where I'll keep telling myself "just wait 4 more years to retire. In 4 years you'll have all your finances in order." I was saying that a year ago, and I would be saying it a year from now. I always tend to follow the path of least resistance, and working for the same firm, even if that entails long hours, is the path of least resistance.
So I'm setting a timeline. This isn't so I have "an end in sight" - although depending upon my mood, that's one way of looking at things. But also, I don't want to get too comfortable with where I'm at. If I have an end date, I think I'll appreciate the good I have, and savor moments I wouldn't have otherwise.
So, my timeline is this: I will leave my job on April 1, 2015. That sounds like a long ways off. It's 1087 days. It's 778 workdays. But it's countable. It's about 150 weeks. It's less time than I've currently been working.
I'm thinking about this as a graduation date. Knowing that there's an end in sight - that I won't just be cruising along in the same track, until I'm 45 and desperate and lonely, looking at all the fresh-faced college graduates on the subway, wondering where my youth has gone. After that, I could travel, hike, camp, or simply try a new profession.
In the interim, I want to do a few things, many of which I've already acknowledged. I want to get in shape - I've definitely been eating healthier. Right after 'graduation' I want to be able to do physically strenuous things. I know I'll be mentally sharp, and I want my body to be able to keep up.
I also want to experience NYC. I've been more adventurous recently, checking out some jazz bars; wandering through Tribeca, the High Line, & Chinatown. With a limited number of weekends ahead of me in NYC, even 3 years' worth, I don't want to spend all Saturday mouldering in front of the computer reading Reddit.
I want to get better at all the things being an 'adult' entails. That means keeping a clean apartment (I'm terribly embarrassed about my bachelor lifestyle), learning to dress presentably, learning to keep myself tidy, learning to be punctual when replying to letters/phonecalls, etc. It's time for me to grow up and be more mature.
I want to get my finances in order. I'm still working out what my 'number' is, but I believe that in 3 years, I can have $400k in savings; even if I have to work again, that's hardly the end of the world. I'd also like to set aside a dedicated travel fund, for two things: first, to travel (duh), and second, to relocate once I'm done traveling. I'm thinking of about $15k, which ought to be enough to cover quite a bit of travel, and maybe $4k of which would be to move and get settled in somewhere new.
Of course it's ambitious to set timelines 3 years in the future. But without an end in sight, I'll take nothing for granted, and I'll keep being a coward, postponing the time when I step away from my desk.
m741 thanks for sharing. you are insightful, self-aware and totally relatable.
"I want to get better at all the things being an 'adult' entails. That means keeping a clean apartment (I'm terribly embarrassed about my bachelor lifestyle), learning to dress presentably, learning to keep myself tidy, learning to be punctual when replying to letters/phonecalls, etc. It's time for me to grow up and be more mature."
ugh, this. i struggle with being grown up and doing basic mature/responsible things. between my jobs, figuring out how to get back in shape (i'm becoming a fat skinny person), projects and spending time with friends and family, it's so difficult for me even find the time to keep my life organized and running smoothly.
how do parents do it???
anyway, this is a great website to start: http://unfuckyourhabitat.tumblr.com/
"I want to get better at all the things being an 'adult' entails. That means keeping a clean apartment (I'm terribly embarrassed about my bachelor lifestyle), learning to dress presentably, learning to keep myself tidy, learning to be punctual when replying to letters/phonecalls, etc. It's time for me to grow up and be more mature."
ugh, this. i struggle with being grown up and doing basic mature/responsible things. between my jobs, figuring out how to get back in shape (i'm becoming a fat skinny person), projects and spending time with friends and family, it's so difficult for me even find the time to keep my life organized and running smoothly.
how do parents do it???
anyway, this is a great website to start: http://unfuckyourhabitat.tumblr.com/
-
jennypenny
- Posts: 6853
- Joined: Sun Jul 03, 2011 2:20 pm
"how do parents do it???"
We hide a lot of whiskey in our coffee
I was like you. And I felt awful because I thought after I had kids I would develop all of these nesting instincts and gleefully keep house. (still waiting for that to kick in
) One of my favorite lines in "The Break-Up" is when Aniston's character says "I want you to *want* to do the dishes" and Vaughn's character says "Why would I want to do the dishes?" Once you give yourself a break about not liking it you won't mind it so much.
The site is really corny but I like flylady.com for help developing a cleaning schedule.
We hide a lot of whiskey in our coffee
I was like you. And I felt awful because I thought after I had kids I would develop all of these nesting instincts and gleefully keep house. (still waiting for that to kick in
) One of my favorite lines in "The Break-Up" is when Aniston's character says "I want you to *want* to do the dishes" and Vaughn's character says "Why would I want to do the dishes?" Once you give yourself a break about not liking it you won't mind it so much. The site is really corny but I like flylady.com for help developing a cleaning schedule.
Lol, the adult thing reminds me of this awesome blog post:
http://hyperboleandahalf.blogspot.com/2 ... adult.html
Anyways, your end date is right around mine (although I'm not quite as adamant... I see it more as a "final answer" date where do a final assessment on priorities, etc.). Of course that means I have to lay the foundation to properlyake the finals decision.
http://hyperboleandahalf.blogspot.com/2 ... adult.html
Anyways, your end date is right around mine (although I'm not quite as adamant... I see it more as a "final answer" date where do a final assessment on priorities, etc.). Of course that means I have to lay the foundation to properlyake the finals decision.
Since I'm in a new job that I happen to like (I'm sorry but it's pretty prestigious, lots of perks, cool projects...thanks ERE forum for the encouragement in taking it btw), I think for fun I'm going to set my date to June 1, 2015. I'd be creepy and make it match up with m741's but we get our bonus review in April (if I'm still in this job).
Thanks for the replies, guys. That "why I'll never be an adult" link is pretty much what happens to me.
I definitely feel like a little kid who's trying to impersonate a grown-up. But I suspect many people feel that way, at least in their 20s.
@Palmera, I don't think it would be creepy to share 'quitting' dates. I chose April because it's a bit after my bonus season. Depending upon what I want to do (new job, hike the Appalachian trail, or travel to Europe), I may be forced to adjust +/- a month or two, to accommodate - Appalachian Trail really requires starting in March, and I wouldn't want to hit Europe in the summer tourist season. But the important thing for me is knowing that I won't be doing this forever, and that times will have to change.
I definitely feel like a little kid who's trying to impersonate a grown-up. But I suspect many people feel that way, at least in their 20s.
@Palmera, I don't think it would be creepy to share 'quitting' dates. I chose April because it's a bit after my bonus season. Depending upon what I want to do (new job, hike the Appalachian trail, or travel to Europe), I may be forced to adjust +/- a month or two, to accommodate - Appalachian Trail really requires starting in March, and I wouldn't want to hit Europe in the summer tourist season. But the important thing for me is knowing that I won't be doing this forever, and that times will have to change.
@palmera - I like that 'unfuck your habitat' site. Funny and useful. Added it to my RSS feed.
@bigato - I know the feeling. I've been getting rid of stuff at a relatively rapid clip - usually a grocery bag per week, which adds up when you don't own too much to start with.
Also, this past weekend, I did a serious reorganization of my apartment. I moved in a few months ago and since then one room (the largest one!) had really only been occupied by my cats. I dragged a few pieces of furniture around, did some mopping, and now I have a big, spacious bedroom. Feels good - this upcoming weekend I will do another batch of cleaning.
Finally, one of my goals over the next year is to get rid of a full bookcase of books. Over the past two years I've already gotten rid of one-two bookcases. I currently have about 6 bookcases worth of books, which is just too many.
@bigato - I know the feeling. I've been getting rid of stuff at a relatively rapid clip - usually a grocery bag per week, which adds up when you don't own too much to start with.
Also, this past weekend, I did a serious reorganization of my apartment. I moved in a few months ago and since then one room (the largest one!) had really only been occupied by my cats. I dragged a few pieces of furniture around, did some mopping, and now I have a big, spacious bedroom. Feels good - this upcoming weekend I will do another batch of cleaning.
Finally, one of my goals over the next year is to get rid of a full bookcase of books. Over the past two years I've already gotten rid of one-two bookcases. I currently have about 6 bookcases worth of books, which is just too many.
Another month in the books!
Again, this wasn't an ERE-focused month. And yet, I saw my net savings increase quite a bit.
Truthfully I didn't track spending much at all. I got out of the habit and it's difficult to get started again. But if I'm going to track expenses any month, it's May.
Anyway, I did hit a major milestone this month: over 200k in savings devoted to ERE (I don't include my 401k in this number).
I'm very happy about that number. Even if it's only half of what I need, it's still a sizable chunk, and just knowing it's there makes me more comfortable.
I also hit another milestone, my highest amount of dividend income in a single month, $440. A lot of that is due to quarterly dividends aligning in April, but $440 is legitimate income. I'm also sitting on a big chunk of cash, trying to figure out where to invest. Everything feels overpriced!
I won't go into other numbers this month, because as I mentioned, they're mostly estimates. My overall income has been consistent for a year now.
Outside of ERE, things have been going well. I regressed slightly on my diet, but it's still much better than January/February and earlier. I'm playing frisbee on a semi-regular basis. And I signed up for the gym again. I just started lifting again. I'm not setting any hard goals, I just want to be able to lift regularly and make consistent gains. Collectively frisbee/lifting have made me realize just how out of shape I was.
I've been doing some more cleanup and simplifying. I even mopped my floor twice this month, quite an achievement for me.
I also started playing go. I used to play chess when I was younger and a bit in college, though I was never very good. Part of reason I gave up was that a huge chunk of the game once you reached a certain level felt like memorizing openings. If a typical game was ~40-50 moves, you'd have 10-15 memorized before you started on your own path. That seemed like a waste to me.
Go is the same in the sense that it's a basic game with tons of complexity. There are definitely openings, but the style of the game is much different; plus there's usually a separate opening for each corner of the board, so you can simultaneously be attacking in one corner and defending in another. It feels like a broader game, too. In the sense that a chess board is quite cramped. There isn't much freedom, so it generally feels like a very tactical struggle. Whereas with go there are little skirmishes and engagements that begin to define the board, and the real complxity lies in how these skirmishes affect one another.
One of the guys I work with is a good player (1-dan) and so far he's been happy to instruct me and give me advice, so I'm taking advantage of that. Solving problems (tsumego) on the subway keeps me occupied as well. And it's free.
761 workdays & 1065 days until I leave my job.
Again, this wasn't an ERE-focused month. And yet, I saw my net savings increase quite a bit.
Truthfully I didn't track spending much at all. I got out of the habit and it's difficult to get started again. But if I'm going to track expenses any month, it's May.
Anyway, I did hit a major milestone this month: over 200k in savings devoted to ERE (I don't include my 401k in this number).
I'm very happy about that number. Even if it's only half of what I need, it's still a sizable chunk, and just knowing it's there makes me more comfortable.
I also hit another milestone, my highest amount of dividend income in a single month, $440. A lot of that is due to quarterly dividends aligning in April, but $440 is legitimate income. I'm also sitting on a big chunk of cash, trying to figure out where to invest. Everything feels overpriced!
I won't go into other numbers this month, because as I mentioned, they're mostly estimates. My overall income has been consistent for a year now.
Outside of ERE, things have been going well. I regressed slightly on my diet, but it's still much better than January/February and earlier. I'm playing frisbee on a semi-regular basis. And I signed up for the gym again. I just started lifting again. I'm not setting any hard goals, I just want to be able to lift regularly and make consistent gains. Collectively frisbee/lifting have made me realize just how out of shape I was.
I've been doing some more cleanup and simplifying. I even mopped my floor twice this month, quite an achievement for me
.I also started playing go. I used to play chess when I was younger and a bit in college, though I was never very good. Part of reason I gave up was that a huge chunk of the game once you reached a certain level felt like memorizing openings. If a typical game was ~40-50 moves, you'd have 10-15 memorized before you started on your own path. That seemed like a waste to me.
Go is the same in the sense that it's a basic game with tons of complexity. There are definitely openings, but the style of the game is much different; plus there's usually a separate opening for each corner of the board, so you can simultaneously be attacking in one corner and defending in another. It feels like a broader game, too. In the sense that a chess board is quite cramped. There isn't much freedom, so it generally feels like a very tactical struggle. Whereas with go there are little skirmishes and engagements that begin to define the board, and the real complxity lies in how these skirmishes affect one another.
One of the guys I work with is a good player (1-dan) and so far he's been happy to instruct me and give me advice, so I'm taking advantage of that. Solving problems (tsumego) on the subway keeps me occupied as well. And it's free.
761 workdays & 1065 days until I leave my job.
I'd like to solicit job advice from all the people here.
I've got a great opportunity right now, provided I handle it in the right way. There's two divisions in my company which both want me to work for them. They have overlapping responsibilities and that's been a big source of tension.
One organization is technology, which I currently work for. This organization has a well-defined hierarchy, handles a broad diversity of different systems, is a "safe" organization to work for. I recently switched teams within this organization, amicably, and I like the team I'm on and my manager is excellent. However, I don't have faith in technology upper management. And it's a politically weak group within the company. I feel that given my track record, even though I'm fairly junior, the organization could have given me a little more recognition.
The other organization is quants. If technology "wants to get the job done, right, but take a long time to do it," quants "want to get the job done, quickly, so long as it works." There's a broad diversity of tasks in this organization, but most of the technology is uniform. The hierarchy is somewhat amorphous. I'm on good terms with a lot of people in this organization, and it's the polically dominant group in my company. However, there's some infighting here, and the upper management feel sociopathic to me - very smart people, but ruthless. The rumor is that compensation in this organization is better, although people in technology say it's the same.
Recently a large chunk of people who have a job function similar to mine were moved wholesale from technology into quants as part of a 'consolidation' effort. This is why I was offered the opportunity to move. In a few months there will almost certainly be layoffs within this group. Because my job function is somewhat between that of the two organizations, I don't think I would be vulnerable to this.
Because the perception (correctly, I think) is that quants "took over" a division of technology, there's a lot of tension because of this at the management level. So if I were to switch I would certainly antagonize people. On the other hand, if I were to decline the offer, I might also antagonize people.
From an ERE perspective, I only want to work at this company for about 3 more years. Technology is a 'safe' choice, I have no doubt that I could survive and do well for quite a long time in this organization. But it would be different than being in quants, and I would be stuck in the politically weaker group.
At this point, I really have no idea what I want to do. If I were to flip a coin, I wouldn't even hope for a certain side of the coin. I have a week to think this over and make a decision.
I've got a great opportunity right now, provided I handle it in the right way. There's two divisions in my company which both want me to work for them. They have overlapping responsibilities and that's been a big source of tension.
One organization is technology, which I currently work for. This organization has a well-defined hierarchy, handles a broad diversity of different systems, is a "safe" organization to work for. I recently switched teams within this organization, amicably, and I like the team I'm on and my manager is excellent. However, I don't have faith in technology upper management. And it's a politically weak group within the company. I feel that given my track record, even though I'm fairly junior, the organization could have given me a little more recognition.
The other organization is quants. If technology "wants to get the job done, right, but take a long time to do it," quants "want to get the job done, quickly, so long as it works." There's a broad diversity of tasks in this organization, but most of the technology is uniform. The hierarchy is somewhat amorphous. I'm on good terms with a lot of people in this organization, and it's the polically dominant group in my company. However, there's some infighting here, and the upper management feel sociopathic to me - very smart people, but ruthless. The rumor is that compensation in this organization is better, although people in technology say it's the same.
Recently a large chunk of people who have a job function similar to mine were moved wholesale from technology into quants as part of a 'consolidation' effort. This is why I was offered the opportunity to move. In a few months there will almost certainly be layoffs within this group. Because my job function is somewhat between that of the two organizations, I don't think I would be vulnerable to this.
Because the perception (correctly, I think) is that quants "took over" a division of technology, there's a lot of tension because of this at the management level. So if I were to switch I would certainly antagonize people. On the other hand, if I were to decline the offer, I might also antagonize people.
From an ERE perspective, I only want to work at this company for about 3 more years. Technology is a 'safe' choice, I have no doubt that I could survive and do well for quite a long time in this organization. But it would be different than being in quants, and I would be stuck in the politically weaker group.
At this point, I really have no idea what I want to do. If I were to flip a coin, I wouldn't even hope for a certain side of the coin. I have a week to think this over and make a decision.
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LiquidSapphire
- Posts: 510
- Joined: Thu Jul 28, 2011 6:40 pm
I think one thing to consider would be your personal work philosophy. Do you prefer to get it done and meet a deadline, with flaws, or do it right? If your philosophy is not well matched to the group, and specifically, your manager, it will introduce some stress.
The only downside to staying, it seems to me, is possibly giving up the opportunity to earn a little bit more, and the management is politically weak. I think if that group's core function is still critical (not vulnerable to outsource/completely being eradicated) then I would think about staying where you are. It just seems like the other place doesn't have as good of interpersonal dynamics, and you have a known, good, quantity where you are. To take a risk and jeopardize that I think I would want to see more gain than just a small raise and these other fringe benefits. My 2 cents!
Also, you might have the chance to move to the new group later possibly, it sounds like, but I think if you moved now, it sounds as if, politically, it would be difficult to go back to your old group if you didn't like the new situation?
The only downside to staying, it seems to me, is possibly giving up the opportunity to earn a little bit more, and the management is politically weak. I think if that group's core function is still critical (not vulnerable to outsource/completely being eradicated) then I would think about staying where you are. It just seems like the other place doesn't have as good of interpersonal dynamics, and you have a known, good, quantity where you are. To take a risk and jeopardize that I think I would want to see more gain than just a small raise and these other fringe benefits. My 2 cents!
Also, you might have the chance to move to the new group later possibly, it sounds like, but I think if you moved now, it sounds as if, politically, it would be difficult to go back to your old group if you didn't like the new situation?
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FI Fighter
- Posts: 68
- Joined: Wed Feb 08, 2012 9:00 am
- Contact:
"However, there's some infighting here, and the upper management feel sociopathic to me - very smart people, but ruthless."
The importance that work environment, day-to-day interactions make cannot be overstated.
Your situation reminds me of a decision I made not too long ago, deciding on which place to work. I left behind the safe choice with excellent manager, and instead elected to join a new company with very smart, but ruthless people. After just one year though, I regretted my choice. For myself, I chased the salary and underestimated the importance of being at a place where I was actually happy.
Since your plan is to get out after 3 years anyway,it may not matter much which group has more influence/power within the company. That is, you won't be sticking around long enough to really even notice. I would simply suggest picking the one where you feel you will be most happy. 3 years will feel like an agonizing eternity if you end up in a bad place. After one year, I was begging to go back to the old job, even with a paycut.
The importance that work environment, day-to-day interactions make cannot be overstated.
Your situation reminds me of a decision I made not too long ago, deciding on which place to work. I left behind the safe choice with excellent manager, and instead elected to join a new company with very smart, but ruthless people. After just one year though, I regretted my choice. For myself, I chased the salary and underestimated the importance of being at a place where I was actually happy.
Since your plan is to get out after 3 years anyway,it may not matter much which group has more influence/power within the company. That is, you won't be sticking around long enough to really even notice. I would simply suggest picking the one where you feel you will be most happy. 3 years will feel like an agonizing eternity if you end up in a bad place. After one year, I was begging to go back to the old job, even with a paycut.