Fox's Journey: And Onto the Sunlight!

Where are you and where are you going?
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TopHatFox
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Re: Fox's Journey: Out of the Burrow

Post by TopHatFox » Thu Jan 18, 2018 7:36 pm

Feeling pretty depressed today. It's like I wake up fine/good, go to work, and come out the other end depressed. Thinking of quitting the 50-hour/week recruiting job this weekend. Held out for a month, so this is probably a good time to call it.

Job searching here I come...

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daylen
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Re: Fox's Journey: Out of the Burrow

Post by daylen » Thu Jan 18, 2018 7:49 pm

All aboard the jobless train!

James_0011
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Re: Fox's Journey: Out of the Burrow

Post by James_0011 » Thu Jan 18, 2018 7:56 pm

Why are you quitting before you find a new job?

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daylen
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Re: Fox's Journey: Out of the Burrow

Post by daylen » Thu Jan 18, 2018 8:03 pm

@James_0011 Have you seen his savings? I say take the month off for spiritual enlightenment, but I am the last person anyone should take career advice from. :lol:

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TopHatFox
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Re: Fox's Journey: Out of the Burrow

Post by TopHatFox » Thu Jan 18, 2018 8:06 pm

Because I feel unsustainably awful every day at the office c:

Looks like the only counseling jobs I can get with a bachelor's are $11/hr. (US) Poverty here I come!

OTCW
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Re: Fox's Journey: Out of the Burrow

Post by OTCW » Thu Jan 18, 2018 8:53 pm

TopHatFox wrote:
Thu Jan 18, 2018 8:06 pm
Because I feel unsustainably awful every day at the office c:

Looks like the only counseling jobs I can get with a bachelor's are $11/hr. (US) Poverty here I come!
$11/hr is about $23,000 a year based on a 40 hour week. Don't look at it like poverty, look at how much more that is than what you can live on. Especially if that is what you want to do. Good luck with everything!

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Kriegsspiel
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Re: Fox's Journey: Out of the Burrow

Post by Kriegsspiel » Thu Jan 18, 2018 9:06 pm

And to think, you might hate counseling too! Life is a bitch.

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TopHatFox
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Re: Fox's Journey: Out of the Burrow

Post by TopHatFox » Thu Jan 18, 2018 9:28 pm

Yeah / :

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RFS
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Re: Fox's Journey: Out of the Burrow

Post by RFS » Thu Jan 18, 2018 9:44 pm

OTCW wrote:
Thu Jan 18, 2018 8:53 pm
TopHatFox wrote:
Thu Jan 18, 2018 8:06 pm
Because I feel unsustainably awful every day at the office c:

Looks like the only counseling jobs I can get with a bachelor's are $11/hr. (US) Poverty here I come!
$11/hr is about $23,000 a year based on a 40 hour week. Don't look at it like poverty, look at how much more that is than what you can live on. Especially if that is what you want to do. Good luck with everything!
^^ Great point, OTCW. From an objective perspective, it doesn't seem like you're in completely dire straits. It sounds like you just need to find work that doesn't grate against your soul & personality for several hours a day.

I wouldn't write off working as a teacher. It's a collaborative environment, your colleague's personalities will be similar to yours, there's tons of time off, and it CHANGES. I used to work in sales, and the repetition drove me crazy. You don't need to be extroverted to succeed, too. If you learn how to control your classroom and communicate with difficult kids, it's smooth sailing. Several states allow people who don't have teaching degrees to simultaneously work + get a teaching license. You could try signing up as a substitute to get a feel for it.

Also, I would suggest completing the Self Authoring Program by Jordan Peterson. This thing lowered my existential despair to almost 0.

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BRUTE
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Re: Fox's Journey: Out of the Burrow

Post by BRUTE » Thu Jan 18, 2018 10:44 pm

what if counseling sucks too? what if TopHatFox will never find his dream job? what if this is as good as it gets?

OTCW
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Re: Fox's Journey: Out of the Burrow

Post by OTCW » Thu Jan 18, 2018 11:14 pm

I will say, if you are feeling depressed, don't give up on counseling, and see a medical professional. Good luck.

classical_Liberal
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Re: Fox's Journey: Out of the Burrow

Post by classical_Liberal » Thu Jan 18, 2018 11:29 pm

I think the reason TopHatFox likes the idea of counseling is s/he derives satisfaction from having become competent at a skill, then enjoys communicating what was learned to others (ie help them).

Going from university setting as a senior who was able to successfully navigate the system without legacy contacts, debt free, and graduate with honors made TopHatFox an expert in this "field". Now, just being a FNG (fucking new girl/guy) at some job is frustrating and difficult; probably feels like more of a burden than a resource.

Becoming competent takes time. I highly encourage TopHatFox to simply pick something s/he doesn't hate and stick with it. In a year, things will be better. In two years you will be competent and can again feel like a real contributor, one that others seek out for advice (counseling). At this point you will again feel more fulfilled; probably until you achieve mastery and then want to move on. Luckily you have found the ERE concept so very early in life and will be FU or FI by the time this happens. Approach learning a new job with the same veracity you approached learning ERE or university and the process will go more quickly and be more enjoyable.

You have been born into one of the wealthiest countries of the world in an era of extreme wealth (one which will not last). Personal freedom levels are very high at present. The library of Alexandria is at your finger tips. You have already learned how to "win" at the prevailing system in five years. The world is your oyster, don't waste an opportunity most of humanity throughout the world and history have aspired towards.

Edited: fro spelling (yes I did that on purpose).

James_0011
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Re: Fox's Journey: Out of the Burrow

Post by James_0011 » Thu Jan 18, 2018 11:52 pm

@classic liberal 10/10 post

wood
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Re: Fox's Journey: Out of the Burrow

Post by wood » Fri Jan 19, 2018 4:49 am

I hate to be one to tell you this, but in all due respect: Man the f.. up!

You keep quitting, complaining, asking and worrying. It's good to be humble and seek knowledge. You seem like a very pleasant and smart guy. But like classical_Liberal said, you must realize that you are extremely privileged in the bigger scheme of things. When I read quotes like "US poverty here I come!" complaining about $11/hr in a western country and feeling "unsustainably awful every day at the office", let me remind you that there are people who just woke up this morning with no money to feed themselves and their kids, no job and no future prospects. No opportunity. Have you ever seen poverty first hand? Do you realize how lucky you are? It sounds like you don't. Of course, realizing how lucky you are won't solve the problems you have at hand. You take action and responsibility which is good. Now man up and tough it out for a while. There will be suffering no matter which way. I think you already know this.

slowtraveler
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Re: Fox's Journey: Out of the Burrow

Post by slowtraveler » Fri Jan 19, 2018 5:51 am

I still wonder why you haven't gotten in your van and started travelling around in national parks.

http://www.andybaird.com/travels/skylarking/

This guy did it with a relatively high wr and small ss.

You could also. Or find your own way.

Also $11/hr is pretty good in the grand scheme of things. If you stick to a job for a while, you'll get competent (assuming you try), build respect in the work environment, and begin to enjoy it more as you'll also slowly have more autonomy and room to suggest improvements/changes. This takes years, not months. All you need is 200k. Also, check out the Saver's Credit, maybe you qualify at the low income. Along with maybe some other cool benefits.

https://www.irs.gov/retirement-plans/pl ... ers-credit

Where's the fun THF? We're all here because we seek FI, all of us here are here because we aspire for freedom from work, are finance nerds, frugal af compared to the average person in our cohort.

Do something you can stick to. Constantly quitting sucks emotionally. Way too much time spent searching and with lifestyle friction from the constant transition. No momentum built.

That's why I say, go live in the parks for a while like you dreamed of. It'll lighten your heart. It may lead to some serendipity. It'll open you up to more possibilities than you're currently seeing.

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Gilberto de Piento
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Re: Fox's Journey: Out of the Burrow

Post by Gilberto de Piento » Fri Jan 19, 2018 10:38 am

Feeling pretty depressed today. It's like I wake up fine/good, go to work, and come out the other end depressed.
Depression can be a sign that there is a problem that needs to be solved and you need to make changes to your life, for example, leaving a job you hate. Depression can also be a chemical imbalance or mindset problem, meaning that no change is going to make you feel better until you get the underlying mental issues out of the way. Only you can really know what the problem is.

Have you thought about why you are depressed after work? Is there something particular that happens during the day that you don't like? Do you need a snack and some exercise when you get home (seriously)? Are you thinking deep existential negative thoughts all day long? It can be difficult getting used to sitting in a chair doing the same thing for ten hours a day, five days a week, if you are used to more self-directed variety.

I take the point of people saying you need to stick with something longer but having been a person who stuck with things far too long I say now is the time in your life when you should be making changes until you figure out what you like or at least don't hate. It gets harder to switch later.

Paula
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Re: Fox's Journey: Out of the Burrow

Post by Paula » Fri Jan 19, 2018 3:34 pm

I was fired from my first real job after 20 days of work. It was my dream job in a prestegious industry and I remember sitting with a friend after the first week as I fought back tears asking her how someone could do this for their whole life. Completely exhausted at the end of each day. Dead on the weekend. Truthfully, I fired myself.

The economy was bad and the only job I could get at the time was with a temp agency. That saved me. The assignments changed every few weeks and there was a scheduled end to each. I don't know how to explain it other than knowing that the end was near allowed me to get used to working long hours and the in between times allowed me to figure how how to continue to be human while working.

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TopHatFox
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Re: Fox's Journey: Out of the Burrow

Post by TopHatFox » Fri Jan 19, 2018 4:53 pm

Hahaha, man the f*ck up? Come now, not only is that such an analog phrase, but it's also exactly what I am doing. I'm taking responsibility for my work and life. I am paying for all of my expenses and coming up with plans to be happy both long term and short-term. I am actively taking care of a major health concern while concurrently figuring out a way to make a living. I have now figured out that sales and marketing is not for me. The job is the cause of the friction; it's not physiological, otherwise I'd have been feeling like for a larger part of my life. I'm now going to try counseling or healthcare.

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finity
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Re: Fox's Journey: Out of the Burrow

Post by finity » Fri Jan 19, 2018 7:10 pm

The man up was probably meant more as a "challenge yourself to drag your ass to work for a year before taking a decision". Or probably keep your job while searching for a new one. It's impossible to tell if you like the job long-term if you give yourself such a short time. It takes time to grow into a full-time occupation.

Besides that, I like your route. You're in an extremly good place at such a young age, not only financially, but also by having tried many different things in life. You're very brave in taking your direction and are ready to step up against what society calls normal. Most people would not have the courage to find their way to live the life they want. It's just that you could give things a little more time. Relax and "enjoy" the 9-5 torture. 8-) It's an experience after all, isn't it? Imagine yourself looking back in 5 years, thanking your past self to have suffered for your 5-year-into-the-future-self.

FIREing in 5 years will be an even better feeling when you felt the burn of what other people endure their whole life.

Disclaimer: I can't really speak about this, as I work for a very good company. It took me the better part of two years to adjust to the time-sucking black-hole of 9-5 work (and I work less than 40h/week on average). Work life in Europe may be easier, but it will take me longer to retire (because ... taxes). You may be more of a european fit than an american one, in terms of work-culture :geek:

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finity
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Re: Fox's Journey: Out of the Burrow

Post by finity » Sat Jan 20, 2018 2:33 pm

You may also want to listen to this amazing piece about american work culture, which kind of shocked and amazed me :shock:
https://www.thisamericanlife.org/513/129-cars

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