A Journey of Mindfulness--the Remaking of Life in Midstream.

Where are you and where are you going?
IlliniDave
Posts: 3035
Joined: Wed Apr 02, 2014 7:46 pm

Re: A Journey of Mindfulness--the Remaking of Life in Midstream.

Post by IlliniDave »

2017 July Update

Dull [Lack of] Numbers:

I did finally manage to get my June expenses tallied, but haven't completed July yet. I'll update over the weekend. What I can say is that July spending will be relatively high for having picked up another guitar toy. Still have 1-2 more items on my wish list, maybe. But I could call it good now and not feel deprived.

I'll also have to update later on the state of the stash. Ballpark I think invested assets will be up maybe about $8K after I crunch the numbers.

IRL:

Should wind down on the last big sprint of my professional career in the next ten days. I realize now that I am pretty run down from it. Working like this never fazed me as a younger man, but as my doc likes to remind me, I'm not 25 y.o. any more. :lol: I'm really looking forward to taking a breath and being in a better position to devote more to the day-to-day process of living.

I'm also starting to plan a trip up to my end-of-the-road hideout. With everything involved in the final stages of my mom's illness and her passing, I didn't make it up at all last year, and the side of me hopelessly connected to the Northwoods is needing some attention, haha. Part of it will be occupied with getting a plan finalized for the cabin's "foundation" (pads/piers). But the more I think about it the more days I'm adding to my time up there as play days, although I do want to spend the bulk of my time off back home with family.

The aforementioned winding down of a demanding task at works marks the end of one facet of my career. The same is true for my primary colleague on the job. We mention it frequently, and it's like another layer of the veil between me and future me is being drawn to the side. I've found it interesting how different people respond to me as the end nears, something I might have more to say about at a later time. My thoughts have been more attuned to how I am responding to other people at this same juncture.

Increasingly I find myself categorizing people as either "of the past" or "of the future". (What happened to "of the present"? Need to think more about that.)

For those around me who will ultimately reside in the "of the past" bucket, I'm generally anxious to show as much kindness as I can. Among other things that means I've been accepting more social invitations which add to my overall workload as an introvert (albeit a "high functioning" one). I'm about at my max duty cycle for engaging with the majority-extrovert world, something around 40%, and I can't sustain that indefinitely. Somewhat paradoxically, I can also sense that I'm beginning to pull away from these same people. Creates sort of a dream world vibe.

When it comes to those in the "of the future" bucket I've caught myself starting to reach out more to non-relatives back home I've kept in touch with over the years. I'm not going to throw in the towel completely, but it's not looking likely that friendships which have grown stale are going to be reinvigorated simply by my hanging my hat in closer geographic proximity. I should have, and mostly did, expect that's how it would be.

That will leave me in the dreaded dilemma zone for introverts--having to establish new social ties. And I'll have to do it without the social structure of a job to jumpstart the process. I'll have family to tide me over, which should be sufficient. Like most families, mine has some dysfunction, but for the most part they are good people that I've never felt were an unreasonable burden. However, I will need to branch out considerably as time goes on. This isn't something I worry about, I tend to find friendly relationships in all kinds of ways, it's just a matter of investing a little in some of them so they blossom beyond acquaintanceship. The only real difference compared to past analogous junctures is that I intend to base things more on overlapping interests than in circumstance.

All that has mostly been simmering in the background and this is the first time I've tried to organize the thoughts. More in the foreground events have conspired to make me again keenly aware of my "introvert's curse"--no matter how true my intentions or affections, in time I always wind up hurting people simply because of the deepest wiring of who I am. If I was a stereotype tough guy I suppose I wouldn't care about collateral damage, say the burden is on them to adapt to me, but I'm not really that sort of tough guy, so there it is. Figuring out how to thread the needle will, as always, be a challenging endeavor. And who knows, someday I may get it right! :)

User avatar
Bankai
Posts: 816
Joined: Fri Jul 25, 2014 5:28 am

Re: A Journey of Mindfulness--the Remaking of Life in Midstream.

Post by Bankai »

IlliniDave wrote:
Thu Aug 01, 2019 7:18 am
"introvert's curse"--no matter how true my intentions or affections, in time I always wind up hurting people simply because of the deepest wiring of who I am.
Can you elaborate on this as I'm not sure what do you mean? I'm (very) introverted myself but I'm not aware of anyone being harmed by my need to recharge or my dislike of crowds. Are all the people around you expect you to be outgoing 100% of the time?

7Wannabe5
Posts: 6217
Joined: Fri Oct 18, 2013 9:03 am
Location: Clinton River Watershed

Re: A Journey of Mindfulness--the Remaking of Life in Midstream.

Post by 7Wannabe5 »

@Bankai:

Because sometimes women feel hurt or angry if a man is too slow in his deliberations and/or mechanisms. Introversion and pace are not necessarily correlated in all realms, but it is likely that rate of communication or forwarding-the-ball would apply.

I know this because I belonged to a post-divorce support group which had a fairly wide variety of MBTI members and the "I" guys were always telling me not to let the "E" guys I dated steal the ball from me so fast.

I would suppose that same rule of thumb would apply to general social functioning like keeping in touch with old friends.

User avatar
Bankai
Posts: 816
Joined: Fri Jul 25, 2014 5:28 am

Re: A Journey of Mindfulness--the Remaking of Life in Midstream.

Post by Bankai »

Interesting. I think about ppl I care about much more often than I reach out to them. I might think about a friend 20 times in a week but only send him a single text. Are you suggesting reaching out much more and not waiting until 'I should really get in touch with X' bar reaches 300%?

7Wannabe5
Posts: 6217
Joined: Fri Oct 18, 2013 9:03 am
Location: Clinton River Watershed

Re: A Journey of Mindfulness--the Remaking of Life in Midstream.

Post by 7Wannabe5 »

@Bankai:

Err on the side of "yes", but it varies? Although I am extroverted relative to this forum, I am still just below the 50th percentile for general population, so I have been in relationships where I was confused/hurt by lack of communication, but also relationships where I felt overwhelmed by seeming demands of communication or activity. For instance, yesterday evening I felt compelled to drag myself away from my books and sit on some bleachers while my SO hit golf balls. Every relationship is unique.

User avatar
Bankai
Posts: 816
Joined: Fri Jul 25, 2014 5:28 am

Re: A Journey of Mindfulness--the Remaking of Life in Midstream.

Post by Bankai »

I generally agree, although some diplomacy is advisable, else one might find oneself divorced, homeless, jobless and friendless fairly soon. As for my (few) friends, we generally require about the same amount of interaction. The one very extroverted friend has a lot going on in his life and is spreading attention across multiple fronts, therefore is happy with once-every-couple-of-weeks communication/hanging out, while others are also introverts. I'm not interested in bad matches, would rather read a book or lift some weights.

7Wannabe5
Posts: 6217
Joined: Fri Oct 18, 2013 9:03 am
Location: Clinton River Watershed

Re: A Journey of Mindfulness--the Remaking of Life in Midstream.

Post by 7Wannabe5 »

Bankai wrote:some diplomacy is advisable
True. The introverted female protagonist of a novel I just finished chased her new BF away by telling him she needed more space in ungracious manner, but then got him back by saying "Being with you is just as lovely as being alone." Whereas, my extremely introverted ex-husband once told me "I dislike you less than almost all other humans." which was kind of amusing until it really wasn't. So, I also agree that sustainability is key.

IlliniDave
Posts: 3035
Joined: Wed Apr 02, 2014 7:46 pm

Re: A Journey of Mindfulness--the Remaking of Life in Midstream.

Post by IlliniDave »

Bankai wrote:
Thu Aug 01, 2019 8:24 am
Can you elaborate on this as I'm not sure what do you mean? I'm (very) introverted myself but I'm not aware of anyone being harmed by my need to recharge or my dislike of crowds. Are all the people around you expect you to be outgoing 100% of the time?
Hi Bankai, here's my answer to your question. I haven't read everyone else's take on my answer to the question, so if they are right, I apologize for being repetitive.

One of the key aspects to being an introvert of the type I am is having a strong need to "recharge" alone. It can be any type of stress or exhaustion that triggers it, but the strongest urge comes after extended exposure to the majority-extrovert world. It often comes, therefore, at the worst possible times like holidays and whatnot. Part of my internal stew is that I'm fairly personable (what I called a high-functioning introvert above) but my introvert characteristics are very strong: the I in my INTP/J is very skewed compared to the others. Since I'm not shy or withdrawn people of the majority-extrovert world seem to have a hard time understanding my behavior in that regard. I can be perfectly "normal" for extended periods of time, but eventually I'll need to recharge, meaning I'll need to carve out some dedicated alone time.

The problems that causes is most obvious in "relationships" or potential relationships, but it has affected friends, colleagues/coworkers, and even family members. The need to be "away" part of the time on an ongoing basis seems to invariably hurt people's feelings as they tend to at some point take it personally. No amount of explaining can convince them it's not "them", since generally being extroverts they fundamentally don't understand the need. I didn't really realize it about myself either until first the offending behaviors were pointed out to me, and then later I was able to connect it specifically to introversion as I learned more about that. It could be that how your introversion manifests is different enough that you don't trigger the same response I do. One thing I think gives me trouble is that I don't necessarily come across as an introvert in a lot of settings.

IlliniDave
Posts: 3035
Joined: Wed Apr 02, 2014 7:46 pm

Re: A Journey of Mindfulness--the Remaking of Life in Midstream.

Post by IlliniDave »

Bigato, dunno whether refining vocabulary would change much, but you are zeroing in towards the crux of it. There is, or can be, of course, a distinction between shy/withdrawn and introverted. I don't know if there are shy/withdrawn extroverts, but there are introverts who aren't globally shy/withdrawn. For me it's a conditional thing. In small groups with ~1-3 other people I can usually be an equal participant, but as the groups grow to 5 or 10 or more people simultaneously interacting, I start to fade a little. It's not like I get all twisted up and blushing if someone in a larger group says something to draw the group's attention to me, it's more like I just slip into an observer/listener role. But even that doesn't get to the heart of introversion as it affects me, which is the need for a measure of "quieter" surroundings to make everything balance out over longer time frames. You're right that conflating introversion and those painfully shy people we all run across from time-to-time likely sets the stage for me to be a disharmonious presence. And even having a nascent awareness of it, I've yet to find a way to successfully mitigate it.

Gilberto de Piento
Posts: 1531
Joined: Tue Nov 12, 2013 10:23 pm

Re: A Journey of Mindfulness--the Remaking of Life in Midstream.

Post by Gilberto de Piento »

This is an interesting conversation. In my life it took me awhile to figure out how to stay recharged and I'm still struggling with how to make sure it happens. I've found that living with another person makes it very difficult for me to truly "wind down." The trick is that I need an hour or two every few days where I am alone and doing something that requires no physical or mental effort. Working on a project or solving a problem or working out won't do it. Unfortunately it is difficult to read a book or watch TV alone in my own room for an hour without being perceived as a jerk, even after explaining the issue a number of times.

IlliniDave
Posts: 3035
Joined: Wed Apr 02, 2014 7:46 pm

Re: A Journey of Mindfulness--the Remaking of Life in Midstream.

Post by IlliniDave »

bigato, that sounds like quite a bind your friend contends with.

GdP, It's been a while since I lived with anyone, so I guess I'm getting spoiled. I don't know if I could get by on an hour or two every few days. But for me activity/project time can work if it's not too intense--anything where I can get into a mindfulness head space. For reasons of which I only know a fraction I've tended in the past to get paired up with extroverts, which of course exacerbated the tension. You could say I was a slow learner, but at least now I know a few things not to do going forward.

Jason

Re: A Journey of Mindfulness--the Remaking of Life in Midstream.

Post by Jason »

An extrovert that has social phobia? That's like being a doctor who faints at the site of blood.

7Wannabe5
Posts: 6217
Joined: Fri Oct 18, 2013 9:03 am
Location: Clinton River Watershed

Re: A Journey of Mindfulness--the Remaking of Life in Midstream.

Post by 7Wannabe5 »

It's easier to see it in young children or nature. For instance, a rabbit is shy and extroverted.

George the original one
Posts: 5356
Joined: Wed Jul 28, 2010 3:28 am
Location: Wettest corner of Orygun

Re: A Journey of Mindfulness--the Remaking of Life in Midstream.

Post by George the original one »

Jason wrote:
Sun Aug 04, 2019 9:47 am
That's like being a doctor who faints at the site of blood.
You just described an ex-girlfriend of mine.

IlliniDave
Posts: 3035
Joined: Wed Apr 02, 2014 7:46 pm

Re: A Journey of Mindfulness--the Remaking of Life in Midstream.

Post by IlliniDave »

Received some disturbing news regarding life at the end of the road. Last time I was up, two years ago, two of the cabins in the little Common Interest Community changed owners. Both happened to close while I was there but I didn't meet any of the new neighbors. In anticipation of my trip up in about 3 weeks I was talking to one of my "old" neighbors. He enthusiastically reported that with the arrival of a couple younger couples, quite a social life has sprung up in the neighborhood. Card games, cookouts, and group fishing outings. The downside is that it might take some diplomatic maneuvering to keep from being drawn in without being to non-neighborly. The upside is that it sounds like it's a pretty well established group now so my absence won't be disruptive, and it's seemingly all couples which sort of gives me an out.

I'd already started making arrangements to do some undeveloped land scouting while I'm up there. Now I'm motivated to make sure that happens. I'd hate to have to give up my lakeside perch on the edge of the wilderness area, so hopefully my imagination is just getting a little carried away and I won't find the Northwoods' equivalent of Spring Break going on up there. :lol:

IlliniDave
Posts: 3035
Joined: Wed Apr 02, 2014 7:46 pm

Re: A Journey of Mindfulness--the Remaking of Life in Midstream.

Post by IlliniDave »

bigato, the "lol" at the end was to signify the entry was a bit tongue-in-cheek. There's probably a remote chance I'll find the neighbors and their effect unbearable, but people drawn to the area tend to appreciate the tranquil environment, so I suspect you're right and it won't be anything out of hand.

Jason

Re: A Journey of Mindfulness--the Remaking of Life in Midstream.

Post by Jason »

IlliniDave wrote:
Tue Aug 13, 2019 7:34 am
Card games, cookouts, and group fishing outings.
Obviously, someone from the unlit cigar demographic needs to step in and tell these city types that this is not the place for that type of yankee camping.

GandK
Posts: 2018
Joined: Mon Sep 19, 2011 1:00 pm

Re: A Journey of Mindfulness--the Remaking of Life in Midstream.

Post by GandK »

IlliniDave wrote:
Thu Aug 01, 2019 7:18 am
... I tend to find friendly relationships in all kinds of ways, it's just a matter of investing a little in some of them so they blossom beyond acquaintanceship. The only real difference compared to past analogous junctures is that I intend to base things more on overlapping interests than in circumstance.

All that has mostly been simmering in the background and this is the first time I've tried to organize the thoughts. More in the foreground events have conspired to make me again keenly aware of my "introvert's curse"--no matter how true my intentions or affections, in time I always wind up hurting people simply because of the deepest wiring of who I am. If I was a stereotype tough guy I suppose I wouldn't care about collateral damage, say the burden is on them to adapt to me, but I'm not really that sort of tough guy, so there it is. Figuring out how to thread the needle will, as always, be a challenging endeavor. And who knows, someday I may get it right! :)
Catching up on journals.

I resonate painfully with the above.

That said: as it relates to retirement and moving and your potentially noisy new neighbors :), is it possible you're ruling out a new potential good friend before they've had a chance? In any group I find myself in there tends to be one - if only one - person I'm glad I met afterward.

7Wannabe5
Posts: 6217
Joined: Fri Oct 18, 2013 9:03 am
Location: Clinton River Watershed

Re: A Journey of Mindfulness--the Remaking of Life in Midstream.

Post by 7Wannabe5 »

For some reason this journal entry reminds me of a flip-book of still images drawn on the bottom corners of a lively novel. Like Dave's new young neighbors will all be on their second marriages and their kids will be the ones getting drunk and playing Eucre by the time he finally moves up there.

suomalainen
Posts: 734
Joined: Sat Oct 18, 2014 12:49 pm

Re: A Journey of Mindfulness--the Remaking of Life in Midstream.

Post by suomalainen »

See, my first reaction/thought to the “young couples” invading (can I say invading any more?) the neighborhood and the impact on a confirmed bachelor was “wilderness swinger parties”. So...yeah, I don’t think that has any real relevance to anything, but thought I’d share. Back to regularly scheduled programming...

Post Reply