Too Old To Retire "Young"

[DutchGirl]

Nice bills. And your house sounds great. Small enough to allow for cleaning it in a few hours, too.

[TheFrugalFox]

I actually dislike large houses. Massive rooms that always seem empty, soulless. I am much more "hobbit like" I guess, and prefer comfortable and homely over looks any day. That said, I like a big workshop - more space for more tools - minimalism goes out the window..

[EdithKeeler]

It’s been a while since I’ve updated, mostly because nothing new or interesting has been going on. Still working, still frustrated over changes at my company, still socking money away so I can escape as soon as possible, debt is going down, net worth is increasing. It’s all good. Oh, and I’ve started working on a novel.

I did have an interesting conversation with a friend this week, who suggested I sell my out-of-state rental house and the house I currently live in and “buy something nicer” over in her part of town. Well, my house here is OK—I talked about it in an earlier post. I have a nice big fenced and wooded yard for my dogs, and my neighbors are friendly enough, but not too, and mostly we leave each other alone, which is exactly the way I like it. No tyrannical homeowner’s association to tell me my front door is the wrong color.

I didn’t want to get into too many details of my finances, but I explained that I’d pretty much decided to stay put for now, because my house is super-cheap (about $150/month to live there, plus utilities and maintenance) and that low amount was a pretty small percentage of my income, and the savings is going to allow me to retire or take another job making less money pretty soon.

The thing was, I was kind of insulted. There was a judgment being made in that comment about my house, about my neighborhood, about the lifestyle I’ve chosen for myself, and it kind of ticked me off. It made me realize how hard it can be to swim against the riptide of prevailing culture. People have made comments to me at work about “Did you see that TV show? Oh, yeah, that’s right, you don’t have a TV.” Sure, it’s a statement of fact, and I don’t know that there’s a judgment per se being made there... but I do think that most people think I’m kind of weird. (If they only knew how much TV I watch over the internet, and I’ve tried to explain that I do watch many of the same shows that they do... but I’m still weird, I guess, because I’m not paying Comcast a ton of money every month for a bunch of other channels I don’t watch).

Another friend commented that I “never go on vacation.” Well, I don’t travel much, it’s true. I find a week off work, staying at home, catching up on chores, walking my dogs, etc. is a really nice way to spend time. And I do travel some—when I have to travel for work, which is occasional, I try to maximize that and see other things and people while I’m there, take an extra day, etc. I have absolutely NO interest in taking a cruise, and while I do want to travel to a few places in Europe, I’m not quite ready to do that yet. One helpful friend suggested “you’re not getting any younger, and it gets harder to travel as you age.” Well, that may be true. But it’s also harder to leave the country when I have a fragile mother to be concerned about, too many dogs to board, etc. Plus, I just like being at home. Travel to me can be very stressful, especially when I’m trying to fit it into my allotted week of vacation time from work.

So, save me from well-meaning friends who seem to think I’m denying myself all the pleasures of life. Really, I’m not. My house is cozy, and I am going to do some small upgrades here in a few months. I don’t miss having a TV. “Vacation” and “travel” are not synonyms to me. And friends, let’s talk again after I retire in a couple of years and you're still schlepping off to work, and let's see if you still see things the same way.

[jacob]

"It ought to be remembered that there is nothing more difficult to take in hand, more perilous to conduct, or more uncertain in its success, than to take the lead in the introduction of a new order of things. Because the innovator has for enemies all those who have done well under the old conditions, and lukewarm defenders in those who may do well under the new. This coolness arises partly from fear of the opponents, who have the laws on their side, and partly from the incredulity of men, who do not readily believe in new things until they have had a long experience of them." - Machiavelli

H/T Ermine

[steveo73]

Another friend commented that I “never go on vacation.” Well, I don’t travel much, it’s true. I find a week off work, staying at home, catching up on chores, walking my dogs, etc. is a really nice way to spend time.

This is what myself and my wife do as well. We have 3 kids and people at work and friends of my kids go on overseas holidays all the time. It seems crazy to me but there is no idea our approach is an outlier.

I can't justify the cost of traveling. I just don't see how there is any value for money.

[Carlos]

I did have an interesting conversation with a friend this week, who suggested I sell my out-of-state rental house and the house I currently live in and “buy something nicer” over in her part of town.

Was it a good friend? Perhaps they had no idea it might be an insulting comment but rather they intended it to be a smart lifestyle move. To most people Nice house produces more happiness than two Average houses.

To us forumites the rental income and low overhead produce more life satisfaction through freedom and lack of stress.

It's sort of like someone saying - what do you mean you can't afford to go on the cruise with us, just apply for a credit card and charge it! That's what we're doing!

[IlliniDave]

If it makes you feel any better, I get some of the same grief. I'm occasionally counseled I need to spend "some of that money" or "live a little". I think mostly the people are well-meaning, just incapable or unwilling to allow that there are standards of happiness (or contentedness or whatever) different from their own. It is aggravating at times, but I've learned to just focus on my breathing and thank them for trying to help. That's a pretty good indicator of my growth as a person--not so long ago I would have argued with them and preached my outlook until I drove them away.

This is an adaptation of something that I don't even remember where I stole it from, but a pretty good motto for me:

The joy you find at the top of the mountain is the joy you carried up with you.

[EdithKeeler]

It's so fun when you find a member of your tribe.

I was talking to a guy I've known for years, not close, just a lawyer I work with from time to time. I don't know how we got on the subject, but we started talking about bargain shopping and buying used at Goodwill and Habitat for Humanity, etc. It was fun, because we both live in the same city, but both spend a lot of time in another city, and we were giving each other tips about great places to buy used, estate sales, etc.

This is a guy that can probably afford to buy whatever he wants, whenever he wants, but he sort of shrugged and was like "you can find a lot of good used stuff," and "why pay all that sales tax on expensive new stuff when you don't have to."

I dunno. I just love it when I have a chance encounter with a fellow frugal person, who's pretty open and unapologetic about it.

[EdithKeeler]

A guy that I worked closely with at my company (in another office) retired July 1. Not super-early retirement but early by most standards; he's 60. Very healthy and in shape; before he retired he expressed that he was looking forward to it, spending more time with family, doing a couple of hobbies, working on a little side thing he does. He's a very smart man; big reader, interested in a very wide variety of things, one of those guys when they get into something they read every book on the subject and make themselves an expert.

It's October. He's calling all the people he worked with "to chat." He's apparently bored. He runs and swims every morning, has finished all his big projects he wanted to get done around the house, etc. After just a few months, he's kind of at loose ends.

I just think that's really... sad. And not what I would have expected from this fellow. Geeze, I hope I'm not like that!!

[GandK]

I felt that a little, but in my case it was about not having my preferred level of adult interaction and intelligent conversation, not about boredom.

These forums help.

Yours is one of my favorite journals, Edith. Thank you for sharing your thoughts.

[Ego]

I just think that's really... sad. And not what I would have expected from this fellow. Geeze, I hope I'm not like that!!

My dad had the same problem and didn't live long after retiring. I've been thinking lately about how one might recognize this before retirement. I wonder if a grass-is-always-greener outlook might be a good indicator.

[steveo73]

I just think that's really... sad. And not what I would have expected from this fellow. Geeze, I hope I'm not like that!!

This is a concern isn't it. I really want to retire and I'm 41. This might be old by ERE standards however I think at 50 I should really be done. I don't want to end up like that guy.

In stating that I think I'm basically lazy so maybe I'll be cool.

[steelerfan]

I just think that's really... sad. And not what I would have expected from this fellow. Geeze, I hope I'm not like that!!

This is a concern isn't it. I really want to retire and I'm 41. This might be old by ERE standards however I think at 50 I should really be done. I don't want to end up like that guy.

It's a big concern for me. As a non-ERE person that would still like to retire in my fifties I can sadly identify with him. Boomers are wrapped up in their work identities. My favorite hobby is a work skill (programming) and I am an accountant (sick). I am trying to break out of this mind set and am trying to get DWs mind wrapped around leaving. We could do it right now financially other than the kids in HS if we were to downsize. She has her identity wrapped up in the kids lives and they are breaking away as they should. I want to retire in 4 years when my youngest goes to college.

My MIL is 82 years old and she still is working on the road travelling 85% of the year. DW has mentioned that that will be her.... I am terrified my wife will never want to quit or will spiral into a deep depression when we pull the trigger. I start the conversation that we could walk away and am planning some trips but who knows? Some people will never quit and will never be happy unless they are working.

[IlliniDave]

I guess that's one of those things where you'll learn about yourself when the time comes. I don't see it as a concern, just a possibility, and one of the reasons I intend to be very open-minded. Maybe I'll wind up with some sort of paid occupation, maybe I'll find a volunteer niche, or maybe I'll just wallow in leisure. I wouldn't see any one of those as more of a success or more of a failure than the others. For me it's more about location, which precludes any more than a token possibility of me returning to my employer. I probably will keep in touch with some of my current coworkers, at least for a time. My dad who's been retired for over 10 years now still plays golf and poker on a regular basis with some of his former colleagues. But he's the kind of guy who is never bored, even when he's not doing anything particular. Luckily I seem to have the same trait. Maybe the key is that if you get bored easily now, you're more likely to find yourself bored in retirement.

[steveo73]

Some people will never quit and will never be happy unless they are working.

My FIL is really rich. I'm talking like 30-50 millions of dollars wealth and yet he still works. He has said that he will die working.

In stating that he is also frugal and supports my FIRE plan whereas my parents think I'm crazy.

[steveo73]

But he's the kind of guy who is never bored, even when he's not doing anything particular.

I'm the same way so I think I'll be cool. I sometimes worry though what I'll do as the body slows down. I'm 41 now and I can feel myself slowing down and being a little more vulnerable.

[George the original one]

But he's the kind of guy who is never bored, even when he's not doing anything particular.

I'm the same way so I think I'll be cool. I sometimes worry though what I'll do as the body slows down. I'm 41 now and I can feel myself slowing down and being a little more vulnerable.

Now is the time to address those concerns of slowing down. Figure out what falls into "resistance is futile" and what falls into "change a habit to repair".

For instance: weight gain & stamina can be fixed, but eyesight degeneration can only be slowed (maybe). Using caution, even excessive caution, to avoid injuries while staying active helps. Learn how to fall down (regular occurrence in my fishing, LOL).

[Tyler9000]

It's October. He's calling all the people he worked with "to chat." He's apparently bored. He runs and swims every morning, has finished all his big projects he wanted to get done around the house, etc. After just a few months, he's kind of at loose ends.

I just think that's really... sad. And not what I would have expected from this fellow. Geeze, I hope I'm not like that!!

Eh... I think I'd cut him a little slack. He's allowed an adjustment period, and I personally think boredom is very underrated by habitually overworked people.

And for me, maintaining relationships with previous coworkers would be a positive outcome. I'm more discouraged by the times when I've worked with people for years and considered them friends but then never spoken with them again after leaving the company.

[steveo73]

Now is the time to address those concerns of slowing down. Figure out what falls into "resistance is futile" and what falls into "change a habit to repair".

For instance: weight gain & stamina can be fixed, but eyesight degeneration can only be slowed (maybe). Using caution, even excessive caution, to avoid injuries while staying active helps. Learn how to fall down (regular occurrence in my fishing, LOL).

Yep. I do jiu-jitsu which is tough on your body. I find if I don't stretch and massage my back with a tennis ball my body just goes to crap. I have also put on some extra weight. I didn't even notice and then the other day I realized my shirt is too tight.

I think there are financial criteria to reach prior to retiring but also non-financial stuff such as my health.

[EdithKeeler]

So hitting the big 5-0 has not been nearly as traumatic as I thought it would be. I took the whole week off last week—had a “staycation” where I stayed in town and did some things I’d been wanting to do, did some chores and projects around the house that I’d been putting off for no good reasons, and most of all, kind of took stock of life.

And came to the conclusion that all things considered, it’s pretty damn good. Yeah, I’m not super crazy about my job, but there’s more to life than work, and the job allows me to do a lot of things I want to do. So for right now, I’m staying put. I’m mostly over that whole “I’m supposed to have a corner office and a team to work for me.” Not that life is about comparison, but financially I’m doing so much better than SO many people, I have nothing to complain about.

My week off did show me that unless I have something to work on (side job, etc.) it’s going to be pretty easy to briggle away a ton of time. I slept in every day (it was wonderful), getting up about 8 or 8:30. I fixed breakfast for myself several days, which is a luxury I just really enjoy. There’s something about making and sitting down to a simple, hearty breakfast/brunch of (don’t lecture me, health nuts) of eggs, potatoes, bacon or sausage and good hot coffee that just sets the day for me (I’m a farmer’s granddaughter...). For the record, when I have a big breakfast, I don’t eat again until dinner. And I took the dogs to the park for a good walk. By the time I did all that, it was well after noon. When I’m at work, I’ve accomplished most of my tasks for the day by noon, so having breakfast and walking the dogs is not all that impressive. I also think that without something, I’ll become pretty anti-social. I had two entire days where I didn’t leave the house at all (didn’t mind a bit), but in general, that’s probably not a good habit to get into.

Most important, during my time off, I kind of figured out a business I want to try my hand at. It’s something I’ve had in the back of my mind for a long time, and found a ton of reasons/excuses not to try to do it. Well, today I took the concrete step of registering my domain name. Seems like a big step to me!! Maybe there’s something about getting a little bit older that makes you realize that 1) life goes by a lot faster than you thought it would, so why wait and 2) failure, if it happens, is not fatal and 3) there are solutions to financial issues and questions that used to feel insurmountable and 4) for me, I’ve spent a lot of life worrying about how family would react to things and trying to get approval that I’ve finally realized I’m never going to get anyway, so I might as well please myself.

So, here I am. More on the business thing later, at some point—a lot of stuff to do there. But I feel really good about things—better than I’ve felt in a long time. Life is good.