Too Old To Retire "Young"

[1taskaday]

Glad you got through this ordeal ok.

A wake-up call...

[7Wannabe5]

Ouch! The 50s aren't always so nifty

[Sclass]

Glad that worked out well for you.

My dad had a ruptured/infected gall bladder and it was removed. It was bad. He developed pancreatitis. He almost died. As bad as it was for you it could have been way worse.

If you can live on $25k income and that is what you file on your taxes, you’ll be eligible for premium assistance under Obamacare. Not sure if this will all be there when you pull the ripcord. It was kind of a shock to me when I realized my tax and insurance costs went way down when I retired. I really didn’t need as much income as I had thought given these two large controls.

Get strong.

[EdithKeeler]

I've been spending some time looking around and thinking about my next step. I want to step out of my current role soon (see journal) but am not quite ready to completely quit working. Mostly because 1) health insurance 2) I'd like to earn a little money--not a ton--to bridge the gap for a few years and 3) social reasons. I can do without company-provided health insurance if I make a little more money, so I am flexible.

My relatively successful 32-year career doesn't translate into anything obvious. As an insurance claims person, I know a lot of stuff about insurance, policies, analyzing liability and damages, contract analysis, negotiating, legal processes and strategy, managing people, customer service, etc. I have all kinds of certifications and licenses in the field. But I'm really having a tough time seeing ways to leverage those skills into other jobs, especially jobs that are part time and, well, sort of easy. If I lived in a metro area with a big insurance presence, I'd probably just pick up some temp work for a while--work until a job ran out, take some time off, then sign back up again and temp some more. But alas, I'm in a city where I currently work for a company with the ONLY claims department in town--all 4 of us. Lots of adjusters work remote, but typically not on a temp basis. And if I do adjusting work, I really only want part time or periodic. If I can't get that, might as well keep on doing what I'm doing. Changing jobs at my current company is not an option.

Ideally, I'd like to do something completely different. I've thought several times about teaching, and while that would be more of a work time commitment than I'd like, it's something I've considered off and on for years, so maybe I should look at scratching that itch. Problem is, I'd have to go back to school to get a teaching degree (state rule). Used to be you could get a teaching certificate if you had a degree and passed certain tests, but not anymore. There are provisions for getting that teaching cert while teaching... but boy, going back to school and paying for three years' worth of classes to effectively take a $60K cut in pay from my current job seems supremely stupid, even if it does come with 2 months off in the summer.

I did look at teacher assistant jobs--they pay a whopping $15 an hour, which seems ridiculously low. (But also more than substitute teachers make, assuming an 8 hour day!). That might be something I might consider, but only if close by to my house--not worth it to drive all over town for that.

After my recent hospital stay, I started looking at hospital jobs. TON of them in my city because we have a medical school and teaching hospital, plus many other hospitals, including St. Jude. Just Googling open positions at hospitals in town was eye-opening. Tons and tons of jobs--for nurses, doctors, various technologists (like ultrasound, etc.). For someone starting a career, it seems like a no-brainer to get involved in the medical field. But of course I have no education in that, and while I suppose I could go back to school... meh. Same objection as above.

I did see open positions for "Patient Transport" person--basically wheeling people around the hospital from x-ray to ER to ultrasound back to wherever. Totally within my wheelhouse, would give some good exercise and a lot of people contact, which I really want, so that might be something to think about, too. No idea what it pays, but I'm guessing not much, and probably not even as much as the teacher assistant gig. But would definitely up the step count, and that would be a good thing.

Another thing I've thought about is medical transportation. I'm a good driver, spotless driving record, and well, I love to drive. I've actually had a lot of contact in my current job, as well as with my mom's situation, with the medical transport business. It pays a whopping $10 an hour. I know I'm looking to take a cut in pay... but wow. $10 an hour? Figuring a 20 hour work week, that's $800 a month before taxes, etc.; $1600 a month if full time? I mean, I said I'd like to earn a little money, but... that's damn little. I could get a job as a babysitter and make more. And there's no upside like the patient transport gig where I'd be getting a lot of walking exercise in.

I could probably figure out a way to do some consulting work... maybe. It's hard to see who might hire me over a lawyer to do what I do. I'm kinda poo-pooing that, plus again, the regional issue of no companies in the area. I could be an independent adjuster, but no one hires them part time, and the full time gig would be as many hours or more as I'm working now, for less money. So why bother. More stress and less money? Awesome!!

I've thought about buying a couple more rental properties. That gets me money.... but not the social aspect I'd like, and that's so passive once it gets going, I'd be looking for stuff to do. Plus I don't want to be lopsided in terms of investments.... one rental for now seems like plenty.

I've thought about starting a small business--dog walking/concierge services. Start up costs would be minimal--just need to get bonded--and I could probably eventually get enough business doing word of mouth stuff at the dog park I regularly go to. (Problem is: all my dog park friends are getting older and retiring and have less need of dog-walking/concierge services). But that one is actually do-able, and i have some ideas jotted down to do that. Of course, can't get it going until I quit my current job, so there'll be a pretty good lag at first. But still do-able.

Other small business: DBF has pushed me for years to buy a food truck or do a tiny restaurant/pop-up, etc. but frankly.... that's just too many hours and too much work. Import something and sell it? Maybe, but no idea what.

I don't code. Suppose I could learn that, but doesn't particularly appeal. Again: my next job needs to have a social aspect.

I am planning on buckling down on my writing and thoroughly exploring Kindle publishing this year. I have some stuff to say about single women, money, savings, investing, as well as dealing with elderly parents' issues, so I'm starting to work on that. That might bring in a few bucks, but doesn't meet the social part (until I go on the book-signing circuit, hahaha).

If I stay where I'm at, in a couple of years, I could probably approach my boss about working part time... I know he'd go for it if the situation is similar to now. He wouldn't go for it now, however, due to some stuff going on at the company, and frankly, in a couple of years I won't NEED/want to go part time. Maybe something to think about in 6 months, but the time is NOT right currently.

As I write all this, i realize how relatively privileged I am to have this "problem." You know, the "problem" of having almost enough money to quit, the "problem" of having a really good job with really good benefits that makes it hard to settle for something "less" even when it's a conscious choice to do so, for some pretty specific reasons. The "problem" of having sucked on the corporate teat for so many years it's hard to imagine doing anything else. The "problem" of having enough smarts and ability to probably do a ton of things if I put my mind to it--(and the very real problem of convincing something to hire me at my age to do it). The "problem" of having a giant list of things I want to do in my free time... if I only had free time. (I talked to a friend yesterday--she'll be 66 later this year--and she told me she doesn't plan to EVER retire because 1) she can't afford to and 2) she has no idea what in the world she'd do all day without a job to go to. I thought "Good god, wanna see my list???").

[horsewoman]

Regarding PT-Jobs - I don't know how insurance agencies are set up in the US but here in Germany all large companies have franchise offices where the insurance reps work on a self-employed basis. I'm an office clerk with no training in insurance, but I used to work in such an office as a secretary to the rep, plus managing car insurance, small claims, and general customer support. The agency had 3 or 4 sales reps employed who handled all the insurance stuff next to sales.
If there are such offices in your town you would be a real asset to them, I'm sure. Of course the pay would be less than you have now but that's why it is so important to get expenses down. You are paid in ample free time after all as well!

Do you read Jin+Guice's Journal? The recent discussion was centred around this topic. Maybe there are some insights to be had for you as well.

[mooretrees]

Didn't you mention trying out being a paralegal in a not-to-distant post? I do think there is some schooling involved, but likely a much higher hourly wage than the other options you explored above. Somewhere here someone mentioned a podcast with someone who FIRE'd and then started bartending a couple days a week. Talk about social contact! Not sure if that is interesting at all to you....

I know the situations vary a lot, but in rural Oregon there is such a shortage of teachers that the normal regulations have been waived for education. I have a friend who has been a sub for a couple of years without any certifications. Worth exploring more closely if that's been an interest.

Also, I did work as a dog walker (very briefly) and it was fun and easy. I imagine that if you left some ads at local dog boarders you might get some traction there. Not much social contact there.

Also, I agree this is such a good problem to have. Good luck figuring it out.

[EdithKeeler]

Of course the pay would be less than you have now but that's why it is so important to get expenses down. You are paid in ample free time after all as well!

Do you read Jin+Guice's Journal? The recent discussion was centred around this topic. Maybe there are some insights to be had for you as well.

Thanks, I’ll take a look at his journal.

Yeah, I know my expenses are high compared to a lot of people around here. But that’s ok with me. I’m pretty sure my expenses will come down a good bit once I stop working at what I’m doing. But, at the same time, I’m really not interested in a bare-bones retirement, either. Sure, I can ditch my home WiFi and save $60 a month using other sources. But quite simply: I don’t want to. I’m sure my cell phone bill will go down... but I’m not going to get a bare bones trakphone because I don’t want to. I like having a cushion so if I have a leak in the roof I can call someone ASAP.

What can I say? Too many years suckin’ on that teat. I’ve gotten very comfortable knowing I’ll have X amount coming in every month, and I’m just not ready to pull out all the stops. I’d rather slowly transition, not just for the money, but also those social reasons I mentioned.

And.... I know that retiring, whether early or late, semi or full, will be a big deal for me. It is NOT NORMAL (for me), in terms of how I’ve been “programmed” since both. You’re born, you go to school, you work to at least 65, you play golf and then die. I’ve been working at something or other since I was 12 years old. I’m pretty sure that FOR ME stopping work and stopping that kind of structure won’t be good for me. I need to ease in.

[EdithKeeler]

It actually does sound like you want to stay in the job you've worked more than 3 decades to get and become highly proficient in, at least for now. You've looked over the fence, and $ wise, a lot of the options you've thought about don't pay all that well. I've been reading a different book by these authors for a while, and I picked up the employee-side of their recommendations and read through the whole thing:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/157675250X/

Number one on my list from seeing what you've described is cutting things down to actually 40 hours a week. You can leanFIRE if you need to, so why are you driving yourself to skip lunch and work too many hours? I'd say to define your highest-value responsibilities and talk to your boss about who can pick up the rest. If he wouldn't be open to part-time, he definitely doesn't want to see you quit and get 0% of your work. Your plate is currently too full.

I think, actually, you’ve nailed it. I really do like parts of my job... I think what I don’t like, if this makes sense, is how I am in my job. I am somewhat OCD, I think I’ve mentioned before—actual doctor’s diagnosis and everything—and that manifests itself in this feeling that Everything Must Be Done. Not necessarily by me—at least I don’t feel like I always have to do it all myself—but I can drive myself crazy.

After this health thing, I’m reaffirming my commitment to just 40 hours a week at work. I’ve also started ordering my mom’s Many Things from Amazon—I’ve been killing myself running around town getting her demands. If Amazon doesn’t have it, she’s not getting it, unless it’s convenient for me. I’m also getting a cleaning person for my house while I’m still working. (I’m OCD enough to want it spotless, not OCD enough to do it myself!!).

In the meantime I’ll continue pondering the choices before me. The best bet may be just to go part time at my current job—good for me and frankly good for them—but I need to figure out how best to put that in place. <(EdithKeeler begins rubbing hands and planning....)>

Thanks for the book rec. I’ll check it out.

[1taskaday]

2 points

The first one you are enacting,(I think Scot 2 develops this concept very well in his journal) spend money to make life as stress free and easy for yourself as you can. You earn great money...use it to make your life easier.
Hire a personal trainer if your health is so important to you...slot it in as an appointment in your schedule.

The second point...I was in the same dilemma you are in now...well paying job nothing else really compared to its hourly rate...make a long term plan to enable you to cut your hours back while doing it...look around...is there anyone you could train up to job share with you? Is there any position that pays well in your company that requires part time hours? There's always someone smart "coasting"...study them,how did they get it...luck or neck?make a long-term plan...and play hard ball to get exactly what you want...guys do it all the time.
As Cimorene12 said just don't your job so well...you're in a great position...you plan to leave soon anyway...why do you care so much what people at your workplace think?

[Ego]

You might combine your desire to work in the medical field and to be social with your insurance experience by becoming a patient advocate.

[Sclass]

My relatively successful 32-year career doesn't translate into anything obvious. As an insurance claims person, I know a lot of stuff about insurance, policies, analyzing liability and damages, contract analysis, negotiating, legal processes and strategy, managing people, customer service, etc. I have all kinds of certifications and licenses in the field. But I'm really having a tough time seeing ways to leverage those skills into other jobs,

I keep playing this over in my head. There is solid gold in here. You just have to be creative about extracting it. Like any old fat business there is money to be made for those who dare to mix things up a bit.

A friend of mine has a lot of torn up wrecked cars in his shop. He basically buys out totaled cars from insurance companies. When his crew has idle time between repair jobs they fix the wrecks and sell salvage titled cars. He makes money.

I asked why and he says the insurers salvage for anything and leave residual value on the table. He says they’re fat by overcharging us on premiums. He just takes it.

Just a thought. There is gold in dem hills. Don’t sell your knowledge short.

[Jason]

It takes a certain amount of gall to go into business for oneself and by her own account, Edith just doesn't have it anymore.

[IlliniDave]

I've been through a number of the same thought processes. After 33ish years I'm a pretty good cog in a specialized machine. Its not easy to think about deliberately turn the $ spigot off. The cog-like aspect of my professional side means I'd have to stay near the machine to continue to extract from it. That's not a viable alternative for me so I've pursuing what I hope to be a "once and for all" retirement. However, nothing wrong with semi-retirement in my view, either as a transition step or long-term pursuit. Hope you're able to find a happy solution.

[jennypenny]

Wow EK, I'm glad you're ok. I wish we all lived closer so we could help each other out (since we all tend to be the caregivers in our immediate circles).

[EdithKeeler]

I actually ventured into a store today--first time since March 12. I had to get onions, dammit, the only thing i really "needed" food-wise. Other than that, I have enough stock for a month or more, most likely. But just about every recipe I have starts with "dice a large onion." (OK: not my brownie recipe).

Been working at home since Tuesday; I have to applaud my company for arranging for as many people as possible to work from home so quickly, and they scrambled to get people equipment that didn't have it. I was actually pretty productive last week--no in-person meetings, no "hey what do I do about this?" questions from people not in my department, etc. If it wasn't for all the "how's it going?" touch base meetings, I would have gotten even more done! (Most of my department has been working 3 days a week from home for like, years, so it was no big deal for most of our department, though a BIG deal in other departments. I work at home occasionally, but mostly hate working at home, so I almost always go into the office anyway).

All in all, I haven't minded being "stuck" at home. DBF was planning to come visit starting last weekend, but with all the news, etc. we decided to cancel, because we both really like to go out and about--restaurants, movies, etc. when he's here. We decided we didn't want to risk that, and then, of course, they closed all the movie theaters and restaurants anyway. They closed them in Texas (where he is) as well (except they WILL deliver margaritas--how awesome is that!), and he's going a little stir crazy and he's threatening to come to Memphis anyway, but I've asked him not to. I don't need him bringing something here, and I know he won't stay confined for long, and I don't need him running out every half hour and risking bringing something back in. And, I'm not sure how well we'd get along both in the house, with me working, and him idle. Maybe OK for a while.... but phone is fine for now.

As I said, I don't mind being at home. Now that I have onions, I'm perfectly content! (I did dig up some wild garlic in the backyard to use in a pinch). I've taken the doggos to the park for 2 quick trips, but mostly we just wander around the back yard for exercise--I have a big yard--and I pull weeds and stuff while I'm out there. Work, of course, kept me busy last week, and probably this week as well, but I can see that starting to taper off. I work for a company that insures businesses--mostly contractors, things like that, and as their business falls off, so do their claims. I can already see a decline in incoming claims--lots fewer car accidents--but it's funny, because I can also tell that a lot of people are clearing off their desk as they've gotten less busy--lots of small claims of all types from months ago that for various reasons people didn't get around to reporting. I'm not too worried about this crisis impacting my work long term---we have a large number of contractors who would be let go first, and again, right now, we still have plenty to keep everyone busy anyhow, especially in my department. The courts are mostly closed, so a lot of the litigation we're handling is on hold for now.

And other than having to work, I sort of feel like I'm on a little bit of a vacation. My mom is in "lock down" at her nursing home--she can't have any visitors, we can't deliver any stuff to her, and while it's frustrating for her, and I do feel bad for her, I'm not gong to lie about the fact that it's been a bit of a break for me. I've known I spend a lot of time running around doing stuff for her, but it didn't really hit me until last weekend when I realized just how much time it was taking to do various errands for her, buy this and that, buy special ingredients and cook meals that she requests (always harder, IMHO, to cook special requests rather than stuff you'd just make for yourself), pack them up and take them over, hang out for a few hours, schlep the stuff back.... We talk on the phone a lot, and I'm glad she's mentally good and we can do that (I feel badly for the people with Alzheimers, etc. who are probably confused about what's going on and why their loved ones aren't visiting). But this has been a little bit of a needed rest for me. I'll go back to it when this is over, of course, but I'm going to enjoy NOT doing stuff right now!

And I'm working on my chore list, and that feels good to knock some of that stuff out. All those things that pile up that you eventually get to--I knock out a few of those things every day. Sorting thru junk to take to the Salvation Army, unpacking/reorganizing those last things from the move, getting every last bit of laundry done and--get this--I actually IRONED some stuff yesterday! Woot! Washing the dog toys and leashes, reorganizing the silverware drawer... and I have still have many more things left to do. A little taste of what early retirement might be like--but then again, maybe I'll have all those little things done before I quit!

I was thinking yesterday that a couple week "break" isn't such a bad thing for a lot of Americans. I've talked to people like me who are just sort of enjoying a slightly slower pace right now. And yes, I realize we're the lucky ones that haven't lost jobs, etc. But some of us have just been working our butts off, and I've talked to more than one friend who commented that in the last week they were able to catch up on their sleep. Me too!

In addition to my chores, I've gotten back to my writing, a little. I found 2 post-apocalyptic stories that I never finished, and I'm regretting not finishing both of them. Had I published, I'm sure CNN would right now be saying "And EdithKeeler's prescient novel of an America ravaged by a virus..." and calling me for interviews. HAH! Seriously, a couple years ago I started writing a kinder, gentler post-apocalypse novel that imagined most of the country killed off by a lethal virus that caused people to really stay away from each other for fear of reinfection, because the virus still lingered. (I love post-apocalyptic stories, but get tired that they always are really violent and get kind of crazy sometimes). Anyway, I had this couple living on their little farm in the middle of nowhere, relatively contentedly until.... and then I had plot problems. And there was another story.... but I'm working on that again, and maybe I'll share it with you all someday. And circumstances spurred a new idea yesterday that I've made some notes on.

Plus, there are crochet projects to finish, a quilt top to finish, and a million other projects in various states of not started to almost finished that are calling name.

So I'm pretty good for at least a month. While I'm generally a little over the middle toward the extrovert side, my introvert side is getting a chance to come out and play, and she's enjoying it.

Off to make jambalaya today (now that I have onions!!!). Hope you and yours are healthy and continue to stay that way.

[EdithKeeler]

Several of my friends have commented, one way or another, about how "this virus crisis will change us." When I asked them what they meant, they talked about companies having more people work from home (because they will see how well it works), that it would increase social distance of people (for fear of getting the virus, and even more awareness about flu spread), that the world will be in a terrible recession for years because of this, etc.

I was thinking, the only thing that I've been particularly thinking during this period is that I hope I don't die before I have a chance to retire, that I hope I don't spend my last days doing this job, that I wish I'd gone off and bought that remote farm and worked on my writing more.

I DO think some people will change because of this, but I wonder if it will mean being less materialistic, settling for the smaller home so they have more time with the kids, seeing what it's like to hang with family more and liking it, so they decide to do more of it. Giving up the soul sucking job to paint or make music or whatever. I think I'd like to see that happen.

I know during this period I've been getting more sleep. And I feel better for it. And I hope that continues after this is all over.

[Frita]

I was thinking, the only thing that I've been particularly thinking during this period is that I hope I don't die before I have a chance to retire, that I hope I don't spend my last days doing this job, that I wish I'd gone off and bought that remote farm and worked on my writing more.

This resonates with me. I am probably weird that I think of how I’d feel about whatever situation I’m in if I died and adjust accordingly (lots of death in my family from a young age). So that has probably made me hop from thing to thing, push boundaries of what responsible people do, not have the career I would have preferred, etc. I guess what I am trying to say is that there could have been sacrifices either way. Are you fleshing out a plan?

[ertyu]

I was thinking that if this virus stays endemic, it will increase the chances of dying younger. It could very realistically shorten lifespan. So less of a stash will be necessary. On the other hand, I agree that we will be in a recession for a while and that rapid stock market growth is unlikely in the next couple of years. But I also find myself more willing to pull the plug sooner.

[jennypenny]

Anyone heard from EK recently?

[Sclass]

starting to get worried here. It has been awhile. We don’t exactly leave emergency contact info. Hope all is well @EK.