the animal's journal

Where are you and where are you going?
Mister Imperceptible
Posts: 1463
Joined: Fri Nov 10, 2017 4:18 pm

Re: the animal's journal

Post by Mister Imperceptible »

I never remember love being found in Alaska in Jack London’s stories, but I do remember it being found in California.

For what’s its worth I have had mixed success in the northeast where I am from but I was a major hit when I lived down south. Location matters.
unemployable wrote:
Thu Jul 18, 2019 11:47 am
It is possible those girls in fact DO see you as an attractive long-term mate and are simply back-burnering you while they sleep around with the tattooed construction worker types for now. Meaning you're doing absolutely nothing wrong. Keep playing the long game.
While the point is taken, I have to question whether it’s possible to feel warm and fuzzy about someone who has “back-burnered” you.

User avatar
unemployable
Posts: 630
Joined: Mon Jan 08, 2018 11:36 am
Location: Homeless

Re: the animal's journal

Post by unemployable »

Mister Imperceptible wrote:
Thu Jul 18, 2019 12:56 pm
While the point is taken, I have to question whether it’s possible to feel warm and fuzzy about someone who has “back-burnered” you.
I agree with this sentiment, which is why I wrote earlier, be careful what you ask for.

prognastat
Posts: 995
Joined: Fri May 04, 2018 8:30 pm
Location: Texas
Contact:

Re: the animal's journal

Post by prognastat »

Mister Imperceptible wrote:
Thu Jul 18, 2019 12:56 pm
While the point is taken, I have to question whether it’s possible to feel warm and fuzzy about someone who has “back-burnered” you.
I think it's very hard and the longer it goes on the higher the chances for resentment or feelings of inferiority could be. Neither of which lead to a healthy relationship.

theanimal
Posts: 1669
Joined: Fri Jan 25, 2013 10:05 pm
Location: AK
Contact:

Re: the animal's journal

Post by theanimal »

@Kspiel- :lol: Good point.
prognastat wrote:
Thu Jul 18, 2019 11:45 am

Generally my first advice would be to improve your friend circle if there aren't a lot of women in it(doesn't matter if they're single or not), but it sounds like you are already good friends with multiple couples and single women. Are your friends(most of all the female ones) introducing you to/setting you up on any dates/meetings with single friends of theirs?
The majority of my friend group is women so I've got that going for me. They've tried and thought of setting me up before but there has been zero single friends/acquaintances of theirs they could think of. There really aren't that many single women up here. It really might be time to try somewhere else for a while..

bigato wrote:
Thu Jul 18, 2019 7:00 pm
Ok. So there are 8 women around, you feel lonely and want to date, and yet you decide to stay there? I'm pretty sure you are way smarter than that. Now that *does* sound like a serious blindspot right there.
Slowtraveler's idea, on the other side, sounded like the perfect situation to throw you off balance and force you to explore unknowns. That'd be beyond awesome, consider it at least as a temporary move. Seek contrasts.
No there was 8 women where I used to live. I moved 2 years ago. I live in an urban area now. I'm still considering exploring that idea.
7Wannabe5 wrote:
Thu Jul 18, 2019 12:46 pm
Okey-Dokey. If you don’t want to shake the piggy bank quite that hard, I can maybe scrounge around in my warehouse and get you a 3 night stand with a pudgy older woman for just plane fare, helicopter ride, and 6 pack of moose burgers.
Haha I can't fly helicopters so that'd be even more expensive than the first. But thanks, i'll keep it in mind.
unemployable wrote:
Thu Jul 18, 2019 1:08 pm


I agree with this sentiment, which is why I wrote earlier, be careful what you ask for.
OK I see what you're saying now. I didn't understand it as clearly before, but yes I'd agree with that. My initial thought is that I'm not really into the idea of seeing someone that rejected me early on so that they could mess around before coming back to me later on.

slowtraveler
Posts: 757
Joined: Sun Jan 11, 2015 10:06 pm

Re: the animal's journal

Post by slowtraveler »

My gf and I have been talking and she says you'd have too much choice here. There's more women in a single floor of my apartment than your old area.

If you're serious to come, it'll get you laid. I promise. And the cost will be .1% of 7w5's offer. $2 for a shared meal and some gas for a day trip. If you come before September, I'll still be around to show you some good cheap meals and nice parks. If not, I can send a Google maps screenshot with some bookmarks of places to try. Typically 30-40 baht per dish but some places are 15-20.

If you're serious, there's some things I wish someone had told me before..

Obviously it's your life but I'd recommend to not go exclusive with the first hot girls you get intimate with. It'll take time to know someone and find a really good match but the first lovers will be the ones who choose you or are easiest. Take a month at least, please.

My girl says many girls take good care of their men in Issan as well, not only the north. Just stay away from Udon Thani or Khon Kaen in Issan as those pockets have more of the keeping up with the Joneses vibes. She says Surin, Si Sa Ket, and Ubon Ratchatani have many beautiful, good girls. These women are used to the country life. ie- My love goes to the forest to find mushrooms when they are in season, has eaten many kinds of insects, eats rats and frogs. She could definitely outlive me in the forest, even with my significant fat reserves.

I think you'd be a good catch for a woman here. Making a team leading multi day group hikes eating wild mushrooms and plants, teaching survival with all your combined bad ass experiences. You could definitely find a partnership like this, and with less work than you've done in Alaska. Many women would be stoked to have someone share a lifestyle like this with.

As a warning-
South Thailand, some of Bangkok, bars, massages, and clubs will be more of the gold digger vibe you'll hear about. You'll see clear red flags early so date many girls to find the good girls you really connect with and this abundance of choice will make it easier to fade away from the smoking hot but psychologically unhealthty women.

It will take longer to engage physically with a good girl but the strong emotional connection should be more fulfilling anyways. On the first date you might just hold hands and it may take a week or 2 to kiss but it really is worth it. If she's showing up to meet a few times a week and your heart feels she's interested, she probably is. Obviously, you'll still date other girls so your needs will be handled until you find this special one. When girls ask if you're a player, "I really want to find an amazing woman to spend my life with but that takes time." I recommend you don't stop dating until you find this match, don't settle for just sexy and stable.

From experience, more girls here have paid for my food or even clothes/gifts than ever in America. As a norm, I'm expected to pay for around 75% of food. In America, I can count on 1 hand the times a girl paid my meal. I hear many men here are 50-50 but this seems harsh to me given the likely 90-10 pay differential.

You'll be making more than an Engineer here working just 20 hours a week. My current gf has saved me a ton more money even paying for 2 because she finds such cheap, delicious food and rooms. She's very anti premium and down to earth. Many girls are, just I've had to deal with sifting through the crazy ones.

On the chance you dont like Thailand, you can get a year visa to Vietnam or 10 year multi entry for up to 3 months at a time to China. I hear Taiwanese and Philipino people are also super friendly, speak better English, and the Visas are easier.

Thailand is the hardest to live in long term visa wise but it's not that difficult if you plan it. South Korea I have heard is obsessed with premium and not really friendly. The rain forests, beaches, and women are stunning in all of the former countries (unsure about Korea).

You could get a work permit as a hiking guide with all your experience. I've seen many of these at $100+/person for a group day hike.

Your round trip flight could be free if you apply for the Chase Sapphire Reserve card or another decent rewards card. Just cancel before the annual fee and use it to pay taxes so you get the bonus easily. Flights (and buses) within Asia are quite cheap so you can hop around to find your ideal location(s). Feel free to email or video call me sometime if you want more details or anything.

User avatar
Ego
Posts: 5081
Joined: Wed Nov 23, 2011 12:42 am

Re: the animal's journal

Post by Ego »

slowtraveler wrote:
Thu Jul 18, 2019 5:47 am

Come to Thailand. No, seriously. Your mating market sucks from what I can see. Your confidence will climb as you reverse the odds into your favor and all the dating will allow you to see where you're messing up from a place of experience.
Slowtraveler has shown that this strategy can work well. I've been there, albiet as a married guy traveling with his wife, and I imagine his life as pretty f-ing spectacular.

That said, you've got to be careful going to places where the power dynamics (wealth, citizenship, m/f ratio) are flipped from your current situation. Especially if you are looking for someone to spend the rest of your life with.

From what I've seen, guys who stay for a while in a place where women treat them like George Clooney because of the color of his passport or his relative wealth, find it extremely difficult to return home. Normal power dynamics feels like Alaska to those who have experienced the wonders of Colombia or Ukraine or Thailand.

But that's a minor issue. The real problem occurs when you find the future Mrs. Animal but she has a different passport. You then must either live apart for most of the year or find a place where both of your passports are welcome long-term. Not easy.

It is a long, complex process if you want to get her a visa to live in the US. Living a life dictated by the whims of immigration laws is extremely difficult. Especially while trying to earn a living. On this trip we've encountered quite a few couples with this problem.

slowtraveler
Posts: 757
Joined: Sun Jan 11, 2015 10:06 pm

Re: the animal's journal

Post by slowtraveler »

Thanks Ego, I'm happier here, you're right. Since my move, I've never considered moving back to USA. Colombia, Brazil, or the previously mentioned countries in Asia are my backups. You bring up good points.

Regarding the first of Ego's points, the way that women have a higher market value in the west, you're switching to be the one of higher market value. You're exotic here and women seem to outnumber men.

The second of Ego's points is very real. A work permit will solve this easily in every country mentioned.

The other option is Visa runs every 1-12 months depending on how well you've planned. In Thailand, an Ed Visa will cost about 1000usd per year but travel around the country is then more difficult. In Vietnam, a 1 year Visa is a couple hundred usd. Then you do a border run with the visa paper work ready after the year. Thailand is the only country that may hassle you about staying too long with Visa runs.

If this happens, slow travel. Do 3 months in Thailand, 3 in Taiwan, 3 in Thailand, 3 in Vietnam, etc. You can do this with your girl indefinitely.

Thailand also has a 20 year visa for about 30,000usd but it's a last resort. You can do 3 years of education visas first to see if you like it. After those 3 years are over, you can teach English, translate, work as a guide with your own company, or volunteer instead of paying the big bucks. This assumes you choose Thailand. Other countries are much easier Visa wise, just a border run every 3 months.

Gocurrycracker has talked about some of this staying in Taiwan long term with his wife and son. It seems many stay here even after finding their dream girl. The lifestyle is more relaxed while also being more stimulating due to acclimating to a new culture that is much more community and family-oriented.

rube
Posts: 694
Joined: Tue Oct 02, 2012 7:54 pm
Location: Europe (NL)

Re: the animal's journal

Post by rube »

Slowtraveller, you almost convinced me to go. Especially because I know and like the region. But I think my DW won't agree :lol: .

I do agree though that it might be better for theanimal to go to a region where the m/f ratio is better, even if just for a certain period/trial/new adventure. But also take into account the comments from Ego as they are spot on imo.

7Wannabe5
Posts: 6922
Joined: Fri Oct 18, 2013 9:03 am

Re: the animal's journal

Post by 7Wannabe5 »

All kidding aside, I very much agree with Ego's take. I have experience with serious cross-cultural relationships and living in a situation where the male to female ratio was very off-kilter. Another very important thing to consider is that places with relatively more men will have more masculine energy and places with relatively more women will have more feminine energy. And when the ratios are really out of whack, this energy will be really out of whack too.

I attended an engineering college in a remote northern setting for two of the cutest (19-21) years of my life, and although on one occasion I was literally picked up by a horde of young men and carried over their heads for the length of a city block, I don't think I was formally asked out on a date once in the entire two years. Since my parents lived in another college town where the M-F ratio was balanced, and that is where I spent my semester and summer breaks, I had clear compare and contrast which offered unexpected according to the numbers result that I would get much more attention from men in the second location, and in retrospect, I think this was because I was in more fitting surrounding for me in that locale.

You and SlowTraveler are both great kids, but you are very different. SlowTraveler is a self-aware sensualist. He enjoys massage, special food delicacies, and a lush tropical environment. He used to enjoy smoking a lot of pot. He maybe should have lived in the era of Coleridge. Is that you?

IOW, if you imagine a continuum running from rural Alaska to Thailand combined with a matrix of M/F ratios and masculine to feminine energies, my gut pick would be to drop you in Colorado.

Kriegsspiel
Posts: 928
Joined: Fri Aug 03, 2012 9:05 pm

Re: the animal's journal

Post by Kriegsspiel »

7Wannabe5 wrote:
Fri Jul 19, 2019 7:33 am
AoM had an interesting podcast with Jon Birger, author of Date-onomics, about the effects of skewed sex ratios. He said a lot of good things about Utah.

prognastat
Posts: 995
Joined: Fri May 04, 2018 8:30 pm
Location: Texas
Contact:

Re: the animal's journal

Post by prognastat »

theanimal wrote:
Thu Jul 18, 2019 10:06 pm
The majority of my friend group is women so I've got that going for me. They've tried and thought of setting me up before but there has been zero single friends/acquaintances of theirs they could think of. There really aren't that many single women up here. It really might be time to try somewhere else for a while..
I think you've got your answer right there. You have trouble finding potential partners and despite having multiple female friends they have trouble finding you eligible partners.

That pretty clearly indicates that your potential dating pool is probably very limited where you currently are.

suomalainen
Posts: 786
Joined: Sat Oct 18, 2014 12:49 pm

Re: the animal's journal

Post by suomalainen »

Forget Utah. Too many mormons and unlike other religious chicks, mormon chicks are...not the chicks you're looking for. Or maybe the non-mormon m/f ratio is good?

But @animal, I will say that reading your initial post about the self-doubt was a little..."off character". Maybe that has an impact on your dating life, maybe it doesn't, but by far the surest impact on your dating life has to be the m/f ratio. http://money.com/money/4072951/college- ... p-culture/ If your romantic drought is having that much of an impact on you that it's causing you to think poorly of yourself (starting a vicious spiral), much like working a shitty job for too long may result in burnout, then I agree that changing locations may be what you need. Yes, you'll be sacrificing some of the benefits that Alaska has, but...which is worth more to you? Dating is a numbers game. There's a lid for every pot, but if you've got 10 pots for every lid, finding that lid will be very difficult.

Kriegsspiel
Posts: 928
Joined: Fri Aug 03, 2012 9:05 pm

Re: the animal's journal

Post by Kriegsspiel »

suomalainen wrote:
Sat Jul 20, 2019 3:21 pm
Forget Utah. Too many mormons and unlike other religious chicks, mormon chicks are...not the chicks you're looking for. Or maybe the non-mormon m/f ratio is good?
His point, in the podcast at least, was that Utah Mormons have a skewed sex ratio which leads to female Mormons doing their best to be attractive to males.

Jason

Re: the animal's journal

Post by Jason »

In the Jeffs household, that was called "getting ready for dinner."

suomalainen
Posts: 786
Joined: Sat Oct 18, 2014 12:49 pm

Re: the animal's journal

Post by suomalainen »

Ah. Presumably that does not include jettisoning the mormonism...which would make them most attractive to males. Or at least @theanimal.

theanimal
Posts: 1669
Joined: Fri Jan 25, 2013 10:05 pm
Location: AK
Contact:

Re: the animal's journal

Post by theanimal »

I appreciate all the replies and feedback. tried to get my mind right since that first post and did a ~48 hr fast to clear things up a bit. That post was admittedly off character as suo stated and coming from a moment of weakness. My day to day isn't to the point where I'm moping around bemoaning my current state. Most days are pretty good and I may think about wanting a GF or desiring someone else for just brief moments here and there. When I'm alone for extended periods, that's when I start to get down. It's something I've been working on mitigating and dealing with since living in the cabin but I still have some work to do to avoid those patterns that lead me down the slippery swamps of sadness.

I have come to the similar conclusions as 7w5 did in her post. I don't think living in Thailand full time suits who I am or what I find particularly interesting. That being said, I wouldn't rule off an extended visit as somewhat of a test run. Making the full time move there doesn't sit well at the moment. There's too much that I want to do here. I'm not really into the idea of finding super religious girls either. I do acknowledge the point that currently I'm at a serious disadvantage in terms of the m/f ratio. I did like that podcast @kspiel linked to and find it to hold true for my current area. There is almost 0 hook up culture and it is very monogamous. In terms of moving, I still don't have strong desires yet to leave Alaska, instead potentially moving to Anchorage at some point in the future. It's no Utah or Thailand but it is a much larger market than Fairbanks and much more of an urban area. We'll see though, still in the early stages of the thought process with this one.

Jason

Re: the animal's journal

Post by Jason »

What you are really talking about here is a mail order bride without an explicit transaction. Men have found that moving to the originating country is a better methodology as opposed to the woman moving to the destination country because its more economical and its better for the woman to remain in her culture. It actually increases the chances that the marriage will be successful. I had a "friend" who had his bride come to America and it was a nightmare for him. He was essentially her get out of jail free card. That's the risk you take. It's better to be the hen in the chicken house than to bring a chicken into a hen house.

I understand that the Animal's issue is purely demographics and under normal conditions this wouldn't be a problem. If you can say "I can fly an airplane" but cannot in turn get laid, extenuating circumstances have to be in play. Everyone knows chicks dig pilots. Thinking upon that, isn't Russia an option? One thing Sarah Palin taught the world is that its close to Alaska. Although I guess you have to consider the source.

Suo obviously knows about Mormon girls so you have to value his opinion. But my thought was, based on their specific religious upbringing, you could marry a group of them and over time, pick your favorite one. Assuming other men in the region have the same problem as you, they will be a valuable commodity and you could trade them for I don't know, pelts or plane fuel or whatever resources are of similar value up there. I have to think other civilizations developed in this manner considering mankind's overall depravity. Puts a new spin on Alaska pipe line come to think of it. And I would think they would more easily acclimate to the Alaska tundra than Taiwanese women being that they are used to wearing long, denim dresses and not opposed to churning butter and engaging in other types of harsh and challenging environment activities.

Jason

Re: the animal's journal

Post by Jason »

Factoring in take off landings (including three stops for refueling) my calculations show that a Cessna 182 can travel from Utah to Alaska in approx. 20 1/2 hours holding four people, three passengers. I'm thinking weight capacity could be an issue with the Alaska men as I imagine them to be a hearty bunch, so maybe you're down to three under certain circumstances. The Animal solves not only his problem but through the exchange of resources scarce to two communities, develops a side hustle that could turn into a sustainable business.

I'm thinking "Big Love Airline."

suomalainen
Posts: 786
Joined: Sat Oct 18, 2014 12:49 pm

Re: the animal's journal

Post by suomalainen »

Yeah, let's just say that mormon girls are not like mormongirlz. And as for butter churning and denim dresses, maybe in the south of UT, but not in Salt Lake.

ZAFCorrection
Posts: 454
Joined: Mon Aug 14, 2017 3:49 pm

Re: the animal's journal

Post by ZAFCorrection »

Late to the party, but having spent a few years dating in SLC as a non-Mormon, it's kind of a shit show here. Unless you are dealing with someone who has a foot outside the church (usually associated with religion/life burnout), you aren't going to have a chance with Mormon women. The LDS culture particularly and the Salt Lake area generally is also pretty staid; adults here still think knock-knock jokes are funny for instance.

Salt Lake also seems to attract more than its fair share of free spirit/alternative lifestyle types, so there might be more chance to find a woman who would be cool with ERE. Though, in my experience, the people are mostly just outdoorsy burnouts with no money or plan.

Post Reply