DutchGirl's journal

[sterlingarcher]

Just read your whole journal and I'm impressed that you kept it up for 3 years now. Keep at it!

Maybe you wrote it somewhere, but where in Holland do you live?

[DutchGirl]

Hey all,

The meeting went well. No shouting or screaming from their side (or mine), and no tears from either side either (wew). The presence of my boyfriend truly helped, there was a particular moment when I had discussed my side of it, and they had told me about their side, and the conversation died. He picked it up and helped continue it. It took me two more weeks to make a decision, but I now have agreed to finish up the article that I was writing, and that was close to being finished. To finish it, I'll have to go talk to a statistician about a minor tweak in the statistics, I have to add the resulting p-value to the manuscript, and I have to cut down the manuscript to the right size (it's too long now). Then I'll have to discuss it with my professor and then it can be send in, and then I'm done with it (the professor will have to handle addressing the reviewers etc). It still feels like a huge burden (which may not be a rational thing) and it has caused me a lot of stress over the last few weeks. I have some time in January to work on this, and I hope that with Christmas coming up now, I will be able to just "not think about it" until January. And that I will be able to get it over with soon, in January.

Sterlingarcher, I live in the Southwest of the Netherlands, in one of the smaller cities of "de Randstad".

Came here today to report on my average savings rate this year. This Monday my last salary of the year was paid to me. I will have some more expenses during the next week too, but I know what they are. In 2014 I earned 31,700 euros of salary (posttax). I also gained 3460 euros from my savings and investments, but let's exclude that when calculating my savings rate - otherwise the stock market's well-being would influence my savings rate, and that's weird.

I spent 20,840 euros this year. So my savings percentage (from my posttax salary) has been 34% this year. I'm hoping to up this to 50% next year, due to both decreased expenses (hopefully around 18k euros) and increased income (I'm aiming for 36k euros).

That sounds like a good New Year's resolution for me. A challenge, but still manageable.

[DutchGirl]

... As I wrote already in Henk's journal, a colleague of mine suddenly died last week. He was a great guy, some kind of mentor figure to me. He would sometimes be "on duty" to be called when there were any problems, and if I called that "hotline" and it was him on the other side, I was always happy to hear his voice. I knew he would give me good advice, and he would almost always also ask about my opinion "because two clever minds know more than one". Thanks for the vote of confidence, Edward.

He died at age 55, totally unexpected. I haven't heard what exactly killed him, but he just died in his sleep and in the morning his wife found him dead. Not a bad death, I guess, there are worse. But the fact that I never got to tell him how I appreciated him, and of course the fact that his life was just over like that, and that his wife and his two grown sons suddenly have to make do without him, saddens me so much.

I hope he really enjoyed his work, because he worked right until the end. Given how he dedicated himself to being a great colleague, there are some indications that he did indeed really enjoy his work. That's a bit of a comfort.

As for me, this seems another reason to work hard to reach FI. Not that I hate my job (not at all), but I would also love to experience other parts of life, before it can suddenly and without warning be too late.

When I heard the news, I was spending time with my family in Austria on a skiing trip. I made sure to cuddle my nieces and nephews a lot, so that they will hopefully remember that their auntie loved them to pieces. I made also sure to tell my parents and my siblings that I loved them, too. This was the first time as adults that we went on a holiday together. It was a great success. My parents spent a lot of time with their grandkids, while my siblings went skiing. I also spent a lot of time with the nieces/nephew. We might do it again next year. And maybe then I'll take some skiiing lessons, too.

[jennypenny]

I'm sorry you lost such a supportive friend, DutchGirl.

[steveo73]

He died at age 55, totally unexpected. I haven't heard what exactly killed him, but he just died in his sleep and in the morning his wife found him dead. Not a bad death, I guess, there are worse. But the fact that I never got to tell him how I appreciated him, and of course the fact that his life was just over like that, and that his wife and his two grown sons suddenly have to make do without him, saddens me so much.

It is sad. Sorry to hear.

[llorona]

Very sorry to hear about your loss.

[DutchGirl]

Thank you, all.

[DutchGirl]

So, it's been a short while.

I'm thinking a lot about work/life balance. That has something to do with Edward dying, because it showed me (once again) how life can be short - better be a bit happy with it. It also has something to do with having a holiday for three weeks and now being back at work with some extra responsibilities (that are challenging to me as they have to do with social interactions; but they are also a bit scary for the same reason).

And I keep running numbers...

If I continue on my current path, work 28 hours per week, try to save 18k euros per year (50% of my posttax income), then I am probably fully FI ten years from now. But... Weird as it may sound, working 28 hours/week is quite draining. I work shifts: mornings, afternoons, and evenings. Every week is different. Sometimes I travel 2 hours by public transport to do a 4 hour shift. Sometimes I work the evening, am home at 10PM, and then have to get up at 6 AM to work the morning shift. Sometimes I work a morning and then an evening shift on the same day. Sometimes the people I work with are draining. Sometimes it's busy and there's no time to sit down and have a cup of coffee. Sometimes it's very boring and nothing happens.

I'm not sure I want to continue working 28 hours/week until I am FI. I am not sure whether I will be able to, either.

An alternative strategy could be to grow the stash some more for a few years, and then relax a bit: scale back to say 20-hour work weeks and work a few years longer to get to full FI. Advantages: more relaxed work, and also scaling back slowly to get used to having more freedom (and explore options of what to do with that time). The big danger I see is that there is a higher risk of losing my job before reaching full FI status. On the other hand... even if I lose my job by the time I'm say 75% towards FI, I'm sure I could find another job to get me there, maybe a bit slower, but still I could manage.

Calculations in a spreadsheet program show I could be FI ten years from now by the end of 2024. I'm 45 years old then, almost 46. This assumes I continue to put 18k euros/year in investments, and it assumes a 4% growth of my assets on average. If I start working less hours when I'm 40 (and roughly 60% towards FI), then I can be FI by 2028, so "only" four years later (assuming my income allows me to cover all expenses plus invest 7k euros/year).

In all cases, right now I just need to keep going

My income in January was 2430, my expenses were 1640 (including 300 euros for a semi-annual gift to a specific charity that's close to my heart). So a savings rate of 33%...

[rube]

I hear you. And I feel sometimes the same: I work more hours but I work mostly from house. Still 40 hours is draining me sometimes.
Instead of calculating and trying to predict the future over and over again, I focus a bit less on the 'long term' target (e.g. fully FI in the perfect way) because I know a *LOT* can happen in 5+ years. Instead I created some milestones for ourselves to focus on. The first is about 2.5 years to go, 2nd about 5 years and the 3rd about 7.5 years. This helps me to focus a bit more on the short term while not loosing sight of the long term and not driving me crazy at the same time .

Just keep going!

[steveo73]

I hear exactly what you are stating. Last week I think I worked something like 50 hours and there was a huge amount of pressure. I enjoyed it but I left on Friday and fell asleep on the train and then slept a lot that night and had a headache Friday and Saturday. I also didn't go the gym once last week.

Its not the way I want to live my life. Work was exciting but predominantly because the pressure was huge and shit was hitting the fan but everything else in my life suffered and it doesn't really make me happy.

I know how I want to live my life but getting there is hard.

I also see myself as slowly moving towards FI and minimizing my working hours when I can. I think something like get to a 5% WR and then take 8 weeks holiday. Then work 4 days per week and then maybe 3 days per week and then nothing.

[jacob]

@Dg - Seeing things from the other side, I think from the front side tends to see FI as a finishing line to be crossed. From the back side, that line is/will be meaningless. Granted, it's very nice not to have to worry about it anymore. However, practically, in retrospect, there has not been a single year after reaching FI where I have not enough money from some other venue. I have not touched my nest egg so far. That's almost 10 years going. So rather than labor on hard in a less meaningful life (I mean a way of life that's not optimal for happiness), put less emphasis on crossing some finishing life which in my(*) experiences was relatively immaterial to the life I was living anyway. Of course this is much easier when cost-of-living is low (because skills-of-living is high). It's easy to make 5-10k in evenings or weekends on a hobby basis. It's pretty hard to make 20k that way.

In conclusion: Lower expenses and look to cover that with a second income stream. If you can do this consistently, it becomes apparent that FI is just another way of doing it. Not a better one either.

(*) Not part of the "retire never provide any value again anywhere" philosophy.

[DutchGirl]

Ah yes, I could also work on changing my career to something else. I have been considering that, too. Maybe over the next five years or so I can transition in some other career; one that may not make as much money, but is more satisfying. I have been thinking about something finance-related (as that interests me, currently), but these are still vague plans. Although I already do have my bookkeeping diploma

Compared to others here, my expenses are high. I want to make 36k euros (after taxes) this year and save 18k euros of it; meaning my expenses are 1500 euros per month ($1700/month). Some of these expenses are higher because I live together with my boyfriend. He doesn't want to move to a cheaper house, or to take on a renter (although there's room for one), and he doesn't want to watch every penny when it comes to grocery shopping. On the other hand, we also share costs, which makes life cheaper. And I struggle to keep my unexpected and fun expenses low, for which I have only myself to blame. But that is a project I'm taking on this year...

[m741]

Sounds like the commute is a big problem that's adding a lot of time to 'work' which you aren't paid for. Can you reduce the commute by moving closer or finding closer work? (Maybe not immediately, but in a year or something)? Alternately, can you work longer shifts so that you have to commute fewer times?

[Hankaroundtheworld]

Just wanted to say, 1500 euro per Month is reasonable in the Netherlands, assuming it is 3000 / month for the both of you together. I was surprised about that some years ago, but after listening to several friends and family, it seems 3000 / month is normal for a household in the Netherlands, many with double income spent even more... not that you should, but that you already know. 50% saving is a decent goal, so well done!

[DutchGirl]

Average expenses per month in 2014 were:

rent and utilities 400
groceries 300
fun 200
charities 180
health insurance 160
public transport 140 (+ bike repairs too)
saving for nieces/nephew 80
gifts to family/friends 70
other insurances 50
clothes/mobile phone/other 20

So 1640/month.

Of course I could reduce expenses on almost all of these categories, but most of the time these are choices I have made - I choose to spend more, knowing it'll take me longer to reach FI that way. This year I am trying to reduce the "fun" expenses and the gifts to friends and family. A lean budget (no charities, less gifts and fun, less transport costs, less groceries) would mean I would spend something like 1200/month...

I'm trying to reduce fun expenses to 20/week or roughly 90/month. So far, it hasn't worked very well; I've overspend in January and if I roll over that money to February, then I have to stop spending for February right now with still 75% of the month to go. And oh, next week I'm going to have my passport renewed, which is going to cost 50 euros (for ten years), so then I'm over for February as well and already eating into March's budget.

[DutchGirl]

The end of the month again, time for an update.

I noticed that i didn't answer m741's questions. I work at the blood bank, but I work at roughly ten different locations. I'm actually quite nicely situated in the middle, and I live close to public transport and most of the blood banks that I work at are also close to a train or a bus station. I can bike to three different locations (longest trip is 50 minutes), and for two others I have to walk 30 minutes from a station to get there, which is good because it's exercise. I work when the blood bank is open, and sometimes a specific location is only open for 4 hours on a day (for example 5 PM until 9 PM). My schedule is irregular. I could say no to very inconvenient times & locations, but to me that feels like missing out on some good money. Maybe I'll improve on that topic - that I'll get better at saying "no" to the worst of the shifts. But so it's impossible to "move closer" to work, because if I move closer to one location, I'll move further away from another.

For the third time my boyfriend was asked to apply for a job in Germany. He had a phone interview last week. He thought it went well. Next week they will let him know whether he'll be one of two candidates asked to fly in for another job interview. So we are waiting, again... If it happens this time, then we'll move to Germany, etc etc. My hopes are up, because I'll welcome the adventure, but not as "up" as they were the first time. We'll see. I'll update you guys when we know more...

Expenses were, errr, reasonable this month... 1430 euros. I spent 70 euros on a new passport, which is valid for the next ten years. I went to an event where we sang musical songs all day and evening, I already paid for the event in December, but I went with a friend and we ate out twice (lunch and dinner), so that was 32 euros each. I got a headphone for 19 euros and hope to use it a lot for my new "job on the side".

So I also found a small job on the side and made 85 euros so far, in 1.5 weeks. I like that; I can do it in my downtime from work. I can also do it if we move to Germany. It's just a bit of money, but it might boost my income by 1000-2000 euros per year, which is not nothing.

[DutchGirl]

My boyfriend flew in to Germany last month for an interview. He was supposed to hear something about it one week ago, but didn't. At that time, the onofficial news was that they were as of yet undecided. Apparently they have stayed undecided for the next week, because we still haven't heard anything (sigh). So we are still waiting for news.

As for me, income was higher because finally some extra hours I worked were paid, but I'm expecting even more of them with the April paycheck. I also kept doing that job on the side, and it gave me another 200 euros (pretax, so I'll still have to pay roughly 42% taxes on it (the normal tax rate in the Netherlands...)). Total income was 2525 euros.

Expenses were 1563 euros, so my savings rate was 38%. I'll take it for now... I quickly analyzed the first quarter of the year, and I spent 4580 euros, while I was aiming to spend 4500 euros. So I'm pretty much on track, which is nice.

I still spend too much on candy, fun, gifts... At least more than I like. Last month it was roughly 100 euros, while I was aiming for 20. Time to do better in April, I hope.

PS. Next week I'll be off volunteering with "De Zonnebloem", an charitable organisation that organizes meetings and short holidays for people who are physically handicapped. As a volunteer, I'll be pushing wheelchairs, pouring coffee and helping with meals. I won't have to pay for the hotel nor for food. I know some of the volunteers partake in a holiday week every few weeks. I'm now thinking that this could be a way to reduce your expenses in early retirement, at least on groceries and on entertainment. I could also get my train ticket costs refunded, but I'm probably not going to bother about that. It will be a cheap week anyway. I'm taking 20 euros with me (from our groceries budget) for having a drink here or there when sitting at a pub with the guests. It will also be a week when I won't be using the internet a lot; that'll be quite the change for me. I'm curious whether I'll have withdrawal symptoms.

[DutchGirl]

It's not the end of the month, just yet, but let's pretend it is... This month I spent 31 euros on fun, and stayed within budget for all other budgeted items. In total I have spent 1459 euros. My income for the month is 3504 euros, salary and the side-job. So for this month my savings rate was 58%, wow! (average savings rate for 2015 42%). I'm expecting a nice salary in May as well, so I should be able to keep a nice savings rate.

For next month, I'll have to keep "fun" spending below 54 euros and then I'll finally have an average "fun" spending of less than 20 euros per week for this year.

And after my salary came in last week, my net worth reached 70k + euros. It might dip a little bit below it before the next salary, but not much, and the dip may even be compensated by capital gains / interest paid to me, etc. Nice to see that.

The Germany job is not going to happen, we received word from that last Friday. For me the good thing about that is that I can continue working my job, and can continue to earn a good income there. My boyfriend definitely isn't without work, either!

The Zonnebloem-week was nice. I didn't spent a lot of money, and I enjoyed some nice trips and good weather, together with the guests. Plus (of course?) it again reminded me of the fact that I'm young and healhty(-ish), and that I'd better enjoy it while it lasts. Plus that I should try to keep it that way for as long as I can.

After that week we had a family weekend, and I got infected with a bug that was going around amongst the nieces/nephew (so far, I have given them money and toys, and they have given me smiles, kisses and bugs) and had a cold for two weeks straight. I'm still recovering from it. There's a cold going around in the Netherlands anyway, and some of my colleagues got ill, too, so I picked up a few extra shifts from them. I hope to fully recover this weekend.

My boyfriend was struggling with his current work project, a few weeks ago, and sighed: "Can't we move to some cheap place and be done with this thing called work?". Well, that was a trigger for me to look into our finances. Together we have roughly 300k euros, meaning that we could safely take out 9-12k euros per year and live on that. That's not enough, yet. Our house alone costs 10k/year. We could move to somewhere in Africa or so, but I don't want to do that. So we'll have to keep working on it. Together, our savings rate is something like 30k euros per year, so maybe in five years I can tell him: "Yes, we can go live in Hungary, next to Hankaroundtheworld ... "

[1Vikinggirl]

Hi DutchGirl,
Isn't it nice when the non-ERE partner all of a sudden, without prompting, comes out with these plans? As if they came up with it themselves.
The "DutchBoy" to my Vikinggirl just decided that we will stop working in five years and then trade our Amd-apartment for something small and inexpensive to use as a home base for our cheap travelling lifestyle. Now, all he just has to do is to get his hands on as much work he can the next five years. His spending is controlled but with more income, we really could both be off in five years. (I am FI: see onevikinggirl.blogspot.com)
And for me the Netherlands are plenty nice and warm enough during the winter, although Hungary does sound really nice too.. Igen! Maybe we all join Hankaroundtheworld - Is daar nog plaats?

[DutchGirl]

My boyfriend was struggling with his current work project, a few weeks ago, and sighed: "Can't we move to some cheap place and be done with this thing called work?". Well, that was a trigger for me to look into our finances. Together we have roughly 300k euros, meaning that we could safely take out 9-12k euros per year and live on that. That's not enough, yet. Our house alone costs 10k/year.

I thought about this in another way, just a few days ago. We do have enough assets for one of us to quit working... I spend roughly 1500/month, my boyfriend spends roughly 2000/month. My income is roughly 2500-3000/month, my boyfriend's income is more unpredictable but also at least 2500/month. So if either of us really wants to or has to stop working, then the income of the other person plus some money from the stash is enough to keep us going with the same expenses (and I'm pretty sure we could also reduce expenses some more if necessary).

That feels really liberating. Not liberating enough yet to put in my two weeks notice , but it does feel good. If the boyfriend ever sighs "Oh, I hate this, I really want to stop working" again, I can tell him that he should feel free to do just that.

Hopefully we can just keep going until we're truly FI, but this feels like step 1: if one of us loses their job or quits, there will be no need for panic.