Retirement endgame

Where are you and where are you going?
Nuuka
Posts: 111
Joined: Thu Sep 26, 2019 11:22 pm
Location: Europe

Re: Retirement endgame

Post by Nuuka » Thu Oct 24, 2019 3:28 pm

One of my principles in management was trying to avoid being first to say “no”. I always waited in meetings that somebody else would say no and only after that let my negative stance to be known. So I tried to avoid throwing the first stone.

The reason was to avoid enemies. It hurts people big-time if their ideas or pet projects are shot down. They always try to find who killed their idea. They will hate the one who did it. When you collect enough enemies, they will make your life difficult as manager.

Sometimes my strategy backfired if nobody said no and the idea got accepted. Then I had to find some other way to kill or delay (=non-support) the idea. Sometimes even that didn’t work. And some goose chase project got started.

One big goose chase project had survived about a year of my non-support until it came back to a admin meeting that I chaired for next phase decision. I really wanted to have it killed because I saw that it had huge risk with potential loss of reputation of the organisation. But there was support from upper management and I was summoned to a brainwashing meeting where I was presented ultimatum to support the goose chase project or I would be taken down from admin position immediately.

This was a difficult moment. To be true to your opinion, or to bend to the threat of being fired. I had to make a decision real-time, I had no luxary to think over over night. What I did was to find a third alternative: To void myself from handling that whole issue based on technicality. So I didn’t have to say no (and get enemies, plus removed from position), but I didn’t have to say yes either, so i didn’t bend to the pressure to act against my opinion. This was sufficient to fulfil my internal balance.

The goose chase project did get its funding in admin meeting chaired by another person (who propably received similar brainwash treatment). Some years have passed since and this project is in major difficulties, and now I just follow if the risks blow up or not. Anyway, I washed my hands from the project so I cannot be blamed for that.
Last edited by Nuuka on Sun Nov 10, 2019 6:25 am, edited 2 times in total.

Nuuka
Posts: 111
Joined: Thu Sep 26, 2019 11:22 pm
Location: Europe

Re: Retirement endgame

Post by Nuuka » Fri Oct 25, 2019 6:46 am

Leonardo da Vinci museum in Piazza del Popolo in Rome. This was a good museum with annotated storyline of Leonardo. He was born outside of marriage by a jurist and a maid, so he had no noble background nor big money. During whole his life he needed a host/protector, so he was never independent. In a way he had to become prostitute of science. He had to design war machines for example while in Milan.
Last edited by Nuuka on Sun Nov 10, 2019 6:15 am, edited 1 time in total.

Nuuka
Posts: 111
Joined: Thu Sep 26, 2019 11:22 pm
Location: Europe

Re: Retirement endgame

Post by Nuuka » Sun Oct 27, 2019 2:15 pm

Removed
Last edited by Nuuka on Mon Nov 11, 2019 5:04 am, edited 2 times in total.

Nuuka
Posts: 111
Joined: Thu Sep 26, 2019 11:22 pm
Location: Europe

Re: Retirement endgame

Post by Nuuka » Sun Oct 27, 2019 5:30 pm

Was Leonardo Da Vinci INFJ? I have seen also arguments that he could be INFP because of he had so many incompleted projects.

daylen
Posts: 1242
Joined: Wed Dec 16, 2015 4:17 am

Re: Retirement endgame

Post by daylen » Sun Oct 27, 2019 9:40 pm

Nuuka wrote:
Sun Oct 27, 2019 5:30 pm
Was Leonardo Da Vinci INFJ?
No, he was probably an ENTP. Lots of Ne and Ti.

Nuuka
Posts: 111
Joined: Thu Sep 26, 2019 11:22 pm
Location: Europe

Re: Retirement endgame

Post by Nuuka » Mon Oct 28, 2019 3:13 am

The evidence for my assessment for him being INFJ is as follows:

When painting Last Supper, he was said to have studied 2 years in streets of Milan to find proper faces (for expressing the feelings when Jesus brought out the claim that someone will betray him). So he was observing and collecting the right set of people face expressions. To me this is not explicit thinking but feeling. So XXFX.

Then while painting Last Supper he used to just look for the emerging painting for days, and then on some days paint intesively without breaks and even eating. To me this looks very much like waiting for intuition, therefore XNFX.

Then I found out that Leonardo used a written resume to apply for job assignments. There was one of his resumes shown in Rome de Popolo museum. This tells me that he is INFX. If he were ENFX he would just have gone there and charmed the wealthy people.

Then there was description of the background work he did while in Rome for building a model (set of scetches of bones, veins, nerves, digestion) of the human body by establishing contact to mortuary to get access to human corpses for opening autopsies. This looks to me very much INFJ. If he were INFP he would have not seen the trouble of getting the corpses.

Nuuka
Posts: 111
Joined: Thu Sep 26, 2019 11:22 pm
Location: Europe

Re: Retirement endgame

Post by Nuuka » Mon Oct 28, 2019 3:43 am

Removed
Last edited by Nuuka on Sun Nov 10, 2019 6:23 am, edited 5 times in total.

Jason
Posts: 2369
Joined: Mon Jan 30, 2017 8:37 am

Re: Retirement endgame

Post by Jason » Mon Oct 28, 2019 8:13 am

Nuuka wrote:
Sun Oct 27, 2019 5:30 pm
Was Leonardo Da Vinci INFJ? I have seen also arguments that he could be INFP because of he had so many incompleted projects.
Recent scholarship/speculation leans towards DaVinci having Aspergers. It would explain his problems with social interaction, highly developed skills in certain areas and the incomplete projects.

7Wannabe5
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Joined: Fri Oct 18, 2013 9:03 am

Re: Retirement endgame

Post by 7Wannabe5 » Mon Oct 28, 2019 8:48 am

ENTP with mild cyclothymia would fit too. Jung classified ENP as "feminine" types even though ENTPs are mostly male and lacking primary F. Also ENTPs can be simultaneously social and shy/reclusive in a kooky manner. Imagine Kramer as a "mad" scientist type talking a mile-per-minute as he shows you what he has been working on in his lab-shop-garden-library and then suddenly becoming completely distracted and just walking out of the room babbling to himself about something else and leaving you on your own. Also, the reason why an ENTP would send a resume rather than just show up and be charming is that an ENTP never really wants a job working for somebody else, so would only be able to approach this goal through misdirection, and fast writing is as easy as fast-talking for an ENTP. IOW, an ENTP might mail out resumes on the same minor impulse other types might assign to tasks such as filling out a form for a randomly encountered car raffle, and then almost completely forget about it by the time somebody contacts them with an actual offer.

daylen
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Joined: Wed Dec 16, 2015 4:17 am

Re: Retirement endgame

Post by daylen » Mon Oct 28, 2019 10:56 pm

I am thinking you may be right about INFJ after doing some more digging. His work and interests paint an Ne dominant picture but his reasoning and method is very Ni-Se. Generally, typing with the four letters is not accurate so I type by the cognitive functions. Will elaborate later (maybe ha).

Jason
Posts: 2369
Joined: Mon Jan 30, 2017 8:37 am

Re: Retirement endgame

Post by Jason » Tue Oct 29, 2019 2:07 pm

All these different takes on the man. It reminds me of the Woody Allen movie "Zelig."

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