Millenials - we're kind of screwed as a generation. What to do what to do~

Simple living, extreme early retirement, becoming and being wealthy, wisdom, praxis, personal growth,...
User avatar
Mister Imperceptible
Posts: 1669
Joined: Fri Nov 10, 2017 4:18 pm

Re: Millenials - we're kind of screwed as a generation. What to do what to do~

Post by Mister Imperceptible »

I’m 31, so “millennial” by definition, if we resign ourselves to using definitions invented by social scientists so that they can wear a tie and have a job.

@THF, it’s all good baby, Rome wasn’t built in a day. I second what ZAF said, get untorqued, get off social media, turn off the TV. The media wants you whipped into a frenzy so you do what the system wants, instead of what you want. Don’t buy into the BS narratives being rammed down our throats. Consider what Jason dug up from that Medieval era. Be conscientious of all the dopamine hacks and try to minimize or avoid them.

@slowtraveler
I am looking forward to experiencing how foreign women treat an American man!

@stahlmann
“I will say it again- nihilism must be overcome.”
-Nietzsche

@jason
Thanks again for just being you, dude.

BRUTE
Posts: 3797
Joined: Sat Dec 26, 2015 5:20 pm

Re: Millenials - we're kind of screwed as a generation. What to do what to do~

Post by BRUTE »

lol THF is being such a Millenial..

makes brute think that the whole "sense of agency" thing actually matters.

1.millenials voluntarily took on high levels of student loans
2.millenials only want to do fluffy white collar jobs that require Bachelor's degrees, not get their hands dirty in good paying blue collar jobs
3.millenials blindly follow bad advice
4.millenials .. wait, how is porn bad?
5-10.millenials can't get a girlfriend and somehow it's everyone else's fault.

brute would recommend THF get a job. life's not free. it's not other humans that make life not free, it's the nature of the universe - humans require resources to stay alive. resources don't come free.

User avatar
Mister Imperceptible
Posts: 1669
Joined: Fri Nov 10, 2017 4:18 pm

Re: Millenials - we're kind of screwed as a generation. What to do what to do~

Post by Mister Imperceptible »

Well, before we all descend upon THF and call him a whiny bitch (and you are acting that way THF, but not to worry, I myself have been a whiny bitch at one point, as have most here in all likelihood) I just want to put a positive spin on this. “Become hard” is a wonderful maxim that one should take to heart, as there are no safe spaces in life. However, if you are feeling down, it might not inspire you.

Instead of looking at life in a negative manner, and just having to take your lumps and man up and crush down your feelings, look at it as a great challenge to assert yourself against all odds. If the system is rigged, society corrupt, and culture decaying, that you can defy a cold and indifferent universe to emerge triumphant is beauty itself.

I was $175,000 in student debt at one time. I paid it off. I never once felt defeated by it. Allow nothing to stop you.

I think you may have read one too many of those garbage “10 problems Millenials are facing right now” that keep appearing as you scroll enviously down your Facebook feed to look at the facades people are putting up. I look for things that are beautiful. Art is a great antidote for me. In times past, you would have been prescribed The Iliad. I recommend you watch Shawshank Redemption, or re-watch it, if you have seen it already.

The world is full of possibilities. That you are speaking amongst these fine people is evidence enough that you have the stuff of a “higher being” (yes I said it!) if you can cultivate it. You should take immense satisfaction in that.

Kriegsspiel
Posts: 952
Joined: Fri Aug 03, 2012 9:05 pm

Re: Millenials - we're kind of screwed as a generation. What to do what to do~

Post by Kriegsspiel »

So, what the hell do we do about it all, as millennials?
Make money, pay off your loans, invest; you know ERE. Stop using "social media" and dating sites, they are fucking garbage. Have agency. Life might not be happy, that's ok, do the best you can.

EdithKeeler
Posts: 1099
Joined: Sun Sep 01, 2013 7:55 pm

Re: Millenials - we're kind of screwed as a generation. What to do what to do~

Post by EdithKeeler »

I can't help but wonder why you're so concerned about these "issues" when few of them appear to apply to you. You have no student debt and a net worth most people your age would envy. You have a degree from a top school, and you posted recently that a family member had found you a job. Dating doesn't seem to be an issue since you've written extensively about your polyamory. Finally, I guess I'm wondering why anyone is eager to be lumped so readily into a group.

Most of the millennials I know do not have any of these issues you've posted about. Most of them (kids of my peers) are going to school or have graduated with no or minimal student loans and have gotten good jobs. Some have gotten really good jobs. I know one kid that ran up ridiculous debt for a PharmD; she hates her job, but makes great money, and she's moving back in with her parents. But she's an outlier. One friend's kid went to a modest state school, no debt, got a degree in marketing, I think, and works for IBM, who's paying for her master's. One kid is trans, went to a small college where he's thrived, and is graduating with a music degree and has a job lined up teaching music at some private school.

No one picks when they're born, what generation they fall into. No one gets to pick what's happening n the world when they come into it, or when they graduate from college. A person can whine about the hand that they think they've been dealt, or they can roll up their sleeves and get to work to change their circumstances.

I frankly just don't understand this "we're screwed as a generation" thing. Job-wise people in your age cohort are sitting pretty--companies are courting millennials hot and heavy, and unemployment is so low right now, people can almost have their pick of jobs. Frankly, anyone who lives in a major metropolitan area who's not employed at something probably isn't trying really hard.

In so many ways this is a GREAT time to be alive, and to be young! I think there are very few cultural conventions being imposed on people these days. It's OK to be gay. It's OK to be trans. Black is still beautiful--and we have Black Panther on the screen! Women can work at whatever we want to, and it's OK if we're not married, and it's OK if we're stay at home moms or not. It's cool for dads to stay home, too. We have every kind of information available to us at the touch of a computer screen. We can order food and have it delivered to us... or we can order a car that will come to our door and take us to the food. How freakin' awesome is that?? We can buy anything we want and Amazon will send it to us in 2 days, or 1 if we pay extra. We live in a time when diseases that would have killed us 3 decades ago can be cured or managed with a pill. More and more people are having their cancer cured, or managing it in such a way that they won't probably actually die of the cancer. Have you seen those Boston Dynamics robots?? We live in a time where we can download 2,000 books on a device that weighs like 8 ounces or something. THERE IS A TESLA IN SPACE!

Seriously, you can wring your hands and bemoan your fate as a millennial, or you can look up from Facebook and realize that the world is a fucking awesome place and you're lucky to be alive right now. And if there are things in this world that you think need fixing, then use the tools at your disposal to work on fixing them.

Everything's amazing and no one is happy
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q8LaT5Iiwo4

Randy
Posts: 36
Joined: Mon Mar 05, 2018 9:03 am

Re: Millenials - we're kind of screwed as a generation. What to do what to do~

Post by Randy »

Dang @TopHatFox, you really know how to get a debate going. At 23, I'm also a millenial and am familiar with many of these problems myself.

1 & 2 are the most challenging in my opinion. As I was growing up it was never questioned that you would go to college and that this was necessary for a decent job, unless you wanted to work at McDonald's and be poor your entire life. I was just entering high school around 2009 when all I would hear on the news and from adults is how difficult it was to get a job, so this reinforced the necessity for college even more. How on earth were we supposed to know that trade school was even an option, much less an option that could result in some actual lucrative positions? This naturally resulted in people taking on debt that in hindsight was not the best option. But hindsight is 20/20

5 & 6 are also pose some unique challenges I think. There's no doubt in my mind that overuse of social media can contribute negatively to mental health, but we are lucky in that many of us remember a time Before social media, so we (hopefully) can more easily recognize when it is time to unplug. This is a lesson that everyone has to learn, I think, and I am more worried about the younger generation (do they have a name yet?) where social media is even more ubiquitous. Adding online dating to the social media environment makes things even more difficult to navigate. This basically commodified dating, making it easy to lose sight of the fact that these were in fact people and not products to optimize. For me, apps like Tinder were disheartening because I found myself turning it into a game of numbers with regard to the ratios of numbers of swipes to first dates to second dates etc. until surely it was just a matter of volume of swipes until I found the right guy (maybe that's just the analyst in me).

8/9/10, sure we have challenges with regard to societal roles, but doesn't every generation? I think we are also fortunate in that there is quite a large force trying to address these issues and raise awareness.

One issue you didn't mention is mental health. It seems that there has been a dramatic increase in mental health issues for millenials. A good half of the people I know my age have to deal with anxiety or depression in some shape or form. I'm sure some of the inflation is due to increased awareness of mental health issues leading to increased diagnoses', but I don't think that can account for all of the inflation.

I think the overarching theme for solving these problems that millenials face is that we have to learn to better evaluate our options and choose what works best for us. It can be intimidating to go against social norms, but many of us are realizing that the social norms we've adhered to aren't working for us. And I'm sure these lessons are not so different from what generations before us had to learn. (also, at least we didn't have to worry about school shootings)

I'm really curious about the demographics of the ERE community. We seems to have quite a large spread, but I think it'd be really cool to see a breakdown of ages and also the amount of people living in metropolitan vs. rural areas. Maybe that's best left for another thread though.

User avatar
Jean
Posts: 1907
Joined: Fri Dec 13, 2013 8:49 am
Location: Switzterland

Re: Millenials - we're kind of screwed as a generation. What to do what to do~

Post by Jean »

All advice starting with get a job are useless.
My dad sent 3 job application in his whole life, I used to send 3 in a day sometimes.
When you're in front of a row of 80 yo telling you to get a job, and you aplied to more job in a month than all of them together did in their whole lives, you really don't know what to do with the advice.

Farm_or
Posts: 412
Joined: Thu Nov 10, 2016 8:57 am
Contact:

Re: Millenials - we're kind of screwed as a generation. What to do what to do~

Post by Farm_or »

@Jason - very imaginative! But I can't stop laughing long enough to take in any more posters. I'll have to try again later...

Jason

Re: Millenials - we're kind of screwed as a generation. What to do what to do~

Post by Jason »

Rule of Thumb - whenever anyone starts a wistful "I wish I lived back when...." tell them to read a medical textbook or plumbing manual (if they had any) from that time and then get back to you.

plantingourpennies
Posts: 99
Joined: Mon Jun 25, 2012 12:11 am
Contact:

Re: Millenials - we're kind of screwed as a generation. What to do what to do~

Post by plantingourpennies »

ffj wrote:
Sun Mar 11, 2018 10:22 am
Every so often I just shake my head and wonder how some of these thoughts and questions end up on THIS forum.
Ditto that! THF has created a list of things that ERE is designed to solve, and then posted them to the ERE forum asking how to solve them...

@THF Surely you can see the irony here?
Jean wrote:
Mon Mar 12, 2018 4:37 am
All advice starting with get a job are useless.
Get a job. You're in the best employment market that you've seen in your life-if you're still having trouble then there is likely some underlying issue (drugs, depression, trying to find work as a TV repairman, etc) that you have to resolve first.
Last edited by plantingourpennies on Mon Mar 12, 2018 11:15 am, edited 1 time in total.

RealPerson
Posts: 875
Joined: Thu Nov 22, 2012 4:33 pm

Re: Millenials - we're kind of screwed as a generation. What to do what to do~

Post by RealPerson »

I am really puzzled by the OP Zalo. A degree from Amherst, no student debt due to scholarships (yeah!), money in the bank (or better yet, invested), a good first job as I recall, a sex life to make many men jealous, a clear ERE mindset..... That is one of the most ideal set of circumstances I have ever seen in a young man.

So why a post full of doubt and insecurity? Many of the things you list don't even apply to you. I have a Millennial nephew who, after starting to work, wondered out loud if this is all there is to life. Is that same sort of feeling bugging you? Or maybe college really was a fun and carefree life compared to the world of jobs and responsibilities. I just wonder what's behind the post? It is not just my curiosity. My kids are Millennials and seem to have a similar mindset. i would like to understand them better.

Paula
Posts: 44
Joined: Sun Jan 07, 2018 8:32 pm

Re: Millenials - we're kind of screwed as a generation. What to do what to do~

Post by Paula »

A lot of the recent psychological research has failed to replicate. It was good to see that the work of Dweck and Duckworth on the Growth Mindset has replicated.

Loner
Posts: 221
Joined: Wed Jan 04, 2017 2:26 pm

Re: Millenials - we're kind of screwed as a generation. What to do what to do~

Post by Loner »

Great post Edith. As a Millennial, I keep being amazed on how everything is great now, all the choices, the opportunities (at least in the rich world). It’s not perfect, but in many respects, it sure beats the past. Many things are much easier.

Maybe that’s part of the problem. When there’s nothing to push against, you transform into jelly. Too much is never enough. If you’re not the kind of person that can just make your own meaning, give yourself challenges and goals, and generaly be intrinsically motivated, life can get tough quick in a world of abundance. Sure, you can get laid easy. Sure, you can get a 100k job. Sure there’s no oppressive religion. But then what? What’s the purpose of that? How do you choose if there's no overarching purpose.

It gets even worse if you log on Facebook and see that one friend climbed Himalaya, that a second just married all-smiles in the Bahamas and that a third one got his brand new Lamborgotti Fasterossa. Looks like the world is perfect.

Religion might have been sucky in some ways, but at least it gave you a clear view of what life was about. Having a crappy job that barely pays for a rat-free home is tough, but then you have a clue of why to work. Marrying your neighbour Cletus or Selma sounds bad, but at least you did not worry about the three other billion partners you might have been with.

Just like Randy mentions, I also see a lot of mental health problems around: depression, anxiety, burnout, etc. Maybe this is why. Even if things are objectively better, they feel subjectively worse, and meaningless. Maybe it’s no matter that suicide is so high in countries that have it the best. In a way, I can understand your post THF, even if I don't agree that things a really worse.

For me, the solution is to try as best as I can to be grateful for what I have, and to follow the principles of ERE. Works fine.

User avatar
Jean
Posts: 1907
Joined: Fri Dec 13, 2013 8:49 am
Location: Switzterland

Re: Millenials - we're kind of screwed as a generation. What to do what to do~

Post by Jean »


Get a job. You're in the best employment market that you've seen in your life-if you're still having trouble then there is likely some underlying issue (drugs, depression, trying to find work as a TV repairman, etc) that you have to resolve first.
Yeah, obviously, but I'm not depressed (as far as I know), I don't do drug, and I'm trying to get a job as an engineer, which I every so often ear that we have a lack thereof. I tried for nearly 8 years, and still haven't found what the underlying problem is. No one seems to be able to help me about that. I lack experience for real positions, but I graduated too much time ago to get a traineeship. I applyed to everykind of position I would be qualified for. Janitor, bike delivery, substitute teaching, special force operative (I made it to the end, I was clearly among the best of the survivors performance wise, and they didn't took me personality wise. They even told they really enjoyed the time with me, but that some people couldn't work with me). It really sucks. I would really like someone to help me.

oldbeyond
Posts: 338
Joined: Thu Nov 29, 2012 10:43 pm

Re: Millenials - we're kind of screwed as a generation. What to do what to do~

Post by oldbeyond »

I think there's two aspects to this, sociology(comparing assets/liabilities public and private between generations and the like) and ethics(of the practically minded "stoic" how-should-we-then-live-variety). I guess they get treated as one and the same, hence the endless rehashings of the "evil boomers/weak millenials"-rants(at least in the US, I haven't noticed the same obsession in Europe to anything close to the same degree). When it comes to how to live the sociology doesn't matter that much because no one lives in the aggregate, and even if your generations is getting the shaft, you yourself might be thriving due to skills/assets/relationships/luck etc, as always it's about assessing what you have and doing the best with it. It might be enlightening for long-term planning, though(estimating taxes/government handouts, political developments, securities pricing etc).

In the end, whether us millenials were worse off compared to boomers/X:ers or not is something that will be settled with decent accuracy before we enter our twilight years, so there's a bit to go, still.

EdithKeeler
Posts: 1099
Joined: Sun Sep 01, 2013 7:55 pm

Re: Millenials - we're kind of screwed as a generation. What to do what to do~

Post by EdithKeeler »

they didn't took me personality wise. They even told they really enjoyed the time with me, but that some people couldn't work with me). It really sucks. I would really like someone to help me.
I assume they have these in Switzerland, but sounds to me like you’d benefit from a career coach to help you focus on what you want to do, what you’re suited for and address any impediments in your way.

Tyler9000
Posts: 1758
Joined: Fri Jun 01, 2012 11:45 pm

Re: Millenials - we're kind of screwed as a generation. What to do what to do~

Post by Tyler9000 »

As bad as student loan debt is these days (and I agree it's a huge problem), I wager my FIL would probably take that versus being drafted and dropped into Vietnam at the same age. ;) Every generation has challenges. What defines your character is how you personally deal with those inevitable hardships.

IMHO, step one is to stop thinking of yourself as a victim and start thinking in terms of what actions you can personally take to make the most of the opportunities presented to you every day.

TopHatFox
Posts: 2322
Joined: Thu Oct 17, 2013 10:07 pm
Location: FL; 25

Re: Millenials - we're kind of screwed as a generation. What to do what to do~

Post by TopHatFox »

Randy wrote:
Mon Mar 12, 2018 3:36 am
Dang @TopHatFox, you really know how to get a debate going. At 23, I'm also a millenial and am familiar with many of these problems myself.
'tis my specialty it seems :lol:

One thing that would be cool is to create solutions for these issues to the marketplace during hours after work or weekends. For instance, creating a company that refinances student loans (SoFi) or a company that tries to make online dating better (CoffeeMeetsBagle).

User avatar
Jean
Posts: 1907
Joined: Fri Dec 13, 2013 8:49 am
Location: Switzterland

Re: Millenials - we're kind of screwed as a generation. What to do what to do~

Post by Jean »

EdithKeeler wrote:
Mon Mar 12, 2018 2:25 pm
they didn't took me personality wise. They even told they really enjoyed the time with me, but that some people couldn't work with me). It really sucks. I would really like someone to help me.
I assume they have these in Switzerland, but sounds to me like you’d benefit from a career coach to help you focus on what you want to do, what you’re suited for and address any impediments in your way.
I did. I contacted my former school student service because they offer some kind of coaching for alumni. She made me pass some kind of personality testing. told me to accept that I didn't realy wanted a job, and stop looking for one. But she didn't tell me what to do instead of that. I haven't been able to figure it out since. I met other career. They all leave me the same feel that they have no Idea about what I should do. I don't know where to find a proper coach. I don't even need the money to survive, I just want to make me usefull.

User avatar
Mister Imperceptible
Posts: 1669
Joined: Fri Nov 10, 2017 4:18 pm

Re: Millenials - we're kind of screwed as a generation. What to do what to do~

Post by Mister Imperceptible »

@jean

Edith and the others are giving you fine advice, and you should take all they say to heart and look wherever you can for an actionable item. But you’re an intelligent person and I do not think what you are lacking right now is a specific answer. I am not sure about your upbringing or what is customary is Switzerland. But I am going to tell you that YOU NEED TO GET FUCKING ANGRY. ANGER IS MORE USEFUL THAN DESPAIR. GET MAD YOU SON OF A BITCH GET MAD.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=jeIy2MHZ0xE

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Q4PE2hSqVnk

Post Reply