LASIK

[saving-10-years]

I recently (March '16) had refractive lens exchange (i.e. cataract style) surgery on both eyes rather than the laser treatment talked about here back in 2014. This seems to be something that is offered more often to myopics (Optical Express in the UK has an offer on currently - although I did not use them). It may be something that others are considering but as it carries a risk of retinal detachment when there is high level of myopia its something that needs careful consideration.

Some context:
* My prescription was pretty extreme (-13 left eye and -10 right eye) plus some long-sightedness (c. +1 correction by glasses)
* I already had early symptoms of cataracts
* My left eye was found to have lost its central field of vision in Aug 2015 because of bleeds in that eye and resultant clots and scars (this happens with high levels of myopia but left eye compensated so not spotted until they covered the good eye for the eye test).
* Post surgery eyes work pretty well and I now am now -3 in left (bad) eye and -1 on the right eye. Borderline good enough to drive without glasses. I find that I can now do without glasses for most social purposes.
* However due to some over-correction I am now less 'short-sighted' than intended so reading requires +1.5 correction. (My surgeon explained that its easier to get it exactly right when its not such a large adjustment (he used a golf putting analogy)).
* Cost was just below £5000. My glasses now cost (at most) less than half previously. If I am being frugal (now that I have wider range of choice in lenses/glasses) its probably going to be less than a quarter the usual cost so payback within 10 years. I also have pre-empted cataract surgery in the future.

[chenda]

Apparently indigenous people have zero eye problems and perfect vision. Hearing too.

sounds like natural selection at work, there.

I expect indigenous people are not exposed to industrial sounds which cause noise-induced hearing loss, which is often overlooked. Its advisable to protect your hearing whenever you're in a noisy environment like a music venue, for its long term retention.

[tommytebco]

One more data point.
I was also gifted with great vision. In my 20's it measured 20/13 or so in both eyes.

In my middle to late 40's I noticed my arms were getting too short, as I would squint to read invoices. So I bought non prescription reading glasses (in the $10 range) I wore them on a string around my neck and popped them on as needed. Strength started at 1.25 and increased to 3.5 or 4.0 by my early 60's. At that time, the high magnification caused some eye strain and distance stuff, without glasses, was getting real foggy.

So, I got prescription bifocal glasses. The prescription has not changed much during the last 13 years.

My philosophy has always been to avoid the knife in all situations where there is an option. Thus, I've never had an operation of any kind.

It's worked well for me.

[saving-10-years]

It must be great to have good vision - mine has been poor since age 8. From what I understand now (ah hindsight!) I'd have been better trying my hardest to avoid relying on glasses - although I would have been classified as having a high level of myopia even then, (the UK Royal National Institute of the Blind classifies as High as anything beyond -6). I ended with vision where I could see clearly at 10cm and things got blurred soon after that.

As someone with extremely high myopia my chance of developing cataracts also goes up (winning all the way) as does the danger of losing sight though damage to the retina. As I have early cataracts I will have to go under the knife at some stage. This way I have had that surgery early and its making quite a difference to my life.

Its made me reflect on how much my preference since childhood for activities which did not require good distance vision (I am a reader and craftswoman and computer user for most of my leisure) has shaped all sorts of aspects of my life. I pretty much gave up swimming in late teens when I could not recognize the people that I was swimming with and could not find my clothes on the beach. Wandering around in a bikini smiling (in error) at strange men was not a great experience.

[BRUTE]

anyone familiar with that theory whereby most vision can be "trained" by basically exercising the eye muscles, instead of using glasses? brute hasn't really investigated it, but keeps stumbling over websites making such claims. also something about indigenous populations not having bad vision.

[Eureka]

anyone familiar with that theory whereby most vision can be "trained" by basically exercising the eye muscles, instead of using glasses? brute hasn't really investigated it, but keeps stumbling over websites making such claims. also something about indigenous populations not having bad vision.

Yes, Brute. Or more precisely, I know that it has worked for me to train my eye muscles and to keep on doing it whenever my eyes start to have a weaker vision.

I got glasses against myopia during high school as I couldn't see the letters on the blackboard or other things just a few meters away clearly any longer. Also, both my parents have continuously gotten stronger and stronger glasses over the years as long as I remember.

In my mid-twenties, I heard about eye exercises an started training + shredded my glasses completely immediately. In the beginning the world was rather blurred, but within a (as far as I remember) short period of practising 10-15 min/day I recovered to normal eye sight.

I am now 55 and still have an intact vision on both eyes. I have not done eye exercises on a daily basis since I was young, but whenever I notice that my vision starts to weaken, I start up again and keep it up for maybe half a year. And then after some years when the effect has worn off I start again.

For me these exercises have been a tremendous gift.

[saving-10-years]

That sounds fantastic. Too late for me but perhaps others here can take advantage and throw away the glasses? An ERE challenge? Do you have a URL or reference?

It is sad that other options have clearly been known about for some time and yet we still have opticians prescribing ever stronger lenses.

[Eureka]

It is fantastic, but I don't talk about it a lot as the responses I get are usually disbelief or silence and change of topic. I guess it is similar to talking about ERE to mainstream people.

This is the book I encountered sometime back in the 1980s and from which I learned the eye exercises:



Don't say that it is too late. I just discovered ERE like a month ago and I could also have acted differently if I had known about it earlier, but now I take it from here.

There is a ton of videos with eye exercises on you tube of varying quality. I just skimmed a few, and these are pretty good guides for some of the exercises:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PRwXuRIR3Co

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G_aciDGGvX4

[jennypenny]

http://gettingstronger.org/2016/03/faq- ... hormetism/

[CECTPA]

My mom used to work as a unit clerk at a clinic that does laser corrections and with the amount of complications she's seen she strongly recommended me to stay away.

I've been wearing -6.5 glasses since the age of 10. I'm 38 now and actually my eyesight has slightly improved lately. As per the optometrist it is age-related.

[saving-10-years]

@Eureka

Don't say that it is too late.

Well the surgery replaced my 'accommodating' lens with a bit of plastic which is always focused on a single (1 metre away) point so I can't train the fixed lens nor (I expect) refocus it by changing what the muscles in my eye do. But I will read up on those sources (thanks @jennypenny too) and see what I can do about making sure that I stay at the level I am now at.

Its interesting that the surgeon was of the opinion that my sight would stay stable (no change in prescription) from now on whereas the new optician (far better than my old one) was at pains to explain that my eye would carry on changing and persuade me to opt for varifocals as most convenient. (This would mean that I was always wearing glasses). I intend to wear glasses only when the implant lens does not give me good enough vision and my reading glasses are non-prescription in the upper part. My distance glasses are used for driving and some work/travel (when the dangle from a glasses chain so I can easily take them off). I will follow up and read this stuff with interest.

Its only now that I am RE that I have time to look into these things and not simply accept the advice of the experts.

[Riggerjack]

I expect indigenous people are not exposed to industrial sounds which cause noise-induced hearing loss, which is often overlooked. Its advisable to protect your hearing whenever you're in a noisy environment like a music venue, for its long term retention.

Depends on the local environment. I live in the sticks, between the birds, bugs and frogs, my place is louder than the suburbs, or the city. It's peaceful, but not quiet.

Now the desert is quiet, but doesn't support many people.

Now, my wife is very nearsighted, and she has exceptional close up vision. In a pre technological society, that would be of value, pulling splinters, etc. But she would be a luxury. the tribe would need to be large and rich, to afford such specialists...

[enigmaT120]

My close up vision is also still great (just have to take off my glasses).

Do you have those pileated woodpeckers that love to bang away on metal transformers? Still, I think my place is quieter than the city.

[TopHatFox]

lalala, DIY alternative:

http://gettingstronger.org/2010/07/impr ... r-glasses/

I got my eyes from 20/100 to 20/30 last I checked-- it took about a year or so!

[enigmaT120]

lalala, DIY alternative:

http://gettingstronger.org/2010/07/impr ... r-glasses/

I got my eyes from 20/100 to 20/30 last I checked-- it took about a year or so!

I hope he's not serious about doing those eye exercises whilst driving.

Do any far-sighted people want to borrow an old pair of my glasses to use? They're about -11 diopters. All I have to do is go buy some cheap reading glasses. Or find 7wb5's!

[bryan]

interesting links for eye exercises..

For me, getting LASIK was an automatic 'yes' once I got my first bonus. No regrets. Myself, I had eyesight right on the edge of what is legal to drive without corrective lens (probably on the wrong side of the edge...) and contacts were really, really bothersome. Never had glasses as my eyesight was always on the edge of functional and never had an eye exam until university (to get the contacts) when I couldn't make out a lot of blackboard/projector writings, even with squinting. I would always forget to wear or bring my contacts because I didn't really need them except to be able to read things at a distance or enjoy being able to see well at a distance (like road signs, a movie, or telling if someone "far away" is looking at me).

[Douglas]

I searched the ERE forums for LASIK knowing a thread had to be out there and I wasn't disappointing. We still have a health flexible spending account with our insurance with a bunch of money that will go away so that was the only reason why I considered LASIK. For what it is worth I decided against it for the following reasons.

My vision care has cost me ~$100 / year for the past 10 years and probably less per year before that going back to when I was a child. This is not very much money

The ~2-5% risk seems not necessary for my vision, which is bad but not terrible like some posters

No guarantee I won't have to wear glasses after the surgery. This is the only reason why I would do the surgery and if I can't get this guaranteed the $4000 spent seems like a silly investment.

Having LASIK will set me back ~$1000 in out of pocket expenses (not included health spending account) versus no out of pocket if I just get another pair of glasses + sun glasses.

I didn't want to drive the ~15-20 minutes for each appointment with the LASIK office

I also don't absolutely hate wearing my glasses. They are just annoying to wear all the time.


Hope this helps anybody if they are also considering LASIK but on an ERE-ish budget!

[slowtraveler]

I had Laser with the Simon Institute on the Bay Peninsula. Foster or Daily city probably.

Comes with a lifetime guarantee of free surgery if wears out. Family has had it done there too.

I have better than 20/20.

I did many eye exercises for months prior. All a scam in my eyes.

Laser now makes my eyes slightly dry at times but nothing compared to contacts.

One of the best decisions that happened in my life.

[CS]

I would not do it. The range of your eye focus keeps getting smaller as you get older. The question is where do you want to be able to see without correction? I would find it terrifying to not see close without glasses or contacts.

Even if you get it done, it only works for a period of time, i.e. not even close to your whole life. Then you will be back to wearing glasses for distance, and also not be able to see up close.

Edit - @TopHatFox - holy cow, that article was cool. My last eye guy in CA kept dropping my Rx year after year. Wonder if that was what he was trying to do? Congrats on the results. Did you use the plus lenses for reading? The reduced minuses for far away? Both?

[Jean]

If you get by and don't get headache from it, I wouldn't do anything.
If you do get headache in particular context, I would get a cheap pair of glasses, and wear them in those context. I am longsighted, and I have glasses that I wear for long driving or screenstaring sessions. It nearly got rid of the migraines I used to have.