Will you take statins based on the brand new recommendation?

[RealPerson]

The American College of Cardiology and the American Heart Association issued brand new recommendations for prevention of cardiovascular disease. These recommendations, when implemented, will greatly increase the number of people on statins. It is estimated that the number of people on statins will double!

Will you now fall under the new guidelines? If so, will you start taking statins? If you will, will it be the expensive brand name Crestor or one of the older and cheaper generic statins?

[jacob]

http://earlyretirementextreme.com/my-hd ... -care.html

Yeah, no.

[George the original one]

I aim to stay off any meds for as long as possible.

[slimicy]

Statins are a huge rip off, but who's surprised the pharmaceutical companies want to push out drugs that "cure" something that isn't really a problem (high cholesterol is a symptom of heart disease, not a cause) and once you start aren't supposed to ever stop taking.

[Spartan_Warrior]

Only in my drinking water.

That's the same way I get all my birth control, anti-depressants, and BPA.

[Felix]

I eat my vegetables, that helps more than the statins.

[Dragline]

Not gonna do it -- wooden be prudent.

[slowth]

...(high cholesterol is a symptom of heart disease, not a cause)...

I'm quite interested in evidence for this statement.

[slimicy]

...(high cholesterol is a symptom of heart disease, not a cause)...

I'm quite interested in evidence for this statement.

Cholesterol is a necessary ingredient in the body. Similar to glucose, it's necessary for the function of the brain. Unlike glucose, the cholesterol you ingest largely doesn't make it to your bloodstream to be used by your body-- the cholesterol in your blood comes from your liver. This is why no matter what some people eat they may always have "high" cholesterol, their liver just pumps out more. But if you're otherwise healthy (no inflammation, the real cause of heart disease) this isn't actually a problem despite the medical industry wanting to put everyone on statins.

Some well cited science behind cholesterol and how it actually works: http://www.positivehealth.com/article/h ... he-disease

Heart Surgeon: http://www.sott.net/article/242516-Hear ... rt-disease

More doctors: http://articles.mercola.com/sites/artic ... heart.aspx

[ICouldBeTheWalrus]

Statins seem to be one of the biggest cases of "follow the money" in pharmaceuticals.

As previously mentioned, they do have side effects. And it's not clear they're beneficial in reducing overall mortality in the general population.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Statin#Primary_prevention

[slowth]

But if you're otherwise healthy (no inflammation, the real cause of heart disease) this isn't actually a problem despite the medical industry wanting to put everyone on statins.

Inflammation is a big part of the problem, but the idea the cholesterol levels have no effect is highly questionable. How else to explain a disease like familial hypercholesterolemia? There's no indication of higher inflammation in this disease, only higher cholesterol, which leads to extremely early CVD.

I gather from these articles that they all support the paleo diet as the cure to what ails us. That may be true, but it would still be a mistake to ignore cholesterol levels, and good luck converting the population to a paleo diet. You mean I can't have donuts for breakfast?

[slowth]

Statins seem to be one of the biggest cases of "follow the money" in pharmaceuticals.

As previously mentioned, they do have side effects. And it's not clear they're beneficial in reducing overall mortality in the general population.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Statin#Primary_prevention

That's correct for primary prevention, but you left out the part where it's effective for secondary prevention.


And the walrus is Paul.

[slimicy]

Inflammation is a big part of the problem, but the idea the cholesterol levels have no effect is highly questionable. How else to explain a disease like familial hypercholesterolemia? There's no indication of higher inflammation in this disease, only higher cholesterol, which leads to extremely early CVD.

I'll admit I don't know anything about familial hypercholesterolemia, but just in looking at the wikipedia entry for it I notice it's not affected by conventional methods of treatment (diet changes or statins) so there's obviously something going on that's completely different than what I'm talking about.

On the other hand, the wiki also says the main cause of CVD resulting from familial hypercholesterolemia is Atherosclerosis... which by definition is a chronic inflammatory response, so your claim that it has CVD via familial hypercholesterolemia has nothing to do with inflammation doesn't ring true to me.

I gather from these articles that they all support the paleo diet as the cure to what ails us. That may be true, but it would still be a mistake to ignore cholesterol levels, and good luck converting the population to a paleo diet. You mean I can't have donuts for breakfast?

I didn't say we should ignore cholesterol levels, I said we should be treating them as a symptom, not a cause.

[slowth]

I'll admit I don't know anything about familial hypercholesterolemia, but just in looking at the wikipedia entry for it I notice it's not affected by conventional methods of treatment (diet changes or statins) so there's obviously something going on that's completely different than what I'm talking about.

Not true. Heterozygous FH responds to statins, homozygous less so. It's only different because cholesterol is extremely elevated. Since there is not evidence of increased inflammation, then the elevated cholesterol seems to be the culprit.

On the other hand, the wiki also says the main cause of CVD resulting from familial hypercholesterolemia is Atherosclerosis... which by definition is a chronic inflammatory response, so your claim that it has CVD via familial hypercholesterolemia has nothing to do with inflammation doesn't ring true to me.

That's not what I said. I said inflammation is a problem, but that's not the whole story. Atherosclerosis is inflammation AND deposition of cholesterol on the walls of arteries.

I didn't say we should ignore cholesterol levels, I said we should be treating them as a symptom, not a cause.

So you're saying inflammation is the only problem and high cholesterol is a symptom of inflammation. So how do you treat the inflammation?

[JohnnyH]

So how do you treat the inflammation?

[slowth]

So how do you treat the inflammation?

Sounds good. How about in the real world?

[Felix]

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/11/14/opini ... ef=general

[RealPerson]

From the NYT article: " Statins give the illusion of protection to many people, who would be much better served, for example, by simply walking an extra 10 minutes per day."

Good lifestyle choices are just so much more powerful. Modern man is always looking for the simple pill that will eliminate the need to make wise and deliberate choices. There will never be such a pill and in the mean time America is getting fatter and sicker.

[slimicy]

That's not what I said. I said inflammation is a problem, but that's not the whole story. Atherosclerosis is inflammation AND deposition of cholesterol on the walls of arteries.

There can't be one without the other. The whole mechanism by which cholesterol is deposited on the wall of the arteries is because it's trying to fix the inflammation lining the artery wall. If there's no inflammation on the artery there's no cholesterol sticking to the sides. This is evidenced by the fact that 80% of people who die of heart attacks don't have high cholesterol (It's not just an abundance). Evidence against your theory can also be seen in that recent all cause mortality studies show people with high cholesterol are much less likely to die than those with low cholesterol.

[slimicy]

Sounds good. How about in the real world?

Stop selling people things by saying they're healthy when in fact they just have higher profit margins and are causing the constant inflammation.

Examples: Processed Wheat, Corn Syrup, Canola/Veg Oil, Margarine, fake sweeteners, etc.