I have a 1998 model Compaq 5900Z Desktop computer running Windows 98. This computer cost me $2500.00, and had 500 Meg processor and 128 RAM. At the time it was tagged as the kitten's britches in a desktop. Along about 2006, programs I wanted to buy gave me messages that they no longer were compatible with Windows 98. However my Compaq was working in excellent condition. In 2007, I bought a Gateway Desktop with a 22 inch monitor, which I currently use in the home office, and went broadband internet.
I am sure this has happened to millions of people and folks on this forum. I am sure millions of computers have been trashed or recycled or retired.
NOT ME!!
I am still using my Compaq Windows 98 computer in my shop. I can do most of what I used to do, and it still works very well.
I do not have it on the internet, but I can bring a floppy between my Gateway and Compaq and load stuff off the net if I want to. I refuse to waste a perfectly good machine just because it got a bit old and out of tech. The Compaq has a zip drive and I have gobs of stuff on zip tapes.
I am not a true warrior on this because as I mentioned I up graded to the latest Gateway in 2007 (that cost $1,000, a full $1500 cheaper than the 1998 model). I can see where this upgrade madness could go on forever.
Has anyone else beat this racket?
The Continuing Utility of a Computer
Many old PCs can be resurrected by installing Linux on them. Linux is a free OS you can download online. There are many varieties, some of them very simple & lightweight, specifically for lower spec. computers.
A friend of mine picked up an old PC his company was about to throw out due to a system upgrade. There was no OS on it, but it had been running Windows 2000 - I suggested installing Linux rather than buy Windows XP, and he's never looked back. I myself have been using Linux for about 6 years and managed to do all my work on it using OpenOffice software.
A friend of mine picked up an old PC his company was about to throw out due to a system upgrade. There was no OS on it, but it had been running Windows 2000 - I suggested installing Linux rather than buy Windows XP, and he's never looked back. I myself have been using Linux for about 6 years and managed to do all my work on it using OpenOffice software.
It's funny how so many people get convinced to upgrade computers so often. Completely unnecessary for what regular people do: surf, word process, photo and music management... Then the new computers are slow out of the box due to crap software bloat, like Norton (disgracefully horrible).
IMO, the most cost effective way to compute at a high level is to buy quality parts individually and build your own. Buy parts in order of least price decay to most: case, PSU, hard drive (not SSD), optical drive, RAM, GPU, motherboard and finally CPU... Buy your CPU on a cost per power basis, factor in overclocking ability if you want. The old cost per performance champ was an e4500... The new one, which is surprising as it is near the top of the line, was the i7 920 (when I upgraded).
Promotions and rebates can really lower the cost of many of these.
Get a good metal constructed case, you're going to be in and out of it dozens of times and plastic will fail. I've had an Antec p180 for about 3 or 4 major upgrades and recommend it highly.. I go in once every month or two and completely clean it... Looks are runs like brandnew and I've never had a hardware failure outside of things that spin: hard/optical drives, fans. These things last forever, so I always overclock as much as practical. I don't need a CPU to last the 10 years they are designed for.
When new technology is available you can sell your old and upgrade with new. For me to go from a dual core to a i7, cost me about $250 net for a new motherboard, RAM and CPU... beats the $1,250 i7 systems were selling for and trying to sell a dell dual core for $150 on craigslist.
Individual parts are of better quality and better warranty than big manufacturers. The warranty on a Dell is what, 90 days unless you buy more? The warranty on my hard drives is 5 years. RAM lifetime. GPU 3 years. PSU 3 years... and so on.
Laptops are inferior machines, period. They will never have the power, upgradability, longevity or cost benefit... Repairs almost always involve model specific parts, which are very expensive. Even cleaning a laptop from dust is a difficult and not very effective chore.
Most people are sold on the ease and portability, but then end up slumped awkwardly 90% of the time... Just get a refurb netbook for the 10% of time you'd need portability.
If you need computing power I'd recommend the above. If you're the average person, almost any computer will do... Running Ubuntu Linux will take care of 90% of the problems Windows users have.
IMO, the most cost effective way to compute at a high level is to buy quality parts individually and build your own. Buy parts in order of least price decay to most: case, PSU, hard drive (not SSD), optical drive, RAM, GPU, motherboard and finally CPU... Buy your CPU on a cost per power basis, factor in overclocking ability if you want. The old cost per performance champ was an e4500... The new one, which is surprising as it is near the top of the line, was the i7 920 (when I upgraded).
Promotions and rebates can really lower the cost of many of these.
Get a good metal constructed case, you're going to be in and out of it dozens of times and plastic will fail. I've had an Antec p180 for about 3 or 4 major upgrades and recommend it highly.. I go in once every month or two and completely clean it... Looks are runs like brandnew and I've never had a hardware failure outside of things that spin: hard/optical drives, fans. These things last forever, so I always overclock as much as practical. I don't need a CPU to last the 10 years they are designed for.
When new technology is available you can sell your old and upgrade with new. For me to go from a dual core to a i7, cost me about $250 net for a new motherboard, RAM and CPU... beats the $1,250 i7 systems were selling for and trying to sell a dell dual core for $150 on craigslist.
Individual parts are of better quality and better warranty than big manufacturers. The warranty on a Dell is what, 90 days unless you buy more? The warranty on my hard drives is 5 years. RAM lifetime. GPU 3 years. PSU 3 years... and so on.
Laptops are inferior machines, period. They will never have the power, upgradability, longevity or cost benefit... Repairs almost always involve model specific parts, which are very expensive. Even cleaning a laptop from dust is a difficult and not very effective chore.
Most people are sold on the ease and portability, but then end up slumped awkwardly 90% of the time... Just get a refurb netbook for the 10% of time you'd need portability.
If you need computing power I'd recommend the above. If you're the average person, almost any computer will do... Running Ubuntu Linux will take care of 90% of the problems Windows users have.
Agree fully with Idleswine. Linux flavors like ubuntu can be surprisingly easy to use.
One 'problem' with continuing to use old PCs and monitors is their high power consumption. I'd suggest refurbished/recycled laptops instead. I tend to run mine 24/7 and switching to laptops have cut my compute power consumption by 2/3rds. I also avoid using wifi/wlan as it consumes more power than running a cable (which offers faster network speeds too).
I have been sidestepping upgrade costs by picking up laptops that businesses toss. They tend to be just 2-3 years old and perfectly good for most of the things I do (I am a geek - so my usage tends to be higher than average).
One 'problem' with continuing to use old PCs and monitors is their high power consumption. I'd suggest refurbished/recycled laptops instead. I tend to run mine 24/7 and switching to laptops have cut my compute power consumption by 2/3rds. I also avoid using wifi/wlan as it consumes more power than running a cable (which offers faster network speeds too).
I have been sidestepping upgrade costs by picking up laptops that businesses toss. They tend to be just 2-3 years old and perfectly good for most of the things I do (I am a geek - so my usage tends to be higher than average).
Yes, perfectly functional computers are practically given away.
Laptops do tend to use less power, but you can buy much more efficient power supplies for desktops... They only draw power for what is being used. I haven't measured mine, but my power bills are under $30 a month @ .07kwh.
So if I'm doing something really intensive my computer doubles as a space heater in the winter! If I'm encoding or running calculations on millions of numbers I can heat my little room up quick!
Laptops do tend to use less power, but you can buy much more efficient power supplies for desktops... They only draw power for what is being used. I haven't measured mine, but my power bills are under $30 a month @ .07kwh.
So if I'm doing something really intensive my computer doubles as a space heater in the winter! If I'm encoding or running calculations on millions of numbers I can heat my little room up quick!
@HSpencer: well, if it works for you I'm not sure I'd bother. There's always a chance things will not go smoothly. I'd also pass on the RAM upgrade unless you can find one really cheap. That is usually not the case on older RAM sticks, usually they are somewhat expensive.
If it breaks, I'd definitely try fixing the part and attempting a Linux install.
@jacob: I'm interested in this too, although it would increase the initial cost. But most of the desktop advantages would still stand. I might take a job that requires heavy computing in dusty outdoor (tent) environments... I was thinking of building a small desktop (fits in carry-on), that has maybe 0-2 moving parts. Such a build could have very low wattage, depending on your CPU/GPU.
Unfortunately, I sometimes spend hours waiting on processing, so power consumption isn't one of my top priorities.
I'm somewhat curious to measure my desktop's usage, maybe I'll report back... I can understand the size being a factor... Look at this leviathan:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Whe2aQFWd5Y
I'd be lying if I said I hadn't considered it!
If it breaks, I'd definitely try fixing the part and attempting a Linux install.
@jacob: I'm interested in this too, although it would increase the initial cost. But most of the desktop advantages would still stand. I might take a job that requires heavy computing in dusty outdoor (tent) environments... I was thinking of building a small desktop (fits in carry-on), that has maybe 0-2 moving parts. Such a build could have very low wattage, depending on your CPU/GPU.
Unfortunately, I sometimes spend hours waiting on processing, so power consumption isn't one of my top priorities.
I'm somewhat curious to measure my desktop's usage, maybe I'll report back... I can understand the size being a factor... Look at this leviathan:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Whe2aQFWd5Y
I'd be lying if I said I hadn't considered it!
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Steve Austin
- Posts: 177
- Joined: Thu Jul 22, 2010 12:17 am
Have you considered the ice trick yet? Run your refrigerator/freezer for 8-10 hrs a day, and then turn it off: take an ice bag out of your freezer and put it in the refrigerator for the next 14-16 hrs (ideally when you won't be accessing your refrigerator). When the next day starts, re-power the appliance and put the (soft) ice bag back in the freezer.
This is a conflation of something I saw on those youtube videos from that dude in Connecticut, and a tip I read somewhere during a recent string of grid power outages.
This is a conflation of something I saw on those youtube videos from that dude in Connecticut, and a tip I read somewhere during a recent string of grid power outages.
@HSpencer: I'm afraid your PC is too old for the recent Linux versions too...
Even if Linux runs faster than Windows on same hardware, with time the new features are demanding more power.
So, the latest Ubuntu version (that I recommend) runs great on a recent PC, but don't expect miracles on a 12 years old one
I agree with KTN suggestion... keep yours till it last, and then switch to a 2-3 years old model where you can load Ubuntu and enjoy it.
Another thing to consider, is that with Linux you've a great variety of free software available, so you won't need to buy Office, Norton Antivirus, Paint Shop Pro or whatever software you need as there are great free alternatives.
I would say that an ERE *MUST* consider Linux!!!
Ciao
D
Even if Linux runs faster than Windows on same hardware, with time the new features are demanding more power.
So, the latest Ubuntu version (that I recommend) runs great on a recent PC, but don't expect miracles on a 12 years old one
I agree with KTN suggestion... keep yours till it last, and then switch to a 2-3 years old model where you can load Ubuntu and enjoy it.
Another thing to consider, is that with Linux you've a great variety of free software available, so you won't need to buy Office, Norton Antivirus, Paint Shop Pro or whatever software you need as there are great free alternatives.
I would say that an ERE *MUST* consider Linux!!!
Ciao
D
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George the other one
- Posts: 52
- Joined: Tue Aug 17, 2010 11:55 pm
- Contact:
For old computers I recommend Puppy-Linux (http://puppylinux.org/main/index.php?fi ... tarted.htm). It is lightweight (bare-bones install is 100megs) and is pretty easy to use. There is also fairly good community support for it. One of the main reasons for Puppy-Linux is to "breath new life into old computers."
Here is their mission statement:
http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewto ... 352#296352
EcoPup is a version of Puppy-Linux designed to feel like xp. The group that made EcoPup usually put it on older Pentium-3 computers in coffee shops, churches, boys & girls-style clubs, grandparents pc's, etc.
http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic. ... 37&t=36988
Here is a link to Lucid-Puppy. It is supposively supposed to be very good but I have never tried it.
http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic. ... 37&t=55740
Here is their mission statement:
http://www.murga-linux.com/puppy/viewto ... 352#296352
EcoPup is a version of Puppy-Linux designed to feel like xp. The group that made EcoPup usually put it on older Pentium-3 computers in coffee shops, churches, boys & girls-style clubs, grandparents pc's, etc.
http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic. ... 37&t=36988
Here is a link to Lucid-Puppy. It is supposively supposed to be very good but I have never tried it.
http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic. ... 37&t=55740