Poll: What kind of watch do you own?

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Solvent
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Re: Poll: What kind of watch do you own?

Post by Solvent » Thu Apr 25, 2019 11:42 pm

I like wearing a watch, but haven't for some time. My last nice-ish one was lost at some point while traveling. Then I got a knock-off Longines imitation as a gift, but it didn't last long before it stopped working.

One reason to consider wearing a watch is that smartphones are highly effective distraction machines. Granted, not all of us suffer from this problem, but when I get out my phone to check the time I'm fairly likely to start fiddling with it and lose focus on what I'm doing.

Hence, I'm in the market for a watch again, but Addis Ababa is a shitty place to look for one (tariffs + lack of choice, no Amazon delivery) so I'm biding my time until I get to a suitable market.

I'm leaning towards a quartz movement, perhaps a Seiko. Nothing special.

From my time spent in Geneva I know that if money were truly no object, I'd own a Zenith. Those are beautiful pieces.

Sclass
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Re: Poll: What kind of watch do you own?

Post by Sclass » Thu Apr 25, 2019 11:46 pm

Seppia wrote:
Thu Apr 25, 2019 11:16 pm

Both are much more reliable than the infinitely more expensive Pateks.
That’s like saying a Honda Civic is better than a Rolls Royce. Yeah, no argument there. The problem is the majority of watches sold by Swatch Group, LVMH or Richemont are decorated Civics. It’s really funny when I open a Longines watch and it says something like L369 which sounds unique when it is just really an ETA 7001 found in several other luxury watches with varying gold plating, engravings etc. on the plates to disguise its origin. Nowhere it says 7001 but it is just that. Worse, it is sold up in the brochure as a Linge 369 hand crafted in Switzerland by master watchmakers.

I actually find the Rolex movements unique in some ways. The gear trains are backwards compared to the ETA layouts. I guess I’m snookered into thinking Rolex is unique. They seem to hold some of their value better than other luxury watches.

I had a friend who collected seiko dive watches. Automatics. He liked them because they were bomb proof.

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Ego
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Re: Poll: What kind of watch do you own?

Post by Ego » Fri Apr 26, 2019 2:12 am

Back when i was buying broken watches, repairing them and reselling them, I would regularly own five or six relatively nice watches at any one time that I would wear until they sold. Around that time (10-12 years ago) I had a friend who bought bins full of Costco returns. He would bring me the Suunto watches that were returned and I would resell them. I kept one, a Suunto Vector, that is still going strong. Amazing for a digital watch. I've used it on three long trips. I like the altimeter and barometer functions which are both accurate but the stopwatch function is terrible.

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Ego
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Re: Poll: What kind of watch do you own?

Post by Ego » Fri Apr 26, 2019 2:38 am

BTW, one of the things that Sclass and Seppia have not yet mentioned is that their level of knowledge is a requirement for those who wish to purchase a high end second-hand watch and not get ripped off. It is fairly easy to modify a cheap watch with a counterfeit dial and other external parts. Also, it is hard to spot "genuine fakes".

https://www-forbes-com.cdn.ampproject.o ... -turkey%2F

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Re: Poll: What kind of watch do you own?

Post by jacob » Fri Apr 26, 2019 7:33 am

@Seppia - I see Sclass already answered. Also, I haven't advanced as far as he has (yet?) but basically followed the same approach sans the neighbor. I learned from an old watch course I bought on a DVD on eBay and took apart/reassembled a movement (Longines) I bought on eBay. I haven't destroyed anything yet but that might just be because I move overly slowly (same with everything technical). My watchmaker hobby is kinda dormant. I wanted to see if I could turn it into something profitable, but I found eBay to be fairly efficient marketwise. Thus, I'm currently sitting on my tools wondering whether to go further again or sell them. Fortunately, they take up very little space. I would be open to selling them if you're ever in Chicago.

@Sclass - BTW, what do you use as/for a staking tool? I was wondering whether you might be using something clever.

Seppia
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Re: Poll: What kind of watch do you own?

Post by Seppia » Fri Apr 26, 2019 8:41 am

@Sclass: I wasn’t implying that ETA-powered watches are “better” than Pateks, just that they are more reliable (in the same way as a Civic is much more reliable than a Ferrari).
The quality on Patek is real
Sorry for the confusion :)

Luxury watches today are all extremely overpriced (but so are all luxury goods - the actual cost of an Armani suit is around 7-10% of the retail price) but in fairness:
1- ETA movements are great movements, reliable, time tested and easy/cheap to service as any watchmaker has seen them millions of times
2- they are “just” the engine. Many other things go into the quality of a watch. Same comparison that you made with cars, many Audi run on the same engines as Skodas, yet the cars are very different in many aspects.

@Ego: aside from Rolex which is a completely different story*, I would not hesitate to say that even a complete newcomer can buy with confidence on Watchuseek provided they a) buy from sellers that have lots of positive feedback b) do their research on market prices

*there are just too many excellent quality Rolex fakes, which is not the case for other brands. Google “TC Sub V7 extreme” and you will NEVER buy a five digit sub online again :)

@jacob: you could turn in a decent profit servicing watches in my opinion. With the recent massive increase in prices of luxury watches, all brands have jacked up service costs as well. Omega will not charge less than $600 for a service for example. For ETA powered watches it’s cheaper to buy a new movement and just swap it
Unfortunately I don’t come to the states for work any more, I only take care of the APAC area now. But if the current pricing trend persists I will definitely start training as I sense an opportunity for some real side income: today $150 for a basic ETA 2824 service is considered cheap.

Sclass
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Re: Poll: What kind of watch do you own?

Post by Sclass » Fri Apr 26, 2019 8:50 am

jacob wrote:
Fri Apr 26, 2019 7:33 am
@Seppia - I see Sclass already answered. Also, I haven't advanced as far as he has (yet?) ...I haven't destroyed anything yet...,

@Sclass - BTW, what do you use as/for a staking tool? I was wondering whether you might be using something clever.
Don’t bet on it. I’ve quit after a dozen restorations. I can clean, lube, send a dial out for refinishing, restore hands, change a crystal, replace parts, look up stuff at http://cgi.julesborel.com/cgi-bin/matcgi2?ref=LON_396.2 then install it, that’s about it. I cannot do things like make a new staff, poise. Staking...I’ve pressed jewels using my CNC machine under manual control. Uhm...like once. I don’t have one of those mini arbor presses.

Most of my movement destruction happened when I was a under 25. I can now see the reasons clearly. First I was impatient for results. Second, no source of cheap Chinese and Indian watchmakers tools. I couldn’t afford Bergeon. No YouTube or internet. Frei Borel was a shop an hour away with impatient salespeople...not a web store. My hit rate went way up a decade ago.

Now I’m kind of bored with it. At one time I was fascinated by the inner workings of watch and clock mechanisms. But the more I learned the more I realized it was all kind of the same thing. The balance wheel mechanism/escapement wheel train etc. hasn’t changed much in 100 years. It is just subtle variants on the same thing. Even cars have more mechanical diversity than mechanical watches. That is, most mechanical watches run on half a dozen well known mechanisms. Even chronographs and complications just seem to add more transmissions, levers and brakes. So that more of the same made me lose interest. There are much more diverse machine systems to tinker with out there. Diverse meaning ways to do stuff. Digital systems being the obvious one.

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Re: Poll: What kind of watch do you own?

Post by Seppia » Fri Apr 26, 2019 9:02 am

The lack of diversity in movements is exactly what makes it attractive as a potential “FIREd side hustle” to me.
Learn to service ETA 2824, 2892, Rolex 3130, seiko 7s26 and 6r15 and you can service probably 90%+ of the automatic watches on this planet.

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Re: Poll: What kind of watch do you own?

Post by 2Birds1Stone » Fri Apr 26, 2019 9:10 am

Garmin 920XT that I bought used in 2016.

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C40
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Re: Poll: What kind of watch do you own?

Post by C40 » Fri Apr 26, 2019 10:27 am

I have a couple of Casio G-Shock watches. One is the most plain version, and the other has an ABC sensor (altitude, barometric pressure, and compass). The altitude comes in handy or is just fun to check when on hikes, bike rides, etc. On a hike that is straight uphill, it works very well for checking my position along the trail. The main thing I like about these watches is the convenience of having the stopwatch and timer functions visible on my wrist and more easily controlled than using a phone. I use those for more things than I would have expected. (making tea, roasting coffee, boiling eggs, exercise time tracking, meditation timing, etc...)

Sclass
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Re: Poll: What kind of watch do you own?

Post by Sclass » Sat Apr 27, 2019 9:34 am

Seppia wrote:
Fri Apr 26, 2019 8:41 am
@Sclass: ... (in the same way as a Civic is much more reliable than a Ferrari).
The quality on Patek is real
Sorry for the confusion :)

Luxury watches today are all extremely overpriced (but so are all luxury goods ...,

2- they are “just” the engine. Many other things go into the quality of a watch. Same comparison that you made with cars, many Audi run on the same engines as Skodas, yet the cars are very different in many aspects.

many excellent quality Rolex fakes, which is not the case for other brands. Google “TC Sub V7 extreme” and you will NEVER buy a five digit sub online again :)
No confusion Seppia. You get it. A Ferrari and Civic have their roles. Actually your comment about Skoda engines in Audi is spot on. That is exactly what Longines is doing when they put an ETA 2825 in a luxury watch. The example that comes to mind locally (shame no Skoda here) is a Toyota Camry engine in a Lexus ES. It’s a great car and it is reliable. But at the end of the day you’re getting the heart of a Toyota at the Lexus price. Yes, there is more vibration control, sound insulation and leather but the most expensive part of the car is cheap and mass produced. Excellent quality and highly reliable but cheap and mass produced. So I feel there is a degree of deception going on.

This happened during the resurrection of the mechanical watch industry. It was almost killed by quartz and then you started seeing some houses using ETA automatics and marketing them as something unique and exclusive. This marketing strategy really took off in the late 1990s. It saved the big Swiss houses. During the transition you could buy Longines Quartz watches (Mon Dieu! :o ). Pretty soon the line between luxury watch and fashion watch got blurred. You were no longer buying craftsmanship but you were being marketed craftsmanship. While it saved the industry, it changed fine watchmaking.

The Rolex uses their own movement. And perhaps this is why the used market values an old Rolex more highly than an ETA powered Longines. The market votes with its money. They really fall into a small group of Swiss houses that make their own movements.

Wow...and that TC Rolex fake is impressive. My friend has something like that. He has a datejust he calls a “Swiss replica” he bought in Europe. It looked very convincing up close. Without opening the case it is hard to tell. I’m not a Rolex expert but I was able to turn the set stem clockwise and see the hands rotate counter clockwise which told me the movement was probably ETA. Hopefully the women he picks up at the bar won’t try that. :lol:

My wife once warned me that some watches in Watch Magazine could be faked. They had the cases open. Patek or Vacheron I recall. I told her if the fakes could do the work necessary to make the movement look like this I’d pay them for their work.

Fine:
Image
Check the radius on the machined edges. The parts are ground, not stamped. Counter sunk screw holes. Chamfered screw heads. A mix of polishing and fine graining on the surface. Done by hand.

Mass Produced:
Image
Although decorated, this is a cheap mass produced movement. Check the edges. Sharp. Stamped from sheets. The bluing on the cheap screws looks painted on, not true heat bluing which has a iridescent glow. The screws are not chamfered on the edges. The machining is gouged up in places. Coarse irregular graining done with a rotary cutting tool to appear “high end”. There are irregularities on the edges. Trash. This is a $2000 watch.

Both are quality watches. It’s just the deception of craftsmanship in the second one I dislike. Well, I like them, I own many ETA Swiss watches but I paid the appropriate price.

Nice Submariner BTW. I didn’t notice the first time through it didn’t have a date. Very cool.

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Lillailler
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Re: Poll: What kind of watch do you own?

Post by Lillailler » Sun Apr 28, 2019 2:13 am

I have three watches, a 'beater' which I wear whenever or wherever there is a risk of damage or loss - ski trips, rock concerts, the gym - and two nice Swiss watches. When my father became established in his profession, he bought himself a nice Swiss watch. I think part of the reason for this was that as a teenager he was groundcrew in the air force, and all pilots and navigators were issued with Swiss watches because precise and reliable timing is essential to air navigation, and he looked up to the pilots and wanted one day to be like one of them. Anyhow, when my brother was commissioned an officer in the Army, my father bought him a nice Swiss watch. A few years later, when I got my University degree I thought, maybe he'll buy me a nice Swiss watch too? Later I got a good 'career' job, professional qualification, etc, and still no watch, so I bought myself one . I used it - still do - as my everyday wear, except that in the way of things I have inherited my father's watch, so I have two, which I tend to alternate. Reading Sclass's post above, with the photo of his collection of beautiful watches, I had a little insight of some sort, maybe a glimpse of a higher Wheaton level, that in buying my own watch I was not buying an instrument for telling the time so much as telling myself I had reached a milestone, I was as good as my brother, as good as my father. I wonder if this explains part of 'label-consumerism', a futile quest for self-affirmation, which can soak up all the money you give it? And is part of FIRE to get your self-affirmation in ways which do not make you poor? There is certainly a huge difference between on one hand "if I want a beautiful watch I will spend a couple of months salary and buy one", and on the other hand "I will get some second hand watchmakers tools and buy cheap non-working watches at flea markets and practice mending skills to make a side income and as a by-product fix up a nice watch for myself".

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Re: Poll: What kind of watch do you own?

Post by EdithKeeler » Sun Apr 28, 2019 7:07 am

I’m currently wearing a Swatch. I also have a 10 year old Citizen, but its band is broken at the moment.

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Re: Poll: What kind of watch do you own?

Post by frihet » Mon Apr 29, 2019 5:24 am

C40 wrote:
Fri Apr 26, 2019 10:27 am
Casio G-Shock watches. I use those for more things than I would have expected. (making tea, roasting coffee, boiling eggs, exercise time tracking, meditation timing, etc...)
I also wear a G-Shock,I didn't use a watch for years but when I started working at the rigs I had to. Because you are not allowed to bring your phone with you for safety reasons. Had a cheap one for the first 3 years which I only used for work but decided to treat myself to something better when it broke down.

As C40 I use especially the timer every day, as well as checking the time in my partners time zone. Very handy to know if you are awake at the same time before making contact. Compass and cycles of the moon, not so much....

It's also mud resist, very handy in my industry and something I sometimes joke with colleagues about. I don't think they mean oil based drilling mud though......

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Re: Poll: What kind of watch do you own?

Post by mferson » Fri May 31, 2019 1:34 am

Have a Citizen Ecodrive and I'm amazed at the build quality. It is pretty accurate.

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