Nomadland Movie

Simple living, extreme early retirement, being wealthy, ...
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Alphaville
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Re: Nomadland Movie

Post by Alphaville »

Frita wrote:
Tue Feb 23, 2021 10:15 am
And that is why I am leary of watching movies after reading a book. Hollywood has to commercialize for the masses. (Side note: I heard on NPR that some of Octavia Butler’s books are being made into movie. Ugh!)

Perhaps being based in NYC prompted some joy to hitting the road?
yah.... but i was never gonna read that book, as im currently swamped by other book subjects. nevertheless im glad i got the gist of it: i don't want to be broke and miserable in retirement :shock:

me i'd rather be in new york than on the road. wow, i really want to go there now...

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Re: Nomadland Movie

Post by jacob »

AxelHeyst wrote:
Mon Feb 22, 2021 10:52 am
Also, a lot of the characters in the book are diehard introverts, who I can't imagine make great cinema (anyone following me around with a camera would surely die of boredom), even if they are having a grand time, so I'd understand that the film attempted to pull a different story lens than the book did.
This!

Also see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Four_Argu ... Television

It's hard to portray the supposedly "rich and complex inner life" of an introvert, so TV ends up with a projection on [the rich and complex outer life of an] extrovert terms which often ends up looking rather lame. For example, when I did the documentary I was pushing for in-depth systems explanations perhaps in a conversational format. Compromise: funny cartoons showing the very basics. Whereas the suggestions were along the line of me talking with friends who just happened to drop by for afternoon tea or seeing what "fun" could be had downtown Chicago. Compromise: Me sitting in downtown park reading on my kindle which I otherwise NEVER do. Stuff like that.

We'll probably have to wait for a medium that allows us to experience what other people are feeling or thinking---not just "seeing or hearing"---before these stories improve. I'm thinking perhaps something where the people attempt to convey what's on their mind using a kind of standardized symbolic representation. Maybe using a battery-less format called paper ... and the paper could be glued together on one side to keep it together...

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Alphaville
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Re: Nomadland Movie

Post by Alphaville »

jacob wrote:
Tue Feb 23, 2021 10:42 am

It's hard to portray the supposedly "rich and complex inner life" of an introvert, so TV ends up with a projection on extrovert terms which often ends up looking rather lame.
tv can suck. but the people in this film ARE suffering from poverty, loneliness, grief, lack of healthcare, lack of resources, insufficient accommodations, etc. that's clearly being portrayed.

loneliness is not the same as solitude. solitude is delicious. loneliness is a lack, like a vitamin deficiency. solitude is a month at the library. loneliness is being stranded on an empty road at midnight in a blizzard with no help on the way.

there are many great films that portray the inner life of introverts, but this one movie was about actual pain and actual misery. so it's different.

recommended directors for introvert portrayals: antonioni, jean pierre melville, jim jarmusch, cathérine breillat, the cohen brothers, terrence malick, kurosawa, scorsese, ingmar bergman, fellini, jacques tati, chantal akerman, noah baumbach, greta gerwig, sofia coppola, wes anderson, sam mendes, jared and jerusha hess, buster keaton, charlie chaplin, etc etc etc.

a lot of artists are in fact introverts depicting inner lives, so the above list could grow endlessly.

werner herzog. lars von trier. jane campion. jill soloway. robert bresson. miranda july. kathryn bigelow. richard linklater. lina wertmuller. luis buñuel. kristof(sp?) kieślowski. stanley kubrick. david lynch. maya deren. kenneth anger. park chan-wook. wong kar-wai. apitchapong weerasethakul. ken loach. david cronenberg. peter greenaway. jean-luc godard. konstantina kotzamani. alain resnais.

kill your network tv and check out the criterion channel instead.

eta: a brief compilation of some great documentaries portraying complex issues or inner states etc:
the act of killing
paris is burning
exit through the gift shop
the thin blue line
inside job
burden of dreams
(+ werner herzog eats his shoe)
buena vista social club
paris is burning
crumb
enron: the smartest guys in the room
f is for fake
the fog of war
les glaneurs et la glaneuse (the gleaners and i)
grey gardens
harlan county usa
i am not your negro
jiro dreams of sushi
kooyanisqatsi
samsara
searching for sugarman
waltz with bashir (cartoon!)
when the leevees broke
man with the movie camera
david lynch: the art life
the gates
night and fog
the up series
the many underwater films of jean painlevé
the power of nightmares
manufacturing consent

plus many more i have not had the chance to see and/or can't remember right now

making documentaries is an art. yes it is cheaper and easier with cheaper cameras so more people are making them these days. but an artist is an artist is an artist, regardless of gear. eg. see: agnès varda.

--

later: inspired by my little list above watched 2 great short documentaries this evening:

-gap toothed women (les blank, 1987, 31m). the real subject is the joy of life. delightful!
-vive le tour (louis malle, 1962, 18m). the tour the france on steel bikes! brilliantly shot and edited, and more real than real because you're everywhere. they'd grab free beers from roadside taverns? :lol:

Western Red Cedar
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Re: Nomadland Movie

Post by Western Red Cedar »

I have to agree with @Alphaville on the perceived challenges with portraying introverts. I think it comes down to lazy or uninspired filmmaking.

For example, rather than shooting @Jacob in the park looking at a screen, how about a scene of him mixing the ingredients for fresh taco shells, pressing them on his homemade tortilla press made from scrap wood, and preparing a meal he's harvested from the garden. Even if the filmmaker had limited time, they could add in their own shots of dried beans soaking and tomatoes/peppers on the vine. Layer those scenes on top of a conversation about systems theory, web of goals, and applying it to your daily life.

Frita
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Re: Nomadland Movie

Post by Frita »

@Alphaville
Are you craving NYC for the citylife, to leave your currant situation, or just have itchy feet? Maybe a combination? (I am getting intermittent cabin fever myself, just wanting to go anywhere.)

Oh, and thanks for some viewing suggestions.

@Western Red Cedar
Film still seems to lend itself towards actions. Even extroverted characters sometimes seem to be rather flat. I wonder if it is more difficult to portray the T than the F. (Note to self: I should read the book Jacob linked upthread as it probably explains this better.)

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Alphaville
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Re: Nomadland Movie

Post by Alphaville »

Frita wrote:
Thu Feb 25, 2021 10:28 am
@Alphaville
Are you craving NYC for the citylife, to leave your currant situation, or just have itchy feet? Maybe a combination? (I am getting intermittent cabin fever myself, just wanting to go anywhere.)

Oh, and thanks for some viewing suggestions.
i love new york city. in a way, it contains the world, and you can just walk to it. and i'm a massive flâneur.

my situation is moving towards online so i could be anywhere, but i think there'd be more opportunities in a city of commerce and art and enterprise where everybody hustles and tries their best. i mean, even the food carts are exceptional, look at this happy guy: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sxt4YCIsn2I

my wife would need a more careful transplant and we don't know what's possible yet, but we'll see...

more viewing suggestions on my reply to @western red cedar :D

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Alphaville
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Re: Nomadland Movie

Post by Alphaville »

Western Red Cedar wrote:
Tue Feb 23, 2021 10:06 pm
For example, rather than shooting @Jacob in the park looking at a screen, how about a scene of him mixing the ingredients for fresh taco shells, pressing them on his homemade tortilla press made from scrap wood, and preparing a meal he's harvested from the garden. Even if the filmmaker had limited time, they could add in their own shots of dried beans soaking and tomatoes/peppers on the vine. Layer those scenes on top of a conversation about systems theory, web of goals, and applying it to your daily life.
sure you can show processes but joy is ultimately about meaning, and the best thing about food is sharing it. even religion has the notion of "communion". introverts are more sensitive and need less stimulation but they also want connection. maybe just to a person or two.

so i'd add shots of the sharing of a meal and the appreciation of it. i like talking about the food im eating while i'm eating it. no?

anyway speaking of great food documentaries, a couple more les blank documentaries:
- garlic is as good as 10 mothers - this is a raucous look at various 70s /early 80s food scenes through garlic. a lot of diy, a lot of stuff we take for granted today was in the hippy fringes back then. a blast to watch.
- yum yum yum! -a taste of cajun and creole cooking. "foodie" stuff aside, if you wanna learn something serious about foraging and living off the land check out those crazy cajuns!

Western Red Cedar
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Re: Nomadland Movie

Post by Western Red Cedar »

@Frita - I generally agree about film lending itself to action. The natural tendency of filmmakers and actors is probably to elicit an emotional response (F), but a good script and concept can effectively stimulate the intellect as well (T).

I figured I would chime in on the topic because I think a halfway decent filmmaker could follow around @AxelHeyst building a container domicile in the mountains and he would get loads of views on YouTube. An even better filmmaker could dive into his transition away from traditional work, his journeys into death valley and across the US, his ecological ethos, and make a pretty compelling documentary. Of course, maybe I'm off point and just think along these lines because I watch a lot of introverts on YouTube doing random and interesting things. Some of them are very talented cinematographers.

@Alpahville - Agreed. I was just short on time while typing that up. My thought was to create a visual representation of a system IRL. Worm compost bins, different stages of the garden, food storage, scrap wood turned into a functional kitchen tool. This all takes time. WOG can be pretty abstract, but showing something as simple as an image of a tortilla press made out of "garbage" can help illuminate these things.

I'd add the Chef's Table series to the mix of food documentaries - especially the early seasons.

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Re: Nomadland Movie

Post by Alphaville »

Western Red Cedar wrote:
Thu Feb 25, 2021 12:09 pm
I'd add the Chef's Table series to the mix of food documentaries - especially the early seasons.
thanks! never seen it. will check out when i get netflix again (a month per year or so)

their david chang shows, "mind of a chef" were great also. the guys is hilarious. and his trash cooking is legendary. e.g ramen cacio e pepe hahaha. see here that recipe: https://youtu.be/RDNtmeRJCLg

eta: wait! mind of a chef was a pbs show. but i was away from pbs areas when i saw it (on netflix).

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Re: Nomadland Movie

Post by Western Red Cedar »

@Alphaville - glad to offer a recommendation you haven't seen. I've been impressed by the directors/docs mentioned above, along with your list of "artists I should listen to" in another thread. In both cases I've known about half and really liked those, but haven't heard of the rest.

I read David Chang's autobiography a couple months ago and enjoyed it. He has Ugly Delicious on Netflix which is great, and a spinoff called Breakfast, Lunch, & Dinner. Mind of a Chef was a Bourdain collaboration, but I think Chang did most of the heavy lifting. The Chef show with Jon Favreau and Roy Choi is also fun, but doesn't have the quality of filmmaking of Chef's Table.

If you end up in NYC, make sure to stop at Ivan Ramen after learning about his story. Probably one of the few meals highlighted in that series that you could find for $10.

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Re: Nomadland Movie

Post by jacob »

Finished the book.

Mainly describes the mobile precariat subculture. Moreso boomers who lost their RE or 401k during the GFC due to what I (unfortunately have to) guess was a bunch of leveraged bets compounded by forced loss selling and unemployment. Or divorce or forced early retirement due to medical/care problems. Some examples of people going from six-figure spending down to four-figure spending. Overall, WL0/1 finding a solution in van living.

There's a lot of coverage of work-camping as a way to "make ends meet" with https://www.amazondelivers.jobs/about/camperforce/ getting maybe 90% of the coverage. This leaves a different impression than what is usually surfacing in the media about Amazon pickers. The main verdict is that it's good work albeit often rather silly being subordinated to the robo/algos telling you what to do at all times. Apparently not uncommon for pickers to walk ~15 miles per day. That's a lot of calories.

Overall, mostly a description of a subculture of people who were forced into the lifestyle. Less so about Millennials who "moved into a van" to live deliberately and front only the essential facts of life while simulcasting it on their social media.

Hristo Botev
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Re: Nomadland Movie

Post by Hristo Botev »

DW picked the book up from the library over the weekend, with an aim towards getting as much info/vetting as she can before we pull the trigger on buying a camper ourselves. I'll be reading it when she finishes.

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Re: Nomadland Movie

Post by Laura Ingalls »

I have both read the book and watched the movie. I also spent a summer as a volunteer at an Army Corp rec area. I think both overemphasis the broke people.

People ran the spectrum, but the most typical set up was a newish 40 ft slide out with a washer towed by a one ton Dodge diesel pick-up. It could be of any age since they live forever. I found introverts and extroverts to be equally common. Everyone liked an active lifestyle and disliked cold. I tell for how wealthy people were was less what they lived in and more where vehicles we registered in. Less affluent stuck to the place they had spent their working years. Richer people had Texas or South Dakota plates. Ex-military was very common. The average person doing this is not living in a claptrap converted van or a $500,000 diesel pusher like they sat in in the movie either.

Most people started with a 3 year old fifth wheel $30-40k and a $25-75k pick up.

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Re: Nomadland Movie

Post by Alphaville »

im not into "awards" but it was in the news the movie won golden globes for best director and best drama.

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