Roasting Coffee at Home

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Frugalitifree
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Roasting Coffee at Home

Post by Frugalitifree »

So again, can't see a reference to this cost cutter so here it is.

I'm a bit of a coffee nut. So in my search for the financially optimal way of feeding my addiction I came across this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OTsC6JWM0qU

It details how to roast coffee beans using a popcorn maker.

I use a delonghi machine that grinds the beans and makes espressos. FYI - bought it at half price saving 350 euros, ok it also cost 350 euros but I don't drink coffee when out much and almost look forward to getting up in the morning just to have a cup! I feel it has already paid for itself - see below.

I buy my beans from a local roaster and have established a good relationship with him. I thought I was getting a good deal buying better quality roasted beans at below supermarket prices(for a poorer product). But I got chatting with the owner and asked him if I could get some green beans from him. he gave them to me at 40% of the roasted price. He wins, i win. He even gave me some tips on how to do it, saying he had tried it before and it works well.

I got the popcorn maker from a family member who was throwing it out. With some trial and error I have managed to learn how to roast the beans to a good standard. I now love the process.

I have calculated that each cup of single shot espresso costs about 6c. It's top quality stuff as the beans I get are really good. An espresso in a cafe in Ireland could cost you upwards on 1.50 -2 euros, possibly more. The quality of this coffee is hit-and-miss to say the least. Thats a saving of up to 1.90 a cup! In many places the coffee is dearer as they wank it all up by heating the milk in different ways and giving it an italian name. The latest such fad is the 'blonde' coffee. Which simply means roasting the bean less, below a mild roast. hipsters everywhere are paying stupid premiums for such en vogue fare. I love my coffee, but the prices they pay for the latest trends are silly.

Making high quality coffee in the comfort of your own home at this price is ERE porn. Anyone else do similar? Any tips?

jacob
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Re: Roasting Coffee at Home

Post by jacob »

I did it in a pan a few times. Strongest caffeine kick I ever felt. However, I didn't feel like spending 30+ minutes to make a cup of coffee, so I stopped.

Bought the green beans at a coffee shop and paid the same as for roasted ones, so no financial incentives.

Frugalitifree
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Re: Roasting Coffee at Home

Post by Frugalitifree »

jacob wrote:
Thu Jun 29, 2017 4:51 pm
I did it in a pan a few times. Strongest caffeine kick I ever felt. However, I didn't feel like spending 30+ minutes to make a cup of coffee, so I stopped.

Bought the green beans at a coffee shop and paid the same as for roasted ones, so no financial incentives.
Using the popcorn maker I roast several 50g batches for about 4/5 minutes each. 20 mins will do a weeks supply. Tip from my roaster(just sounds wrong) was too use a vacuum cleaner through a sieve to cool the beans quickly to prevent them from continuing to roast. I just use my freezer, I pop them in there and they cool quickly. Best coffee comes from beans that have rested 2/3 days before being ground. My next plan will be to see if I can buy green beans in bulk. Perhaps get a few like minded people to pool together. Further savings. If not, I'll keep on the right side of my supplier(sounds better than roaster)

bryan
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Re: Roasting Coffee at Home

Post by bryan »

Haven't done it myself yet but have been subbed to /r/roasting for quite some time. For the last year I have found very affordable roasted beans at a co-op roaster that throw in a free coffee when you buy at least a pound. However, I am now very close to Sweet Maria's so no reason to not dip my toes.

I figured forced air cooling would bring the beans to room temp much faster than just placing them in the freezer/fridge. No idea what bean temp over time graph is best, though. I'm also not sure if flavour is imbued into the beans as they cool (should be an easy experiment..).

Certainly an espresso machine will be the bulk of your cost you have to recover? Or are you just brewing in a cheaper way or built your own espresso machine?

One project I am considering to pair with any roasting hobby is building a bean sorter based on various measures. For instance, roasting competitions favour beans w/ uniform roasting per bean.

Frugalitifree
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Re: Roasting Coffee at Home

Post by Frugalitifree »

Hi Bryan. , how do you mean subbed to roasting? My supplier also throws in a free coffee!

Forced air may well be the best system, but perhaps I'm a little lazy. My freezer is bigger than I need(rental) and isn't near full. Its kept at -19C, which is probably too cold from a financial perspective, and cools the beans within a few moments. Am I right in saying that the idea is to get the temp down below roasting temp as the beans will continue to roast in residual heat, taking them past the sweet spot and perhaps making them more bitter?

The machine was bought during a sale. I had been looking at espresso machines for quite some time and had an idea of the market value of them. When I saw it at half price(as a model update was hitting the shelves - mental as it does the same job, just in a different frame).

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Re: Roasting Coffee at Home

Post by bryan »

Over at reddit!

I'm not an expert, but yeah I imagine you just want to 1) stop any reactions and 2) do what gives it the best flavour in your cup. That's pretty nice that you have an espresso machine.. I've settled for cycling through various brew methods for what I'm in the mood for. I think the aeropress gives me my best overall results.

Frugalitifree
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Re: Roasting Coffee at Home

Post by Frugalitifree »

Ah, ok thanks! I haven't been keeping up-to-date with my redit parlance:-)
The aeropress isn't something I've tried though have heard only positive feedback.
I'm in love with my espresso machine. If you love your coffee it is worth sourcing one at a price that you would consider good value. In the long run you will save money and it brings joy every day. I no longer drink coffee out as I feel I can have a better coffee at home(unless Im in a rare coffee shop in which case I annoy them for info on how to achieve a better cup) and I get a kick out of completing the whole process myself.

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Sclass
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Re: Roasting Coffee at Home

Post by Sclass »

Thanks for sharing. I've wanted to do this but some stuff holds me back. Laziness. Not wanting my popcorn coffee flavored.

I do notice my beans degrade in flavor from the day I get them at Peet's to the point I hit the bottom of the bag. I've compromised by getting 1/2 lbs.

when I hacked my bread machine to do custom cycles I came across a bunch of people using a hacked bread machine as a roaster. I'm wondering if a toaster oven with a rotisserie motor could be repurposed to roast. The air popper looked like it needed a lot of attention for very small batches. But maybe small batches is the point.

The lure of the green beans lasting is attractive.

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Re: Roasting Coffee at Home

Post by jacob »

Small batches are certainly better due to the decay---at the opposite end we have buying 10lbs of ground coffee and still using it 12 months later. Roasting beans is very much like roasting popcorns. They actually pop too! You need a way to get rid of the husks that flake off. I used to two colanders "in the wind", similar to separating the chaff from the wheat. With a popcorn machine, you get the beans roasted uniformly. My problem with using a pan on the stove was that my beans ended up covering the range from light-medium to very dark.

dirt
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Re: Roasting Coffee at Home

Post by dirt »

My parents used to roast their own in a air popper like in the video. Eventually they switched to using a stove top popcorn maker with a built in stirring mechanism.

After roasting, they would just shake it around in a colander to cool it off.

Frugalitifree
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Re: Roasting Coffee at Home

Post by Frugalitifree »

I set up an extension lead for my popcorn maker and roast my beans outside. The wind itself takes care of the chaff. the thing is to take the beans off after the second pop, but of course this depends on your preference and how the bean roasts. Sometimes earlier, sometimes later. How do you like your steak, how do you like your coffee?

Working with small batches ensures freshness. I've been told that depending on the bean you should wait three to four days after roasting before grinding and enjoying your cup.

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Sclass
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Re: Roasting Coffee at Home

Post by Sclass »

Thanks for sharing this. I finally got some green beans and roasted them in my popper. I had some funny results.

First I smell like smoke. The right darkness (that I like) comes on so fast I really need to watch things. I get all Smokey.

Second, I let the beans rest a day and I was disappointed with the first cups. Not much flavor nor much smell. After a day it tasted better. Two more days and it is almost chocolatey. There must be a limit though.

I got motivated because Peet’s has been really losing flavor lately. My theory is that I’m in LA which is far enough away from their roasting house in Oakland. They’re on the old side by the time I get them to my home. Maybe I’m losing my sense of smell, but I swear their coffee was better when I lived in the Bay Area. Anyway, it looks like I’m going to be unwinding my business with them now that I’m doing the popper roasting.

It is actually pretty simple. I don’t know why I was so intimidated at first.

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Re: Roasting Coffee at Home

Post by jacob »

That is weird... flavor, smell, and especially caffeine content should be high. They should not smoke. They should pop like popcorn (w the sound but w/o the mushrooming).

Keep in mind that the beans keep "evolving" (due to heat capacity) until you get them cooled down. I flipped mine between two colanders outside---also helps with the husks. I rested them for about 2 minutes before grinding. Coffee is not like chili in the sense that it develops flavor, character, movement, and eventually self-awareness, the longer you let it sit. The sooner the better says theory.

AFAIK, coffee houses don't roast daily but more like weekly... so you can get an old batch.

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C40
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Re: Roasting Coffee at Home

Post by C40 »

I've done some research on this, and have been roasting myself for the last 3-4 months for making espresso. My experiences have confirmed the current common consensuses.

As for roast timing and letting it sit:
- It takes around 24 hours after roasting (or maybe slightly more) for the coffee to be decent. (There is a lot of off-gassing that occurs after roasting and if you use it before that has happened, it has much less flavor). If you use the beans immediately after roasting, the coffee is probably going to be really dull and flat.
- Flavor generally peaks around 3-7 days after roasting.
- After about 7 or 10 days, the flavor starts going downhill, and the drop off is very noticeable by 15 days.

Grinding is very important.
Basically, a good burr grinder made of very hard material (types of ceramic) is much better than cheaper types. You'll want one that is well-made (so it keeps the burrs aligned correctly) and that is easy to adjust and can be adjusted precisely. I researched hand grinders, and the good ones cost $200 when bought new (these are ones like the Orphan Espresso Lido, Knock Felgrind, Helor 101, and Comandante MKIII. I use a Lido E-T and like it). Grinding within 15 minutes of brewing/extraction is good. If you're going to pre-grind, then it is even more important to use a good grinder. Snobs say it turns to shit after 15 minutes but I've seen well-executed tests showing it's still just as good for 3 or 4 days.

Depending on how you're making the coffee, it may be worthwhile to use sieves to sort the ground coffee. (like these, but you could probably get some cheaper that aren't specifically marketed to coffee lovers/snobs. This is more important if you're making coffee that uses coarser grinds, like pourover or whatever. For espresso, it may be better to leave the fines in there, as some variation in size would help the coffee compact better in the porta filter

(If anyone's looking for a way to make espresso, I've been using the Flair espresso maker and I like it a lot. it's WAY cheaper than buying a big electric espresso machine. It makes real espresso (unlike, say, an Aeropress or Moka pot). I've been using a Bellman steamer to froth milk. I haven't used frothers on espresso machines myself so it's hard to know for sure how well the Bellman works, but I can usually get the results I want, or, close to it.

A few notes on roasting
- It is SUPER important to heat the beans evenly. Individual beans can burn easily, so keeping them moving helps ensure all the beans are receiving similar levels of heat. I assume the popcorn makers work well enough for this (?). I've been using a little purpose built pan that has a bunch of holes in it, and I keep the beans moving by continually moving the pan in a circular motion. I imagine this pan might allow more even roasting than, say, a cast iron pan, since it allows a lot of the heating to be done by convection rather than conduction.
- The beans do smoke while roasting. If I'm remember correctly, they will smoke quite a lot just before and during the earlier stages of first crack, and then maybe again near 2nd crack. Maybe the amount of smoke depends on the temperature/time used?

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Sclass
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Re: Roasting Coffee at Home

Post by Sclass »

Maybe it’s the beans I bought. I roasted a cup and use them everyday. The flavor is changing. It started out flat. I was so pissed off I thought I’d return the remainder of the green beans. Then the pots of coffee got better and better over the last four days. I don’t think it’s my imagination.

There is a lot of smoke. I like to roast the beans to get them like Peet’s Major Dickason’s blend or Garuda. Dark. Well into the second crack. Way more roasted than the beans Starbucks brews. Some YouTube videos say this is going too far when the beans get shiney with oil but that’s how they look at Peet’s. Peet’s tosses their unsold beans weekly. I had a friend who worked at the Los Altos shop and she’d give me the discards. They certainly got flat tasting fast at that age. That’s why I think I’m getting old beans there. The first cup I make after getting them home is okay then they just start losing flavor. I’ve been drinking Major Dickasons daily for thirty years. I know what happens when I go on vacation and come back a month later and make coffee. It’s the same. I’m convinced they’re selling me old crap for a premium price. Either I’ve changed or the coffee has changed. It has been so dramatic that I’ve been driven to change my source.

I bought this grinder for $2 at a yard sale. It has worked well for a decade.

Image

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Sclass
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Re: Roasting Coffee at Home

Post by Sclass »

Darn. My espresso machine started leaking water from the foam nozzle. I took it apart with my Swiss Army knife and it was sealed with two o-rings that turned into black dust in my fingers. I’m freaking out like a junkie wondering how I’m gonna get through tomorrow. I ordered the parts from an online appliance website. Amazing how they had all the diagrams and parts. Shipping was $8, o-rings were $6. Oh well, I should be up and running at the end of the week.

I’ve gotten by on modest gear. This machine has made two lattes every day for ten years. I got it for $10 at a rummage sale.

Image

Oh yeah, and my SO started protesting about the simple flavor of my home roast beans. I got some Major Dickasons blend from Peet’s to make her happy. I then realized that my green beans are not a blend like The Major. They’re single origin Ethiopia Yirgacheffe. The coffee tastes good but it is a simple plain chocolate flavor. It lacks the character of the blend.

Perhaps like blended whiskey as opposed to single malt?

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C40
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Re: Roasting Coffee at Home

Post by C40 »

FYI- here are two good sources for green coffee beans:

Sweet Maria's

Coffee Bean Corral

I like Sweet Maria's better. Except, if you want beans for decaff espresso, Coffee Bean Corral have a REALLY REALLY good one.

Prices can be a little lower at Sweet Maria's. It ends up costing somewhere around 40% as much as buying roasted beans from most coffee shops or online, and can be way better because you can roast them exactly as you want and in the right amounts so they are perfect freshness.

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Sclass
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Re: Roasting Coffee at Home

Post by Sclass »

Hey thanks for sharing. I wonder if I should buy several varieties and blend?

Edit ~ hey I found this at sweet Maria’s. Interesting rabbit hole.

http://legacy.sweetmarias.com/blending.php

Frugalitifree
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Re: Roasting Coffee at Home

Post by Frugalitifree »

Sclass wrote:
Tue Jan 16, 2018 4:26 pm
Thanks for sharing this. I finally got some green beans and roasted them in my popper. I had some funny results.

First I smell like smoke. The right darkness (that I like) comes on so fast I really need to watch things. I get all Smokey.

Second, I let the beans rest a day and I was disappointed with the first cups. Not much flavor nor much smell. After a day it tasted better. Two more days and it is almost chocolatey. There must be a limit though.

I got motivated because Peet’s has been really losing flavor lately. My theory is that I’m in LA which is far enough away from their roasting house in Oakland. They’re on the old side by the time I get them to my home. Maybe I’m losing my sense of smell, but I swear their coffee was better when I lived in the Bay Area. Anyway, it looks like I’m going to be unwinding my business with them now that I’m doing the popper roasting.

It is actually pretty simple. I don’t know why I was so intimidated at first.
So it seems maybe your roaster is a little too hot for the beans. They shouldn't smoked if they're shiny when done you've extracted the oils which, depending on prefernce, is a sign they've been over roasted. This may well be a factor in the poor quality of resulting coffee. If you'd rather not buy a new roaster(mine was a secondhand popcorn roaster) you could try turning the roaster off intermittently and turn the beans by moving them round inside yourself.

its a science really, as is every stage in the process, from roasting, to grinding, to making, etc. But what a beautiful science it is

Frugalitifree
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Re: Roasting Coffee at Home

Post by Frugalitifree »

Sclass wrote:
Tue Jan 16, 2018 10:14 pm
Thats great, its not your imagination. My roaster recommends two to three days resting to allow gases emit off the beans and for the flavours to settle. Any coffee you get from a proper coffee shop will have beans that have been rested appropriately.

As far as shiny beans, this is a matter of preference. Shiny beans indicates a darker roast.

Another thing to consider is that each bean responds differently to the process. So what will work with one bean may not with the next. The amount of variables in the whole thing is crazy, its like making wine in that regard.

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