A few times in my career(s), I have been chided for using the word "that" in my writings. In my college English class, and in the US Army. Have you ever been in trouble for doing "that"?
Seems "that" is an unnecessary word?
He turned on the light so THAT we could see.
He turned on the light so we could see.
Some of you "wordsmiths" and authors jump in here.
http://www.kriscramer.com/the-unnecessary-that/
"That"
------Now most managed funds underperform the market. One reason is "that" they grow so large "that" they essentially become the market while still charging 1% fees "that" are much higher.---------
Above sentence was copied from a blog some where on the internet.
I just wanted to go out to a randomly selected blog and see if I could find any possible over/mis use of the word "that".
I "forget" which "randomly selected" blog this was, and it does not matter anyway.
The selected sentence above may be perfectly good in every way, so I am doing research and not trying to point out errors.
Above sentence was copied from a blog some where on the internet.
I just wanted to go out to a randomly selected blog and see if I could find any possible over/mis use of the word "that".
I "forget" which "randomly selected" blog this was, and it does not matter anyway.
The selected sentence above may be perfectly good in every way, so I am doing research and not trying to point out errors.
--------because "that" person craves contact with people on a daily basis. But "that" person may have plenty of FI funds. It's just "that" they want "that" personal contact. So this person brings in plenty of money and could never leave home if desired.------
Here is something from one of my posts, so it shows you I am a terrible offender of the word "that".
Actually I am hopeless on "that".
Here is something from one of my posts, so it shows you I am a terrible offender of the word "that".
Actually I am hopeless on "that".
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Robert Muir
- Posts: 280
- Joined: Thu Jul 22, 2010 10:15 pm
For the same reason that we say "for free" instead of merely saying "free". We would say, "you can have this car for free". Why don't we say "you can have this car free."?
According to Wikipedia, these are called complementizers.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Complementizer
According to Wikipedia, these are called complementizers.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Complementizer
I have held onto two books from my college days, one being Strunk and White's Elements of Style. They basically say to play it by ear -
...The ear, for example, must decide when to omit that from a sentence, when to retain it. "She knew she could do it" is preferable to "She knew that she could do it" - simpler and just as clear. But in many cases the that is needed. "He felt that his big nose, which was sunburned, made him look ridiculous." Omit the that and you have "He felt his big nose...."
...The ear, for example, must decide when to omit that from a sentence, when to retain it. "She knew she could do it" is preferable to "She knew that she could do it" - simpler and just as clear. But in many cases the that is needed. "He felt that his big nose, which was sunburned, made him look ridiculous." Omit the that and you have "He felt his big nose...."
@ Ralphy
I lean towards your point. Evidently using the word "that" is a sticking point for some people. In the military, your taught to write military letters on about an 8th grade reading grade level.
We were taught to write the letter, and then proof it to see how many sentences or words we could omit, and then rewrite it for a final time.
My wife comes from years on end in the school system, so too, is a stickler on written prose. She is always telling me I write way too long letters about something. I have also noticed my posts on this forum are probably way too long.
When I was in the 2d or 3d grade, my teacher sent home a note with me, saying "Herbert can do better". I have never forgotten her note.
I lean towards your point. Evidently using the word "that" is a sticking point for some people. In the military, your taught to write military letters on about an 8th grade reading grade level.
We were taught to write the letter, and then proof it to see how many sentences or words we could omit, and then rewrite it for a final time.
My wife comes from years on end in the school system, so too, is a stickler on written prose. She is always telling me I write way too long letters about something. I have also noticed my posts on this forum are probably way too long.
When I was in the 2d or 3d grade, my teacher sent home a note with me, saying "Herbert can do better". I have never forgotten her note.
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AlexOliver
- Posts: 461
- Joined: Tue Aug 03, 2010 7:25 pm
I can't speak to whether "that" is overused, but I do know that according to Bryan Garner's Modern American Useage, most instances of "which" should be replaced with a "that." It may be grammar heresy to say so, but to me the highest imperative is effective communication. If your audience understands you with adequate clarity, then issues like a superfluous "that" or a few extra words seem secondary. I suspect the military favors shorter written documents because they generate so many of them in triplicate or quadruplicate. As Jacob might say, the military is creating an unnecessary storage problem.