Anyone make their own yogurt?

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Alphaville
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Re: Anyone make their own yogurt?

Post by Alphaville »

plow_2 wrote:
Tue Feb 23, 2021 3:20 pm
You can buy bulk 11 lb bags for like $70 with ever present deals. (40% off right now).
ah! unfortunately

& Artificial Flavor, Modified Food Starch, Sucralose, Acesulfame K

i hate that stuff :(

and apparently, so does my microbiota?

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/30721958/

Frita
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Re: Anyone make their own yogurt?

Post by Frita »

I finally made yogurt (French-style in the little pots). My first attempt was a bust in the oven with the light on. I rescued it by reheating to 110 degrees, adding a bit more Fage, and using a crockpot covered in my down coat. The texture was more like a flan than yogurt. Okay, but not quite what I was hoping for. Was this the result of the rescue?

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Alphaville
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Re: Anyone make their own yogurt?

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Frita wrote:
Mon Mar 01, 2021 10:48 am
I finally made yogurt (French-style in the little pots). My first attempt was a bust in the oven with the light on. I rescued it by reheating to 110 degrees, adding a bit more Fage, and using a crockpot covered in my down coat. The texture was more like a flan than yogurt. Okay, but not quite what I was hoping for. Was this the result of the rescue?
flan? like, which kind? some are supersoft and uniform some are a bit chewy and separated.

was it chewy curdled? was it gummy?

and to check reality vs desire--what is it you were hoping for? what texture and tang was your target?

Frita
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Re: Anyone make their own yogurt?

Post by Frita »

Alphaville wrote:
Mon Mar 01, 2021 10:53 am


It was smooth and medium firm, like a flan you’d buy individually on the street in Mexico that wasn’t quite firm enough to pick up and eat with just fingers. No curdling or gumminess. No tang. It had an eggy taste with no eggs. Of course, it lacked the richness of eggs.

Target: creamy, medium thickness and tang.

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Alphaville
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Re: Anyone make their own yogurt?

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Frita wrote:
Tue Mar 02, 2021 10:21 am
the best way to achieve creaminess is to scald the milk, which denatures some proteins, and let it cool to fermentation temp before inoculating.

beyond a basic creaminess, further thickening requires straining.

commercial producers will use things like gelatin or modified starch or guar gum to create a textural illusion. also some stuff like skyr is made with rennet. some of this could affect your culture especially on first generation where it would be more abundant.

lack of tang means an insufficient fermentation, which means either the culture you used was inactive, or your temp was too low, or too high and you killed it, or you needed more time to ferment, etc.

my inoculation size is a mere 1 tbsp per quart, maybe 2tbsp at most when starting with a (weak) commercial product (i use measuring tablespoon). that seems like a small quantity but works if the culture is truly active. some commercial yogurts have inactive cultures which won't reproduce.

adding more inoculum for some reason gives me a gummy yogurt. sometimes it's not supergummy but it's a bit of a weird thickness/elasticity. this is an empirical finding, and i don't have have an understanding of why it happens, but i suspect due to casein which i think can form fibers (see: amyloid fibrils). but i don't know enough to explain it--i just observe that it happens and adjust to avoid it.

there may be other issues like population selection when culturing at different temperatures, eg favoring mesophiles over termophiles, or favoring extreme termophiles, etc. conditions matter as they exert evolutionary pressure.

most consistent way to culture for you would be to scald the milk first, then inoculate when at 40-42C, then once mixed distribute into jars, then keep at target temp as close as possible, but without turning your home into a lab.

i can't remember if fage works, some commercial cultures die on first or second generation, but i've had luck mixing a bit of this and a bit of that till something survives well. my current culture is 6 months old, i just used siggy (always starts great, might have rennet) then on 2nd or 3rd gen added a local yogurt for diversity. assuming 1 per week im on about 24th gen and going strong.

natural selection is based on variability so starting with more bacteria gives your population more survival chances.

eta: larger volumes hold on to heat better than smaller volumes so the little jars might cool too fast with just a lightbulb before fermentation begins. so you might want to submerge the small jars in a volume of hot water, for thermal regulation. i, an indelicate oaf, just lump the whole milk gallon :D

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Re: Anyone make their own yogurt?

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Thanks, @Alphaville. I did another batch yesterday. It didn’t set in the crockpot so there was another rescue. (Busy skiing and then a waste-of-time Zoom board meeting.) The rescue worked but came out grainy, not quite clabbered, with some whey. The taste is a bit tangy and good. Thoughts for the next batch: 1) babysit to maintain the temperature and 2) add less inoculator.

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Alphaville
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Re: Anyone make their own yogurt?

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great, congrats! fermentation and taste are the important part, so that's an improvement. please keep us posted as you discover more things.

you don't mention if the milk was scalded, but scalding helps with "setting." unscalded milk gives a more liquid / non-set yogurt even when the fermentation has been good, and it will clabber eventually due to increasing acidity, but without going trough a custardy phase facilitated by the unfolded protein. also i got grainy texture when using powdered milk for some reason.

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Re: Anyone make their own yogurt?

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@Alphaville
Thanks, I will keep at it.

Yes, I did scald the milk. From what I have read, some recommend just bringing up to 180 degrees F, while others hold that temp for 10 to 15 minutes.

Regarding adding milk powder yielding a grainy texture, I read that additives in the inoculator and/or yogurt mix produce graininess. I also read that less inoculator produces a creamier yogurt with less whey. IDK

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Alphaville
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Re: Anyone make their own yogurt?

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Yeah I gave up fermenting powdered milk for that reason. It was a pandemic exercise and it didn't taste good.

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Re: Anyone make their own yogurt?

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Success! I ended up with moderately tangy, creamy yogurt on the first try (i.e., no rescue). (After eating the thicker mishmash of Greek yogurt and ricotta cheese, I think I enjoy both. The custard stuff was okay too, actually.)

@Alphaville
1 tablespoon of start per quart of milk made the difference. I put in small jars in a water bath in the crockpot, adjusting the temp every three hours or so, for 11.5 hours.

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Alphaville
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Re: Anyone make their own yogurt?

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Frita wrote:
Wed Mar 10, 2021 1:25 pm
Success!
yeah! 🍻🍻🍻

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Re: Anyone make their own yogurt?

Post by Lemur »

Anyone try mixing veggies with Yogurt? Seems like a strange combo but since I eat Yogurt almost daily and I’m trying to get in veggies at every meal...thought I would experiment.

Maybe zucchini is worth a try.

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Re: Anyone make their own yogurt?

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Lemur wrote:
Wed Mar 10, 2021 2:29 pm
Anyone try mixing veggies with Yogurt? Seems like a strange combo but since I eat Yogurt almost daily and I’m trying to get in veggies at every meal...thought I would experiment.

Maybe zucchini is worth a try.
yeah with cucumber and dill it's a classic (see:tzatziki). i'll also mix yogurt with spinach so the calcium binds the oxalates (instead of my kidneys). i eat with potatoes also.

savory yogurt is very middle eastern and/or indian (see:raita) but for euro version think as sour cream or mayo replacement.

i sometimes add olive oil and black pepper to my yogurt... especially strained yogurt (aka "greek") for a savory dish. labneh and pita is great too... usu eaten alongside olives and little pickles etc. labneh being a yogurt cheese (strain the yogurt and keep straining, then add salt and keep straining). great on a salad sandwich too, or just tomato...

eta: after writing this i found some references to cold borscht that appears yummy. some recipes ask for "buttermilk and sour cream" i say screw the preciosity and just use full fat yogurt.

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Re: Anyone make their own yogurt?

Post by Frita »

@Lemur and @Alphaville
Thanks for the inspiration to eat more savory yogurt. I seem to have a lot of it these days and am not much of a sweet person (anymore).

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Alphaville
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Re: Anyone make their own yogurt?

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Frita wrote:
Thu Mar 11, 2021 9:48 am
@Lemur and @Alphaville
Thanks for the inspiration to eat more savory yogurt. I seem to have a lot of it these days and am not much of a sweet person (anymore).
last night as i was going to sleep i had a thought of making ranch dressing with yogurt. i'm not a ranch dressing type of person, but maybe those who are could use yogurt as the base.

buttermilk is close to a lean watery yogurt and... oh look, wikipedia mentions yogurt:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ranch_dressing

yeah. apply to salad.

oh and use yogurt instead of crema in a torta. milky tang is milky tang i say. elotes! rajas!!

--

also if you strain your yogurt (i do that with 1/2 my batch) you get a diversity of product for more options.

-yogurt cheese/labneh as mentioned before, but also:

-whey, which is great for fermenting vegetables in it, making doughs and batters, cooking grains and beans and stews, making lemonade, etc. e.g. i use whey to make coleslaw, and to ferment cabbage. eg see: viewtopic.php?p=238994#p238994 where it's both in the pickle and the batter.

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Re: Anyone make their own yogurt?

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@Alphaville

Lots of great ideas, thanks!

I made another batch of yogurt yesterday and can say I have the process down. Short of higher outside temps or turning up the heat in the house, I need to turn on the crockpot to high for 5 minutes every two to three hours. It sets in six hours but I prefer more tang. Oh and not too much starter (1 T. per quart) or it approaches something more like ricotta.

The other day I made an olive oil-yogurt cake with my homemade yogurt. It rose higher than with commercial yogurt with the same denseness. I think the flavor was slightly better too.

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Alphaville
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Re: Anyone make their own yogurt?

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@frita

glad to know you got it down! it's all about moving the culture forward from now on, generation after generation, and letting it get a little wild as it picks up added bugs from everywhere.

please hook us up with your chocolate cake formula, my wife likes to bake cakes and it should be fun to eat some.

i've been thinking about reducing dairy and i'm going to experiment with soy yogurt next. i like to invent problems hahahahaha.

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Re: Anyone make their own yogurt?

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a note on deliciousness:

this past couple of weeks we ate our yogurt slowly. kept for a week and decided to strain it to make it more keto friendlyl another week passed.

the yogurt that waited and then was strained, now 2 weeks since inception, is starting to taste amazing!

some sillies say "keep for 3 days" or something, to which i reply: bullshit. keep pushing the times and if you're lucky a great flavor will start to develop.

please not i didnt keep this latest one in a plastic but on a draining basket with room below. so it's like it's hanging in a cave or something. wow, so yummy.

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Re: Anyone make their own yogurt?

Post by Frita »

@Alphaville
Here’s the recipe. This is a dense cake, kind of like poundcake. We usually eat the leftovers for breakfast.

Olive Oil-Yogurt Cake

1 cup yogurt, room temperature (Plain is my preference but can use flavored, just as a side note for yogurt buyers.)
3 large eggs, room temperature, lightly beaten
1/2 cup olive oil (or canola)
1/3 cup sugar
1 1/2 cups all purpose flour
1 1/2 teaspoons baking powder
Optional: citrus zest, vanilla (maybe 1 teaspoon total)

Beat yogurt, eggs, oil, and sugar until smooth (about a minute). Add remaining ingredients and
beat until well-combined (another minute). Pour into a greased and floured 8” round pan. Bake at 325 degree F oven for 25-35 minutes until it tests done.

*I have never made it chocolate flavored. If I were to do so, I would make these changes:
1) Decrease flour to 1 1/4 cups.
2) Add 1/4 cup cocoa powder.
3) Increase sugar to 1/2 cup.
4) Add some instant coffee powder and/or cinnamon (maybe 1/2 teaspoon) to enhance the chocolate flavor.

Agreed on letting the yogurt age! I am going to double my next batch for that reason. (It reminds me of our old beer brewing days when we kept sampling, discovered that it aged well and had none left.). Another discovery is that one cup canning jars seem to make better yogurt than the French pots. No idea why there’s a difference.

Following on your adventures in non-dairy yogurt. I prefer the dairy but, man, it can tear up my stomach if I eat much. I find it super-addictive if I eat much more than a half a cup.

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Alphaville
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Re: Anyone make their own yogurt?

Post by Alphaville »

thanks for the info! we'll make after we lose some weight...

if the dairy tears your stomach just drain the evil aka lactose in liquid.

here a labneh-making video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=917UAW5Jgyw

this guy hangs longer: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A02WG_htnho

this guy drains outside the fridge: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4yPflssR2yA which would continue fermentation for even less lactose, hence even tangier. and i like how he spreads it on the plate

finally, this guy with a good radio voice, he serves his sweet, and has the wrong ideas/motivations about making it hahaha, he's kinda funny, and he shows many hacks to drain it, also salts it differently:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A4rIDnH490o

--

eta: with my wife being lactose intolerant and me wanting to reduce sugar ive been thinking about fermenting my leftover whey with a dry champagne yeast.... yeah sounds crazy so i'll try it of course for that very reason

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/a ... 0247923461

http://www.liquidirish.com/2012/05/whey-alcohol.html

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