Warren Buffett

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trfie
Posts: 163
Joined: Wed Feb 04, 2015 12:35 am

Re: Warren Buffett

Post by trfie » Wed Feb 21, 2018 3:25 pm

7Wannabe5 wrote:
Wed Feb 21, 2018 9:01 am
I don't exactly grok why you guys want the responsibility of having to take care of more money than you need or want? I like my multi-millionaire friend who grew up as one of 13 kids on a farm and was unemployed and eating out of a dumpster at one point in his 20s, and I find him very interesting, but I don't envy him. I guess because he seems a little bit more like a 3 trick pony, than a Renaissance person. Most people find themselves more stuck due to impulsivity, but there are people who get stuck in compulsivity. My friend also checks his blood pressure about 1000X more often than the average human. Why is he worth nearly $100,000,00? In good part because he can't not try to turn a nickel into a dime. Of course, I think he is also motivated by the fact that the game does change somewhat at higher levels, so new curve to conquer there. Different strokes for different folks.
Why is it responsibility to have a lot of money? It's more related to personal factors. If he wanted he could give away most of it, retire or find another job, etc.

Regarding the other posts about Warren Buffett, those are all good points, but the OP's contention was that there was a problem with "the system" which I think can be rejected, or at least one can identify specific factors.

Campitor
Posts: 884
Joined: Thu Aug 20, 2015 11:49 am

Re: Warren Buffett

Post by Campitor » Wed Feb 21, 2018 7:08 pm

The article the OP linked in his post basically states that Buffett is a bad guy for investing in monopolies. Buffett invest in monopolies (hard and soft) because he likes companies that don't have any competition (think Coca Cola and its market dominance of Cola drinks). His preference for these types of companies is his love of buying "sure" bets as an investment. People think this is bad because it encourages monopolies and strengthens existing ones. So basically what the article is stating is that you should hate the player instead of the game. Buffet is basically using the rules of the market to mine large returns on his investments.

Technically Buffett isn't breaking any laws. The article even criticizes Buffett for investing in Apple because the company shelters its earning in foreign accounts. So basically they say we should hate Buffett because of his investment style. I can't agree with this position. Maximizing returns via established rules is not something I can look down on. And they also want all Billionaire money to be taxed so each American can get a check similar to Alaskans getting oil money. I can barely contain my laughter on that one.

Mister Imperceptible
Posts: 1075
Joined: Fri Nov 10, 2017 4:18 pm

Re: Warren Buffett

Post by Mister Imperceptible » Mon Jul 22, 2019 5:37 pm

bigato wrote:
Sat Jul 20, 2019 6:37 am
Mister Imperceptible, I don't see the dishonesty in them because I don't see where what they speak is inconsistent (to my mind it isn't). Could you further explain it? I mean, at least Ray Dalio that I know has discussed at length the debt cycle/deleveraging and the roles central banks and governments play in it. He has even been invited by governments to explain his opinions on this multiple times. Could you elaborate? It's ok if you think it's better to open a new thread on the topic.
I don’t think my irritation with Dalio deserves its own thread, and maybe it was gratuitous to express it in the other thread where the OP was just looking for advice.

Dalio is actually giving investment advice I approve of, which is more than I can say for Buffett at the moment. There are a lot of people who have profited from financialization so this is not to criticize anyone for leveraging the existing system to its maximum benefit.

What bothers me is the holier-than-thou act. Write a book making claims to radical honesty. I get ads on my Facebook from Dalio talking about what a great guy he is and how is wants to give back. Goes on CNBC after he donates a hundred mil and says capitalism isn’t working, spouts a bunch of clichés about education. You can’t say anything bad about him because hey, he just donated a hundred mil. There was not anything in his video regarding the economic machine about all the immoral and criminal activity that led to the 2008 crisis. As an individual you could be crushed and ruined but Dalio is there to pat you on the head and say “it’s just human nature.” If you are just going to gloss over the behavior and the policies that led to the crisis as human nature I cannot give any credit for radical honesty.

Where was all this stuff in 2008, 2009? 2016 and Trump happens and some of the elites wake up to the fact and the plebs are increasingly bullshit and beyond placating with usual means. I was younger during the GFC and not paying attention, so maybe my criticisms are unfair. Maybe Dalio is a great guy. But there is going to be even more backlash against Wall Street in the future and Dalio is getting ahead of it. It feels like a PR campaign, Dalio is selling the idea that he is a great, radically honest guy, and I’m not buying it.

bigato
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Joined: Sat Mar 05, 2011 12:43 pm

Re: Warren Buffett

Post by bigato » Mon Jul 22, 2019 6:35 pm

Ok, so let me try to be in your shoes and let's consider that all of your impressions about the (lack of) human nature from Dalio e/ou Buffet are completely accurate. So how does that relate to their advice regarding investing, that is all that we have been talking abou them? And how does that impact in *your* vision of their advice? Would you like to discuss their advice instead of their morals, or maybe discuss how their morals impact their advice? I'm really trying to understand here.

Mister Imperceptible
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Re: Warren Buffett

Post by Mister Imperceptible » Mon Jul 22, 2019 8:04 pm

In the first sentence of my reply I acknowledged that it was perhaps gratuitous. Hence my posting in this thread instead.

My perception of Buffett and Dalio means I take what they say with at least a grain if not a half shaker of salt, and not as gospel. I would imagine I would invest differently if I had a billion dollars. I would probably have a PR representative also.

FIRE 2018
Posts: 127
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Location: Florida

Re: Warren Buffett

Post by FIRE 2018 » Mon Jul 22, 2019 8:39 pm

Warren Buffett is a great man. His frugal ways and value approach investing is legendary. I adopted his ways at an early age and I am reaping the rewards. Funny that critics come out and think they know more than he does. Thank you sir!

Mister Imperceptible
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Re: Warren Buffett

Post by Mister Imperceptible » Mon Jul 22, 2019 10:35 pm

There is a space in between hero worship and demonization

FIRE 2018
Posts: 127
Joined: Fri Jul 19, 2019 7:32 am
Location: Florida

Re: Warren Buffett

Post by FIRE 2018 » Tue Jul 23, 2019 6:59 am

I will be under hero worship. Mr Buffett influenced the way the way I live my life and amassed wealth thru discipline and continual investing. Haters always gonna hate...

Jason
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Joined: Mon Jan 30, 2017 8:37 am

Re: Warren Buffett

Post by Jason » Tue Jul 23, 2019 7:45 am

FIRE 2018 wrote:
Tue Jul 23, 2019 6:59 am
Mr Buffett influenced the way the way I live my life and amassed wealth thru discipline and continual investing.
I think we need to be realistic here. Not everyone has the wherewithal to spend five minutes coming up with a stupid ass song like "Margarativille" and then spending the rest of their life playing it for a bunch of Hawaian shirt wearing, weekend warriors until it becomes a lifestyle brand.

FIRE 2018
Posts: 127
Joined: Fri Jul 19, 2019 7:32 am
Location: Florida

Re: Warren Buffett

Post by FIRE 2018 » Tue Jul 23, 2019 8:04 am

Realistic is Mr Buffett used an approach that amassed a lot of followers that used his way to improve their lives and their communities. If one chooses to bitch and complain it's one's life and the choices or lack of choices they make.

Campitor
Posts: 884
Joined: Thu Aug 20, 2015 11:49 am

Re: Warren Buffett

Post by Campitor » Wed Jul 24, 2019 9:33 am

How Not to Be Wrong: The Power of Mathematical Thinking

The above is an interesting book. In one chapter it talks about a dream team of mathematicians who were assembled during WW2 to analyze data in order to improve war time efforts and increase efficiencies; if you can get food and munitions to troops faster than the enemy while also conserving effort and fuel, it will provide obvious benefits on the battlefield. The team was asked to examine airplanes that survived heavy damage so they could determine where to add extra armor. After many days of analysis they concluded that airplane engines should have additional armor. The generals scoffed at the idea because none of the planes submitted for examination contained any damage to the engine area. The mathematicians said this is precisely why armor is needed on the engines since it's obvious that any plane that took engine damage didn't survive hence the lack of planes with no engine damage; they also provided the mathematical formula that supported this hypothesis.

How does this tie into this Warren Buffet thread? What type of entrepreneur doesn't survive the trip to the "Warren Buffett" airfield never mind not even getting off the ground? Don't say it's money because there are many millionaires/billionaires that started poor and don't say it's luck because many millionaires/billionaires have also experienced decades of failure until reaching success. So what is missing? I have my own thoughts on this but I'll keep them to myself since I think I'm garnering a controversial reputation on these wealth and income threads. :P

7Wannabe5
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Re: Warren Buffett

Post by 7Wannabe5 » Wed Jul 24, 2019 11:03 am

Well, there are always exceptions that prove the rule, but one major factor would be living in or relocating near a growing, affluent urban area while still young and/or vigorous.

Another factor would be whatever word or phrase would best describe the difference between me and the guy who sold home pot growing supplies in the divided modular office/garage space next to me.

FIRE 2018
Posts: 127
Joined: Fri Jul 19, 2019 7:32 am
Location: Florida

Re: Warren Buffett

Post by FIRE 2018 » Wed Jul 24, 2019 11:34 am

Successful people even in this forum who are FI each has his or her own story to accomplish FI. I have seen and know millionaires that live the jet set lifestyle and flaunt it then again there are others in the same net worth range that live a lifestyle that is way under the radar. It's all about one's personal choice.

Mister Imperceptible
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Joined: Fri Nov 10, 2017 4:18 pm

Re: Warren Buffett

Post by Mister Imperceptible » Wed Jul 24, 2019 12:26 pm

I can respect someone for being capable and successful while disbelieving them when they say 2+2=5

Jason
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Joined: Mon Jan 30, 2017 8:37 am

Re: Warren Buffett

Post by Jason » Wed Jul 24, 2019 3:43 pm

Campitor wrote:
Wed Jul 24, 2019 9:33 am
I have my own thoughts on this but I'll keep them to myself since I think I'm garnering a controversial reputation on these wealth and income threads. :P
There's no hymen check on the internet. Let's hear them.

Campitor
Posts: 884
Joined: Thu Aug 20, 2015 11:49 am

Re: Warren Buffett

Post by Campitor » Wed Jul 24, 2019 4:18 pm

Jason wrote:
Wed Jul 24, 2019 3:43 pm
There's no hymen check on the internet. Let's hear them.
The low hanging fruit of what is missing from the Warren Buffett billionaires club:
  • Lazy attempts on capital aggregation
  • Unfocused effort
  • Irresponsible money management
  • Poor time management

7Wannabe5
Posts: 5309
Joined: Fri Oct 18, 2013 9:03 am

Re: Warren Buffett

Post by 7Wannabe5 » Wed Jul 24, 2019 5:56 pm

Right. Just like the low hanging fruit to the Princess Club is:

1) Being lazy about making yourself be beautiful
2) Focusing on boys who are not even the Prince
3) Irresponsible lack of attendance at charm school
4) Poor smile management

FIRE 2018
Posts: 127
Joined: Fri Jul 19, 2019 7:32 am
Location: Florida

Re: Warren Buffett

Post by FIRE 2018 » Wed Jul 24, 2019 6:12 pm

There is a saying that billionaires are people of means. Because in the end they are and we are not and the end justifies the man of means.

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