White supremacy run amok

[bryan]

It's a common enough term in my world and not hyperbolic when in context (e.g. a social crucifixion or in competitive games). For instance, you could say that Damore guy was crucified as well.

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/crucified
http://www.thesaurus.com/browse/crucify

It seems oppress and crucify are quite close to each other in meaning.. So the disagreement may be in the idea that you can/can't be oppressed/crucified/excommunicated from certain societies?

[Dragline]

Re the murder weapon and suspect:

https://twitter.com/search?q=james+alex ... r%5Esearch

Now tell us, class, what terrible injustice did this guy for being a white man suffer before he decided to go to someone else's city and kill people? Where is his high school crucifixion picture?

[Chad]

I have noticed that most "injured white males" are whiners who are better described as "snowflakes" given how they like to apply that moniker to others. But claiming victimhood is what its all about.

Coming late to this thread. It's disappointing to find the majority of the comments trying to validate these hate protests instead of decrying them. The subject needing discussed is obviously the protest that caused a murder/domestic terrorist incident, but 90% of these posts don't talk about that.

The militia walk was pathetic.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world ... 90081.html

[Spartan_Warrior]

@Brute:

Then what other factors are more causal in holding down 99.9% of white men? And how does structuring the opposition to those factors along racial or gender lines make any sense if they are not the most causal factors?

[Dragline]

So why isn't the POTUS talking like this? As the local police chief said, this was premeditated violence.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-lse0nQ0jvQ

Maybe because POTUS is also on the losing side of history with his supporters.

[bryan]

I hope no one read my posts and thought that I am explaining or validating anything that could be construed as supporting any of this hateful bs? My posts have been largely a tangent from @Spartan_Warrior's claim that "fuck white men" (or more innocently the SJW/PC stuff) is not an attitude held by some powerful people.

For instance, I think this is quite the A+ twitter thread: https://twitter.com/JuliusGoat/status/8 ... 1832925184

[C40]

Coming late to this thread. It's disappointing to find the majority of the comments trying to validate these hate protests instead of decrying them.

Chad - what specific posts are you talking about that are trying to validate hate protests? I think you've misunderstood the majority of posts here.

Edit to add -- there are a lot of different conversations going on here, many continuations of conversations from other threads (particularly the PC running amok one, in relation to some of the posts on the first page about white men being or not being blamed or ignored or whatever)

[BRUTE]

Then what other factors are more causal in holding down 99.9% of white men? And how does structuring the opposition to those factors along racial or gender lines make any sense if they are not the most causal factors?

brute has no idea what holds humans down. lack of education, opportunity, family structure, hugs..
the point brute is trying to make is this: just because the top 1% or so of any power structure are white male humans, that doesn't mean that all white male humans share the power and are therefore open for trashing publicly, making fun of, etc.

humans are individuals. just like any decent human being would feel terrible if a black female human got fired for expressing some facts in a corporate setting, brute would expect a decent human being to feel terrible for a white male suffering the same fate. instead, a ton of humans, including on this forum, find it ok to make fun of Damore, calling him "right", a pussy, crybaby, snowflake, whatever. brute isn't even saying Damore isn't any of these things, but why is it OK for decent human beings to make fun of white men, when it's clearly not ok to make fun of other groups.

and then, when some white racists do stupid, violent shit in Virginia, it's the fault of "the ridiculous narrative of white male persecution".

maybe not all white human males are part of the same group of friends and responsible for each other's behavior. just a thought.

[Spartan_Warrior]

@Bryan:

>held by powerful people

Who the fuck is Julius Goat??

I mean aside from someone who's right in this single tweet?

[Spartan_Warrior]

@Brute:

"brute has no idea what holds humans down."

I'll give you a hint: It's the same thing that holds C40 up in the position of privilege to not worry about this.

"calling him "right", a pussy, crybaby, snowflake, whatever. "

None of which is related to his white maleness, though, right?

If white maleness is not the primary factor holding these people down, how is white male persecution not a ridiculous narrative? (I don't see how you can argue that it's not a narrative that feeds directly into white supremacy, so I assume that's the issue you have with the statement.)

[bryan]

@Spartan_Warrior, idk. I usually don't look to see who people are on twitter unless it is called out in the tweet.

>>held by powerful people
>Maybe not in big hierarchies or mass perception (i.e. privilege e.g. how alleged criminals are treated), but definitely in major social systems or local systems.

[Spartan_Warrior]

Social media is not fucking oppression.

"Oppression is the prolonged, unjust treatment or control of people by others. In the past, the definition of oppression was limited to tyranny by a ruling group, but overtime it has transformed because governments are not the only people who oppress. Today, oppression “could also mean denying people language, education, and other opportunities that might make them become fully human in both mind and body." This is seen throughout history through the actions of Hitler and Mussolini in Europe, King George III in the United Kingdom and the Thirteen Colonies (the predecessor of the United States of America), and today by observing the actions of people such as Kim Jong-un in North Korea and Bashar al-Assad in Syria. Although these leaders are separated by nearly fifty years and a few centuries, both are "governmental regimes that deprive people of at least some of their human rights.”

Tell me again how the regimes of Hitler and King George resemble a guy getting denied on Twitter or some other guy tweeting a political statement you don't agree with.

Or better yet, don't.

[C40]

@Brute:

"brute has no idea what holds humans down."

I'll give you a hint: It's the same thing that holds C40 up in the position of privilege to not worry about this.

ah yes, certainly all of my successes in life stem primarily from ...... hmmm... what do you say? Will you make me a list please?

(I would be genuinely curious to see what people consider the primary factors resulting in a single person being safe/successful/etc. I think if ten of try to make a list of the ten main factors or characteristics that a person had at birth that contributed to them having a good/safe/successful life, (whether it was ten of us trying to list it for one of us, or each person themselves, as we are quite similar) we'd have a lot of overlap, but very different order or perceived weighting of the factors)

[C40]

@Bryan - I took a look at the twitter of that girl and the guy who she (claimed to) reject because he voted for Trump. I didn't really see much of him being harassed or anything other than what is in that one single thread from her post. Sometimes things like this on the internet do result in real problems for a person who did nothing wrong. Problems when trying to get into college or get a job (because when those places google the person, a bunch of nasty shit about them comes up), but I don't think this looks like one of those cases. It just looks like obvious teenagers carrying on.

[Spartan_Warrior]

@C40:

The list is short. Here it is:

1. Capital.

I'm not suggesting to know every causal factors as to how you obtained it, but it is the essential material difference, right now, between you and the underprivileged white men, meth addicts, et al. Capital, and all that comes with it in terms of access to material resources, education, health care, (ETA: possibly even reproductive rights and dating success; see Brute's most recent link in the "Trump: Clown Genius" thread), for you AND your future generations.

It's also what separates you from having any real need to concern yourself with these issues.

Do you disagree?

[Dragline]

Well, at least a few people on the right are calling things for what they are -- evil. Does anyone here seriously think differently and what the hell have you been smoking?

"On Twitter, Rubio wrote that it was, "Very important for the nation to hear [Trump] describe events in Charlottesville for what they are: a terror attack by #whitesupremacists.”"

"Beyond Rubio, Trump’s response apparently also was not enough for Senator Cory Gardner, who chairs the Republican Party’s Senate-election effort. “Mr. President, we must call evil by its name,” he tweeted. “These were white supremacists and this was domestic terrorism.”

Republican Orrin Hatch, who has served as a senator for 40 years, referenced his brother, who was killed in World War II.

"We should call evil by its name. My brother didn't give his life fighting Hitler for Nazi ideas to go unchallenged here at home," he said on Twitter."

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-virgi ... ium=Social

[Spartan_Warrior]

A-fucking-men, Orrin.

[C40]

I think I mostly agree, but I think the effect of capital on the quality of my life goes back way further than the capital I have now. When I didn't have my capital, my life was just as good as it is now, except that now my capital allows me to have full control of my time. I had healthcare before. I could buy whatever I needed and wanted. I didn't have to worry about much. Once I started working after university, all of these were true, but I didn't have any financial capital myself.


On my own list, I probably would've put the economic status of my family at #1, or very close to it. I think that may be about the same thing as you mean.

Now, my capital allows me to have full control of my time

When I didn't have my own capital, the capital held in the communities I lived* ensured I had a decent education and wasn't exposed to many negative influences.

*My parents didn't really have much or any money. But I benefited from capital - primarily, as I understand it, capital of banks that give large mortgages for homes that provide a lot of property taxes, and capital of my dad's employer, that facilitated his job which then allowed him to pay those property taxes, that then paid for decent schools and parks and whatever else make a community safe and decent.

Is that similar to what you meant, or something entirely different?

I'd also say that some factors of a person's parents also have a huge influence (their mental health, conscientiousness, emotional maturity, supportive/driving of their children's education, and so on... but then of course these depend on other things and there could be a whole string of causes there....)

[Chad]

Coming late to this thread. It's disappointing to find the majority of the comments trying to validate these hate protests instead of decrying them.

Chad - what specific posts are you talking about that are trying to validate hate protests? I think you've misunderstood the majority of posts here.

Edit to add -- there are a lot of different conversations going on here, many continuations of conversations from other threads (particularly the PC running amok one, in relation to some of the posts on the first page about white men being or not being blamed or ignored or whatever)

It's all minor, but it's still validation when people are suggesting the protest is valid because of X...

or maybe it comes from the attitude of "fuck white men".

the right to peacefully protest the removal of a confederate statue.

Also, I don't know that this would count as white supremacy run amok. I'd imagine that a good deal of them welcome violence and the extra media attention it brings. (I don't necessarily mean the full-on 'white supremacists are acting like terrorists' part, I'm referring to the general "white supremacists and their opposition protestors get in violent clash" part.

@spartan, may I ask what your gender and race is? Also, what part of the country do you live in? Thanks

Most white men have no systemic power,

99.9% of white men have no systemic power.

These assholes murder three people (most recent number I have seen) and this is the conversation? It's just disappointing this is where the conversation goes and not to what truly emoldened these people.

[Spartan_Warrior]

@C40, yes, that's pretty much exactly what I mean. I was using capital strictly in the economic sense, but that is a huge enough contributor to the other factors like mental health of parents, etc., that I'm willing to factor them into the definition as well.