Early Retirement Extreme Forums

I am at the age where many of the people around my age are getting married. I enjoy weddings, but do not enjoy travelling and the obligations that come with them.

My parents have a similar mentality of those discussed in the OP in this thread... viewtopic.php?f=16&t=10641 Weddings are traditional and lavish. Gifts are expected. EVEN if you are not going. This has been a constant point of contention with my mom and I. I don't agree with the notion that one should give a gift just because they get an invite in the mail. I also have 40+ cousins. I'm not looking to start giving multiple gifts out every year and have this become a serious expense (for those I'm not attending). That being said, I don't really have a strategy for weddings I go to now. Toska's strategy in the other thread seems appealing $100 for family/$50 for friends/$25 for everyone else. I make salmon strips that are very good (not just my opinion) and have thought of sharing those with others. My mom told me it wasn't appropriate as a wedding gift. Grr...

Any other gift giving ideas that come to mind?

Now I'm able to avoid most issues since I live so far away from my family. However, my sister is getting married this summer and I will be going. She has asked me to be an usher and with that she wants me to wear a tuxedo that matches the wedding party. This is provided through some new business where they send it to your home. Renting everything costs me $200. I'm not really into the idea of spending so much on clothes for one day when almost everyone else is in a suit and will look just as good. Unsurprisingly, my mother does not agree with my line of thinking. Her argument is that my sister wants me to do it so I can help her celebrate her big day. My argument is that I'm already paying to fly 7 hours twice to be there and celebrate her big day, what I'm wearing does not factor in. Anyways, I'm unsure how to proceed.

Would you go along with it and get the tuxedo? Thoughts?

Does your sister think you wearing a tux is $200 important? If so, eat the cost. You gotta do it for a sibling.

If I had 40 cousins, I'd skip all of the ones I'm not close to and ignore gift-giving unless you attend.

Why are you talking with your mom about this anyway?

Rent the tux and tell her over and over again how happy you are to be a part of it.

Trash the cousins invitations and leave that to your parents

Thanks for the responses. I'll rent the tux.

@bostonimproper = I discuss it with my mom because she brings it up in asking me about gifts. In the case of my sister's wedding, my mom has been very vocal in many aspects because she is the first of my siblings (5) to get married.

I should have noted that the average plate was $10. The events have been at home, hotel restaurants, fire/township halls and a nice community center.

Your fish idea made me laugh. I gave my cousin 60 lbs of *fresh* strawberries. The family party the next day devoured all of them, it was a hit.

Definitely rent a tux if a part of the brides/grooms party.

I believe it. I think those types of gifts are a hit among the type of people who have the more low key functions. This will not be that...it's something like $25k

Yes to the sister, no to the cousins.

Handmade gifts are best if you're an artisan in any way. A friend of mine gave me a wood and wire hanging sculpture that probably cost him all of 15 bucks in materials but a few hours of work. It was my favorite gift by a mile.

I think living in Alaska gives you a full free pass on any wedding expectations other than your immediate family. You are "that one weird cousin that lives in Alaska". They have many other cousins to be concerned about. You will be easily left out of aggravations they direct at people for not following their made-up and idealized expectations of anyone and everyone giving them as much as possible.

I'm not for weddings, what they stand for or all the goofy money people blow to prove that they care about each other. However, it's important to remember it's the gesture that counts. It's the day for the bride and groom, not you. Nothing says you care about some motherfuckers like dealing with the silly bullshit they put you through to execute their vision.

I'm surprised to hear you say the salmon wouldn't be a hit. Of course I don't know your fam, but IME almost all people enjoy some shit you really put effort into more than some shit you bought.

My theory is give the normie gift and show up in the tux iff you and your sister share some intersecting values and you can expect her to have your back in the future.

Build up social capital but make sure you aren't getting scammed. The scammers are often members of your own family.

Think about it from your sister's perspective. It's the most important day in her life and you are her brother. The last thing she needs is to worry about what you will wear. Just do it for her. If you don't, she might might never forget. We had a really small wedding (20 people) and we didn't invite one of my wife's aunts. She basically cut the ties and my MIL is still bringing this up with resentment each time we see her. You don't want this and $200 as a one off is not that high price to pay.

As to cousins, I agree no need to attend.

To many people weddings, funerals, baby showers, and the likes are very big deals---and possibly even the biggest deal in their life if they otherwise lead normal boring lives. Therefore, whatever you choose can will alter and set the expectations of future family relationships. Since this is partially about personal finance, it concerns how the spending of money affects relationships now and in the future. This means not only how you deal with them or they deal with you but also how they deal with each other insofar you set an example.

I've found that everybody has a price at which point they'll dig in their heels, but to me it's not really about the price but who is paying for it and what the expectations are.

For example, I recall a conversation about "a friend of a friend" who wanted a $$$$ destination wedding (something like Tier 9 of viewtopic.php?p=200124#p200124 ) but then got pissed because some of the invitees couldn't or wouldn't spend so much money to attend their wedding. Given those expectations and lack of concern for the financial impact on the guests, I would have stayed away out of principle.

In my book, if the happy couple want "extras" from their guests (like a tux or arriving in a lambo) in order to conform to some dream wedding, the couple pays for the "extras". Otherwise, the standard/minimum gift price corresponds to the price of the meal. Tit for tat. Very middle class. If not attending, the minimum is a card or a phone call. And if the couple don't want to pay for the designated costumes themselves, you just wear your nicest clothes. These are not hard rules.

I'll reluctantly dig in my heels here to set an example for future relations. The other way around is like asking for a birthday gift and not only specifying exactly what you want but also how much it should cost and then getting pissy if you don't get it. It's crass and it crosses a line for me. I suppose I'm disagreeable that way, but I don't think even a wedding is a license to impose on how other people spend their money.

To summarize, this is not really about how much something costs but the thought behind the cost distribution. If the person or couple show little concern for the impact of what they're explicitly or implicitly asking for, my policy is to give them as little as possible and vice versa. Setting such a standard does have social repercussions. These are not necessarily all bad. For example, I don't mind terribly much not being close to family or friends who take other people's money or life energy for granted insofar that is their choice.

For many brides, the aesthetics of the occasion are very important. This is true at a level beyond wishing to make an impression on others or following tradition. For relatively frugal alternative-artsy counter-example, my DD28 requested that my DS31 and her best male friend both wear navy blue turtlenecks with jackets and braid their long hair with ribbons to match her female Bride's People, and they both complied. Wearing a tux for such an occasion is like providing an unobstrusive, high quality frame for the beautiful picture the bride will be on her special day. So, do it!

OTOH, forget about the cousins or go head and send the salmon or whatever other creative token you prefer.

I'd rent the tux for your sister. If nothing else, you don't want to be the one sticking out in all the photos that inevitably will get dragged out every occasion.

How close are you to your cousins? Most of them may not even invite you to their weddings, especially if you come with an obligation to invite 40 additional guests in your relationship tier. All of our cousins (~40 with SOs) have been executing an informal arrangement to not invite each other to keep costs and size down.

Yes, Jacob spoke to the way that I'm thinking. It's the imposition of costs that get me. Sure it may be selfish to want to but it's no less selfish to require people to spend extra on accessories that solely serve the other person and are not of consequence to the event itself.

This event is emblematic of the differences in lifestyle and thought that have developed between my family and I. A decade ago, I would've thought this was "normal." It's almost the exact opposite now.

basuragomi wrote: ↑

Wed Feb 26, 2020 10:26 am

How close are you to your cousins? Most of them may not even invite you to their weddings, especially if you come with an obligation to invite 40 additional guests in your relationship tier. All of our cousins (~40 with SOs) have been executing an informal arrangement to not invite each other to keep costs and size down.

My family is American Irish Catholic and very big on family/family events. I get invited to every wedding. So far I've missed 4. To be clear, I love my immediate family and extended family very much. I'm just not willing to spend nearly $1k in total costs every time one of them gets married. So far I haven't and it hasn't been a problem.

I agree with people on the tux rental. Smoked salmon seems like a fine gift and one could create a nice basket with wine, crackers, etc. But hey, I am a low maintenance Wyomingite married to an Alaskan. After navigating your 40 cousin’s weddings, you will be an expert resource for all of us.

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Different people see things differently. I look at the $200 tux rental as a cost of not harming the relationship with your sister and possibly with other family members. Only you know how important that is to you.

Guessing here but from their perspective you've removed yourself from their lives by moving to Alaska. Is your sister including you because she really wants you to be a part of the wedding or because of pressure from your mother to do so?

Either way, from the bride's perspective, not wearing a tux is - like Jacob mentioned above - an intentional stick in the eye. Is that what you intend?

I should have noted in my last post that I ordered the rental tux last night.

Most of my siblings live/have lived in a different state than where we grow up since finishing school. But yes, I miss a handful more events each year. This particular sibling and I have the most conflict out of all. This disagreement in styles is just one of many... Hopefully, this will just be a one time occurrence.

I would buy a tux. You can definitely get one for $200 or less and use it again. Personally I hate the idea of renting another man’s pants. I bought a custom tux in Vietnam for a fraction of that and got much more use out of it

Sounds like you’ve made up your mind but for what it’s worth I agree with Ego. I see these things as a cost of maintaining a relationship and depending on the importance of the relationship it’s generally a drop in the bucket.

Go, have fun, and try not to think about how many other men wore those pants

This reminds me of the typical noob problem of how to deal with consumer friends who want to go out for a $100 night on town all the time when the desire is to save the money instead. The usual response is to invite the frivolous consumers for a night of home cooking instead, possibly converting them. Or finding other friends.

Weddings are different being a (hopefully?! ) one time event. So, it's also possible to punt and pay via a change of framework like viewtopic.php?p=189647#p189647 ... yet thinking like that ignores the greater influence one might have in terms of changing the family's financial relationships. Kinda depends on how far you wanna take this issue and in which direction you wanna take it. I see four different outcomes.