Page 1 of 1

Replace dishwasher with small washing machine?

Posted: Sun Dec 06, 2020 7:42 am
by Hristo Botev
DW wants to get rid of both our dishwasher and dryer and put a small washing machine in the kitchen (UK style?), where our dishwasher is currently. (We are planning on putting a bathroom in the basement where the laundry room is currently.) Has anyone done this, or something similar? Looking around online it certainly seems doable, if you are using something more the size of a portable washing machine, as opposed to a more traditional size (by US standards).

Re: Replace dishwasher with small washing machine?

Posted: Sun Dec 06, 2020 8:06 am
by Alphaville
i got wash machine in kitchen (not in dishwasher spot). just dont fry onions on laundry day. :lol:

Re: Replace dishwasher with small washing machine?

Posted: Sun Dec 06, 2020 9:02 am
by UK-with-kids
Plumbing for washing machines and dishwashers is normally the same - just a cold feed and drainage pipe (although in the old days some washing machines had a hot feed as well instead of heating the water by electricity). When I moved into our rental house I installed my own dishwasher in the space where the washing machine used to be. It's a really easy job. The only downside is that washing machines can be very noisy so it's not great having them in a room where you spend a lot of time, and you need to make sure it doesn't rock about if it isn't held in place in some way.

Re: Replace dishwasher with small washing machine?

Posted: Mon Dec 07, 2020 8:08 am
by 7Wannabe5
I wonder what would happen if you tried washing clothes with your dishwasher?

Re: Replace dishwasher with small washing machine?

Posted: Mon Dec 07, 2020 8:54 am
by Seppia
UK-with-kids wrote:
Sun Dec 06, 2020 9:02 am
Plumbing for washing machines and dishwashers is normally the same - just a cold feed and drainage pipe
Same in Italy.
I’m the least DIY person on the planet but managed to install one on my own without issues.

Re: Replace dishwasher with small washing machine?

Posted: Mon Dec 07, 2020 9:05 am
by Alphaville
here in the usa standard is washing machine hooked to hot + cold water lines, at least in my experience, but ymmv

Re: Replace dishwasher with small washing machine?

Posted: Mon Dec 07, 2020 9:11 am
by UK-with-kids
7Wannabe5 wrote:
Mon Dec 07, 2020 8:08 am
I wonder what would happen if you tried washing clothes with your dishwasher?
They would come out very wet as you wouldn't be able to spin the clothes partly dry at the end.

If you used plastic crockery you could maybe wash your dishes in the washing machine though.

Re: Replace dishwasher with small washing machine?

Posted: Mon Dec 07, 2020 9:17 am
by UK-with-kids
Alphaville wrote:
Mon Dec 07, 2020 9:05 am
here in the usa standard is washing machine hooked to hot + cold water lines, at least in my experience, but ymmv
In many UK homes there is only a limited amount of hot water available from a tank in the loft. If the washing machine took it all then you might not have any left for a bath, shower, or washing the dishes. Even with more modern heating systems which give you instant hot water (a combination boiler or "combi"), how would the washing machine control the wash temperature if it had both hot and cold feeds? Would it have a thermometer to measure the temperature of incoming hot water and then dilute with cold water accordingly? And then if the wash temperature was higher than the available water - e.g. for a 90 degree C wash (nearly 200 degrees in F) - it would still need an internal heating element anyway. I think this is why all modern washing machines in the UK now have cold feed only.

Here is an article discussing this for anyone who is interested: https://www.whitegoodshelp.co.uk/cold-f ... -machines/

Re: Replace dishwasher with small washing machine?

Posted: Mon Dec 07, 2020 9:53 am
by Alphaville
UK-with-kids wrote:
Mon Dec 07, 2020 9:17 am
how would the washing machine control the wash temperature if it had both hot and cold feeds?
i'm not a plumber or washing machine designer but i'd assume same as the shower by combining streams?

anyway here's the home depot installation guide

https://www.homedepot.com/c/ah/how-to-i ... 90ca1b2d3e

from that link please observe:

Image

red = hot
blue = cold
(exit is a different hose)

again this might be different in europe with different standards for many things, but my comment was for @hb who is here in 'merica that his kitchen might not support euro standards or he might not be able to find same products.

Re: Replace dishwasher with small washing machine?

Posted: Mon Dec 07, 2020 10:11 am
by UK-with-kids
Yep you might well be right for the US. We actually have the same hot + cold feed in our rental house (in the UK), it's just that the washing machine was about 20 years old and all modern ones in the UK have cold feed only, so the hot feed was redundant.

Obviously for a shower it works differently because shower temperature would never need to go above around 40 degrees (around 100 F) whereas many clothes washing cycles use a much higher temperature, hence why they have internal heating elements. And actually, again in the UK, many showers are in fact electric showers which heat the water directly from the cold feed. I assume this is for the same reason that washing machines have a cold feed only, as water coming in from a hot feed is likely to be unreliable. That being said, there is such thing as a shower which takes in both hot and cold feed (often called a "bar mixer" in the UK). But if you have this installed and you run out of hot water then you can only have a cold shower. And if your boiler breaks down you can't wash at all using the shower head. Electric showers are much more flexible for that reason, and they also save fuel by only heating the water that's needed.

Re: Replace dishwasher with small washing machine?

Posted: Mon Dec 07, 2020 10:16 am
by Alphaville
yeah we're behind on the energy efficiency department in this continent as our electricity is "cheap" (aka ecologically costly coal)

oh! and most of our heating is powered by large deposits of natural gas as well.

electric is more efficient at point of service but gas heating here is lots "cheaper" to produce in money terms. therefore, we make indoor flames (@hb's water heater is gas type).

Re: Replace dishwasher with small washing machine?

Posted: Sat Dec 12, 2020 2:38 am
by DutchGirl
I thought you were going to wash your dishes in the washing machine, and I would advise against that.

Lots of smaller houses in my country do have the washing machine in the kitchen. They're always frontloaders, so that helps. And yes, they definitely need to be put in firmly so that they don't shake things around when spinning the wash.

Re: Replace dishwasher with small washing machine?

Posted: Sat Dec 12, 2020 5:04 am
by chenda
Yes mine is in the kitchen, there is only one kitchen/living room area in my flat but the noise isnt really a problem, only when it's on a spin cycle and I often put it on when I'm out or at night and shut the kitchen/living room door.
DutchGirl wrote:
Sat Dec 12, 2020 2:38 am
I thought you were going to wash your dishes in the washing machine, and I would advise against that. .
😂

Re: Replace dishwasher with small washing machine?

Posted: Sat Dec 12, 2020 5:58 am
by anesde
I’m originally from US but been in UK for a few years now. The washing machine in kitchen was a bit strange at first but I got used to it pretty quickly.

Regardless of what you choose I would definitely advise getting rid of the dryer. If you get a front load washing machine with a good spin cycle and a drying rack that’s all you need really. Dryers just waste energy and don’t actually provide any measurable benefit that a bit of time can’t do; also better for the clothes.

When I lived solo I actually even skipped the drying rack and just ran washing lines across my flat which worked well. My friends said I was living like a gypsy but I liked it. Now that I’m with my SO we got a drying rack as she wasn’t too pleased with the idea :D

Re: Replace dishwasher with small washing machine?

Posted: Sat Dec 12, 2020 8:36 am
by UK-with-kids
We have a combined washer/dryer machine. It looks like a regular (front loading) washing machine but has an optional drying cycle which takes almost all the water out of the clothes and sends it down the same outpipe. The reason we have this is that in the UK it can be very difficult to dry clothes in the colder, damper half of the year, especially if you have young children and mountains of washing to get through. Drying clothes indoors is ok up to a point, but it's not much fun being surrounded by drying racks all the time, which you will be if you live in a typically sized UK home. The other problem we have with indoor drying is that damp and condensation can be a serious issue in poorly ventilated homes with in adequate heating systems, which is the case for our home and many other rented out older properties.

Re: Replace dishwasher with small washing machine?

Posted: Sat Dec 12, 2020 12:02 pm
by chenda
UK-with-kids wrote:
Sat Dec 12, 2020 8:36 am
We have a combined washer/dryer machine. It looks like a regular (front loading) washing machine but has an optional drying cycle which takes almost all the water out of the clothes and sends it down the same outpipe.
Yes I have that too although I rarely use the dryer and just use a drying rack. Although as its just me it's only up over the weekend, I think in families the washing machine is in constant use :)

Re: Replace dishwasher with small washing machine?

Posted: Sat Dec 12, 2020 12:52 pm
by Alphaville
i reduced use of dryer by switching to merino fabrics which practically dry themselves with a spin.

sure they cost more, but you can wear them longer with no ill smell, and they require a lot less energy to wash and maintain. same with certain synthetic fabrics (but some synthetics can smell). easy to wash by hand and hang to dry

fair enough though, they do come from ruminants or petrochemicals. and children might rip them up.

but cotton... drying cotton can be a real plague. especially the heavy fabrics like denim? oof. heavy to wash by hand also.

when i lived in the boonies the jeans would freeze in the drying line if you forgot to take them in after sundown :lol:

-

we still use dryer for bedding and towels. would be silly not to, in an apartment in winter.

Re: Replace dishwasher with small washing machine?

Posted: Mon Jan 04, 2021 7:14 pm
by caren22
i'm not a plumber or washing machine designer but i'd assume same as the shower by combining streams?

red = hot
blue = cold
(exit is a different hose)
The https://justdomyhomework.com/ is the best writing service on the web
again this might be different in europe with different standards for many things, but my comment was for @hb who is here in 'merica that his kitchen might not support euro standards or he might not be able to find same products.
mine also had a safety valve on the hot water pipe!

Re: Replace dishwasher with small washing machine?

Posted: Wed Jan 13, 2021 1:14 pm
by FRx
I've been down this quandary. I have a flat in Spain and there is a tiny washer/dryer combo which installs under the kitchen sink and has attaches with a tiny drain hose directly to the trap drain of the kitchen sink. Very simple.
I have a condo in Portland and I have a dishwasher in the kitchen which has the same connection as above. However, the codes don't allow you to connect directly to a trap, nor use the drain unless you have at least a 2" drain. The reasoning is that most washers are high output - or at least they were back in the day. That's no longer the case with the more efficient units.
There are other factors I decided not to do it: if there was water damage I'd probably be responsible. The w/d combos in Spain cost 250 euros and here they cost 1,250 dollars. The ones in Spain are smaller and here they are pretty massive even for compact units.

Re: Replace dishwasher with small washing machine?

Posted: Wed Jan 13, 2021 1:31 pm
by Hristo Botev
Thanks all (and for FRx resuming this thread). I have happy memories of the small kitchen washers during my time living in the Balkans, in part because I didn't have one and envied my neighbors who did as I was washing clothes in a bucket in my wet bath in the middle of Balkan winters, realizing why many of my neighbors opted to wear "adidos" track pants instead of heavy denim jeans. That said, I was hard pressed to really find anything equivalent here in the US that didn't cost a ridiculous amount of money; and even the "portable" washers don't seem like a good fit. Anyway, what we've decided to do, which is I think the better ERE call anyway, is to just move our current standard-size washer and dryer into the garage; which of course will make are already small garage even smaller, but so be it--we've got too much junk stored in there as it is (I'm going to start sending pictures of our garage to extended family members, so that they can actually see how little space we're working with when they send us things like pitch-back training nets and other kids' toys that we have to find a place to store).