Seeing that many people are interested in sailing, here's an idea for you. Find another 1-2 persons in your non-landlocked city, and buy a boat. The cost of a reasonable boat which isn't going to cross oceans is $5000-$25000. Live on that.
Since the boat isn't going far, it doesn't need to be a sailboat of course. Keep in mind though, that for a similar sized boat, sailboats are far cheaper than motorboats (big engines are expensive!).
The ERE boat
I tossed around the idea of doing this in Chicago for a while, but I couldn't figure out:
- Where do you dock it? Are you paying mooring fees? What are mooring fees typically?
- Where do you store it over the winter? Are you paying for that too?
Ultimately it seemed like it would cost more and be more trouble than just finding a very cheap apartment. I'd love to hear more specifics about how to do this though. If nothing else, I think it'd be fun to try for a while.
- Where do you dock it? Are you paying mooring fees? What are mooring fees typically?
- Where do you store it over the winter? Are you paying for that too?
Ultimately it seemed like it would cost more and be more trouble than just finding a very cheap apartment. I'd love to hear more specifics about how to do this though. If nothing else, I think it'd be fun to try for a while.
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jacob
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You dock at a marina. There's a slip fee. Fees are typically comparable to RV park fees, maybe a little lower but it depends on boat length ($200-$300/month around here + extra if you live on the boat). I know in the sf bay it is close to impossible to anchor out for free. I don't know about Chicago/Lake Michigan. In the Florida Keyes, free anchorage exists. You can haul the boat out ($$$) and store it on the hard for the winter. I've seen pictures of people up north shrinkwrapping their boat for insulation during the winter and staying aboard.
That said. I think there are some "secret" spots to anchor out for free. I've seen boats anchored up at the delta which looked pretty permanent. That is, you have to find the boat equivalent of "city-camping", that is, staying at national parks and walmart parking lots. This information is not heavily advertised for obvious reasons.
I think it's more trouble to live on a boat than in an RV park but ultimately it could be very cheap. One part of the trouble is if people actually have to dinghy in to shore on daily basis. Staying on the boat would make everything far less troublesome.
That said. I think there are some "secret" spots to anchor out for free. I've seen boats anchored up at the delta which looked pretty permanent. That is, you have to find the boat equivalent of "city-camping", that is, staying at national parks and walmart parking lots. This information is not heavily advertised for obvious reasons.
I think it's more trouble to live on a boat than in an RV park but ultimately it could be very cheap. One part of the trouble is if people actually have to dinghy in to shore on daily basis. Staying on the boat would make everything far less troublesome.
Great idea, but then who own's the boat and decides who gets to use it and when? While it is more practical for people to share expenses, I think these issue's are difficult to work out.
I always daydream about sailing the caribbean for a few month's/year's...forever...don't we all want to waste away in magaritaville:)
I always daydream about sailing the caribbean for a few month's/year's...forever...don't we all want to waste away in magaritaville:)
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jacob
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The idea is that 2-3 people get together and live full-time on the boat for 4-6 years while accumulating money and investments.
Combined ownership can be done through boat shares (like 1/3s) and it's often set up as a LLC.
I suppose they may be able to agree on where to go for a vacation if the need arises.
Combined ownership can be done through boat shares (like 1/3s) and it's often set up as a LLC.
I suppose they may be able to agree on where to go for a vacation if the need arises.
In a similar vein, I have a pipe dream to build my own boat along the lines of "Buehler's Backyard Boatbuilding" ( http://www.amazon.com/Buehlers-Backyard ... 0071583807 ). With planning some of the materials could be salvaged from Craigslist and Freecycle.
And, don't forget that pirates used to operate their ships on a share system. "The Invisible Hook: The Hidden Economics of Pirates" ( http://www.amazon.com/Invisible-Hook-Hi ... 0691137471 ) comes highly recommended, and I imagine it goes into some detail on how that used to work.
And, don't forget that pirates used to operate their ships on a share system. "The Invisible Hook: The Hidden Economics of Pirates" ( http://www.amazon.com/Invisible-Hook-Hi ... 0691137471 ) comes highly recommended, and I imagine it goes into some detail on how that used to work.
My boyfriend and I lived on a sailboat for most of last year and plan to do so again. We spent some time traveling/anchoring out, but the majority of the time we had a very cheap slip ($150/mo for a 35' boat) at a marina on the Eastern shore of the Chesapeake. We currently have a (26') sailboat slipped in Pt. Lavaca, TX for $100/mo. However, slip rent in places that people might actually want to live and work can be pretty outrageous by our standards. We considered spending last winter in Charleston, SC, but changed our minds when we discovered that the cheapest slip was $420/mo. We found a few places with liveaboards anchoring out longterm (ex~Beaufort, NC), but I think it would be pretty hard to anchor out and hold a job unless you can call in sick anytime the weather is too rough to brave a dinghy ride to shore. If you have more than one person on the boat and one dinghy, the problem is compounded. Our current strategy is to rent a very cheap room ($150 split two ways) in Austin, TX where jobs are plentiful and pay slip rent on our boat as well. We plan to work three quarters of the year and sail job-free for the winters. Not the best strategy for saving money, in my opinion, but a way to make things like spending the winter in the Bahamas attainable for two 25-year-olds with part time jobs.
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Checking Carly
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My brother has been seriously looking into buying a boat to live on in the L.A. area, either docking it in Long Beach Marina or near Redondo Beach. He knows he wants a sailboat, to avoid having to pay so much for gas expenses. He's been looking in the 40+ foot size on Craigslist and found some good deals (obviously expecting to bargain them down some.
Most of the problem is becoming part of the live aboard program. Some places it is a two year wait before you can do it. So he's trying to look for boats that already have it and hoping it will transfer. Does anyone know if this is what happens with LA?
The cost is definitely less in rent than for a normal LA area apartment (on the water I should say). You pay for slip fees which are determined by how big your boat is and then the live aboard is about $600 per month. So, for the boats he was looking at, he said it would be about $900/month. Not bad for a view on the water. Most also come with internal bathrooms and a clubhouse with showers (some even have spas!) He's also trying to look into setting up a permanent mooring spot in a free "parking" area. Anyone know anything about that either? Do you talk to the harbormaster?
Most of the problem is becoming part of the live aboard program. Some places it is a two year wait before you can do it. So he's trying to look for boats that already have it and hoping it will transfer. Does anyone know if this is what happens with LA?
The cost is definitely less in rent than for a normal LA area apartment (on the water I should say). You pay for slip fees which are determined by how big your boat is and then the live aboard is about $600 per month. So, for the boats he was looking at, he said it would be about $900/month. Not bad for a view on the water. Most also come with internal bathrooms and a clubhouse with showers (some even have spas!) He's also trying to look into setting up a permanent mooring spot in a free "parking" area. Anyone know anything about that either? Do you talk to the harbormaster?
In Chicago, you aren't going to find much on the lakefront that is inexpensive, and probably not anywhere up the river either. If one is looking to work downtown and live aboard, it might be worth looking into something like Marina City in the Printer's Row area - lots of foreclosures, slips in the river, 10 minute walk to the loop, and I think that you can get the slip bubbled or heated if you want to live there year round.
I looked at buying and living aboard in Chicago a few years back, and concluded that here, particularly with extra winter costs and issues, you're better off getting a cheap apartment. Doesn't meant that I wouldn't look into it again though, but I get my water time elsewhere - it's not the driving concern it would be if I were stranded in suburbia.
I looked at buying and living aboard in Chicago a few years back, and concluded that here, particularly with extra winter costs and issues, you're better off getting a cheap apartment. Doesn't meant that I wouldn't look into it again though, but I get my water time elsewhere - it's not the driving concern it would be if I were stranded in suburbia.
Huh - well, looks like renting in River City (previously mis-named it Marina City) might be a little cheaper right now that I'd thought....
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/loca ... 0136.story
and for chicago costs:
http://www.usaboatslips.com/cms/boat-sl ... inois.html
really, for a 28' live aboard in River City, if it includes hookups for pumpout, power and a water supply, really not bad....
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/loca ... 0136.story
and for chicago costs:
http://www.usaboatslips.com/cms/boat-sl ... inois.html
really, for a 28' live aboard in River City, if it includes hookups for pumpout, power and a water supply, really not bad....
True, but a 10 minute walk to the office where you can earn downtown Chicago salaries helps. It's a case not of finding the cheapest place to live, but the cheapest place to live where you can make your savings quickly and easily. Wouldn't make nearly as much sense if you didn't have to/want to live in downtown Chicago.
@jacob: for one, we didn't have an outboard. Depending on how close the anchorage was to the nearest dinghy dock, that could be quite the trip. If you did have an outboard, you would also have to worry about it getting stolen. Outboards and whole dinghies are very popular targets for theft. Also, a lot of marinas charge a fee (something like $5) to tie up and go ashore at their dinghy dock. Hauling your dink up on the yard of someone's waterfront property to avoid the fees would probably not go over well. All this said, we LOVE to hear about cheap, liveaboard friendly marinas, cities tolerant of longterm anchoring out, etc. I'm not saying there aren't good places, it's just harder to find than you might think.