Tribe: On Homecoming and Belonging, by Sebastian Junger

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classical_Liberal
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Re: Tribe: On Homecoming and Belonging, by Sebastian Junger

Post by classical_Liberal » Mon Dec 31, 2018 5:37 am

@campitor
Fascinating! Essentially, a need for psychological hormesis. If the environment doesn't provide it, do we need to create it ourselves through self-destruction?

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vexed87
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Re: Tribe: On Homecoming and Belonging, by Sebastian Junger

Post by vexed87 » Mon Dec 31, 2018 10:31 am

I do wonder why we so often get surprised that separating human's from nature is any different from the neurosis you see in wild animals when you take them out of their natural habitat. Why do we expect anything to behave healthily in circumstances in which natural selection has not forged them.

The key take home from Tribe for me is that I need to get out my self imposed cage and experience life as much as nature 'intended', as an ape-like social being who is supposed to participate in much smaller scale society than most of us belong to at present.

It is a challenge for an introvert like me to put in to practice, but it's who we are. Admittedly, it's easier said than done when everyone else is happy to live in this crazy modern world and attempt to drag me back in with them if I ever express any desire to resist.

In any case, I enjoyed the book, it now sits alongside my copies of Sapiens and The Righteous Mind.
Last edited by vexed87 on Mon Dec 31, 2018 11:06 am, edited 3 times in total.

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theanimal
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Re: Tribe: On Homecoming and Belonging, by Sebastian Junger

Post by theanimal » Mon Dec 31, 2018 10:51 am

Junger was on today's EconTalk talking about tribe.

http://www.econtalk.org/sebastian-junger-on-tribe/

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Re: Tribe: On Homecoming and Belonging, by Sebastian Junger

Post by Campitor » Mon Dec 31, 2018 11:19 am

I believe humans are hardwired to output physical and cognitive energy towards exploration, creativity, and mastery. Our existence and advancement is a result of expressing this genetic programming. We can't control this anymore than we can control the cellular symbiosis that gives rise to consciousness. This is our current design otherwise we would have been indolent and perished from existence.

When we are deprived opportunities to exercise our fundamental programming, that energy builds into frustration. That frustration produces negative behavior which causes conflict. This conflict gives rise to competition which pushes on the same physio/psychological levers employed by exploration, creativity, and mastery. Who are my enemies? How can I defeat them? How can I control them? This frustration is what pushes us to explore, create, and master our environment so that our species can survive. We can't control this behavior but we can create positive outlets for our genetic disposition.

Our genetic programming will be expressed negatively if we destroy opportunities for positive mastery for those of average or below average ability, unknowingly stifle creativity in the ignorant pursuit of metrics and/or profits, and abolish challenges in the pursuit of optimizing outcomes instead of opportunities.

daylen
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Re: Tribe: On Homecoming and Belonging, by Sebastian Junger

Post by daylen » Mon Dec 31, 2018 11:34 am

+1 Campitor

For more information, look into evolutionary game theory. Great stuff!
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evoluti ... ame_theory

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Re: Tribe: On Homecoming and Belonging, by Sebastian Junger

Post by prognastat » Mon Dec 31, 2018 1:19 pm

I think a part of the the problem in modern society is one of the things that has made us thrive too. Specialisation. The more specialised we become the more efficient we become, but we also lose sight of the bigger picture and this can lead to feeling a lack of accomplishment.

For example if you're a cobbler/shoemaker you might feel accomplished completing a single shoe. If you are working in a factory making shoes and your part is gluing the soles to the upper you might be able to get far more work done in the same time that the cobbler finishes one shoe, but I suspect you'll actually feel less accomplished despite doing more work.

This in turn might also lead to us not identifying with our job as much, there was a time where your job was so much of an identification that people still have professions as last names. Now we aren't getting identity from a tribe nor from a purpose.

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