Born to Run

[theanimal]

I just finished reading Born to Run by Christopher McDougall. Not your typical ERE book but as someone who really values their health, I really enjoyed it. A lot of evidence is presented how modern shoes are actually pretty bad for us and are the cause for a majority of injuries with running and some related activities involving the legs. Apparently barefoot is the way to go! One of the main reasons I wanted to read this book is because I hate running/am not the best and I like to work on my weaknesses.
I just bought a pair of Xeroshoes to try out. They are basically a somewhat better verision of the Vibram FiveFingers and they only cost $25! (they are also supposed to be VERY durable). Any thoughts on any of this?

[lazyboy]

just bought my second pair of Vibrams last week. I realy like them. Yes I know they are real expensive.
Just want to give you one tip if you´re starting to run barefoot. Don´t go on asphalt!!!! You could hurt your feet real bad. Start slow, best on some lawn or on forest soil.

[thebbqguy]

After reading Jim Ryan: Master of the Mile in 5th grade I started running 5 days a week for the next 23 years. I ran distances ranging from 2 miles to 13 miles on a regular basis. I am not really built for running long distance, but I actually achieved a 19:22 5k in high school. I loved it. But now I cannot run at all and I have trouble walking sometimes. If you start to feel pain, I'd suggest you get it checked out. I'm not kind of person that goes to the doctor unless it's absolutely necessary and the running ruined my knees. I have had 2 knee surgeries and have been assured I will need a double knee replacement in a few years if the arthritis continues.

[TheLuckyWizard]

Bron to run is a great book. You might want to check out Scott Jurek's Eat & Run too, another great running book
My big takeaway from both of them is to take smaller strides. Seems to be working so far!

[theanimal]

I plan on starting slow based off all the articles I've read about it. Developing the foot muscles seems to be a somewhat long process (6 months.)

@TheLuckyWizard-That book is one of the next on my list!
@bbqguy- You might want to check out this book. The author was told that because of injuries he was going to have to slow down or stop running which caused him to go on this quest. His findings are pretty remarkable IMO and basically there is no reason why we should get hurt/injured from running. Humans appear to be born to run like the title suggests yet honestly most do not run properly and therefore place a greater strain on joints, ligaments, muscle etc. which results in a lack of efficiency and often injury.

[Dragline]

Here is a good follow-up article from the author of the book:
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/11/06/magaz ... wanted=all
As he points out, running is probably not a good activity for most people unless it is done properly and carefully. The risk factors are appalling:
"“The data suggests up to 79 percent of all runners are injured every year,” says Stephen Messier, the director of the J. B. Snow Biomechanics Laboratory at Wake Forest University. “What’s more, those figures have been consistent since the 1970s.” Messier is currently 11 months into a study for the U.S. Army and estimates that 40 percent of his 200 subjects will be hurt within a year. “It’s become a serious public health crisis.”
Nothing seems able to check it: not cross-training, not stretching, not $400 custom-molded orthotics, not even softer surfaces. And those special running shoes everyone thinks he needs? In 40 years, no study has ever shown that they do anything to reduce injuries. On the contrary, the U.S. Army’s Public Health Command concluded in a report in 2010, drawing on three large-scale studies of thousands of military personnel, that using shoes tailored to individual foot shapes had “little influence on injuries.”"
Obviously, many people enjoy running, do not get injured and there is no reason they shouldn't continue doing it. I know a number of people who do very well with it. But its not something to be taken up lightly.
My own experience was that it was something I wanted to try and I worked at it for about a year. I've never been a good runner and wanted to see if I could just be able to do ten miles in one go. When I reached the goal, I quit. And certain pains I was having went away. So now I still more to walking and biking. As for running, I only do occasional sprints now.
Hope you have a better experience with it than I did. But that "100-up" exercise from the article looks like something worth trying, even if I'm not planning on doing any more running.

[theanimal]

@Dragline
I do plan on improving my form so that I can run gently. Like McDougall says in that article, "Learn to run gently, and you can wear anything. Fail to do so, and no shoe — or lack of shoe — will make a difference."
There is a good quote in the book where McDougall's coach says something along the lines of: you wouldn't swim or swing a golf club without learning the basics and how to do it properly first, yet people think they can just go out and run without focusing on/learning proper form.

[jennypenny]

As someone who found running later in life (and after serious mobility issues), I get a little frustrated with stats about running injuries. If people start running without proper conditioning and training of course injuries will follow, but that's not the fault of running. Running has more injuries because people think they already know how to run (everyone is born knowing how to run) and so assume technique isn't an issue. For most other exercise, people learn from someone else (from crossfit to spinning).
@theanimal--I use a combination of chi running and pose running. Proper foot strike is important IMHO. My PT turned me on to pose running and I haven't been injured since I took it up. I suppose my running is mostly pose running with a little chi running thrown in. I do think that strength training should be the core of everyone's exercise to avoid injury in any cardio activity. FWIW, the worst post-exercise pain I've ever experienced was not after a run but after a spinning class (I blame you for that Ego ).
I'm also a fan of irunfar.com.
I found an article describing the two techniques.

http://adventure.howstuffworks.com/outd ... unning.htm

[George the original one]

Hmm, kind of like Tennesse Walking Horse, but for people.

[billc]

I ran competitively in high school and college. Always preferred a supportive shoe for training and then light scale racing flats for races and speed workouts. I did not like running in bare feet. Best advice is to try something and see how your body responds. If your foot rolls inward (overpronation - which is common) I would start with bare foot style running limited distances and not too frequently at first and see if you have any pain.
FWIW - I typically ran 50-60 miles per week and went through 5 pairs of training shoes per year (retail $110/ea).

[steelerfan]

I would agree. As a former elite distance runner who trained at times over 100 mpw, I can say with confidence most people are not cut out for long term running. I was pretty lucky for a while but today I can no longer run at all. Mostly an elypto man these days... The are more people than you would think that simply drop dead as well. Caballo Blanca from the book died last year and he was very fit. My best friend ran an ultra last summer and I crewed for him. I am trying to discourage him from doing too many of those as a toll for a typical 50 yo white carnivore non vegetable guy like him must be incredible...

[vireoes]

I ran competitively in high school and college. By the end of my college career I felt I was spending as much time treating injuries as training and gave it up. When I took it up again to drop some weight 15 years later I switched approaches and took up running form more seriously. I ran mostly with shoes and sometimes barefoot, but focusing on form over speed. I used to replace shoes religiously when I ran competitively and bought the top of the line shoes for my foot type. Now when I run in shoes they are often several years old and falling apart. I was able to complete 5 marathons and several ultras without injuries. I am not fast and don't train especially hard, but I can run distances now that I could never dream of tackling before. I couldn't make it through a high school cross country season without some kind of injury. So for me it has made all the difference and saves me a ton of money. I prefer running to biking for fitness and I used to spend a small fortune on running shoes. It seemed crazy that such a simple fitness activity should cost me so much money. It didn't align with my values, so I am happy now running slow in my bare feet or old beater shoes.

[FarmOne]

Born to run? Think about nature for a minute. What animal other than human do you see running long distance every day? Even wild horses run in intervals for play or escape. Antelope run, but only (relatively) short distances. I had a dog that loved to run, but it was for play. He didn't naturally have a set distance or pace that he repeated every day like a human. If he did, he got sore feet and could not run until he healed up.
I used to run a lot; started running to cross train for bike racing. Ran one marathon, three half-marathons, and several 5k's. I still enjoy to run ocassionally, but natural shorter distances to avoid injury.
The repetitive motion type injuries are not natural because it's not natural to run the same paces and distances that feed our endorphin craving. "No pain, no gain" is not good advice...

[George the original one]

> What animal other than human do you see running

> long distance every day?
Wolf, bison, caribou on the tundra. Wolf hunts chasing the prey for 30-50 miles.

[Chad]

Lots of conflicting evidence on running, as with almost all health related items.
I have read articles by personal trainers that suggest our hips (especially female hips) aren't desinged to go super long distances, as they aren't directly over our feet. While, others suggest long distance running was how we killed animals.
I have also seen studies suggesting ultra marathons and the training for them are detrimental to our health.
Of course, I just read in Men's Journal yesterday that runners have a lower instance of arthritis than non-runners and even walkers.
As with almost everything, it appears that extremism(and poor form) turns running into a detrimental exercise, but a more moderate approach with less over training makes it a healthy endeavor.

[theanimal]

FarmOne- Believe it or not, homo sapiens used to kill by running the animals to death. Human beings are the only species that release heat through their skin. Other animals release it through panting. When an animal is sprinting, it can not pant. Therefore, humans used to run at a steady pace for hours behind the animal so that they would sprint and eventually die of heat exhaustion. There are still tribes in Africa that do this today along with the Tarahumara in Mexico.
If you do not have correct form, you will obviously become injured. Like I said, you wouldn't start swimming without learning the movements first. Please read the book before making any conclusions or at least read the article from the NYT linked above.

[Ego]

Endorphins. Nothing releases them like running. They're a double edged sword. They produce the runner's high - that blissful feeling where everything is right with the world, everyone is beautiful, nothing is too difficult or painful. As we all know, pain has a purpose. Not feeling pain can be dangerous. A runner awash in endorphins can run through hell with a smile. They're at least as addictive as coffee. It is important to be mindful of this while running to avoid injuries.
Recently I began upping the intensity of my runs and giving myself at least one non-running day afterward. Spinning is an excellent alternative (despite what Jenny says as intervals can be done and endorphins injected without the jarring and pounding of running.
That said, it is the pounding that creates dense bones. My wife is approaching fifty and is an avid five-day-a-week runner. She did the bone density test at one of those freebee health clinics. The nurse kept resetting the machine and starting over while testing. She couldn't believe the result. Apparently she had the highest score of the day, higher than the twenty year old guys. Over-achiever that she is.... she began doing box jumps to see if she could increase it even more. Ugh.

[Ego]

Also, if you have joint (knee, hip) pain you might consider adding gelatin (Knox Jello) to your diet.
http://vgncds.bsu.edu:82/news/article/0 ... 32,00.html

[thebbqguy]

@Ego The gellatin sounds interesting. I was a dedicated consumer of MSM for about 10 years. It had little to no effect for me.
I'm afraid that my joint damage is quite pronounced and degenerative at this point. At least 95% of my miniscus is gone. They went in to do a partial joint replacement (i.e. metal on plastic variety), but there was nothing to secure it to that would actually work.
As a teenager I was one of those guys that would run 4 miles in the morning, ride my bicycle 18 miles to baseball practice, practice for 2 or 3 hours, and then play basketball for an hour or so later that night. I also had a lawn mowing business, so throw in about 10 yards a week at 1 hour a piece, a 6 hour cemetery job and 4 hour big box retailer job and it took it's toll.
I was in the Army when I really started to notice it, but if there's one thing I learned in the Army it's that you don't complain about a little pain. It's unfortunate now, but that's just how it was at the time.

[Ego]

That sounds rough. I hope gelatin helps. We make it a few times a week. There is a theoretical risk of BSE contamination since it is made from cattle bones/skin. Apparently heat does not kill the prions responsible for the disease. Gelatin and fish-oil are our only vegan cheats.